Oh feck off FIA
The F1 Thread 2012 Season
- Thread starter Rado_N
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Imran (@Annihilate Now!) are here to discuss Amad saving our blushes in a win against Southampton as well as our now annual loss at home to Brighton. They discuss Amorim's post-match comments, revisit how mid-table we may or may not be, and discuss some transfer news.
Schumacher may lose 3rd. Rumour is that he used DRS during yellow flags.
Superb victory for Ferrari, and great drive by Alonso.
What a nightmare for McLaren.
What a nightmare for McLaren.
Rumour aka Webber and Horner crapping on. The only way that Schumacher could have been penalized is if his DRS was open as the yellow flags came out for the incident. He wasn't close enough to any car on the final lap to use DRS and according to a poster on another forum I visit, clearly backed off in yellow flag sectors.
BBC are saying that Pastor and Lewis are in front of the stewards in 17 mins.
Hopefully a penalty for Pastor but going of his past record he should pass get a race ban
Hopefully a penalty for Pastor but going of his past record he should pass get a race ban
They'll probably punish Hamilton.
stranger things have happenedA race ban?
Would be harsh and unnecessary.
not with his past record.
He was penalised in Monaco for his bad driving and it has happened at another race.
he did and BBC just showed it on the Forum
Delighted for Alonso and Ferrari.
Alonso is a fantastic driver.
Alonso is a fantastic driver.
Apparently Vettel has a pre contract with Ferrari for 2014. No idea how I missed that.
Red Bull have denied this, say he will be driving for them in 2014
The one race when my favorite driver of all time gets on the podium in a long time, I miss the race.
You missed a cracking race.
Up until Vettel dropped out it was an OK race , after the SC came out and Vettel car stopped it was excellent race.
Best race of the season so far for me.
Any where I can see extended highlights without downloading?
If your in the Uk iplayer or BBC 2 at 23:45
Maldonado gets of easy again, given twenty-second penalty for incident with Hamilton.
Im in the States but I have links to watch BBC 2. So in another 5 and 1/2 hours right?
Also stewards to take no further action against Michael Schumacher.
As much as Maldonado was at fault for the incident that saw Lewis into the wall, it was Lewis' own fault that he found himself in such a position whereby a crash could potentially occur.
Lewis' aggressive defence of a position he could never hold is what let him down today; it was very immature driving. Of course, he had every right to defend his position, but common sense dictated that he should have yeilded to the quicker car and accpeted fourth place. Maldonado was at fault for the crash but Lewis can only have himself to blame for getting into such a futile, risk-laden tussle in the first place.
Lewis' aggressive defence of a position he could never hold is what let him down today; it was very immature driving. Of course, he had every right to defend his position, but common sense dictated that he should have yeilded to the quicker car and accpeted fourth place. Maldonado was at fault for the crash but Lewis can only have himself to blame for getting into such a futile, risk-laden tussle in the first place.
Cant argue with any of that.
Yes that's right, just under 5 hours now.
Massa and Button should be dropped for a couple of races and some talented test/young drivers given a shot.
Brilliant drive from Alonso again. Him and Vettel are the Messi & Ronaldo of F1 - simply in a class above everyone else.
Brilliant drive from Alonso again. Him and Vettel are the Messi & Ronaldo of F1 - simply in a class above everyone else.
Of course you are correct, perhaps looking back Hamilton will realise he would have been far better off giving the place up and taking home the points. But you can't blame him for being punted off by quite frankly an accident driver waiting to happen, Maldonado would have got the position cleanly had he waited but he hasn't shown any common sense since he entered F1.
Quite often the same allegation leveled against Lewis earlier in his F1 career.
I think Lewis was pretty good in his first 2 seasons, 2010 he was genuinely mental at some points and 2011 someone shat in his cereal.
I've watched Maldonado since his early GP2 days, he has aways been unhinged, fast but mental.
Today's crash between Hamilton and Maldonado kinda highlighted something that I've been thinking about for ages. I might as well share it.
One great thing about F1 is how safety has increased way beyond what it used to be. Cars are faster than ever but they're also safer than they were before. I'd say the increase in safety is far greater than the increase in pace, balance, etc.
The problem is that the drivers have got a bit too secure in cars now. I'm too young to remember Senna but my Uncle, who's a true F1 fanatic and has worked in motorsport for decades, disliked him because of how Senna basically risked his life every time he hopped into an F1 car. While it saw him rise to the top quickly, it also ended in the ultimate sacrifice for his sport. I'm lead to believe that some of the maneouvres Senna would attempt were the first of their kind, where a driver would play with death much more than was the norm.
Now that the cars are safer and the drivers aren't playing with their lives, which is ultimately a good thing, it's about respect. Alonso had a gripe about it recently and I think he's right. Things like swerving all over the track to avoid being overtaken are unsafe and drivers did it because the risk to themselves was minimal.
At the end of the day, the drivers don't have to share a mutual respect for their lives any more so it's about showing respect to each other. A sentiment that, as any fool can see, is unlikely to be shared by 24 men on a track.
Today the crash personified this problem for me. I'll start with Maldonaldo. As a driver I've serious doubts about him. He's reckless and, assuming he gives a toss for the other drivers' safety, I've yet to see him concerned. He's used his car as a weapon more than once this season which is more than once too many times over an entire career. I think it's clear as day that he saw red and literally speared Hamilton off the track. It's spiteful, it's unsporting and it's truly unsafe. This is a multi-million pound business/sport and the last thing it needs is for drivers to start playing GTA on the track. We scorn footballers for being bad role models but Maldonaldo should be pulled up on his behaviour. I can't speak of it lowly enough in a sporting sense, it was just so poor.
However, Hamilton has to accept his part in this. This season he's been much improved but he's been a bully behind the wheel in the past and I think his reckless side showed today as well. In effect, I agree with Cider. I appreciate that Hamilton had the position but it was his driving that caused Maldonaldo to go off the track. I also fully understand that he didn't expect Maldonaldo to get hell-for-leather and simply ram him. The thing is, he didn't vouch for it at all. Shutting Maldonaldo out was the only thought in his mind. You can almost guarantee he thought that because he was sitting on the race line he was impervious to Maldonaldo: "I've got the racing line, he's off the track, he can't touch me".
To stress, Maldonaldo was wrong. Horribly wrong, IMO. But Hamilton was stupid too. Was shutting Maldonaldo out that important? I fully get that he didn't expect what happened next but the fact that he didn't account for it concerns me. If his personal safety had come into it, like it would've done in eras passed, neither driver would've done what they did. Hamilton wouldn't have placed his car as a blockade to the track -- for all the lambasting I've done of Maldonaldo I think it's only fair to point out that he could argue that he was simply returning to the track -- and Maldonaldo wouldn't have rammed another car.
It just feels like these "racing incidents" are becoming more common as the safety margins increase, giving the drivers more room to play with. I personally don't want that. Let's be honest, the crashes are entertaining but when drivers are gambling against what the other driver should do as a point of principle instead of what another driver should do relative to his own safety, we're going to end up with a lot less actual racing.
Hamilton could've walked away with points today if he hadn't stupidly gambled his car on this odd, self-assured premise that Maldonaldo didn't care about his. I mean, the logic is absurd. Hamilton thinks "I can risk my car here because Maldonaldo won't risk his". If he's willing to risk his car how can he then bet against Maldonaldo risking his?! Particularly when he was the man with more to lose!
I digress. If any of you actually read this bunch of nonsense let me know your thoughts!
One great thing about F1 is how safety has increased way beyond what it used to be. Cars are faster than ever but they're also safer than they were before. I'd say the increase in safety is far greater than the increase in pace, balance, etc.
The problem is that the drivers have got a bit too secure in cars now. I'm too young to remember Senna but my Uncle, who's a true F1 fanatic and has worked in motorsport for decades, disliked him because of how Senna basically risked his life every time he hopped into an F1 car. While it saw him rise to the top quickly, it also ended in the ultimate sacrifice for his sport. I'm lead to believe that some of the maneouvres Senna would attempt were the first of their kind, where a driver would play with death much more than was the norm.
Now that the cars are safer and the drivers aren't playing with their lives, which is ultimately a good thing, it's about respect. Alonso had a gripe about it recently and I think he's right. Things like swerving all over the track to avoid being overtaken are unsafe and drivers did it because the risk to themselves was minimal.
At the end of the day, the drivers don't have to share a mutual respect for their lives any more so it's about showing respect to each other. A sentiment that, as any fool can see, is unlikely to be shared by 24 men on a track.
Today the crash personified this problem for me. I'll start with Maldonaldo. As a driver I've serious doubts about him. He's reckless and, assuming he gives a toss for the other drivers' safety, I've yet to see him concerned. He's used his car as a weapon more than once this season which is more than once too many times over an entire career. I think it's clear as day that he saw red and literally speared Hamilton off the track. It's spiteful, it's unsporting and it's truly unsafe. This is a multi-million pound business/sport and the last thing it needs is for drivers to start playing GTA on the track. We scorn footballers for being bad role models but Maldonaldo should be pulled up on his behaviour. I can't speak of it lowly enough in a sporting sense, it was just so poor.
However, Hamilton has to accept his part in this. This season he's been much improved but he's been a bully behind the wheel in the past and I think his reckless side showed today as well. In effect, I agree with Cider. I appreciate that Hamilton had the position but it was his driving that caused Maldonaldo to go off the track. I also fully understand that he didn't expect Maldonaldo to get hell-for-leather and simply ram him. The thing is, he didn't vouch for it at all. Shutting Maldonaldo out was the only thought in his mind. You can almost guarantee he thought that because he was sitting on the race line he was impervious to Maldonaldo: "I've got the racing line, he's off the track, he can't touch me".
To stress, Maldonaldo was wrong. Horribly wrong, IMO. But Hamilton was stupid too. Was shutting Maldonaldo out that important? I fully get that he didn't expect what happened next but the fact that he didn't account for it concerns me. If his personal safety had come into it, like it would've done in eras passed, neither driver would've done what they did. Hamilton wouldn't have placed his car as a blockade to the track -- for all the lambasting I've done of Maldonaldo I think it's only fair to point out that he could argue that he was simply returning to the track -- and Maldonaldo wouldn't have rammed another car.
It just feels like these "racing incidents" are becoming more common as the safety margins increase, giving the drivers more room to play with. I personally don't want that. Let's be honest, the crashes are entertaining but when drivers are gambling against what the other driver should do as a point of principle instead of what another driver should do relative to his own safety, we're going to end up with a lot less actual racing.
Hamilton could've walked away with points today if he hadn't stupidly gambled his car on this odd, self-assured premise that Maldonaldo didn't care about his. I mean, the logic is absurd. Hamilton thinks "I can risk my car here because Maldonaldo won't risk his". If he's willing to risk his car how can he then bet against Maldonaldo risking his?! Particularly when he was the man with more to lose!
I digress. If any of you actually read this bunch of nonsense let me know your thoughts!
I haven't read it, but I'm in a bad mood now, so I just wanted to point out that in actual fact, they're not. Will read it properly in the morning
Said it before and will say it again. Despite what Vettel has done the last couple of seasons for me Alonso is by far the best allround driver in F1.
Just a fantastic talent and great to see him fighting for wins and championships.
Just a fantastic talent and great to see him fighting for wins and championships.
God damn it! I missed the highlights on BBC 2.
right on. May cost him the WDC.
can't stand him... So I agree, fantastic talent. He has great balance between fight and maintain. Lewis is all fight which hurts him.
Agreed, I am a Hamilton fan but Alonso is easily the best driver.
To be honnest if anything will stop Lewis from winning the WDC will probably be Mclaren. If they don't feck up today this incident doesn't happen. The BBC showed all the clips of the Mclaren errors with Lewis, it's a lot. If not for the feck ups he would probably be leading the WDC right now or at least a lot closer to Alonso.
Lewis is well within his rights to defend his place, he was two laps from the end & on a circuit which isn't renowned for overtaking. The problem is with your theory of letting cars through is that if you're a racer, you don't do that.
You let one car through & then every time anyone wants to pass you in the future they'll just stick their car up the inside and they know in the back of your head that you'll yield every time due to previous incidents of letting cars through.
The issue today with Lewis was more the McLaren pitstop feck up cost him a victory. As for Maldonado, well this guy shows that when it comes to racing and making judgements for position he clearly hasn't a clue. He's shown it time & time again (dont forget he was even banned for life from racing at Monaco in 2005 due to injuring a marshall) that the decision he makes are often the wrong ones.
A race ban?
Would be harsh and unnecessary.
Given his previous history at Spa and Monaco it would be generous just a one race ban, anyway he got off light the ugly cnut.
Massa? Yes he should be dropped entirely
Button? Not a chance, Button is in a slump and Mclaren have openly admitted that they have not been giving him the best setup to race on and they are working to rectify that problem.
The difference between Massa and Button is that Button is having a slump of form, he has not forgotten how to drive just look at how good he was last year while Massa has been just downright shit for a few years now.
I said he had every right to defend his position, didn't I? That doesn't mean that to defend the position was the correct thing to do.
I appreciate that I'm not a racing driver, but I disagree with your point because I think there were two champion racing drivers on the track yesterday who would have reacted to Maldonado differently to Lewis; namely, Alonso and Vettel. The more mature drivers would have recognised that Maldonado's fresher tyres meant that he was going past regardless of any effort to stop him, just as Kimi had done moments before. Getting into an aggressive tussle for position with a car with greater grip just isn't worth the risk, as Hamilton abruptly found out; just as with Kimi before the defending against Maldonado would inevitably involve much wheel-to-wheel maneuvering, and that's where contact and accidents occur; Lewis was basically just asking for trouble, all for the sake of three points, and it eventually cost him fifteen.
Now, I'm a Lewis Hamilton fan, he's the reason I began watching the sport five years ago, and it's his mental driving at times that attracts me to support him, he's certainly exciting to watch in comparison to the more mature drivers named above. It's hypocritical of me to expect him to tone down the racing that I love him for, but as much as I enjoy watching him make a crazy pass, I hate to see him throwing his steering wheel in frustration after smashing into a wall. If he's to win another title he has to learn to race for points efficiently like Alonso does so well, and the incident yesterday is a prime example of Lewis Hamilton failing to do exactly that. It cost him, and will cost him again unfortunately; I bet McLaren have given him a right bollocking on the quiet - or at least, they would have done had they not fecked up in equal measure.
I am sure that they are in no position to do that. Plus hamilton this season has been really mature, as mature as alonso and all, if it wasn't for mclaren he would've been leading the championship and wouldn't be in the position he found himself yesterday. Plus there were only 2 laps remaining so you can understand why he didn't want to lose the chance of finishing on the podium. He still was within his right to do what he did, its not his fault. In retrospect he probably should've backed off but who knows, he could've kept the 3rd position for 2 laps.
No, of course not.
If it werent for Mclaren ? the team that built the best car on the grid for the first part of the season ?
Lewis is unprofessional and deserves what he gets as a bit of karma - he constantly slates his engineers & pit crew on radio. He is the Joey Barton of F1
Every driver in F1 at some point in their career has faced issues with their teams similar to what Lewis had last couple of years but no one slates their team publicly like he does. Lewis is highly talented driver and one of the quickest but the absolute worst 'team professional' that engineers and pit crew could have.