The F1 Thread 2010 Season

This Barrichello/Schumacher controversy reminded me of the previous controversy b/w these two

 
marchi-91 said:
From Krits in the Newb Forum
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Schumacher is recognised as great, what's he on about?

Senna is also remembered for what he was willing to do on track, and that Prost moment is a critical aspect of his career. It's hardly hidden or forgotten

One died a decade and a half ago in a tragic racing accident, the other is still pulling yet more dangerous moves on his opponent today, I'd say that pretty accurately highlights the difference
 
B Cantona said:
Schumacher is recognised as great, what's he on about?

Senna is also remembered for what he was willing to do on track, and that Prost moment is a critical aspect of his career. It's hardly hidden or forgotten

One died a decade and a half ago in a tragic racing accident, the other is still pulling yet more dangerous moves on his opponent today, I'd say that pretty accurately highlights the difference
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Highlighted perfectly by Top Gears excellent piece on him in last weeks show.
 
Krit from the newbies take on this (occurred via PM; I responded to the first roughly along the same lines as I already have done in this thread, i.e. no one has forgotten the darker side of Senna's driving, debunking this idea of "not fearing death" because it's another man's life at risk with such a manoeuvre, defending Hamilton for not having done anything as ridiculously dangerous as Schumacher did, and also scolded Schumacher not just for driving Barrichello into the concrete, but also across the pit lane exit which was just as dangerous)

You say that The contrast between Schumi and Senna is that 'one died in a tragic accident a decade ago while the other is pulling yet more dangerous moves today'. Does Senna (I never saw him drive, I was too young but I've read about him and admire him) automatically get renounced for his incredibly dangerous manoeuvres just cause he died? Yes, I know of the time when Senna stopped in the middle of the race to check up on a fellow driver.

I lewis any better than Schumi?

I want you to understand that I am not defending Schumi in what he did. What I am trying to do is point out that the true 'elite' of the drivers have to be cnuts at some point. Didn't Senna himself say that when you start fearing death that you will stop being a great racing driver?

I hate Lewis, But I can identify in him a quality that very few others have. Schumi has that as well. And no matter how much I love Massa, he doesn't have it. I would like you to go back to the Chinese GP (I think) Where both Vettel and Alonso were tearing it up through the back of the field while Massa just couldn't get passed the slower cars. On a clear track Massa can be incredibly quick, he just isn't aggressive enough when dealing with other drivers.

and in response to my response (I don't store my sent messages anymore so I dunno what I said word for word)

Was Senna not risking others lives? Those cars were a lot less safer back then. And I did see that Top Gear show and in one clip they showed how he ended up on TOP of Mansells car.

Hamilton may not have taken it to the extreme that Schumi did in the last race but he has weaved across the track dangerously before.

The reason I don't like Hamilton is cause he is McLarens cnut, not Ferrari's. Its as simple as that but I doubt you'd hold that against me. I'm sure a lot of people would hate Keano if he wasn't a united player. Another reason for Hamilton hate is cause he didn't really get through the pack like the rest of the drivers. He went straight in to a McLaren. BUT, I'll admit, I don't think I can hold that against him. He is quite special. I am more impressed with him this year than any year previous.

Back on topic, The reason I want to defend Schumi is can you honestly tell me that in 10 years from now you won't look back at Schumi and think "What a horrible cnut he was" instead of "Man, he truly was a great driver, one of the greatest maybe". I remember Clarkson talking about Senna being one of a dying breed. Where the drivers would put everything on the line to win. Maybe Schumacher is the last of that dying breed.

I suggested it might be nice to add this to the debate and he agreed, if I could be arsed to post it for him, which it seems I can! :D
 
The fact he keeps calling Hamilton a cnut doesnt really help his points, which are valid.
 
Have to say I really don't understand those who 'hate' Hamilton. Even the bloke I can stand the least because of my idolisation of Damon Hill - Schumacher you guessed it - I have a grudging admiration for, and a recognition of brilliance. What has Hamilton done to cause this? He was a breath of fresh air with his instant impact in the sport, something many still woefully under-credit him for. And if it's anything to do with the Alonso business... surely Alonso has shown since time what an anus of a whining wanker he can be? (lets be clear I don't hate Alonso, I just think he missed out on a pair of testicles at birth)

Each to their own, I just don't get it
 
B Cantona said:
Have to say I really don't understand those who 'hate' Hamilton. Even the bloke I can stand the least because of my idolisation of Damon Hill - Schumacher you guessed it - I have a grudging admiration for, and a recognition of brilliance. What has Hamilton done to cause this? He was a breath of fresh air with his instant impact in the sport, something many still woefully under-credit him for. And if it's anything to do with the Alonso business... surely Alonso has shown since time what an anus of a whining wanker he can be? (lets be clear I don't hate Alonso, I just think he missed out on a pair of testicles at birth)

Each to their own, I just don't get it
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As clearly shown at Hockenheim.

I think it's impossible not to respect and admire Schumacher, everyone does and not having would be quite ludicrous IMO, he was a one of a kind brilliant racer, however the fact that Hamilton isn't spoken of in a similar vein is interesting, I see no reason why he isn't as admired as the likes of Schumi, he is clearly a similarly talented driver who has been plagued by unreliability and in the case of the majority of last year lack of pace, yet he is still regularly topping his team-mates, and when these team-mates include Fernando Alonso and Jenson Button then that shows you he is an incredible racer.
 
B Cantona said:
Have to say I really don't understand those who 'hate' Hamilton. Even the bloke I can stand the least because of my idolisation of Damon Hill - Schumacher you guessed it - I have a grudging admiration for, and a recognition of brilliance. What has Hamilton done to cause this? He was a breath of fresh air with his instant impact in the sport, something many still woefully under-credit him for. And if it's anything to do with the Alonso business... surely Alonso has shown since time what an anus of a whining wanker he can be? (lets be clear I don't hate Alonso, I just think he missed out on a pair of testicles at birth)

Each to their own, I just don't get it
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In all the F1 threads since 08 we have all talked about this many times I still don't get it. There are allot of people who hate him even on here but for me there are drivers I dislike like Alonso but I don't hate him. There are still berks over the last few weeks in here still think Lewis is overrated and his championship was lucky.
 
phelans shorts said:
As clearly shown at Hockenheim.

I think it's impossible not to respect and admire Schumacher, everyone does and not having would be quite ludicrous IMO, he was a one of a kind brilliant racer, however the fact that Hamilton isn't spoken of in a similar vein is interesting, I see no reason why he isn't as admired as the likes of Schumi, he is clearly a similarly talented driver who has been plagued by unreliability and in the case of the majority of last year lack of pace, yet he is still regularly topping his team-mates, and when these team-mates include Fernando Alonso and Jenson Button then that shows you he is an incredible racer.
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Hamilton is just starting out and has a whole career ahead of him...Schumi's done it for a long long time and consistently...

IF and once Hamilton wins numerous Championships and does many times what Schumi has done, I am sure he would receive the same recognition?
 
B Cantona said:
Have to say I really don't understand those who 'hate' Hamilton. Even the bloke I can stand the least because of my idolisation of Damon Hill - Schumacher you guessed it - I have a grudging admiration for, and a recognition of brilliance. What has Hamilton done to cause this? He was a breath of fresh air with his instant impact in the sport, something many still woefully under-credit him for. And if it's anything to do with the Alonso business... surely Alonso has shown since time what an anus of a whining wanker he can be? (lets be clear I don't hate Alonso, I just think he missed out on a pair of testicles at birth)

Each to their own, I just don't get it
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I don't like Hamilton, I never have, but I'd never say I 'hate' him, I usually reserve that level of emotion for people who have actually wronged me (as well as a few footballers hehe). I'm not going to get drawn into the why's and wherefores of my feelings, because I don't see the point, some like him, some don't, no big deal.

However, I've never denied his excellence as a driver, and I will even go as far as to defend him when the real numpties start talking bollocks about him. I try to be as objective as I can in here, and I think I do OK at it.
 
You can't defend Schumacher, but there's been other incidents this season that went unpunished which could have had equally serious consequences



Extremely fortunate that there weren't people waiting for their car at that time
 
EdWeatherall said:
You can't defend Schumacher, but there's been other incidents this season that went unpunished which could have had equally serious consequences



Extremely fortunate that there weren't people waiting for their car at that time
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Went unpunished but was roundly criticised. To push Hamilton towards the pit crews was absolutely monumentally stupid. You're right something should have been done there too. Doesn't excuse Schumacher though

Much of the focus for that incident went on the pit crew of McClaren claiming unsafe release, which is nonsense how can the lollipop man possibly know Vettel has been released milli-seconds before? Never mind the fact he makes a much better pit box exit than Hamilton
 
I just want them to show some consistency, Schumacher deserves his ban and perhaps even should have been more, but Vettel should have been 10 place dropped....and probably the same for his role in his Webber collision.

He's just too reckless if you ask me, reckless defending his position, see the starts and also overtaking, see vs Sutil (?) at Silverstone
 
EdWeatherall said:
I just want them to show some consistency, Schumacher deserves his ban and perhaps even should have been more, but Vettel should have been 10 place dropped....and probably the same for his role in his Webber collision.
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Think you're going too far now, no one will ever attempt an overtake if the ramifications are that they stand a chance of a 10 place grid drop! I think it was Vettels fault for the crash, but it's a racing incident rather than reckless dangerous driving
 
Dropping places for what happened in Turkey would be ridiculous, however that pit lane incident with Lewis would be fair enough, for reasons outlines above by brad, as it really would remove what little overtaking we still have.
 
Just back home from the outback in Oz with no way of watching F1 but looking at the leaderboard it looks like a hell of a season. I only seen the first few races when there was a lot of rain which put a bit of unpredictablity/excitement into the races. What has it been like in the dry European races? Are McLaren starting to fall away and if so why?

I really don't expect anyone to have the time or interest in giving me the briefest of brief reviews of the European stint of the season but I would much appreciate it
 
17Larsson said:
Just back home from the outback in Oz with no way of watching F1 but looking at the leaderboard it looks like a hell of a season. I only seen the first few races when there was a lot of rain which put a bit of unpredictablity/excitement into the races. What has it been like in the dry European races? Are McLaren starting to fall away and if so why?

I really don't expect anyone to have the time or interest in giving me the briefest of brief reviews of the European stint of the season but I would much appreciate it
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Civil war at Red Bull. youtube "turkey vettel webber" for one of the reasons why. Also, they took away Webbers new front wing to give to Vettel after a mistake by Vettels mechanics broke it at Silverstone. Webber then promptly won the race and got in trouble for something he said on the radio after the race to Christian Horner. They're still far and away the quickest team though, they just have a habit of fecking themselves over. Ferrari fell away but are coming back into it now, though they got into huge controversy when they gave Massa a coded message telling him to let Alonso pass him in order to win the race. McLaren are falling away, though they are still developing the car. Mercedes seem to have stopped development of this years car and are focussing on next year, with the end result being Schumacher trying to run anybody near him off the road. He got away with it at the Canadian GP but last week at Hungary he almost rammed Barrichello into the pit wall. Rosberg is outshining Schumacher. Kubica is impressing in a renault. And for the best crash of the year youtube "webber valencia." Its amazing.
 
Thanks for that Gormless, much appreciated. I'm disappointed I missed so much of this season and I'm only home for 4 weeks and I just found out there is a break in the season so I'll only see one race before I head off again.
So it's good to have Schumacher back is it? There seems to be a nice bit of argument over that here. He seems to be making the races interesting with some of his moves but he was always like that, however the move on Barrichello looked a bit over the top.

Hopefully Redbull can keep it up and get me top of that fantasy f1 although reading a few of the things Horner has said in the last few weeks I don't think I'd like to see him winning anything
 
Forgot about Jenson's triathlon entry:

BBC said:
Despite suffering from a bout of tonsillitis in the days leading up to the event, McLaren’s Jenson Button put in an impressive performance at Sunday’s London Triathlon. Button is understood to have finished fourth out of the 570 competitors in his group, with a time of 2.14:14.

The annual event includes a 1500-metre swim, a 40-kilometre bike ride and a 10-kilometre run. It attracts 11,000 entrants making it the largest triathlon in the world.

“Great day at the London Triathlon,” said Button on his official Twitter site. “Suffered quite a bit on the run due to just being physically drained I guess from the antibiotics. Still reasonably happy with the result though.”

Button competed to raise money for the Make-A-Wish Foundation, a charity which makes dreams a reality for young people fighting life-threatening illnesses. For more details on the 30 year-old’s fundraising efforts, visit www.justgiving.com/jb2010.
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Good effort that, especially considering he'd been ill.


Anyway, Spa this weekend, one of my favourite tracks on the calendar, gutted we don't have Kimi there this year though, he was phenomenal round there.
 
R_Nick said:
Anyway, Spa this weekend, one of my favourite tracks on the calendar, gutted we don't have Kimi there this year though, he was phenomenal round there.
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Won 4 out of the last 5 there, in fact he got his only win there last year.

YouTube has a load of onboard laps of Raikonnen at the Spa as well and for good reason.
 
R_Nick said:
Forgot about Jenson's triathlon entry:



Good effort that, especially considering he'd been ill.


Anyway, Spa this weekend, one of my favourite tracks on the calendar, gutted we don't have Kimi there this year though, he was phenomenal round there.
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By this weekend, surely you mean 2 and 1/2 weeks from now?
 
R_Nick said:
Forgot about Jenson's triathlon entry:



Good effort that, especially considering he'd been ill.


Anyway, Spa this weekend, one of my favourite tracks on the calendar, gutted we don't have Kimi there this year though, he was phenomenal round there.
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no it aint:wenger:
 
I miss Kimi :(

Even Montoya to a certain extent. He also provided entertainment
 
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