That perfectly summed up his time here for me too. Thank you! For me he was a frustrating player. Even when he had I'd say 2 good seasons with us. What I really hated was when you see Rooney do all the work and he taps in the ball and does his solo celebration like it was all him. Then you see Rooney score and point to whoever helped with the goal. Such a selfish player. Where Rooney was a team player. So for me I never gravitated to Ronaldo. He kind of put me off with his attitude. Also at that time I was still more interested in Giggs, Scholes, and RVN. The sound of Ruud echoing around the stadium when he scored still gives me goosebumps when I think of it.
The comprehensive Ronaldo thread
- Thread starter Red the Bear
- Start date
These sort of stats are meaningless. He missed 6 big chances which means he was the reason those chances were created and he was in the right place.
Any player can miss big chances it's just the law of averages and he'll go on a scoring spree sooner than later. Am I doing it right?
I only just realised that the World Cup could end up with Argentina vs Portugal in the final - having a World Cup on your medal list might well be the decider for Messi vs Ronaldo so would be a World Cup Final to decide the best player ever. That‘s pretty incredible.
I hope he’s not watching Messi at this World Cup otherwise it will tip him over the edge. Messi looks tremendous.
Tbf, he was always the superior player. No debate. Messi is a special player.
Tbf, he was always the superior player. No debate. Messi is a special player.
Is Ronaldo the new Bobby no goal?
But goal scoring is what gets him in these all time conversation. While his overall play was good, it wasn't so spectacular that if he take away his goal scoring prowess we'd still be talking about one of the greatest. But we can do that with Messi. Take away his goals and he'd still be looked at as one of the greatest just for the sheer skills and what he can do with a football.
There's nothing to decide. Messi is easily better and other players have WCs too. It's only youngsters who like to assume these 2 are the only two in the conversation.
Feck you almost had me. Well done.
Absolutely not. This is the problem with Messi vs Ronaldo debates, they get reduced to singular stake points in order to sell this narrative that they are close and fighting tooth and nail to see who is the better player. In order to make the Messi vs Ronaldo a debate, the discourse has been focused solely on goals, that way the comparison and illusion of them being close to each other is maintained because that's the only metric Ronaldo goes toe to toe with Messi.
As football players, not just goal scorer, meaning the whole package no one has come close to Messi among his peers. He's simply been the best player for the duration of his peek/prime. Ronaldo has challenged him as a goal scorer but that's where it stops.
I think his fans are as irritating as Morgan. Obviously he is a fan too. He obviously has scored some great goals for United including the free kick and the header in CL Final. he was a great goal scorer. His dribbling and his passing and his hold up play and his first touch is not outstanding.
Exactly.
In terms of creativity, technique, passing skills, Messi is easily among the top creators group that include Maradona, Platini, Zico, Zidane, Xavi, Modric type of players... Ronaldo has no business here..
In terms of dribbling skills, Messi is easily among the top 3 ever, for some the best dribbler ever.. Ronaldo again has no business here..
Only in terms of goal scoring, Ronaldo is among the top goal scorers ever and Messi easily matches that despite not playing as a penalty box striker unlike Ronaldo for many years now..
You guys try too hard. Ronaldo was the catalyst for our most dominant period in the modern era. Stayed here longer than Cantona and won more than Cantona too. How many players won best in the world in a United shirt? Ferguson calls him the best he ever had. Ronaldo is a dickhead yes, not denying he’s a bozo, but he’s not a footnote for United. He’s one of the most important players this club has had. Maybe not top 10 but top 15 or 20.
It’s OK if he’s not one of your favourites but these takes just come off as ridiculous listing random goals and “oh yeah, the feeling that Rooney would score every time he touched the ball” followed by “I made my case convincingly” to diminish Ronaldo’s contribution at United is comical. Guy probably had two or three of the best seasons any United player ever had, and outside of those he was a very good, electric young player. Fanbase was singing his name a decade after he’d left. Come on.
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Yes but he's also an egotistical cnut beyond all belief. Stats don't show that but it certainly plays on a hell of a lot of fans minds when thinking of their favourite players.
I despise the man.
Completely agree, he was special for us. Too bad he decided to act like a prick. Did similar things in 2006 and 2008 but nothing close to the behavior of this year. It's hard not to dislike him atm, which doesn't mean that'll be the case in 5-10 years.
Yep - nailed it.
It's understandable some fans are upset at the ridiculous behaviour this season, but to try and diminish the past contribution is hilarious.
The only United player to win the Ballon D'or at United outside of the Trinity.
Saw someone trying to say he'd not scored any special or key goals as well. Ignoring the 2 seasons where he scored loads of great goals, scoring in semis and finals etc.
I always think people seem to forget 06-07 Ronaldo (and to a much lesser extent 05-06) where he was easily the most exciting player in the league. I think he got 20+ assists that year and 23 goals. Paul Scholes said he'd never seen another player play like Ronaldo did that year. 07-08 is where we see the goal obsessed Ronaldo.
He's a complete moron and self-obsessed idiot but the attempts to rewrite him as one-two season wonder at United is pretty silly. 4 Sir Matt Busby POTY awards, 5 PFA team of the season inclusions in 7 and a bit seasons is pretty successful.
He's a complete moron and self-obsessed idiot but the attempts to rewrite him as one-two season wonder at United is pretty silly. 4 Sir Matt Busby POTY awards, 5 PFA team of the season inclusions in 7 and a bit seasons is pretty successful.
Exactly this.
No Pele is better than Ronaldo too.
You lost all credibility once you compared Ronaldo to Cantona. Imo. I get it you love Ronaldo. And that's fine. You are entitled to your opinion. I have a diffrent view of him when he was here. He had one dominate season for us. That's it. 2 good. And then 3 that we not very good. Your building him up into something more then he was when here.
"you lost credibility"
feck's sake - I don't care about personal opinions on credibility. I used Cantona as a benchmark because he's a legend of this club and considered by many a catalyst for a turning point for United. Ronaldo was similarly a catalyst for another dominant era for United. It's not a subjective thing, Ronaldo was here longer than Cantona and won more than him. I'm not building him up to be nothing more than what he was. Ask his peers about how they feel about his contributions to United - from Neville to Keane to Rio etc. Hell, most people here see Ferguson as largely infallible (I don't) - ask him how he feels about Ronaldo in relation to United. This myth that Ronaldo only had one or two good seasons here is also bollocks that has been going on for too long:03/04 - scored 6 and assisted 8
04/05 - scored 9 and assisted 9
05/06 - scored 12 and assisted 8
06/07 - scored 23 and assisted 14
07/08 - scored 42 and assisted 8
08/09 - scored 26 and assisted 12
This was largely as a winger and before him and Messi put up outrageous numbers that completely skewed people's perception of what a good season is - but according to Redcafe he was only good for two seasons at United
Even his first two seasons are good when you contextualise that he was a teenager and not a starter. United and any other top club currently would kill for a wide player that could put up those numbers - and keep in mind we're in an era in which teams score a lot more goals.For comparison. Hazard - a Chelsea legend - that I often see complimented on this forum as one of the best in the prem recently:
12/13 - scored 13 and assisted 24
13/14 - scored 17 and assisted 10
14/15 - scored 19 and assisted 13
15/16 - scored 6 and assisted 8
16/17 - scored 17 and assisted 7
17/18 - scored 17 and assisted 13
18/19 - scored 21 and assisted 17
Ronaldo is not a very likeable person, but all this revisionism trying to diminish him at United comes off as ridiculous. It's best to just not speak on him at all then get on the internet and act like he wasn't all that at United - he was.
Piers...Piers another exclusive.
It would be so brilliant if Santos starts him on the bench
Iam sure it's all just nonsense, he will start and assist to Bruno's three goals against the swiss and then score a hattrick against netherlands in the final with bruno providing the assists.
At this point I just feel sorry for him. What a sad end to a wonderful career. I'm pretty sure he won't be remembered like this.
If he stays in any of the big leagues in Europe, he will make Keane and Souness look stupid
He doesnt like Santos for using his name. Santos is reserved for Ronaldo.
Ronaldo was not the catalyst. He was a great player in a great team. You act like we never won anything before Ronaldo arrived and stopped winning after he left."you lost credibility"
03/04 - scored 6 and assisted 8
04/05 - scored 9 and assisted 9
05/06 - scored 12 and assisted 8
06/07 - scored 23 and assisted 14
07/08 - scored 42 and assisted 8
08/09 - scored 26 and assisted 12
This was largely as a winger and before him and Messi put up outrageous numbers that completely skewed people's perception of what a good season is - but according to Redcafe he was only good for two seasons at United
For comparison. Hazard - a Chelsea legend - that I often see complimented on this forum as one of the best in the prem recently:
12/13 - scored 13 and assisted 24
13/14 - scored 17 and assisted 10
14/15 - scored 19 and assisted 13
15/16 - scored 6 and assisted 8
16/17 - scored 17 and assisted 7
17/18 - scored 17 and assisted 13
18/19 - scored 21 and assisted 17
Ronaldo is not a very likeable person, but all this revisionism trying to diminish him at United comes off as ridiculous. It's best to just not speak on him at all then get on the internet and act like he wasn't all that at United - he was.
Ronaldo had 2 good seasons and one great. His first 3 were not. His first in particular was very frustrating.
You trying to say that Ronaldo was like Cantona. Not even close. Eric was influential from the moment he arrived. Ronaldo was not. Thier was so many more influential players in the team.
The year before Ronaldo arrived we won the title. The next three years we did not. How is he the catalyst?
Evra and Vidic arrive in winter 05/06. Their first full season 06/07 we win the title. And 3 in a row.
Talk about revisionism. And thanks for putting up those stats. It just proves my point. Look at Edens and Ronaldo first year. Eden had 2x as many goals and 3x as many assists. Yes Ronaldos first year was nothing special.
In both their 3rd seasons. Ronaldo 12g and 8a so 20 goal involments vs Eden at 19g and 13a so 32 goal involments. So again thanks for proving my point that Ronaldo had some pretty average if not below average seasons for us.
Ridiculously selective, you’ve struggled to mention any individual more than once, with Rooney making it twice due to a hat trick v Fenerbache in a CL group game and a league game against Arsenal. I’d add Rooneys goals against Newcastle and City by the way, with the City one probably the best united goal I’ve seen. However, and this is the big problem….other than the league cup I can’t think of a single trophy that Rooney was the key player in us winning, ala Hughes or Bruce’s headers, Keane v Juve…that legitimately were crucial to the eventual winning of a major trophy. Whereas Cantona and Ronaldo not only won us individual games but did it with such regularity and with enough moments of individual brilliance that they were THE key player in those successes.
I’ve took a few moments from each season, if some of these don’t match a goal against Arsenal in October or two headers v Sheffield weds then I think that’s on you :-
03/04 fa cup run 2 goals 3 assists in 5 games, goal at home to city in cup. Opener in final. Outstanding in semi final and final. MOTM and player of the season.
04/05 Arsenal 4 2 game 2 goals. FA Cup run 6 games 4 goals 3 assists. Outstanding in final.
05/06 goal in league cup final
06/07 Reading goal 1-0 down. Dragged us back into the game. Form from nov to march 13 league goals 5 assists, Xmas period where scored 2 goals in 3 consecutive league games where we were struggling 5/6 MOTM awards and player of the month. Fulham away winner. City away winner the goal that ultimately won the league. Ronaldo’s outstanding form throughout the season the catalyst
07/08 CL group stages 5 goals, winning goal v Lyon, opener away to Roma unbelievable header, only goal in final. 2 goals at home to Blackburn in 2-0 win, 2 goals at home to Fulham in 2-0 win, 2 goals at home to Everton in 2-1 win, Portsmouth home 2 goals in 2-0 win including THAT free kick, Derby away only goal in 1-0 win, Bolton 2 goals in 2-0 win, Villa home genius goal Cruyff flick and 3 assists in 4-0 win, Arsenal 2-1 equaliser from spot. Pressure kick had to take it twice. West Ham home crucial game put us 2-0 up with 2 goals in first 20 mins to kill game. Won 4-0. Reading crucial penalty at 0-0 to win us the league.
08/09 That goal at Porto, Those two goals away at Arsenal in semi, 2 goals in that Villa game, equaliser got us back in before Macheda winner, 2 goals in ten mins v spurs to get one back then put us ahead
I dont, massive dickhead reaping what he has sowed for 20 years, its quite funny now its not our problem any more.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...-cristiano-ronaldo-world-cup-switzerland/amp/
70 per cent of Portugal fans want Cristiano Ronaldo dropped for their last-16 World Cup tie versus Switzerland.
70 per cent of Portugal fans want Cristiano Ronaldo dropped for their last-16 World Cup tie versus Switzerland.
Feck me. He was some player.
Wow ... I thought they worshipped him unconditionally there
No. I don't act like we never won before or after him - that's your hang ups. I act like he was a catalyst for a dominant period for United because he was. He was the star man in said dominant period and we were better during said period (hence dominant) than we were before and won more then than what we won after. United's dominance is directly correlated with him developing into best player in the world.
Stop trying to have conversations (I remind you - you quoted me), in which you try to tell people what they are trying to say - instead read and understand what's being said. Cantona having an immediate impact as a 25/26 year old and Ronaldo having to develop as a 17/18 year old is not something I should have to explain in a conversation about football, for feck's sake. A catalyst for something doesn't have immediate impact as a prerequisite.
Those stats prove that every season Ronaldo had at United were good. Again, stats don't happen in a vacuum. I assume you're an adult, so I expect you to be able to contextualise things. Ronaldo came to United a teenager, and for the first 3 years, he wasn't a starter. Marcus Rashford, for example, in the season he broke out - scored 12 and assisted 2. Eden Hazard joined Chelsea as a 21/22 year old and as a starter for them.
I don't want to engage with you further because more often than not - exchanges on this forum tend to lead to me gaining/learning something or are, at the very least, amusing. I don't believe any of this will be possible with you, so I wish you a good day.
I'd choose the United version of Ronaldo over the Madrid version any day.
I remember watching some video of some of his performances and memories came rushing back. Personally I think he'd have ended up a better, more rounded human being if he stayed at United
Edit: Obviously I'm talking about the first stint. The second stint was a massive mistake
I also preferred the Uniyed Version to the Madrid version. It might have been his knees or his desire to keep up numbers with Messi but he sacrificed too much of his game.