The 'Awful Squad' Brigade

Danny1982 said:
That's wrong. And that's not what SAF thought about the squad when he left it by the way. He was even talking about the prospects of winning 3 titles in a row.

Our team isn't a team in decline, and we've already added very good pieces to it since SAF left. A good manager will have us challenging for the title easily imo.
Click to expand...

I disagree.

Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra - all top players and the bedrock of the defence turning a corner. Scholes retired and Giggs 40 years old.

Our midfield hasn't been up to the task for years. Last season Fergie's ability to get the best from the players and RVP's goals papered over the cracks.

Those players above we're always likely to move on soon. They're big players, probably big personalities and those in the squad don't look ready to step in - especially at the back. Smalling and Jones have suffered for being played out of position last year and this and as it stands both need to up their game to be regular first choice players.

For me, Moyes has under achieved, and maybe a world class manager would have us up there challenging. But you need to look at in context - he has a big job to do in terms of replacing top players, as well as dealing with the pressure of succeeding Fergie.

I liken it to me getting a new boss at work who wants to motivate me and buy into his plan - despite my being aware that next year I'm likely to be replaced. It's a difficult position.
 
Evra, Vidic, Rafael, Rio, Carrick, Valencia, Young all need to be replaced. So yeah, that sounds like a pretty major overhaul to the squad that is needed. It's laughable to suggest that replacing Moyes will avoid that.
 
Buttner, Rafael, Young all showing today why this squad is not up to it. Shockingly average footballers for this level. The Rafael love in on here is bizarre.
Fletcher not up to this level but time is running out for him to maybe regain his previous form.
 
soapythecat said:
Buttner, Rafael, Young all showing today why this squad is not up to it. Shockingly average footballers for this level. The Rafael love in on here is bizarre.
Fletcher not up to this level but time is running out for him to maybe regain his previous form.
Click to expand...

Buttner is not our main left back, we could have played Nani or Januzaj in Young's place and Rafael is not a shockingly average footballer. Are squad is fine and more than good enough for at least 4rth.
 
UnofficialDevil said:
Buttner is not our main left back, we could have played Nani or Januzaj in Young's place and Rafael is not a shockingly average footballer. Are squad is fine and more than good enough for at least 4rth.
Click to expand...
That's why I said 'squad' and not first 11. That's what the thread is about.
Look at the amount of errors Rafael has made this season. The amount of goals we have conceded due to attacks from his position. He is reckless, rash, unpredictable and his defend is questionable.
Average.
 
soapythecat said:
Buttner, Rafael, Young all showing today why this squad is not up to it. Shockingly average footballers for this level. The Rafael love in on here is bizarre.
Fletcher not up to this level but time is running out for him to maybe regain his previous form.
Click to expand...
Buttner is not good enough.
Young is not good enough.

Rafael is good and has proven it in the past.
Fletcher, can't judge him properly now, but I thought he wasn't that bad when he played this season.
 
Players who are realistically not good enough:

Evra, Rio, Vidic, Giggs, Young, Valencia, Buttner, Cleverley. That's 8 - or 1/3 of the first team squad, which is a fairly significant amount. Clearly Moyes could have done far better but there is a lot to do in terms of retooling the squad.

People having a go at Rafael are clearly forgetting the times last season when he was one of our key players - and credited as being the player who made our attack tick, from RB!
 
charleysurf said:
a pretty major overhaul to the squad that is needed. It's laughable to suggest that replacing Moyes will avoid that.
Click to expand...

This is definitely true. Posters on the caf have an irritating habit of blaming either Moyes or the players, when really both are at fault this season. We need to invest heavily in the squad, regardless of who the manager is.

I wonder if they'd be saying the same thing if SAF was still in charge? I get the feeling that the squad's frailties would be more widely accepted by these posters if they didn't think it equated to an excuse for an unpopular manager.
 
Kag said:
Second best squad in the league.

De Gea
Rafael Smalling Jones Evra
Carrick Fellaini
Januzaj Mata Kagawa
Rooney

...is the second best starting XI in the league provided it was played regularly, confident and managed by coaches that were worthy of working with such quality. Talent is obvious to those that can see it, not to mention those that don't harbour the grass is greener syndrome that boast a refusal to understand potential other problems and faults in other teams, only choosing to scrutinising the bad and badder (sic) in ours.
Click to expand...

Well, this is hilarious, in a horrible kind of way.
 
All we need is some fecking energy in midfield. Cleverley is probably the best at providing that right now which is a bit of a shame.
 
First and foremost, what we need is a manager. Lets take it from there.
 
This season has been shite, nothing but shite. It has exposed our squad and the frailties thereof. I would not have thought back in Sept. that by May I would be saying:

We don't have a manager.
Vidic is gone and we need at least one central defender.,
Rio, Evra , Chicharito and RVP might go of their own accord,Carrick should go.

On the other hand I would not have thought we'd have Mata, who looks a keeper, or the best young keeper in the league.

Muppet season in session in 13m.
 
jaimoe said:
This season has been shite, nothing but shite. It has exposed our squad and the frailties thereof. I would not have thought back in Sept. that by May I would be saying:

We don't have a manager.
Vidic is gone and we need at least one central defender.,
Rio, Evra , Chicharito and RVP might go of their own accord,Carrick should go.

On the other hand I would not have thought we'd have Mata, who looks a keeper, or the best young keeper in the league.

Muppet season in session in 13m.
Click to expand...
I dont think Evra, RvP or Carrick will be going anywhere. Even if we get a new midfielder (please god!) and a new LB having the experience of Evra and Carrick will be great. If we are getting who i think we are getting i dont think RvP will be going anywhere. Probably likely had Moyes still been in charge but no i dont see it.

IMO the players who should/will be leaving are: Nani, Anderson, Giggs, Rio, Vidic, Hernandez and Young. In we will get a LB, 2 midfielders (actual midfielders not number 10s that we put there), a pacey winger and possibly another RB or CB. That for me should be enough for next season given we arent going to be in Europe next season.
 
jaimoe said:
This season has been shite, nothing but shite. It has exposed our squad and the frailties thereof. I would not have thought back in Sept. that by May I would be saying:

We don't have a manager.
Vidic is gone and we need at least one central defender.,
Rio, Evra , Chicharito and RVP might go of their own accord,Carrick should go.

On the other hand I would not have thought we'd have Mata, who looks a keeper, or the best young keeper in the league.

Muppet season in session in 13m.
Click to expand...

If Van Gaal comes in, RVP won't be going anywhere.
 
A clear out is needed with a fair few new faces coming in. This squad needs to be woken up. There seems to be a lack of hunger in the team from most. Could argue a lot was down to Moyes and then in these 4 games they had nothing to play for but I always think there is no excuse for a lack of desire.
 
OneUnited24 said:
I dont think Evra, RvP or Carrick will be going anywhere. Even if we get a new midfielder (please god!) and a new LB having the experience of Evra and Carrick will be great. If we are getting who i think we are getting i dont think RvP will be going anywhere. Probably likely had Moyes still been in charge but no i dont see it.

IMO the players who should/will be leaving are: Nani, Giggs, Rio, Vidic, Hernandez and Young. In we will get a LB, 2 midfielders (actual midfielders not number 10s that we put there) and a proven winger. That for me should be enough for next season given we arent going to be in Europe next season.
Click to expand...

Evra's performances over the last 4-5 weeks have convinced me a new contract should be offered. Giggsy already has left as has Nema. Nani has been crap , Young crap, Chicha just okay. We'll see I guess but Shaw sure would look good at left back. Interesting to see what happens with Valencia and Cleverly too.
 
LARulz said:
A clear out is needed with a fair few new faces coming in. This squad needs to be woken up. There seems to be a lack of hunger in the team from most. Could argue a lot was down to Moyes and then in these 4 games they had nothing to play for but I always think there is no excuse for a lack of desire.
Click to expand...
Usually i'd agree with you, but given the blows the players have taken this season you kind of feel given there was nothing to play for or win they did just take their eye of the ball.

I maintain once Moyes was shown the door Giggs job was not to ensure we finish strong (problems need to be addressed and neither Giggs or Moyes were/are the men to do it) but give the dressing room a lift and give the fans a much needed lift/surge of optimism for the coming season
 
If you asked City fans last year, they would have said the same. Lots of deadwood and needing a major overhaul. But three good signings and a good manager made it possible for them. and very few of their players would have made it to our sqaud.

The most frustrating thing is if we had signed two or three quality players in the summer, it would have given few players a good competition and increased the morale even under Moyes. We would not have been looking at a major overhaul as many people want it now. It would have been a smooth transition. Instead we got fellaini in the last minute.:mad: How criminal was that?
 
OneUnited24 said:
I dont think Evra, RvP or Carrick will be going anywhere. Even if we get a new midfielder (please god!) and a new LB having the experience of Evra and Carrick will be great. If we are getting who i think we are getting i dont think RvP will be going anywhere. Probably likely had Moyes still been in charge but no i dont see it.

IMO the players who should/will be leaving are: Nani, Anderson, Giggs, Rio, Vidic, Hernandez and Young. In we will get a LB, 2 midfielders (actual midfielders not number 10s that we put there), a pacey winger and possibly another RB or CB. That for me should be enough for next season given we arent going to be in Europe next season.
Click to expand...

Would you rather him than Welbeck? Both can only play as forwards and Hernandez is better than him at goal scoring and making good runs. Would be a real weapon to bring on from the bench against tiring defense.
 
bleedred said:
Would you rather him than Welbeck? Both can only play as forwards and Hernandez is better than him at goal scoring and making good runs. Would be a real weapon to bring on from the bench against tiring defense.
Click to expand...
I like Hernandez but think Welbeck offers us more than him. Also i dont rate Hernandez as much as some on here - hes good, as you say, coming off the bench but i think he wants a starting role and hes just not good enough to...
 
City underperfomed last season but they still had an excellent spine to their team in Hart, Kompany, Zabaleta, Toure, Silva and Aguero. It was always likely that they would improve this season.

We are in a very different situation. With Rio, Vidic, Evra and Giggs probably leaving and the likes of Carrick potentially in decline, we need to rebuild that core of our team.
I can't see any manager winning us the league next season, there's too much work needed.
 
The midfield is awful no doubt about that, other than mata, januzaj, carrick and Valencia I think we should be prepared to listen to offers for all the other midfielders/wingers (excluding the youngsters like lingard, lawrence etc). The likes of young, anderson, nani and one or two of fletcher/fellaini/Cleverley have to go no matter what but how realistic that will be with van gaal not arriving until July I am not sure.
 
sullydnl said:
City underperfomed last season but they still had an excellent spine to their team in Hart, Kompany, Zabaleta, Toure, Silva and Aguero. It was always likely that they would improve this season.

We are in a very different situation. With Rio, Vidic, Evra and Giggs probably leaving and the likes of Carrick potentially in decline, we need to rebuild that core of our team.
I can't see any manager winning us the league next season, there's too much work needed.
Click to expand...
Do we though?

We have a good core, DDG, Evans/Smalling, Carrick (getting on but this season aside hes been one of our best performers) Rooney, RvP - hardly sunday league players. I still maintain 2 CMF, a left back, winger and we'll be set.
 
Central midfield is the only 'awful' area. There are tweaks to be made elsewhere - Nani and Valencia either need a return to form or to be replaced, and we need a new first-choice LB. The problem is that it's hard to see how strong we are elsewhere - our #10s, our strikers, Januzaj, Rafa, the potential of Jones-Evans-Smalling as our CB trio - because no team can play well without a good midfield.

It needs to be a much bigger summer than we're used to, but mostly that's down to a problem that we've failed to address for five seasons now. The real catastrophe this season has been the management.
 
OneUnited24 said:
Do we though?

We have a good core, DDG, Evans/Smalling, Carrick (getting on but this season aside hes been one of our best performers) Rooney, RvP - hardly sunday league players. I still maintain 2 CMF, a left back, winger and we'll be set.
Click to expand...

Evans and Smalling have yet to prove they have what it takes to be part of the core of a top team. Promoting them to that position would be part of the rebuild I'm talking about.

Even if Carrick isn't in decline he soon will be. Age is not on his side.

RvP and Rooney have struggled to play together as much as we'd want due to injury and there are plenty of posters here who'll tell you that partnership doesn't work particularly well.

I don't think we need that many players, even four would be enough. They have to be four players we can build the rest of the team around though, which is what I mean when I say we need to replace that spine of our team.
 
sullydnl said:
Evans and Smalling have yet to prove they have what it takes to be part of the core of a top team. Promoting them to that position would be part of the rebuild I'm talking about.

Even if Carrick isn't in decline he soon will be. Age is not on his side.

RvP and Rooney have struggled to play together as much as we'd want due to injury and there are plenty of posters here who'll tell you that partnership doesn't work particularly well.

I don't think we need that many players, even four would be enough. They have to be four players we can build the rest of the team around though, which is what I mean when I say we need to replace that spine of our team.
Click to expand...
Both Evans and Smalling have proven they are capable of playing CB but havent been given a chance to play there consistently with the need to give Rio and Vidic game time - which up till this season made sense but i honestly think Evans/Smalling should have been our starting CBs but Moyes was intent on going with experience.

We all admit that midfield will be a area we need to strengthen and i think thats what we will be doing but having Carrick there will not be a bad thing. Having him sit in front of the back four with a naturally offensive MF partner i think he will still shine as pace isnt vital to his game.

I'll give you RvP and Rooney have yet to *click* but just replace one of them with Mata. Regardless to say i don't think the spine of the team is that bad and most of the rebuilding will be done in the wide areas (and central midfield which we've all known for a few years now!)
 
Management has arguably been the biggest flaw in our season this season, but this is still a distinctly average squad. It makes me laugh when people suggest we have the second best squad in the league, which is simply false. We have some excellent individual quality with some of our players, but the standard beyond those players more or less drops significantly.

That being said, I think five players could create a strong squad that can compete at the top of the league next season. That isn't my expectancy, as there is a lot of work for van Gaal to do, but if do spend in excess of a reported £100M or so than we should expect to fare well in the league next season, particularly without the distraction of European football. Said signings, would have to be players that have an instant impact on the team however. I think we should be looking at a minimum of four first team starters in terms of signings next season and a competitive winger, even though we are strong in the offensive positions.
 
charleysurf said:
Well, this is hilarious, in a horrible kind of way.
Click to expand...

Wait for next season with largely the same squad, now that the arsehole is no longer in charge. Although Davey's fanatics may not like the upcoming improvement, it must be said.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.