The Americas Draft

A bit more on El Beto Garcia Aspe in case anyone isn't that familiar with him. Described by the BBC as 'a tireless midfield grafter', ranked as the midfielder with the highest average rating at World Cup 1994 (depending how you classify Hagi), who also had this kind of genius within him:

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six of you left to pick...let's get this done sharpish and we can get to the draw!! I've got Tuppet's.
 
ORLANDO PECANHA ...(TIM VICKERY)

Brazilian football lost one of its all-time greats last week when Orlando Peçanha died at the age of 74.

If he had to go, then maybe the forces of destiny and the gods of soccer thought it appropriate to take him on the eve of Carnaval. Perhaps they were trying to make a point, juxtaposing his loss with the start of the country's great party. Because as revelers fill the streets from Rio to Recife, there are many who like to see Brazilian soccer as one giant Carnaval, everyone more concerned with having fun than with the result, in a fabulous land full of skilled strikers and inept defenders.

It is a nonsensical point of view that does a monstrous disservice to those who have played defense for Brazil -- and none has done it better than Orlando Peçanha.

In a low-scoring game like soccer, it is simply not possible to win titles while giving away cheap goals, and the record shows that no one is better at winning titles than Brazil. Statistics reveal that in World Cups very few can better Brazil's defensive record. This is not only a result of the individual ability of the likes of Orlando but also the intense tactical experimentation that occurred in the Brazilian game around the middle of the last century.

It was Brazil that came up with the idea of the back four. The old WM system had space for three defenders -- two fullbacks and a center back (who formed the base of the M). Coming up against superb strikers every week in domestic soccer concentrated the minds of Brazilian coaches, who hit upon the idea of placing another man in the heart of the defense. Now there would always be cover; one would mark and the other would be spare, ready to mop up the danger if his colleague was beaten. And so the modern back four was born.

The Brazilians played the system in Sweden in 1958, the first time they won the World Cup, and still the only time they have won it in Europe. The heart of their defense would quickly become the classic center back pairing. There was big, towering Bellini, the team captain, with few technical flourishes, but highly effective at dealing with the aerial threat. And alongside him there was Orlando.

Excellent in the tackle and blessed with the crucial defender's gift of being able to read the game and sense danger before it appeared, Orlando was made for the role. The 1958 side was perhaps the most stereotypically "Brazilian" of all the country's World Cup-winning teams. The older members of the 1970 side I have spoken to seem to agree that man for man the '58 boys were better. The squad in Sweden could count on the youthfulPele, Garrincha's twisting fullbacks inside and out down the right wing,Didi's pulling the strings in midfield and Nilton Santos' charging forward elegantly from left back. But one of the notable facts of that campaign is that Brazil did not concede a goal until the semifinal. Such defensive solidity permitted the front players to take risks and express themselves.

According to veteran journalist Sergio Cabral, in the opinion of Didi, the brains of that 1958 team, Orlando was Brazil's best player in the World Cup. But Orlando couldn't receive the same praise when Brazil retained its title in Chile four years later. By this time he had left Vasco da Gama in his native Rio and joined Boca Juniors in Buenos Aires. He was an idol in Argentina, but it made not the slightest difference to his international ambitions. Brazil did not select players who were based abroad, and so, much to his regret, Orlando was not included on the squad.

He returned home in time for a last hurrah at the 1966 World Cup in England. A year earlier he left Boca and joined Santos to ensure that he would be eligible for selection. In hindsight, he might have wished he had stayed in Argentina.

It is not a World Cup that Brazil can look back on with any fondness. Orlando, 30 at the time, did not play in the first two matches. But after Brazil was beaten soundly by Hungary in the second, his introduction was one of nine changes made for the final group game against Portugal. With Pele kicked out of the game and opposing striker Eusebio on fire, Brazil lost 3-1 and was eliminated from the tournament.

Some 35 years later, I gently asked Orlando whether he had been too old for the competition. Not a bit, he replied. He was as good as ever, but the team had been undone by chaotic organization. His professional pride was still bruised by the result. In the 30 official games he played for his country, this was the only time he was on the losing side. And in those 30 games, the team conceded just 23 goals.

It is a magnificent record, and it goes to show that in the country of Carnaval the strikers and attacking midfielders might be full of feints and dummies and dance steps of individual inspiration, but there is also a strong defensive tradition of center backs who are just as skilled in their own, less eye-catching arts.
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If you had to pick the best ever Brazil team what would it be? (Tim Vickery)
Edward Steele

What a question! Talk about an embarrassment of riches!

In collective terms then the plaudits usually go to the 1970 team, who were obviously fantastic, but who had a key advantage over earlier sides - television.

They were the first ones seen live all over the world. The older players from 70 would concede that, man for man at least, the 1958 side were better - and they remain the only team to have won in Europe.

Of those teams which didn't win the World Cup, I think 1950 must have been something special,, and I've got a soft spot for 1982 - if only Careca had been fit to play centre forward!

In terms of an individual collection, this question obliges me to commit injustice upon injustice.

This is my personal choice - there are so many players to choose from that I don't think any two answers to this question would ever be the same (and I'm doing it on condition that I can have the biggest subs bench in history!)

Goalkeeper xxxxxxxxx
Right-back Jorginho (1990, 94)
Central defence Domingos da Guia (1938), Orlando Pecanha (1958, 66)
Left-back Nilton Santos (1950, 54, 58, 62)
Right wing Garrincha (1958, 62, 66)
Holding midfielder Toninho Cerezo (1978, 82)
Attacking midfielder Zizinho (1950)
Left wing Rivelino (1970, 74, 78)
Support striker Pele (1958, 62, 66, 70)
Centre forward Romario (1990, 94)
Subs: xxxxxxxxx
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA) 12. D. Bertoni (ARG) 13. Bebeto (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU) 12. M. Á. Brindisi (ARG) 13. S. Agüero (ARG)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA) 12. Gilberto Silva (BRA) 13. Quinonez (ECU)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG) 12. Cubilla (URU) 13. Ademir Da Guia (BRA) 14. A. Ortega (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR) 12. F. Rincón (COL) 13. S. Goycochea (ARG)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU) 12. Everaldo (BRA) 13. A Valencia (ECU) 14. Anderson

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA) 12. Ze Roberto (BRA) 13. P. Zabaleta (ARG) 14. Ariel Ortega (ARG)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA) 12. Lugano (URU) 13. Caniggia (ARG) 14. Alberto Garcia Aspe (MEX)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile) 12. Jair da Rosa Pinto (BRA) 13. Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório 'Coutinho' (BRA) 14. Oscar Mas (ARG)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU) 12. L. Perea (COL) 13. P. Aimar (ARG) 14. J. Valdano (ARG)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL) 13. Leonardo Araujo (BRA) 14. Keylor Navas ( COS)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA) 13. J. Olguin (ARG) 14. Orlando (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG) 13. G. Heinze (ARG) 14. Adriano Leite (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU) 13. J. Valdivia (CHI) 14. Juninho (Pernambucano) (BRA)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL) 13. H. Sotil (PER) 14. Oblitas (PER)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG) 13. Antonio Carbajal (MEX) 14. D.Yorke (T&T)

@Aldo
 
Raees said:
Goalkeeper xxxxxxxxx
Right-back Jorginho (1990, 94)
Central defence Domingos da Guia (1938), Orlando Pecanha (1958, 66)
Left-back Nilton Santos (1950, 54, 58, 62)
Right wing Garrincha (1958, 62, 66)
Holding midfielder Toninho Cerezo (1978, 82)
Attacking midfielder Zizinho (1950)
Left wing Rivelino (1970, 74, 78)
Support striker Pele (1958, 62, 66, 70)
Centre forward Romario (1990, 94)
Subs: xxxxxxxxx
Click to expand...

That's interesting take on the best Brazilian side. Romario and Jorginho are kind of controversial choices. Don't know much about da Guia, mine would probably be:

GK: Gilmar
RB: Cafu
LB: Nilton Santos
CB: Lucio
CB: Luis Pereira
LW: Zagallo/Rivelino
RW: Garrincha
DM: Zito
CM: Falcao
SS: Pele
CF: Ronaldo

Of course in attack there is plenty of options tho. Orlando is also someone who deserves appreciation.
 
Raees said:
Goalkeeper xxxxxxxxx
Right-back Jorginho (1990, 94)
Central defence Domingos da Guia (1938), Orlando Pecanha (1958, 66)
Left-back Nilton Santos (1950, 54, 58, 62)
Right wing Garrincha (1958, 62, 66)
Holding midfielder Toninho Cerezo (1978, 82)
Attacking midfielder Zizinho (1950)
Left wing Rivelino (1970, 74, 78)
Support striker Pele (1958, 62, 66, 70)
Centre forward Romario (1990, 94)
Subs: xxxxxxxxx
Click to expand...

Rest of it is - what - personal preference and whatnot. But that one is decidedly a bit odd.
 
Bias aside I agree with Vickery that Jorginho is a better right back than Alberto, Santos, Cafu, and Leandro.
 
"El Botija"
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Reunited with another great #10 from his country.
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Walter Gomez​

In a time where Schiaffino was enjoying all the glory I described, he wasn't even considered to be the best Uruguayan #10 in his own country. This honor was given to Walter Gomez, but since he was playing out of the country (again, River Plate of the late fourties and fifties), he didn't play in the national team. River fans used to sing: "La gente ya no come, por ver a Walter Gomez." (People do not eat, to see Walter Gomez.)
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA) 12. D. Bertoni (ARG) 13. Bebeto (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU) 12. M. Á. Brindisi (ARG) 13. S. Agüero (ARG)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA) 12. Gilberto Silva (BRA) 13. Quinonez (ECU)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG) 12. Cubilla (URU) 13. Ademir Da Guia (BRA) 14. A. Ortega (ARG)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR) 12. F. Rincón (COL) 13. S. Goycochea (ARG) 14. W. Gomez (URU)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU) 12. Everaldo (BRA) 13. A Valencia (ECU) 14. Anderson

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA) 12. Ze Roberto (BRA) 13. P. Zabaleta (ARG) 14. Ariel Ortega (ARG)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA) 12. Lugano (URU) 13. Caniggia (ARG) 14. Alberto Garcia Aspe (MEX)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile) 12. Jair da Rosa Pinto (BRA) 13. Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório 'Coutinho' (BRA) 14. Oscar Mas (ARG)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU) 12. L. Perea (COL) 13. P. Aimar (ARG) 14. J. Valdano (ARG)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL) 13. Leonardo Araujo (BRA) 14. Keylor Navas ( COS)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA) 13. J. Olguin (ARG) 14. Orlando (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG) 13. G. Heinze (ARG) 14. Adriano Leite (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU) 13. J. Valdivia (CHI) 14. Juninho (Pernambucano) (BRA)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL) 13. H. Sotil (PER) 14. Oblitas (PER)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG) 13. Antonio Carbajal (MEX) 14. D.Yorke (T&T)

@Tuppet
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA) 12. D. Bertoni (ARG) 13. Bebeto (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU) 12. M. Á. Brindisi (ARG) 13. S. Agüero (ARG)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA) 12. Gilberto Silva (BRA) 13. Quinonez (ECU)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG) 12. Cubilla (URU) 13. Ademir Da Guia (BRA)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR) 12. F. Rincón (COL) 13. S. Goycochea (ARG) 14. W. Gomez (URU)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU) 12. Everaldo (BRA) 13. A Valencia (ECU) 14. Anderson

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA) 12. Ze Roberto (BRA) 13. P. Zabaleta (ARG) 14. Ariel Ortega (ARG)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA) 12. Lugano (URU) 13. Caniggia (ARG) 14. Alberto Garcia Aspe (MEX)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile) 12. Jair da Rosa Pinto (BRA) 13. Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório 'Coutinho' (BRA) 14. Oscar Mas (ARG)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU) 12. L. Perea (COL) 13. P. Aimar (ARG) 14. J. Valdano (ARG)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL) 13. Leonardo Araujo (BRA) 14. Keylor Navas ( COS)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA) 13. J. Olguin (ARG) 14. Orlando (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG) 13. G. Heinze (ARG) 14. Adriano Leite (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU) 13. J. Valdivia (CHI) 14. Juninho (Pernambucano) (BRA)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL) 13. H. Sotil (PER) 14. Oblitas (PER)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG) 13. Antonio Carbajal (MEX) 14. D.Yorke (T&T)
 
hybrid of Davids and Ronaldinho, of course its a pick of the draft:cool:
 
@Tuppet picks:

El Loco

DZUvA8I.png


JUAN SEMINARIO
One of the most explosive South American attackers of all time, Juan Roberto Seminario Rodríguez is one of the best players to have come through from Peru. Blessed with express speed, Juan Seminario also possessed great close control and was an extremely skilled finisher which was evident when he won the Pichichi trophy in 1961-62 season with Real Zaragoza, over the likes of Alfredo Di Stéfano and Ferenc Puskás etc who had won the Pichichi for eight out of the nine years between them from 1955-1964.
 
Skizzo/Pat 1. Ronaldo (BRA) 2. L. Junior (BRA) 3. Joya (PER) 4. Bochini (ARG) 5. D. Pereyra (URU) 6. R. Pavoni (URU) 7. J. Altafini (BRA) 8. Rattin (ARG) 9. P. Forlan (URU) 10. Taffarel (BRA) 11. C. Mozer (BRA) 12. D. Bertoni (ARG) 13. Bebeto (BRA)

Enigma/Joga 1. M.Garrincha (BRA) 2. J.Zanetti (ARG) 3. D.Godin (URU) 4. Zito (BRA) 5. Ruben Sosa (URU) 6. J. Veron (ARG) 7. M.Kempes (ARG) 8. A. Ancheta (URU) 9. Branco (BRA) 10. L. Mazurkiewicz (URU) 11. F. Morena (URU) 12. M. Á. Brindisi (ARG) 13. S. Agüero (ARG)

oneniltothearsenal 1. Zico (BRA) 2. Domingos Da Guia (BRA) 3. Socrates (BRA) 4. Leonel Sánchez (CHI) 5. Eyzaguirre (CHI) 6. Careca (BRA) 7. R. Marcos (CHI) 8. Júlio César da Silva (BRA) 9. Marinho Chagas (BRA) 10. Yearwood (HON) 11. Gilmar (BRA) 12. Gilberto Silva (BRA) 13. Quinonez (ECU)

Tuppet 1. Romario (BRA) 2. L. Monti (ARG) 3. V. Andrade (URU) 4. Perfumo (ARG) 5. Hector Scarone (URU) 6. Roberto Matosas (URU) 7. Deco (BRA) 8. A. Sastre (ARG) 9. O. Caetano (URU) 10. Angel Labruna (ARG) 11. Amadeo Carrizo (ARG) 12. Cubilla (URU) 13. Ademir Da Guia (BRA) 14. Seminario (PER)

Aldo 1. D. Passarella (ARG) 2. R. Carlos (BRA) 3. E. Francescoli (URU) 4. O. Ruggeri (ARG) 5. J. Mascherano (ARG) 6. Leônidas Da Silva (BRA) 7. F. Arce (PAR) 8. A. Di María (ARG) 9. W. Martínez (URU) 10 M. Salas (CHI) 11. M. F. Solich (PAR) 12. F. Rincón (COL) 13. S. Goycochea (ARG) 14. W. Gomez (URU)

EAP/Sjor 1. Djalma (BRA) 2. O Varela (URU) 3. Neymar (BRA) 4. I Cordoba (COL) 5. P Rocha (URU) 6. Tostao (BRA) 7. Jair da Costa (BRA) 8. A Angelilo (ARG) 9. Hugo de Leon (URU) 10. M. Senna (BRA) 11. A Mazali (URU) 12. Everaldo (BRA) 13. A Valencia (ECU) 14. Anderson

Physio 1. H. Chumpitaz (PER) 2. T. Cubillas (PER) 3. C. Valderrama (COL) 4. Julinho (BRA) 5. G. Delgado (PER) 6. D. Simeone (ARG) 7. E. Cambiasso (ARG) 8. L. Artime (ARG) 9. Canhoteiro (BRA) 10. R.Higuita (COL) 11. L. Gustavo (BRA) 12. Ze Roberto (BRA) 13. P. Zabaleta (ARG) 14. Ariel Ortega (ARG)

Gio 1. Ronaldinho (BRA) 2. Nasazzi (URU) 3. Erico (PAR) 4. Zizinho (BRA) 5. Pedernera (ARG) 6. Mauro Silva (BRA) 7. Gambetta (URU) 8. Bellini (BRA) 9. José Leandro Ferreira (BRA) 10. J. Pizzaro (CHI) 11. Júlio César (GK) (BRA) 12. Lugano (URU) 13. Caniggia (ARG) 14. Alberto Garcia Aspe (MEX)

Maz/Mar/R 1. Didi (BRA) 2. Hugo Sanchez (MEX) 3. Marzolini (ARG) 4. Néstor Gonçalves (URU) 5. C. Gamarra (PAR) 6. Ghiggia (URU) 7. Zagallo (BRA) 8. Mauro Ramos (BRA) 9. Jorge Burruchaga (ARG) 10. Nelinho (BRA) 11. Claudio Bravo (Chile) 12. Jair da Rosa Pinto (BRA) 13. Antônio Wilson Vieira Honório 'Coutinho' (BRA) 14. Oscar Mas (ARG)

MounchesterUtd 1. Chilavert (PAR) 2. Rivelino (BRA) 3. Vidal (CHI) 4. Kaka (BRA) 5. W. Samuel (ARG) 6. Zamorano (CHI) 7. José Macia Pepe (BRA) 8. A. Gallego (ARG) 9. Marcelo (BRA) 10. Miranda (BRA) 11. P Bengoechea (URU) 12. L. Perea (COL) 13. P. Aimar (ARG) 14. J. Valdano (ARG)

DavidG 1. Cafu (BRA)2. Rivaldo ( BRA) 3. T. Silva ( BRA) 4. Aldair ( BRA) 5. Clodoaldo ( BRA) 6. Julio Cesar Romero ( PAR) 7. Michele Andreolo ( URU) 8. Radamel Falcao ( COL) 9. Juan Pablo Sorin (ARG) 10. "Magico" Gonzalez (ELS) 11. Leonel Alvarez (COL) 12. Andres Escobar (COL) 13. Leonardo Araujo (BRA) 14. Keylor Navas ( COS)

Raees 1. P.R. Falcao (BRA) 2. Jairzinho (BRA) 3. J.M. Moreno (ARG) 4. P. Montero (URU) 5. R. Ayala (ARG) 6. A.Recoba (URU) 7. Orsi (ARG) 8. Pedro Petrone (URU) 9. V.Benitez (PER) 10. U. Fillol (ARG) 11. Eusebio Tejera (URU) 12. A.Friedenreich (BRA) 13. J. Olguin (ARG) 14. Orlando (BRA)

Boris 1. Schiaffino (URU) 2. J.L. Andrade (URU) 3. Gerson (BRA) 4. A. Spencer (ECU) 5. J. Melendez (PER) 6. Nestor Rossi (ARG) 7. F. Loustau (ARG) 8. Jorginho (BRA) 9. Filipe Luis (BRA) 10. Edinho (BRA) 11. Emerson Leao (BRA) 12. Rene Houseman (ARG) 13. G. Heinze (ARG) 14. Adriano Leite (BRA)

Mciahel Goodman 1. C. Alberto (BRA) 2. G. Batistuta (ARG) 3. Lucio (BRA) 4. Dunga (BRA) 5. O. Ardilles (ARG) 6. Riquelme (ARG) 7. Crespo (ARG) 8. OPEN 9. R. Maspoli (URU) 10. W. Ortiz (COL) 11. E. Mascheroni (URU) 12. I. Hurtado (ECU) 13. J. Valdivia (CHI) 14. Juninho (Pernambucano) (BRA)

Jayvin 1. Redondo (ARG) 2. L. Suarez (URU) 3. Sivori (ARG) 4. Cueto (PER) 5. R. Marquez (MEX) 6. Maicon (BRA) 7. J. Velasquez (PER) 8. Tarantini (ARG) 9. Ricardo Gomes (BRA) 10. R. Sensini (ARG) 11. Corbatta (ARG) 12. O. Cordoba (COL) 13. H. Sotil (PER) 14. Oblitas (PER)

P-Nut/Downcast 1. N. Santos (BRA) 2. J.E. Santamaría (URU) 3. Dani Alves (BRA) 4. Alexis Sánchez (CHI) 5. Cerezo (BRA) 6. Luis Edm. Pereira (BRA) 7. D. Forlan (URU) 8. A.Quintano (CHI) 9. Tevez (ARG) 10. Danilo Alvim (BRA) 11. Ademir De Menezes (BRA) 12. C. Peucelle (ARG) 13. Antonio Carbajal (MEX) 14. D.Yorke (T&T)

@oneniltothearsenal
 
Can definitely tell there is some sentiment going on here :lol:

Yorke, Valencia and now Anderson!
 
Chesterlestreet said:
Rest of it is - what - personal preference and whatnot. But that one is decidedly a bit odd.
Click to expand...
Aye. In terms of actual World Cup performances, Jorginho did little wrong, was part of a solid defensive unit, and offered plenty going forward. For instance in 1994, a 24-year-old Cafu was firmly ensconced on the bench as Jorginho's back-up. Obviously I think the heights Cafu reached later in his career and his sustained performances at club level move him up a notch or two.
 
Gio said:
Aye. In terms of actual World Cup performances, Jorginho did little wrong, was part of a solid defensive unit, and offered plenty going forward. For instance in 1994, a 24-year-old Cafu was firmly ensconced on the bench as Jorginho's back-up. Obviously I think the heights Cafu reached later in his career and his sustained performances at club level move him up a notch or two.
Click to expand...

Well, he was a solid player - clearly so. Seems an odd inclusion in an all-time XI, though. Most would say Nilton, Alberto and Cafu (all of whom are in GOAT territory, nothing less) are simply on a different level - and there will be several others you could make a case for picking ahead of him too.

It's pretty much the same as picking Branco over Nilton for me. The only difference is that Nilton is unquestionable for that position - whereas whether you go with Djalma, Alberto or Cafu is a matter of preference more than anything. Going for Jorginho is very original, put it like that - regardless of what the possible take is (World Cup performances, specifically, or overall standing in the game).
 
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Really enjoyed this draft as was expected. Cheers Chester for running it. The drafting was top notch all round with all teams looking brilliant before the tournament. Here's my final squad:

LOS LOBOS​

GOYCOCHEA, Sergio (GK | Argentina)
PASSARELLA, Daniel (SW, CB | Argentina)
RUGGERI, Oscar (CB | Argentina)
MARTÍNEZ, William (DF, DM | Uruguay)
ROBERTO CARLOS (LB, LWB | Brazil)
ARCE, Francisco (RB | Paraguay)
MASCHERANO, Javier (CB, DM | Argentina)
RINCÓN, Freddy (CM | Colombia)
SOLICH, Manuel Fleitas (CM | Paraguay)
DI MARÍA, Angel (CM, AM, LW | Argentina)
GOMEZ, Walter (AM | Uruguay)
FRANCESCOLI, Enzo (AM, SS, LWF | Uruguay)
LEÔNIDAS Da Silva (RWF, SS, ST | Brazil)
SALAS, Marcelo (ST | Chile)
 
Aldo said:
Really enjoyed this draft as was expected. Cheers Chester for running it. The drafting was top notch all round with all teams looking brilliant before the tournament. Here's my final squad:
Click to expand...

Agreed. Looking forward to the draw.
 
Ill take Ignacio Prieto chile, cant update now
 
The draw tonight?

Skizzo/Pat may already send their last pick to Chester/harms :)
 
Then - as is the tradition - time to make a listing of the 'FORGOTTEN GREAT PLAYERS'.

No more than 4-5 players IMO.
 
Aldo said:
Really enjoyed this draft as was expected. Cheers Chester for running it. The drafting was top notch all round with all teams looking brilliant before the tournament. Here's my final squad:

LOS LOBOS​

GOYCOCHEA, Sergio (GK | Argentina)
PASSARELLA, Daniel (SW, CB | Argentina)
RUGGERI, Oscar (CB | Argentina)
MARTÍNEZ, William (DF, DM | Uruguay)
ROBERTO CARLOS (LB, LWB | Brazil)
ARCE, Francisco (RB | Paraguay)
MASCHERANO, Javier (CB, DM | Argentina)
RINCÓN, Freddy (CM | Colombia)
SOLICH, Manuel Fleitas (CM | Paraguay)
DI MARÍA, Angel (CM, AM, LW | Argentina)
GOMEZ, Walter (AM | Uruguay)
FRANCESCOLI, Enzo (AM, SS, LWF | Uruguay)
LEÔNIDAS Da Silva (RWF, SS, ST | Brazil)
SALAS, Marcelo (ST | Chile)
Click to expand...

187-fiesta-mexico_s01.jpg
 
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Double entendre. If you know then you know.
 
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