Film Star Wars

Podracing stuff was okayish, I'll give you that. Honestly it was a quite fun scene to watch.

Darth Maul was awesome and unique indeed mainly thanks to being portrayed more like a Sith assassin than a typical lord in the order plus of course his famous saber wielding techniques and fight style. He saved that movie from being a total kid drama.

CGI Yoda sucked violent balls in Phantom Menace and Lucas has no excuse for this feck up. It was really that hard to make another puppet, even better than the one in Empire Strikes Back ? They had to make another Special Edition to correct his face because he looked like an effin gremlin.
 
feck's sake, everybody hates this film except me. Darth Maul is awesome and so is Jar Jar Binks!

Darth Maul is overrated and Jar Jar is terrible.

I love the movie though, but that comes because it is Star Wars rather than because it is a good movie. Similar to Manchester United (at the moment).
 
Darth Maul is overrated and Jar Jar is terrible.

I love the movie though, but that comes because it is Star Wars rather than because it is a good movie. Similar to Manchester United (at the moment).

Speaking of Darths, who is your favourite? Besides the obvious...

I'd probably go with Nihilus
 
Speaking of Darths, who is your favourite? Besides the obvious...

I'd probably go with Nihilus

Palpatine possibly. After I read the Darth Plagueis book (which I must say is a fantastic reading, for me second to only Heir to the Empire novel) I like him even more.

Darth Vitiate was very evil but such a badass so I like him too. Bane was a big idealist.

Likely thins three in the order I mentioned. Don't like that much Nihilius, he was a bit lucky to get connected to the force on such a way and even after he became so powerful, still didn't knew what he wanted. Vitiate is a big improvement on him.
 
Darth Vectivus...
As he helped turning Han and Leia's son into Darth Caedus... That pissed of his Jedi sister..
 
Generating some Star Wars nerdish debate:

What do you think would have happened if both Yoda and Kenobi would have gone to fight Palps together (ignoring Skywalker)? Kenobi was the third-fourth most powerful Jedi of his time so it isn't out of question that they would have defeated him.

Also, why the heck Mace stupid Windu didn't wait for Yoda and Kenobi before he went to fight Palpatine. I think that with any of them on the team, Palpatine would have lost. And Kenobi would have controled Skywalker.

Stupid Jedi!

It wouldn't have mattered if Obi-Wan was there. If he's not capable of beating Palpatine on his own he would be a hindrance. Palpatine could play it against Yoda similarly to how Dooku did with Anakin. I'm not even sure that Obi-Wan could defend against the force lightning like Yoda could. Yoda knows what it is but Obi-Wan probably has never seen it before.

Palpatine was a bit lucky not to have died. Yoda was as well but at least it would have been a draw that favored the Jedi.

You might say that Yoda did defeat him. Palpatine, instead of trying to finish off Yoda, went to Vader. Ironically that's something that Sith find to be a weakness. Either it was a weakness and mistake from Palpatine (since it eventually cost him his life) or it was poorly written. Bane would simply think that if Vader would die, he wouldn't be the chosen one (assuming Bane would believe in stuff like the chosen one).
 
The whole prequel trilogy is full of bad story writing.

Changing the force into a chemicals (Midichlorians) that somehow runs in your blood is against Star Wars spirit but new generation of hipsters needs to have everything explained these days.

Actually, Lucas had always written it that way. He came up with midichlorians before 1977. The midichlorians aren't the force however. They're microorganisms. They're somehow related to the force and a high midichlorian rate suggests force sensitivity but it isn't the force.

Midi-chlorians were intelligent microscopic life forms that lived symbiotically inside the cells of all living things. When present in sufficient numbers, they could allow their host to detect the pervasive energy field known as the Force. Midi-chlorian counts were linked to potential in the Force
 
Actually, Lucas had always written it that way. He came up with midichlorians before 1977. The midichlorians aren't the force however. They're microorganisms. They're somehow related to the force and a high midichlorian rate suggests force sensitivity but it isn't the force.
Great explanation. Thank You for taking time and pointing this out but I still think that type of knowledge fits more into Star Trek 'science' than Star Wars and it's strong mythical aura.

Personally for me it kills the atmosphere as Qui-Gon Jinn - an experienced Jedi Master should be able to trust his own force and instinct in sensing Skywalker's potential. That's just me. Maybe I'm just too jaded with the prequel trilogy too much but Mega Thanks anyway, mate. I feel more informed with that fact now.
 
Great explanation. Thank You for taking time and pointing this out but I still think that type of knowledge fits more into Star Trek 'science' than Star Wars and it's strong mythical aura.

Personally for me it kills the atmosphere as Qui-Gon Jinn - an experienced Jedi Master should be able to trust his own force and instinct in sensing Skywalker's potential. That's just me. Maybe I'm just too jaded with the prequel trilogy too much but Mega Thanks anyway, mate. I feel more informed with that fact now.

Here's a little more. It's actually quite smart I think what Lucas did. It just comes off a bit tard-ish when he puts it on the screen. He has some difficulties with that.
Midi-chlorians in The Phantom Menace are part of a recurring theme throughout the movie, that of symbiotic relationships.They were loosely based on mitochondria, organelles that provide energy for cells; like midi-chlorians, mitochondria are believed to have once been separate organisms that inhabited living cells and have since become part of them; even now, mitochondria act in some ways as independent lifeforms, with DNA all their own. Lucas established this relation with mitochondria, in particular the necessity of midi-chlorians for life to exist, as a metaphor for society; namely, he says all parts of society must get along in much the same way the midi-chlorians and their symbiont do.
 
Here's a little more. It's actually quite smart I think what Lucas did. It just comes off a bit tard-ish when he puts it on the screen. He has some difficulties with that.
This is becoming quite fascinating now. I never knew that Lucas has put so much weight in the science department when working on the origin of force. The idea of complex metaphors were present in Stanley Kubrick's work which I guess compliments Lucas as an artist.

I'm actually more impressed than confused about it now.
 
Generating some Star Wars nerdish debate:

What do you think would have happened if both Yoda and Kenobi would have gone to fight Palps together (ignoring Skywalker)? Kenobi was the third-fourth most powerful Jedi of his time so it isn't out of question that they would have defeated him.

Also, why the heck Mace stupid Windu didn't wait for Yoda and Kenobi before he went to fight Palpatine. I think that with any of them on the team, Palpatine would have lost. And Kenobi would have controled Skywalker.

Stupid Jedi!

Surely Palpatine couldn't have beaten Kenobi and Yoda together...

I've never read into the star wars EU stuff (beyond some kiddie books about Obi Wan and Qui Gon's early years together) so I'm sure there's lots of factors I'm unaware of, but Yoda was doing pretty well on his own. Can't possibly see how Obi Wan wouldn't turn that one for the Jedi.
 
It wouldn't have mattered if Obi-Wan was there. If he's not capable of beating Palpatine on his own he would be a hindrance. Palpatine could play it against Yoda similarly to how Dooku did with Anakin. I'm not even sure that Obi-Wan could defend against the force lightning like Yoda could. Yoda knows what it is but Obi-Wan probably has never seen it before.

Palpatine was a bit lucky not to have died. Yoda was as well but at least it would have been a draw that favored the Jedi.

You might say that Yoda did defeat him. Palpatine, instead of trying to finish off Yoda, went to Vader. Ironically that's something that Sith find to be a weakness. Either it was a weakness and mistake from Palpatine (since it eventually cost him his life) or it was poorly written. Bane would simply think that if Vader would die, he wouldn't be the chosen one (assuming Bane would believe in stuff like the chosen one).

I am not sure about that. If I am not mistaken Dooku neutralizing OWK as easy as he did was more because of their styles of fighting (Dooku being the master of a style of fighting for which Kenobi had no idea how to defend). But probably Sidious knew that too. On the other side, the presence of Yoda there wouldn't let Sidious having the time Dooku had. But yeah, I think that likely Kenobi would have died on that duel which means that Skywalker would have become much more powerful then he did (he lost a lot of midichlorians after his duel with Kenobi).

On the other side, Yoda, Windu and Kenobi would have defeated Palps for sure. Shame that only Master Fistu thought that and adviced Windu to wait for them, but Windu was a bit arrogant (overconfident) on his abilities.
 
So, one of my friends has never seen any Star Wars before, and as I have them all on blu-ray (well my brother does) she insists we watch them all over the coming weeks. Now, being that I want the experience to get better as it goes along, we're going in George Lucas order, and yesterday we started with Phantom Menace... a few things stood out to me:

  • How fecking racist are those trade federation gimps? They are exactly like badly dubbed old chinease martial arts films... but not played for comedy.
  • George Lucas is wank at naming things.... case point "Well these aren't just ordinary droids... they roll around and move fast... much like cars... in fact, I'll call them droidykars"
  • Those rolly droid things are so powerful, why on earth didn't Vadar want them as part of his Empire? Oh wait...
  • Not only is Jar Jar Binks awful, he now looks terrible on blu-ray. With all the humans being in HD, it makes it so blanatly obvious it's a CG creation... it might as well be Who Framed Roger Rabbit.
  • Fake Queen Amidala actually makes the REAL Queen Amidala clean a droid... what the feck? That's your queen!
  • Mind tricks don't work on that flying alien... mainly because they can't for the plot to progress and George Lucas is lazy... but also because he's a Toydarian... or something
  • It really doesn't take much to have a senate reform. One vote of no confidence? Jesus christ... I realise such motions exist, but it usually takes more then one pissed of person to change who's in charge... surely?!
  • Palpatine's plan is all over the place... he doesn't want her to leave the planet, but he needs her to leave the planet to vote no confidence? what?
  • I could go on, but I'll leave with the most sinister thing... in pretty much the very last shot, 19 year old Natalie Portman turns towards that 9/10 year boy Anakin, smiles, and then bites her lip.... it's fecking weird.

    Anyway, I conclude that this is probably the worst Star Wars film...

It falls apart after the first act. The second act (them fecking around on Tatooine) basically entirely undermines the idea that the Trade Federation are committing mass human rights breaches on Naboo because the Queen is basically content to get involved in some kind of intergalactic door to door knocking/local drag race over the course of a week or so instead of high tailing it to Coruscant to get help for her people.

Bear in mind by this point in the film we've seen Qui Gonn use the Jedi mind trick to
a) basically steal a submarine from the Gungans ("You will speed us on our way"), and
b) try and make Watto accept a currency that is entirely useless to him.

Especially given that a New Hope shows us that there is a trade in star ship charters on Tatooine the film basically grinds to a fecking stupid halt as soon as he doesn't immediately go and procure with money or mind trick another ship for them to leave on - it tells the audience that what is happening on Tatooine isn't really that important.

While I don't want to play the 'hey lets re write the prequels' game, they could for example have found a ship piloted by a hotshot pilot (and braggart slightly in the Han Solo mold) named... Anakin Skywalker. He could have given them passage to Coruscant, decided he fancied a bit of that Queen (who would NOT have been 14 for the purposes of this exercise) and that would have given him reason to fly back to Naboo with them afterwards (as opposed to the actual reason given by Lucas, which is that Anakin went to Naboo with them because Qui Gonn promised his mother that he'd look after him... by taking him into a war zone). Then he could have legitimately taken part in the battle against the Droid Control Ship, as opposed to accidentally crashing into it because he's barely out of nappies and destroying it from the inside out, which was fecking stupid.

ON a side note, and not to go on and on about how shit Phantom Menace was, but I watched it the other day with directors commentary (I've been working through the saga like this whenever I've got housework to do) and Lucas and whichever muppets were there with him commented that they wanted the battle against the Droid Control Ship to be as tense and climactic as the battle at the end of A New Hope. fecking fail. On two levels.
1. What were they trying to actually do? I think we're meant to assume that they're trying to destroy the ship, but how were they going to do this? This is important to convey to the audience because we have no actual idea how well they were doing at this before Anakin showed up and accidentally won the battle for them - there's no tension. There's no moment equivalent to Red Leader missing the exhaust port and telling the rest of the squad to go on without him before being gunned down by Vader - you get no sense of how the battle is actually going.
2. It was ultimately entirely fecking pointless destroying it anyway - by the time Anakin accidentally flew into it and accidentally fired his torpedoes into the accidental reactor, the Gungan army had surrendered and were being taken prisoner, and the Queen had already reached and subdued the leader of the Trade Federation (ie the guy in charge of the robots anyway).

It's an entirely pointless sequence.

* She was 17 :wenger:


Playing a 14 year old.

Which makes it even creepier (and the entire film even stupider)
 
It falls apart after the first act. The second act (them fecking around on Tatooine) basically entirely undermines the idea that the Trade Federation are committing mass human rights breaches on Naboo because the Queen is basically content to get involved in some kind of intergalactic door to door knocking/local drag race over the course of a week or so instead of high tailing it to Coruscant to get help for her people.

He wasn't content of doing so, but Qui Gon was her last hope of leaving Naboo. And then the ship had problems so in order to repair it, Anakin had to do the race. There wasn't any other option.

Bear in mind by this point in the film we've seen Qui Gonn use the Jedi mind trick to
a) basically steal a submarine from the Gungans ("You will speed us on our way"), and
b) try and make Watto accept a currency that is entirely useless to him.

Well, desperate times call for extreme things. Qui Gon wasn't entirely dogmatic like the rest of the main Jedi masters (the main reason why he never got a seat on the Jedi High Council) and didn't entirely believe that you can only do the right things in order to avoid the temptation of the dark side. Trying to fool watto - while it wasn't a right thing to do - looked the only option to stop the war on Naboo.

Especially given that a New Hope shows us that there is a trade in star ship charters on Tatooine the film basically grinds to a fecking stupid halt as soon as he doesn't immediately go and procure with money or mind trick another ship for them to leave on - it tells the audience that what is happening on Tatooine isn't really that important.

20 years later though. Probably it didn't exist at that time.

Playing a 14 year old.

Which makes it even creepier (and the entire film even stupider)

Yep, Padme Naberrie being queen at 14 years old was a bit stupid. Naboo was a democratic planet when the queen/king was more symbolic then on other places (well similar to Aldeeran) and was chose on free election, though still I don't see why the hell they chose a kid for queen. Despite that Palps did a lot of plotting for that to happen, still it was stupid. Interestingly enough, she even wasn't the youngest queen on Naboo's history.
 
He wasn't content of doing so, but Qui Gon was her last hope of leaving Naboo. And then the ship had problems so in order to repair it, Anakin had to do the race. There wasn't any other option.



Well, desperate times call for extreme things. Qui Gon wasn't entirely dogmatic like the rest of the main Jedi masters (the main reason why he never got a seat on the Jedi High Council) and didn't entirely believe that you can only do the right things in order to avoid the temptation of the dark side. Trying to fool watto - while it wasn't a right thing to do - looked the only option to stop the war on Naboo.

That's kind of the point though - it loses all urgency when he doesn't just walk up to someone hawking their services as a charter pilot and go "You will accept 20 Republic Dactaries to take us to Coruscant", because we've seen that he's willing to do that kind of thing up to that point in the film.

20 years later though. Probably it didn't exist at that time.

You're like the biggest KOTOR1 fan I can think of - you know it's basically unchanged for like 4000 years.
 
You're like the biggest KOTOR1 fan I can think of - you know it's basically unchanged for like 4000 years.

Well, yeah but things could have changed during the time. It isn't a good explanation - to be fair - cause Tatooine was a planet where a lot of smugglers live so it would have been a bit strange to not find people who change currencies but anyway.
 
Why couldn't they just have got a 18 year old to to play Anakin and then Natalie Portman could have been... you know... 18?
 
Why couldn't they just have got a 18 year old to to play Anakin and then Natalie Portman could have been... you know... 18?

I think that George Lucas wanted the first movie to also attract kids (I think that it was also the main reason why Shit Shit Binks had such a big role).

I don't agree with the young Anakin hate though. Jake Lloyd did a better job than Hayden Christensen on the second episode. It burned the Darth Vader being fearful cause we saw him as a kid, but still I think it was ok. The non development of how Anakin became Vader was a far bigger problem IMO, and only after watching the TV show and read the novel somehow I accepted it. The novel fixes a lot of job there, and it is quite a shame that the movie cut a few things especially considering that the novel was published a month after the movie.
 
I think that George Lucas wanted the first movie to also attract kids (I think that it was also the main reason why Shit Shit Binks had such a big role).

I don't agree with the young Anakin hate though. Jake Lloyd did a better job than Hayden Christensen on the second episode. It burned the Darth Vader being fearful cause we saw him as a kid, but still I think it was ok. The non development of how Anakin became Vader was a far bigger problem IMO, and only after watching the TV show and read the novel somehow I accepted it. The novel fixes a lot of job there, and it is quite a shame that the movie cut a few things especially considering that the novel was published a month after the movie.

Extra number 44 did a better job than Hayden Christensen... still doesn't make the job Jake Lloyd did good. Regardless though, casting a kid in that role caused loads of problems. Casting a bad actor for the next two films only made the problems worse. Giving him a terrible story arch made it awful.
 
Extra number 44 did a better job than Hayden Christensen... still doesn't make the job Jake Lloyd did good. Regardless though, casting a kid in that role caused loads of problems. Casting a bad actor for the next two films only made the problems worse. Giving him a terrible story arch made it awful.

Christensen was fine of Revenge of The Sith IMO. The problem was Attack of The Clones when he looked more like a teenager who plays comedy moves than the next Darth Vader. Looyd did a good job IMO, but people didn't want to see Darth Vader as a kid and for that was unfairly criticized. For example I never understood why people disliked so much when he said 'yipes'. Well he would eventually become one of the best antagonists ever and a terrible person, but still, a kid is a kid.

Interestingly, there were more than a thousand candidates for the character of Anakin Skywalker and somehow Lucas decided to go for Christensen. One of those people was also Leonardo Di Caprio who in 2004 (the same year as when Revenge of The Sith was released) gave a pefect performance on 'The Aviator'.
 
I think that George Lucas wanted the first movie to also attract kids (I think that it was also the main reason why Shit Shit Binks had such a big role).
If that's the case, then Lucas must have a terrible and not very flattering view on what kids enjoy. Jar Jar Binks...
I don't agree with the young Anakin hate though. Jake Lloyd did a better job than Hayden Christensen on the second episode.
That's setting the bar very low.
 
If that's the case, then Lucas must have a terrible and not very flattering view on what kids enjoy. Jar Jar Binks...

My 8-9 years old nephew liked Jar Jar. Also other kids I know thought that he was funny.

The problem was that Star Wars shouldn't have been targeted for kids, and it was good that they fixed a bit of that in the other two movies (especially in the last one) which was way more darker.
 
My 8-9 years old nephew liked Jar Jar. Also other kids I know thought that he was funny.

The problem was that Star Wars shouldn't have been targeted for kids, and it was good that they fixed a bit of that in the other two movies (especially in the last one) which was way more darker.

I thought he was funny when I was a kid.
 
I always liked Jar-Jar.


247.gif


Posting gifs may or may not be against the rules, I don't keep up with these things.

You deserve this.
 
Christensen was fine of Revenge of The Sith IMO. The problem was Attack of The Clones when he looked more like a teenager who plays comedy moves than the next Darth Vader. Looyd did a good job IMO, but people didn't want to see Darth Vader as a kid and for that was unfairly criticized. For example I never understood why people disliked so much when he said 'yipes'. Well he would eventually become one of the best antagonists ever and a terrible person, but still, a kid is a kid.

Interestingly, there were more than a thousand candidates for the character of Anakin Skywalker and somehow Lucas decided to go for Christensen. One of those people was also Leonardo Di Caprio who in 2004 (the same year as when Revenge of The Sith was released) gave a pefect performance on 'The Aviator'.

Agreed. He was pretty good in the third movie I thought. Did the whole "tortured young man making a series of bad decisions spiralling into madness" thing very well. Looked the part more as well. Still let down by the shitty writing at times, but he did what he could with it.

As for the kid, I never had an issue with seeing Vader as a child. I think I actually liked the story arc more seeing him go from wide eyed, altruistic child to...well just about the most famous villain in history. Anakin's development as a whole is definitely my favourite part of the prequel trilogy. Podraces and Darth Maul a distant second.
 
One of the most hilariously stupid things about Phantom Menace was how they all just accepted without a single word that only Watto sells the ship part they're looking for. "Hmm, this nice slave trader tells us he's the only one who's got a very expensive part on the ENTIRE feckING PLANET. We should definitely believe him".

Agreed. He was pretty good in the third movie I thought. Did the whole "tortured young man making a series of bad decisions spiralling into madness" thing very well. Looked the part more as well. Still let down by the shitty writing at times, but he did what he could with it.

As for the kid, I never had an issue with seeing Vader as a child. I think I actually liked the story arc more seeing him go from wide eyed, altruistic child to...well just about the most famous villain in history. Anakin's development as a whole is definitely my favourite part of the prequel trilogy. Podraces and Darth Maul a distant second.

I'll never understand the Darth Maul love-in that even got him resurrected in a retarded way in the series. I mean, what do we learn about him in the movies? He looks cool and has a rasping voice... erm... that's it. Considering he's supposed to be the antagonist in the climactic battle at the end, we know feck all about him and see him twice before that battle. I couldn't give a feck about him, he was little more than any of the hundreds of stormtroopers that totally fail to land a single hit on Han and co. in the original trilogy. Just an extra.

Christensen did okay in RotS but any time I see him I'm forcefully and unpleasantly reminded of the awful, tortured dialogues between him and Natalie Portman in Attack of the Clones. I remember I almost died of pure cringe when I first heard him talking about how sand gets into his vagina.
 
I watched quite a few of then recently when they were on itv, and I realised how many scenes in,1-2 are taken straight out of films 4-6. I can't really renener them now but loads of thdm are basically the same... But worse. Except in 1-2 the bits that aren't taken out of 4-6 are basically talking politics and being boring
 
One of the most hilariously stupid things about Phantom Menace was how they all just accepted without a single word that only Watto sells the ship part they're looking for. "Hmm, this nice slave trader tells us he's the only one who's got a very expensive part on the ENTIRE feckING PLANET. We should definitely believe him".

Tatooine has a very small population I think (less than half a million or so).

I'll never understand the Darth Maul love-in that even got him resurrected in a retarded way in the series. I mean, what do we learn about him in the movies? He looks cool and has a rasping voice... erm... that's it. Considering he's supposed to be the antagonist in the climactic battle at the end, we know feck all about him and see him twice before that battle. I couldn't give a feck about him, he was little more than any of the hundreds of stormtroopers that totally fail to land a single hit on Han and co. in the original trilogy. Just an extra.

Spot on. I think that I have started to hate him and Boba Fett for the only reason that somehow people think that they are amazing because they...look cool and do some stupid moves. At-least they gave to Boba a back story, while the back story of Maul is even less intriguing than him. He was pretty much an assasin who was chosen by Palps when he was a baby and trained to deal with lesser enemies of him and his Master (Darth Plagueis). Reading his backstory, he isn't even a real Sith, just like Asajj Ventress he's just a weapon of the Sith Apprentice. Pointless at all, and I hated when he somehow magically returned from the dead to then try to do some things which he in the end completely failed. And they still let him alive in the end because he is cool. Or I dunno. A pointless character that somehow for no reason at all became popular.

It is even more amazing that how a truly developed and very deep character like Darth Tyranus/Count Dooku who was more powerful, smarter, wiser, more experienced and had much more role than him on the saga isn't near as popular as him. I guess they should have given a fancy lightsaber to Sir Christopher Lee, tatoo his face and make him do some stupid moves.
 
Darth Maul is basically the Boba Fett of the prequels.

Well actually he's a bit better than Boba seeing as he actually does something before dying and being needlessly venerated.

I love the idea of Dooku but as far as the movies go he is unfortunately underdeveloped and what is meant to be his big 'reveal' (that he's actually working for the Sith) is handled so stupidly.

- The first we hear of him is suggestions of rumours that he's behind the assassination attempt on Padme, which Mace Windu denies because he used to be a Jedi and is therefore honourable. At this point all we know as the audience is that he used to be a Jedi.

- The next time he's involved is the first we actually see of him, where he chairs a conference of idiotic space CGI muppets, including the (racist) bad guys from the first prequel, talking about how they're going to build a robot army. At this point the audience knows that he's in league with the bad guys.

- Then we see him interrogating Obi Wan and letting him know that there's a Sith Lord in charge of the Senate. Dooku then leaves Obi Wan's ass strung up when Obi Wan doesn't join Dooku's cause. At this point we can see that Dooku is a bit of a wanker.

- Then we see him standing around with the space CGI muppets at a public execution for the protagonists that he helped organise. By this point we know that he's in charge of the bad guys, is a wanker and a bit of a liar, and organised the public execution of the good guys.

- Then in the hangar as he tries to make his escape - we're meant to be shocked that he's got a bunch of dark side powers and a red lightsaber, and when he starts lopping peoples limbs off?

- Finally, at the end of the film when he lands on Coruscant, we see him being all subservient to Sidious - was anyone at all in the world shocked by this reveal? He's a Sith Lord, we've been told that "Always two, they are", and he's been chilling with the people who were working for the Sith Lord during the first film?

(the idea that this is meant to be a big dramatic reveal is taken from the comments of George Lucas in his directors commentary on the Attack of the Clones DVD)

It goes back to a deeper problem with the second two prequels though - that Lucas didn't even try for one second to try and make the Separatists anything but cardboard cutout Saturday morning cartoon bad guys. This was a misstep - so so many wars of independence have been fought in history that were entirely justified and righteous that to not even bother pretending that they were a legitimate movement basically closes off a massive amount of storytelling opportunities for him. He can't hide the fact that Dooku is a Sith Lord because he's working directly with the bad guys with the robot army from the first film (WHY ARE THEY EVEN INVOLVED?), Padme has to carry the can on her own vis a vis the whole 'corrupted democracy' storyline, and the audience never has cause to consider things from the side of the Separatists because they're just a bunch of space muppets with a robot army who aren't to be taken seriously (and are to be sliced up gratuitously).
 
I'll never understand the Darth Maul love-in that even got him resurrected in a retarded way in the series. I mean, what do we learn about him in the movies? He looks cool and has a rasping voice... erm... that's it. Considering he's supposed to be the antagonist in the climactic battle at the end, we know feck all about him and see him twice before that battle. I couldn't give a feck about him, he was little more than any of the hundreds of stormtroopers that totally fail to land a single hit on Han and co. in the original trilogy. Just an extra.


Regarding Darth Maul, as I stated earlier I haven't read a whole lot of the EU novels (if anyone wants to recommend some to get me started, please do!). My experience with that is a) a few novels called "Jedi Apprentice" about Obiwan and Quigon's early years, and b) a couple of the novelizations of Phantom Menace, told from characters perspectives (Anakin, Darth Maul). Thus I'm very ignorant on who the character actually is. So in short, yes I think (as do most people) that Darth Maul was badass because he barely spoke (and did so rather raspily), had a cool face, wore a badass hood, had an even more badass lightsaber, killed Qui-Gon without batting an eye, stood in a really cool way when the doors open during the Naboo attack, and just generally exuded a sense of badass-ness at all times. I mean come on, what's not to like here?

(the idea that this is meant to be a big dramatic reveal is taken from the comments of George Lucas in his directors commentary on the Attack of the Clones DVD)

Wait...that was supposed to surprise people? I was either 11 or 12 years old when that movie came out and I, along with everyone else I've ever talked to, knew Dooku would be a Sith. Not in over a decade since has it ever crossed my mind that Dooku pulling out a red lightsaber at some point was meant as some massive M Night Shymalan style reveal. George Lucas had really lost the plot by then I guess.
 
It's Attack of the Clones for me tonight... anyone else?

I think I'll go with The Phantom Menace today. I need some inspiration for an exam I have on Monday, so going for a Star Wars marathon this week (6 movies on 6 days).