All four would play for relegation or mid-table fodder.
That's not a glowing endorsement for McTominay's midfield abilities.
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All four would play for relegation or mid-table fodder.
That's not a glowing endorsement for McTominay's midfield abilities.
The bigger problem is he doesn’t use that license. All part of him having no fecking clue where he should be at any given moment. But he is literally never in the box looking to get on the end of chances. Other than at corners anyway.
All four of those are good players, granted, but none of them would play for any team in the EPL. I'd probably argue that right now only McGinn is good enough to play for a top four side, Gilmour might be one day.
I wouldn't be surprised in the least if Ten Hag adjusts Scott's position and tries him as a ball-playing CB in pre-season as an experiment.
We are short enough as it is in midfield , he can’t sacrifice another so I can’t see this happening
All depends on recruitment and/or academy promotion, and as we know, recruitment will be substantial this summer. Also, Ten Hag is far from reticent in giving talented young graduates a healthy quantity of developmental minutes. A lot could change come August-time.
how can a player who cant pass in midfield become a ball playing cb .. he would be a n absolute disaster at the back have u not seen how many stupid fouls he gives away. just get rid, 7 passes in the first half from him is all that the caf needs to hear.
whether you like him for his passion or not, he isnt good enough for this club. we can get rid off all the deadwood but if he, maguire and rashford stiill remain at the end and are consistently playing were screwed
And you know this because of your wealth of knowledge of the Scottish game?
Fine, I'll recalibrate:
Gilmour is with Chelsea. Only reason he's struggling this season is because he's playing with Championship standard players in the EPL. I'm very confident that Gilmour won't play for "play for relegation or mid-table fodder."
Need I remind you that McGinn has been linked to us and Liverpool. He'll most probably join Newcastle.
So yes, those two could make it at Liverpool or City.
As far as Jack and McGregor go. Any team outside the top 3.
I don't recall the so-called superstars of Rice, Mount, Foden and Phillips doing very much against the aforementioned "relegation or mid-table fodder" midfield, at the Euros.
And I wouldn't mention anything about "mid table", because with a certain combination of results, we could very well finish 8th, so cut out the snooty talk.
Should be tried at CB like he plays for the NT, but if it doesn't work, sold in the long run.
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Firstly, Gilmour is not at Chelsea. If he was good enough for Chelsea he'd already be there. That's what loans are for. To improve players who aren't good enough.
Secondly, you seem to fail to realize that "because he plays with..." isn't an actual argument but mere excuse making in order to deflect from accountability.
Thirdly, let's not big up being linked to Newcastle. You'd hope that this isn't the level of football team we are aspiring to match.
And finally, I would certain mention "mid table fodder" as that's the direction well head in if we accept poor performances and mediocrity ad you seem to want to. The whole point is that Manchester United need to improve on its players, coaches and general management to reach the standard being set by its rivals. Which makes, discussing players who are below par extremely important. And in that context a Manchester United starting CM failing to start in midfield for Scotland is alarming and an indictment of our lowered standards. You can big up Scottish players all you want but for the level this club aspires to and has attained many times before most of them are mediocre.
Let's hope that doesn't happen.
Technically, Gilmour is at Chelsea. Google it. Loans are to improve players that "aren't good enough"? What a weird way of saying "to give young players experience"
Secondly, yeah, it does. Especially when it's a success team. Gilmour would walk into our midfield. The phrase "deflect" is an overused soundbite. At least be creative and say "misdirect".
Thirdly, didn't you hear? They're now richer than god.
I'm not going to argue with any of that. I am, however, going to go back and square one and ask you which current Manchester United players are doing themselves justice. It's a very short list. It appears that you're just using McTominay as the Piñata.
Are you going around the houses to criticise Sancho and Lindelof and Varane and Bruno? Golly. I hope so.
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That's just factual. Gilmour isn't good enough for Chelsea right now /at the commencment of the ageement, and hence is in loan. The same goes for Garner or Amad or VDB.
Secondly, the phrase deflect captures the intentional nature of the act better than missdirect which infers a level of natural error/mistake.
Thirdly, their being rich is all well and good but they're not very good and way below the level are looking at. Being linked to them 3/4 years from now can be thought to mean something. Not now.
While I agree that many players and hence the the collective has under performed this season. At the same time, I don't agree with brushing everything under the carpet and just expecting a new manager to automatically turn dust to gold. The most important part about the bad times is to learn form them and we've learnt a lot about these footballers, not just in the past year but the 3-4 years before that.
So while Telles isn't good enough, Bruno has been terrible, Maguire's form has fallen off a cliff and so on, this thread is about Mctominay.
And for me, Mctominay is a rare case of a central midfielder who cannot pass being a first choice central midfielder for fortune-spending Manchester United, one of the biggest football clubs on the planet, for a good 4-5 years. I probably wouldnt sell him as we can only make so many changes, but ensure that he's among the backup options.
On the topic of other players you generally don't have someone from the same nationality as the player defending them to the hilt which increases these interactions and hence the quantum of criticism.
Not really. Inherently, they have the same meaning.
Deflection means to missdirect by action. If you're going to squabble about the intricacies of either definition then you're just being pedantic.
The money they have, I think it'll be a lot sooner than 3/4 years. I was actually thinking about thus earlier. They could very well make Pogba their first marquee signing.
I'll be willing to wager good money that McTominay will be the very few players in the current squad to keep their place. Why? Because he's a manager's dream. He takes instructions. He's loyal. He's not a trouble maker. Those are the traits you want in a player.
OK. People say that, but what does it actually mean? It's another buzz phrase. Everyone can pass. Anyone with a foot can pass a football.
Also, he created two goalscoring chances yesterday. Not bad for a player who doesn't have feet....
Do you know what's funny? I was on the Norwich forum and I was laughed at when i claimed that Gilmour would walk into the United team. In the same breath they said that they really rated McTominay.
It's a case of "the grass is greener..."
And I'm not defending McTominay. I'm aware that the politics of Scottish people and English people are different (Last time we voted for a tory was Churchiill) but we firmly believe that you treat everyone the same.
If everyone barring McTominay was shifting their weight and giving world class performances, then fine, call him on it. However, the last time I looked, Fred (£47M), Maguire (£80m) or Pogba (£89.3m) weren't exactly pulling up trees and giving performances that make McTominay blush.
People rate him because he talks a good game and he's British and most importantly they dont actually watch him!
23 passes as a central midfielder and it's hardly an outlier. It's simply inexcusable. Especially with the way he just jogs about.
People talk about him being passionate but apart from a few fouls he's our most passive player, he plays in midfield for Manchester United and sometimes I forget he is on the pitch. So out of his depth here, unbelievable we've spent 1 billion in the last 9 years and he is a regular.
It was actually 24 passes. Matic had 36 and Bruno had 24 (as well as missing a penalty). So why only single out McTominay?
We'll see how things pan out when ETH arrives.
I don't think he is being singled out, have you looked at Bruno's thread?
But for Scott this is a very valid criticism. He's consistently not getting on the ball enough and making enough passes. That has to be sorted if he wants a future as a starter.
i hope not. If ETH decides the current CBs aren’t good enough, he should buy a proper CB, experimenting is not the right way to take this club forward. I am also not very impressed with Scot’s ball playing skills. He surely gives his best, but he isn’t good enough
Incredibly poor player. He’s also the one player that gets match ratings based on his post game interviews and how good a game he talks in them.
We’ll be a much better team when he’s nowhere near it.
We’ll be a much better team when he’s nowhere near it.
Not that I agree with the experiment, but playing deeper gives you more time on the ball. It's why Blind was mr sideways in midfield and moving him to CB was a good move by LVG. He wouldn't be able to play those penetrating passes in midfield.
McTominay is a high energy player. He needs to run about and doesn't have Blind's ability to read the game, or his left foot. He's also slow, which was a problem for Blind as well.
This thread is always odd. Talking about McGinn playing for City / McTominay is better than Fletcher / Fletcher wasn't world class in 08/09, I don't know where to look 
The point is, though, that McTominay is supposed to be a Manchester United midfielder. Do you really think Scotland would play a real Manchester United midfielder anywhere other than midfield?
Unless those other midfielders play for top sides, it should not matter who or how many options they have. A Manchester United first-team midfielder should be in the first-team midfield for Scotland. It is telling that he is not.
Reminds me of Henderson, in being the worst football player in his team
Telles?
also crap but nah
Henderson was always much better on the ball than McTominay has ever been.
He's shite. Look at what his defenders have to resort to. He was shit but other people were shit too. He's loyal , doesn't cause trouble and listens to instructions. Those are the qualities of a good dog not a Manchester United midfielder.
The guy hides all the time. 7 passes in the first half and 24 passes total in a game is pathetic. That's why people have been calling out his hiding for a whole now. Mctom is a master of looking busy on the pitch but actually doing less than everyone else.
The guy hides all the time. 7 passes in the first half and 24 passes total in a game is pathetic. That's why people have been calling out his hiding for a whole now. Mctom is a master of looking busy on the pitch but actually doing less than everyone else.
Scott McTominay: "The last four games are about pride for us. Going out on the pitch and showing a bit of balls in your performances and not shying away from the ball or not doing everything right." [BT Sport]
Says the guy who made 23 passes in whole game and who is "famous" in hiding. Unbelievable. What is next? Ronaldo saying that we must run more?
But McT did again great for himself; he stepped up with saying all this and now he is the one "who cares for the badge".
Says the guy who made 23 passes in whole game and who is "famous" in hiding. Unbelievable. What is next? Ronaldo saying that we must run more?
But McT did again great for himself; he stepped up with saying all this and now he is the one "who cares for the badge".
I keep hearing that he "hides", but I'm not exactly sure what the hell it means. How can you "hide" in front of 74k people (and millions watching on tv)?
Want the facts? OK. Great.
In the EPL this season:
Fred: Accurate passes per match - 44.1 (84)
McTominay: Accurate passes per match - 33.3 (85%)
Matic: Accurate passes per match - 37.7 (86%)
Is it that much of a differential? 11 Accurate passes per match between McTominay and Fred. And we don't exactly play Pep possession football.
The way that some people talk is that his United equivalent gets 100+ passes per match.
Yes it is that much of a differential. By your stats he has 11 less passes than his United equivalent. 11 passes being 33% of his total completed passes per game. Against arsenal for comparison Xhaka and El neny both had over 70. So he's crap when compared to his teammates and even more crap when compared to his peers in other top 6 teams.
Elneny has 23.9 accurate passes per match.and Odengaard has 36.1 accurate passes per match.
It's time people for people who have a clear agenda to look at the facts and back the players and the team.
This constant chipping away at certain players is weak. I mean, what do people get from these constant stream of abusing players? Does it really help the team?
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Do people realise that McT made more passes than Bruno, Sancho and Matic in the Arsenal game?
Do people also realize he was top for pressing in the Arsenal game?
He also had more touches of the ball than Bruno, Sancho and Matic?
Bit he was of course hiding.
Do people also realize he was top for pressing in the Arsenal game?
He also had more touches of the ball than Bruno, Sancho and Matic?
Bit he was of course hiding.
Why would people realize something that never happened?
Matic made 20% more passes while not even playing the full 90.
A deep midfielder making more passes than a winger and second striker isn’t remotely impressive either. And Bruno still completed the same amount of passes anyway, also not even playing the full 90.
He also didn’t have more touches than any of them.
Elneny has 9? appearances this season and is widely acknowledged as not being good enough. Also i wonder where you get your stats cause according to this site https://www.fotmob.com/leagues/47/stats/season/15382/players/accurate_pass/premier-league
Mctom ranks 91st with 35 accurate passes a game. Some others for comparision:
Hoijberg- 64
Thiago-64
Fabinho- 63
Xhaka- 63
Kovacic-59
Jorginho-56
Tielemans- 53
Dier-53
Lets compare him to united players:
Lindelof- 57
Maguire-57
Fred-52
Pogba- 42
Shaw-42
Matic-45
Bruno-44
Awb- 45
Go on then, try to explain away these stats.
Slight edit those were last seasons stats. Luckily for me this season isn't much different Mctom ranks 89th with 33 a game.
Other midfielders ahead of him: Hoijberg, Rodri, Dier, Fabinho, Neves, Henderson, Tielemans, Kovacic, Romeu,Bissouma, Lokonga, Kante
Other united players ahead of him: Lindelof,Varane,Maguire, Fred,Bruno, Matic, Awb ,Telles Pogba
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We don't exactly play through the midfield.
I'm not exactly sure where we play through, but it's certainly not the midfield.
Most people would say that Henderson and McTominay are comparable, yes? Henderson has a seasonal 52 accurate passes per match. If he was at Manchester United it would be in the 30s.
My stats are from SofaScore.
Yeah. You want to know what the variable is? Those players are from Chelsea, Leicester, Liverpool and Arsenal. Those teams play better than us.
You could literally comb through our first XI and they would compare unfavourable to their contemporaries.
Let's compare other random players:
De Bruyne: 11 goals and 6 assists
Sancho: 3 goals and 3 assists
Van Dijk: 87.1 touches per match
Maguire: 63.5 touches per match
Shaw: 68.2 touches per match
Robertson: 93 touches per match.
Zoinks. Sancho, Maguire and Shaw sure do "hide" a lot during matches.
Oh aren't Elneny and Odegaard Arsenal players? Funny you were happy to compare Mctom to them when you thought it suited your argument.
Also that doesn't explain why he has consistently had less passes than his own teammates . Why does he have less passes than literally every United defender and midfielder this season?
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