Ryan Gravenberch | signs for Liverpool
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Donny enters the chat.......
Potentially another good addition, what started out as a poor summer for transfer dealings has ended up very good for them. Midfield is now looking strong, just their defence that could (hopefully!) let them down.
Can't compare different situations and he's been unfortunate at United, but regardless of length of contract, he'd easily fetch ~€20m if you'd do your business smart imo.
Hopefully he'll be shite and win feck all
We'll see. They've got some good young 8s for Klopp to work with, and you'd assume say 2 out of 3 would be a success. Their attack will be really productive again this season.
Just having Endo as a DM is a big risk for them. And defence remains an issue even if they get Todibo. Overall I think they're slightly better off than they were, and I expect them to get top 4 comfortably based on the fact they'll score more goals than anyone else other than City.
Endo feels like a Klavan type panic signing, but the other three have the potential to be Klopp'd into top players.
He was meant to be the next Pogba. Watch Klopp turn him into a monster. Hopefully, he's more Keita than anything else.
Klavan was alright once he settled in. Wouldn't mind someone like him as 5th choice, although our high line now would probably give him even more problems today.
More importantly they sold ASAP. We could and should have tried to sell DVB after his first season.
You can't compare situations, but it's a definite possibility he ends up in a Donny situation, based on both their start points for these transfers it's arguably higher risk. If he fails at Liverpool too and it becomes certain the only way is down then you'll struggle to get €20m for him, the clubs who'll want him won't pay that.
Endo is a baller. He is a good to very good squad option for most teams.
I'll give him a nod just because he's named Ragnar.
Regarding Endo, Klopp is truly obsessed of collecting national team captains.
Virgil, Robertson, Mo, Szobo, and now Endo.
Gravenberch+Macallister for the cost of Mount is great business.
Don’t care how this place tries to spin it, had we been told Liverpool would buy Mount & United would get the 2 they have combined for a similar fee we’d have been taking the piss.
Don’t care how this place tries to spin it, had we been told Liverpool would buy Mount & United would get the 2 they have combined for a similar fee we’d have been taking the piss.
How is Gravenberch for €40m great business? He’s been garbage for Bayern. They signed him for €18m and have sold him for double that despite him never completing a single 90 minute game in the league since he joined, they must be laughing.
Believe that if you want to, but I'll give it some time first.
It's none of our business how the deal is perceived for Bayern or what they initially paid for him.
No but arguing his signing is great business based on what he’s done for them is nonsense. Now who knows what Klopp can get out of him, he might be the one to rejuvenate his career and he’ll kick on as he’s only 21 but at the moment I don’t think you can say it’s great business.
Great business is an exaggeration but I think in this day and age, signing a 21-year old who looked promising as a teenager at Ajax for €40m is quite a low risk, high upside investment. So in that sense I can see why people would argue that he's a good signing.
He still has everything to prove on the field of course though, so yeah if he doesn't succeed and we sell him at a loss in two years time then certainly it won't have been great business
DVB was a starting 11 player for Ajax in 2018/19 and scored two very important goals. Ryan hardly made an impression during his CL matches the seasons after.
I mean, even the maths are wrong.
Mason Mount was £55m rising to £65m. Mac Allister was £35m rising to £55m and Gravenberch is £35m. That's £75m rising to £95m for those two. It's like 50% more than Mount.
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Fair, but you're still paying €40m for a player that can't get near Bayern's first team under two different managers. That raises some question marks at the very least about his ability to be an asset now, if not his long term potential.
Also fair, but I'd say it's not a definitive indictment on Gravenberch that he can't get in a team with Musiala, Goretzka and Kimmich through the middle. He will get his opportunities at Liverpool and if I trust any manager to get the best out of him, it's ours tbh. We'll see how he fares.
He made 24 league appearances last season at Bayern too, its hardly a case of 'can't get in the team'. For comparison, Garnacho made 19 for Utd. Sancho, Antony, Casemiro and Eriksen all between 25-28 appearances in the PL. I'm sure there's a lot of sub appearances, mind.
I had the Macallister fee at £35 flat. I was working on £65mil versus £70mil but happy to take back if sourced. By rising to £55mil is that appearance or achievement based? Also first time I’ve read the split of the Mount deal as £10mil add-ons.
If you’d like to argue over £5-10mil then feel free but of course this turns into an argument about the fees instead of the players.
Correction. You give me those 2 at £70mil this Summer versus £60mil for Mount & i’m taking those 2 for £10mil more.
Many sub appearances and almost no appearances that in any way mattered. I can’t judge his time at Ajax. But for us he was completely and absolutely inconsequential.
If Bayern doesn’t sign the Fulham player within the next 30 seconds then this is off
edit deal off. He was only going if Bayern signed a replacement
edit deal off. He was only going if Bayern signed a replacement
I think I’ve seen about one game he played for Ajax, and zero for Bayern, so I’m
None the wiser. Could be a bit of a Van de Beek situation for Liverpool.
Well to be fair he is only 21 and he is competing with Musiala, Goretzka and Kimmich at Bayern, very few midfielders could get ahead of those 3. They also signed him cheap back then because he was in last year of his contract at Ajax, or something.
When De Bruyne was 22-23, he can't get into Chelsea first team too, that doesn't make him a garbage player.
So is he going to Liverpool to make them champions or not?
Just another example that once again many young promising players make the mistake of immediately jumping to the largest clubs without getting many minutes. It happens over and over and suddenly they go from the next greatest thing to 2nd tier. Sure the money may be great at first but if you don't get to do much of what you love, what good is that? And yes the clubs are guilty of it too by continuously raiding their less financially capable counterparts.
Seems Bayern really want rid of Gravenberch.
55m rising to 60m and those 5m are quite difficult to achieve.
I think it's also a symptom of how wide the gap in wages have been getting between clubs. He'd be easier for smaller clubs to retain players if there was a more even playing field financially and sports wise.
I don't have any stats but I'm pretty sure that on average players start at the pro level earlier and earlier for a variety of reasons (and play more games too). Out of Chelsea's 10 most expensive signings this summer, 6 are 22 or younger (and none older than 25).
Might also explain why some players are shot in their early thirties.
I wholeheartedly agree that, purely in sports terms, a lot of players would benefit for not rushing their development. But the whole system is not geared towards that and is inciting to maximise your career (including trophy opportunities) & earnings as soon as possible. There's also wage inertia, it's a lot easier to maintain high demands if you already are on a big salary.
Hmmm, interesting. . .
Because he’s a bit poor
That's the fear. And the risk. But while he's vertical he's something Klopp can work on and provide occasional rest to our main midfielders.
Keita, Ox and even Thiago have never been anything other than horizontal bed ridden players taking large chunks out of our salary pot. How do you work with that?
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