Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
- Start date
Of the past? The son of the former head of the KGB is an unelected lawmaker in the House of Lords and an influential newspaper owner, protected personally by Boris, and it's believed he's been helped to get his money out of the country without really feeling the effect of any sanctions. It's not a thing of the past here...
No, that's right, and I agree. I was more making the point that giving Lebedev a peerage was not some aberration. Government policies for at least 20 years have allowed dirty Russian money to be washed in London, of which a good chunk ultimately found its way back to Putin. We also allowed Russia to influence our politics, even after we knew Russian state actors were committing murders on British streets.
The UK has contributed to the funding of this war. What we are doing to help Ukraine seems to me to be the bare minimum considering we helped to fund this war, no matter what our intentions.
We also should absolutely hold the UK Government to account to change the policies and behaviours that caused this mess. I am very concerned that providing more and more weapons will allow the British state to mask the need for these crucial reforms, which have been advocated for by Parliament and the security services for years.
From the BBC liveblog:
Ukraine running out of ammo - officials
Ukrainian officials say their army is running out of ammunition as it engages in intense artillery battles with invading Russian forces.
Vitaly Kim, the governor of the Mykolaiv region on the southern frontline, said the fighting had become a "war of artillery". He added that the Russian army was much more powerful, while Ukraine's troops were running low on shells, AFP news agency reports.
He urged Western allies to speed up their delivery of long range weapons and ammunition to help Ukraine strike back.
"The help of Europe and America is very, very important," Kim said.
Ukraine's deputy head of military intelligence, Vadym Skibitsky, made similar comments in an interview with Britain's Guardian newspaper on Friday.
Ukraine running out of ammo - officials
Ukrainian officials say their army is running out of ammunition as it engages in intense artillery battles with invading Russian forces.
Vitaly Kim, the governor of the Mykolaiv region on the southern frontline, said the fighting had become a "war of artillery". He added that the Russian army was much more powerful, while Ukraine's troops were running low on shells, AFP news agency reports.
He urged Western allies to speed up their delivery of long range weapons and ammunition to help Ukraine strike back.
"The help of Europe and America is very, very important," Kim said.
Ukraine's deputy head of military intelligence, Vadym Skibitsky, made similar comments in an interview with Britain's Guardian newspaper on Friday.
This is in Russia ...
Not exactly. Putin wasn't allowed to get the third term in a row (God knows why this "in a row" was in the Constitution in the first place), so Medvedev switched with him for the third one. The change in the constitution happened later, during a later Putin's term, when they've erased/nullified Putin's previous terms. Medvedev did increase the length of those terms though, from 4 years to 6 years.
Medvedev is a tool, of course. Some people were hopeful when he first came in since he was clearly more liberal and open to the world than Putin was but I never really believed that he would have the guts to try and to get out from under Putin's heel... he didn't. It is believed that he at least considered not giving the place back — or that Putin felt like it may have been the option, we'll never know, so he completely fell out of Putin's favour after they've switched back and now Medvedev finally saw an opportunity to gain that trust back.
Any news on further arms shipments to Ukraine?
A bit worrying if we are supposed to be arming them.
The change in the type of warfare from hit and run on static targets and convoys to an artillery battle is really concerning for me. We (UK/USA/EU etc) need to ramp up deliver of shells. I would happy empty the British Army's supply of howitzers and shells if that will make a difference - we are not in need of them any time soon.
Might I ask if you have a sense that Putin is really in charge or that he’s still beholden to the criminal interests out of St.Petersburg that got him into politics?
I wonder if he even has the power to stop the war if he wanted to. But I’m not up on my Russian politics.
From the BBC:
"Russia having to resort to old artillery as it runs out of weapons
As we've been reporting, Russia is running short of modern weapons and is having to resort to using heavy anti-ship missiles in ground attacks against Ukraine - which are highly inaccurate and can cause significant casualties and collateral damage, the UK's defence ministry says.
We saw a few weeks ago during Russia's strikes on the southern city of Odesa they were using old soviet stock.
The analysis we're getting is that it's symptomatic of the Russians running out of weapons.
They've used up their more modern cruise missiles, they've used their more high-tech precision weaponry, so they're having to dig deep into the arsenals to find out what they have lying around.
I'm sure some Russians would dispute that - they'd say there are some tactical reasons for doing this, but it's quite likely, especially given the sanctions Russia is under, that a lot of its weaponry requires modern western technology imports to make new stocks.
So once they've used them all, given the sanctions they're under, maybe they have to resort to use old equipment."
"Russia having to resort to old artillery as it runs out of weapons
As we've been reporting, Russia is running short of modern weapons and is having to resort to using heavy anti-ship missiles in ground attacks against Ukraine - which are highly inaccurate and can cause significant casualties and collateral damage, the UK's defence ministry says.
We saw a few weeks ago during Russia's strikes on the southern city of Odesa they were using old soviet stock.
The analysis we're getting is that it's symptomatic of the Russians running out of weapons.
They've used up their more modern cruise missiles, they've used their more high-tech precision weaponry, so they're having to dig deep into the arsenals to find out what they have lying around.
I'm sure some Russians would dispute that - they'd say there are some tactical reasons for doing this, but it's quite likely, especially given the sanctions Russia is under, that a lot of its weaponry requires modern western technology imports to make new stocks.
So once they've used them all, given the sanctions they're under, maybe they have to resort to use old equipment."
Oh, no, he's in charge alright. And no, there are no hidden puppeteers behind him, be it some mythical oligarchs or criminals from St. Petersburg — he had cleared out everyone who had helped him to get there & felt that they could control him ages ago (Berezovsky would be the prime example). Watch the council meeting of Russian Security Council that happened a few days before the invasion, on 21th of February, and watch how he purposely humiliates some of the most influential people in the country to showcase his ultimate authority. It's feels like watching some prison movie.
I do believe that he has the power to stop the war if he wants to. He clearly doesn't though, but even if he did there's obviously a consideration of how the people, who are overstimulated by the ridiculous and ever-present propaganda, are going to react to him finishing the war with "the Nazis" without getting anything of significance back & leading the country into a huge economical crisis. He's backed himself into the corner and it looks like he's going to push though until something breaks — either Ukraine or his own regime. Hopefully the latter.
Talking about old weaponry and equipment, here are two russian soldiers at a checkpoint in Donbas equiped with Mosin Nagants and a Sovjet TA-57 field telephone from the 50's.
Occupiers don’t have time to export their "Cargo 200" from Ukraine - call intercepted by the Security Service of Ukraine:
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/06/11/7351927/
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/06/11/7351927/
Vladimir Putin, Russia’s resentful leader, takes the world to war:
https://www.ft.com/content/c039db89-7201-4875-b31f-b41a511496f1
https://www.ft.com/content/c039db89-7201-4875-b31f-b41a511496f1
Sanctions are hitting hard enough to hurt Russia, if not stop it:
https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ing-hard-enough-to-hurt-russia-if-not-stop-it
For example: "Output in industries from aviation to automotive has crashed. In May, the number of cars sold across Russia tumbled by 83% from the previous month, to 24,000. Rewind to May 2021 and monthly sales were nearer 150,000."
https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ing-hard-enough-to-hurt-russia-if-not-stop-it
For example: "Output in industries from aviation to automotive has crashed. In May, the number of cars sold across Russia tumbled by 83% from the previous month, to 24,000. Rewind to May 2021 and monthly sales were nearer 150,000."
Need more of this!
What exactly does Biden gain from saying these things publicly?
If you are able, can you link to the podcast he is talking about? I would be interested to hear more detail about the position.
Its factually true that Zelenskyy downplayed what was an imminent invasion to avoid evoking panic among Ukrainians.
I recall the meeting but there were no gangster leaders there! I don’t doubt he’s the top power within government.
Is it known at which point he broke free and how he was able to do it? These gangsters don’t usually play nice, I’d think they’d use threats and violence to keep him controlled. But then if he needs protection he does have the entire state apparatus. Yet his family abroad would be vulnerable.
Polonium in their tea is quite a calling card tbf.
Thanks so much!
Came to post this astonishing thread myself.
Bear in mind that’s with most having relatively open internet access and not having those books forced upon them. That’s why China is so scary - it’s this level (probably more) or propaganda but with the majority of the country completely cut off from any outside news.
As an aside I find it so weird the U.K. is always the main baddie - kind of shows how backwards Russia is. We stopped being a major power long ago.
I honestly don't think Putin has forgiven us for trying to sway the outcome of the Civil War.
The gangsters in Russia don't have the power that they've had in the 90's. Putin always pushes the argument that it was him who had dragged the country out of the 90's when Russia was divided between the mob & oligarchs and in a way it's true, the only issue is that he wasn't doing it for the country, he simply took everything for himself.
It was a long process obviously but most of it happened in the 00's with siloviki (police, FSB, security service, prison guards etc.) gradually getting more and more power. There's a book in English called "The Vory: Russia's Super Mafia" that depicts that subculture well. At some point more than a half of Russia's prisons were run by the inmates and Vory (literally "thieves" — or "Vory v Zakone" / "thieves in law" — obligatory tag @VorZakone ) were at the top of that rough hierarchy. They're pretty much extinct now and those that are alive are long in hiding.
It's hard to run a shadow criminal organisation in a totalitarian state with well-financed repressive institutions, full control of every branch of political power and little to no concern about following their own laws — those are for the public, siloviki can (and literally do on a systemic basis) torture and even kill people or send people to prison on made up charges (where they are also tortured and/or killed).
I understand the context but I still think it’s not a smart thing to say at this moment. It sounds like Biden is saying it’s Zelenskyy’s fault that Ukraine’s army wasn’t “ready enough” when the invasion started.
It depends on how you define "major power". If you're saying that the USA and China are the only major powers, then fair enough. But otherwise, apart from those two, the combination of soft and hard power and influence wielded by the UK is at least on a par with any other country, and more than the vast majority.
Russia's obsession is probably partly a reflection of this, but also also partly historical, partly a reflection of our geographical nearness (compared to the USA) to "European" Russia, and partly because, compared to many other European countries, the UK can't be as easily pushed - e.g. via energy import dependency, or stirring up political instability - towards Russian ends.
Yeah we’re extremely strong given our ties - close to the US, most of the commonwealth and, despite Brexit, we’re kind of still seen as European. I find it strange they chose us and not Germany - a country who are a recent enemy.
Talking of a Germany they have supposedly just blocked Spain sending 40 Leopard tanks to Ukraine.
Not sure he's referring to just the army, but rather is making a broader (and more accurate) statement that the Ukrainians were caught a bit flat footed during the initial days of the invasion because their leader was busy attempting to downplay everything in the preceding days, despite having been given a lot of intelligence from the US that Putin was preparing a massive invasion. Zelenskyy's actions after the invasion have been very good, but not just before it.