Ruben Neves | Signed for Al Hilal (SA)
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If he reached even close to Carrick's level he'd be an absolute bargain.
That's what we end up having to do in many games, because other teams tend to approach games against us more defensively. It doesn't work great for us so we should seek to improve, but our current players and recruiting strategy is not very conducive to such playstyle. We are the worse possession holders of this years top 4 teams.. and Leeds.
Words are beautiful and everything, but like I said the players he signs (with the exception of VdB) and picks are not really players that are good at the short pass and move game. Neither Fernandes, nor AWB are any good at retaining possession and VdB is benched (correctly in my opinion) over Fred and McTominay. The short passing skills of both are at best average for the league if not below average. Rashford isn't particularly good at give-and-go either (though Martial is better) he thrives in balls behind the back of the defence that he can run onto.
None of our current core players are good at keeping possession and playing short, so really I just don't see it. Not sure if Neves would help in that direction personally, I'm just not very sold on him.
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It was telling he didn't dominate against our B team but it would be incredible to have a midfielder who can pass
Not really a fair comparison, he spams crosses in the box and is a set piece specialist. Ruben Neves is a Scholes/Carrick/Pirlo/Jorginho type of player. Not the same level, but that style, and that's something we've needed for a while.
Would be an ideal option if we wanted to keep the ball more, have him sat behind Pogba and Bruno, can definitely pick a pass,
If 35m is the price its cheaper than Fred and definitely cheaper than Rice.
If 35m is the price its cheaper than Fred and definitely cheaper than Rice.
Then I dont rate it whatsoever. Moutinho is far more creative than Fred and the one that creates on a regular basis for Wolves. He'd need a partner who can do the same here
I like him, but I do agree, buying him would make sense if we're buying two midfielders.
Guess I was not clear enough. I was implying a 3 mid formation with Bruno - DM- Pogba (most of the people here want this). Honestly, I can't see any mid that will make that mid-field work.
Neves is really an exciting option. We have the ball winner in Fred, the energetic one in Mactominay, and Creativity from Pogba and Bruno. We lack someone who can release the ball quickly in the mid and someone who can shield the back four well. Neves will never be an eye-catching player, but I believe he will bring that balance in the mid-field and can do both jobs well.
I quite like Neves as an option too. Though not as much as f.e. Locatelli. Thanks for clarifying, don't think a switch to a 433 formation is very likely either. And as you say, it wouldn't solve the Pogba problem.
Id take him, especially if the fee is reasonable. If Rice is quoted at 90m and Neves is quoted at 35m then its a no brainer really. His passing stats are good, his tackling stats are good. People are saying hes not as quick as theyd like but a DM who can put their foot on the ball and control play is something weve been missing for a long time. If we need to swarm teams with the press then weve still got Fred and McTominay for that.
He is slower than Fred and McT, but also miles better with the football.
Locatelli is the dream, but I don't think he will Italy at all. Neves or Tchouaméni should be ideal.
His pressing stats are actually very good.
Locatelli really does look like the dream midfield player for us to be a deep lying playmaker. Is he just one of those who won't leave Italy? Sassuolo shouldn't be too hard to pry him from of we were interested.
Don’t mind him. Some of our passing and possession play is shocking.
We clearly prioritize quick transitions and pace, but that falls short when teams are sitting deep against us.
My worry is that these kinds of players are not players Ole is a fan of (like Mata and VdB), and he prefers pace and power (Fred and McTominay). He’d be an odd choice considering the type of player Ole likes and how he likes us to play.
We clearly prioritize quick transitions and pace, but that falls short when teams are sitting deep against us.
My worry is that these kinds of players are not players Ole is a fan of (like Mata and VdB), and he prefers pace and power (Fred and McTominay). He’d be an odd choice considering the type of player Ole likes and how he likes us to play.
What’s the point in a player glued to the spot no matter how good with the ball? He’s not a quarterback
I would absolutely take him. He'd be perfect in a double pivot.
No thank you. Rather have a DM that can play pivot by himself.
Neves would be a good replacement for Matic and he offers us something we don’t have. Have a feeling he’d start a lot of games. A lot of talk of pace, which I think is nonsensical for the deepest DM. Mobility is another question but I feel people often confuse that for pace. Mobility is the ability to cover ground and be able to change direction quickly. That naturally declines as you age. Neves doesn’t have a mobility problem. Some players are more mobile than others, clearly, but Neves is perfectly mobile.
What’s intriguing about this is that he isn’t the category A midfielder I think most of the caf feel we need. Myself included. But what also has to enter the argument is weighing up the holistic vision to squad improvements. With funds being limited, do you take a Neves, a Varane, and a Rafinha (for example), or do you take a Rice and a Sancho? It’s a complex question, because if the slightly lesser options become deadwood, then you say the approach failed. But if you get the category A players for less positions and say leave CB unaddressed, that might undo much of the benefits elsewhere.
It’s one where you hope the recruitment department have done their homework on the data metrics of the players and have a longer term vision of squad building than just one season. I certainly don’t have an answer. Most opinions on here “just sign xyz” turn into “everyone could actually see we need a DM, or CB, not Sancho!” A few months later when form dips.
The curveball in all this is what targets the club have in mind that are high potential, off the radar signings, like Kante for Leicester etc. And again, that comes back to the recruitment department.
I have no issues signing Neves, he’s a good player that plays in an area and way that I feel we need improving, but how his signing fits into overall squad development is much harder to answer. And I strongly suspect that anyone suggesting they know the best approach, other than spending 200m, is talking from their derrière.
What’s intriguing about this is that he isn’t the category A midfielder I think most of the caf feel we need. Myself included. But what also has to enter the argument is weighing up the holistic vision to squad improvements. With funds being limited, do you take a Neves, a Varane, and a Rafinha (for example), or do you take a Rice and a Sancho? It’s a complex question, because if the slightly lesser options become deadwood, then you say the approach failed. But if you get the category A players for less positions and say leave CB unaddressed, that might undo much of the benefits elsewhere.
It’s one where you hope the recruitment department have done their homework on the data metrics of the players and have a longer term vision of squad building than just one season. I certainly don’t have an answer. Most opinions on here “just sign xyz” turn into “everyone could actually see we need a DM, or CB, not Sancho!” A few months later when form dips.
The curveball in all this is what targets the club have in mind that are high potential, off the radar signings, like Kante for Leicester etc. And again, that comes back to the recruitment department.
I have no issues signing Neves, he’s a good player that plays in an area and way that I feel we need improving, but how his signing fits into overall squad development is much harder to answer. And I strongly suspect that anyone suggesting they know the best approach, other than spending 200m, is talking from their derrière.
Last time I watched him, it seemed like he can run and walk. He even jumped a couple of times.
He will join a midtable club in Spain or stay where he is. He's vastly over-rated and I'm glad the Wolves faithful have seen the light. He has a long pass in him but is pretty average at evading pressure. I've seen poor teams nullify his passing due to their ability to press high up the pitch.
I'd rather see us give Jimmy Garner or Hannibal Mejbri game time, than sign Neves who has done pretty much feck all since he was in the Championship with Wolves.
I'd rather see us give Jimmy Garner or Hannibal Mejbri game time, than sign Neves who has done pretty much feck all since he was in the Championship with Wolves.
yeah this pretty much. He started off class but majorly tapered off over the last few years. He might be class again in a better team but I’m not calling for us to sign him. I think if he was the one player we got we’d be disappointed at the end of the day.
An improvement
As a matter of fact, Ole deployed Pogba in one of 2 holding CMs in his 4231 formation last season until he was injured, then during project restart last season Pogba still played in the double pivot alongside either of McFred and behind Bruno, in the one-off Europa League semi-final vs Sevilla it was Pogba & Fred as CMs behind Bruno.
This season Pogba also played in the double pivot at the beginning then he was injured/or got covid, but in the tough games in first half of the season, Pogba was played high up the pitch, for example at home vs City or RBL, or away vs Liverpool, this was the trend until Pogba's injury vs Everton Jan 2021 iirc, once he returned from injury Ole started to play him off the left more.
I don’t rate him that highly does anyone else feel the same way ? He looks great for the highlight reel and is a good player but he is overrated imo
Too be honest. I had him in my noteboo. Not sure how many years back. Definitely 1-2 years before he joined Wolves. I thought he was the next big cm player from Portugal. But for some reasons. He hasn’t live up to mine expectations. I thought he was really a good and dominate cm player. The creative, playmaker cm who spread the passes around and dictate the games. But after coming to Wolves. I am not sure. No disrespect. If Wolves is a mid table team and if the qualities of his teammates are not top level and good enough. To lift Wolves close to top 6 - 8.
Not only against top team. Against middle table team and even teams from the bottom. He didn’t stand out as a dominate players, who bossed to teams. He has Moutinho and some others beside him. But I wasn’t impressed to be honest.
And in the last. I just discovered Manuel Locatelli and Franck Kessie in this season. Under a year. To be objective and honest. Same category all those 3. Defensive not theirs best strength. it’s they all round as a cm. The creative, ball and passing ability. Both of those 2 are more dominance. Special Kessie for Milan, a robust and strong cm, but still really good with ball. And Locatelli is really often been a dominance cm for a middle table and not a very good side in Sassoulo. But for Italy. Better teammates than Sassoulo. Then you can a better Locatelli. In stead of chasing the ball more for Sassoulo. Because it’s clearly different to have Nicole Barella as your teammates, than Sassoulo teammates.
Like i said. All of those 3 are best with the ball. Locatelli might be good for Barca as nr.6 for Busquets replacement. But not as nr.6. The Makele, Keane, Kante or Viera nr.6 category and mould. Neither is Neves. It will only work for them against teams who sit back, park the bus and give them enough time to dictate and spend the passes around. Against the best teams I am not sure yet. Full press, top aggressive and top intensity. It will be a lot different.
But here are theirs current transfer value, due to transfermarkt.
Ruben Neves 50 mill euro
Manuel Locatelli 35 mill euro
Franck Kessie 50 mill euro
Like i said above. Right now I rate both Locatelli and Kessie above Neves. Locatelli some years younger than the others too. But you never know what the future will bring. Maybe Klopp, a manager that brings out the top guts, energy, drive and punch to his players. Might be a good motivator and mentor for Neves. I think Neves maybe need to bring out the top guts more consistently. No top guts no glory like peoples said.
Not problem with top guts when it come to Kessie and Locatelli. That button are on for those two.
But still. I have been lucky to experienced world class super creative and skillful cm players in Scholes, Yaya Toure, Luka Modric on his peak. Lately Kimmich for Bayern. The super creative ball players cm.
All of those 3. Neves, Kessie and Locatelli are not there yet. Like I said in others thread. Current level of realistic cm and cb targets are not close to the top level of football history yet. Joshua Kimmich from Bayern is really really good. One of the biggest reason of Bayern success. A Gerrard for Liverpool. You can put Kimmich as RB or RM and still he will do a really good job there. I can’t come to others name that are close to world class or top level of cm.
Those current cm players has a long way to go. But for CF. It’s different. If Kane is realistic to get this summer. Beside Haaland. Compare the level of cm and cb in the current football market. The level of CF youngsters are higher.
And of course. All of those 3 cm players mentioned above. Over a long run are better than Matic, Fred and McTom with the ball. But in defensive job of a nr.6. Shield, protect and ball winner. I think both of Fred and McTom are better. It’s the top level or very good level of the ball skill Fred and McTom is lacking, the creative with the ball. But both of Fred and McTom have done over a whole season. A really good job to help United got second place, plus unbeaten away. So just because both of the are lacking the offensive and creative part of the game. Then we forgot the defensive contributions.
And with the adding of Sancho. And Rashford, Greenwood and Martial did like the season before this season. Maybe it’s enough with 4 ultra offensive and skillful attacking players upfront. And having to defensive cm players against the big guns.
And against teams United shall dominate. You can a allround nr.6 plus a nr.8 in Pogba. Then it should work. Dominate the ball possession and bossed the ball.
So sum up and back to Neves. He has disappointed me and haven’t met mine expectations. Maybe in the future. With the right manager and teams. That brings the best out of him. We will see the best of him. But not with his current level. So in others words. I will lower mine expectations of a cm. If I want to buy him. Because I have seen and experienced so many better cm players in his category in the past. Personally I will past. And still wait and looking for the best. Someone close to, at least Bayern Kimmich level. To overcome Bayern in Europe. That cm player has to me give top confidence. That he is the real deal and what I’m looking after. Neves is not there yet. Right now. I rate him in the group and level under the best. Just very good. Only a 4 out of 5. Top 5 yet. Sorry Neves. But maybe in the future.
Not only against top team. Against middle table team and even teams from the bottom. He didn’t stand out as a dominate players, who bossed to teams. He has Moutinho and some others beside him. But I wasn’t impressed to be honest.
And in the last. I just discovered Manuel Locatelli and Franck Kessie in this season. Under a year. To be objective and honest. Same category all those 3. Defensive not theirs best strength. it’s they all round as a cm. The creative, ball and passing ability. Both of those 2 are more dominance. Special Kessie for Milan, a robust and strong cm, but still really good with ball. And Locatelli is really often been a dominance cm for a middle table and not a very good side in Sassoulo. But for Italy. Better teammates than Sassoulo. Then you can a better Locatelli. In stead of chasing the ball more for Sassoulo. Because it’s clearly different to have Nicole Barella as your teammates, than Sassoulo teammates.
Like i said. All of those 3 are best with the ball. Locatelli might be good for Barca as nr.6 for Busquets replacement. But not as nr.6. The Makele, Keane, Kante or Viera nr.6 category and mould. Neither is Neves. It will only work for them against teams who sit back, park the bus and give them enough time to dictate and spend the passes around. Against the best teams I am not sure yet. Full press, top aggressive and top intensity. It will be a lot different.
But here are theirs current transfer value, due to transfermarkt.
Ruben Neves 50 mill euro
Manuel Locatelli 35 mill euro
Franck Kessie 50 mill euro
Like i said above. Right now I rate both Locatelli and Kessie above Neves. Locatelli some years younger than the others too. But you never know what the future will bring. Maybe Klopp, a manager that brings out the top guts, energy, drive and punch to his players. Might be a good motivator and mentor for Neves. I think Neves maybe need to bring out the top guts more consistently. No top guts no glory like peoples said.
Not problem with top guts when it come to Kessie and Locatelli. That button are on for those two.
But still. I have been lucky to experienced world class super creative and skillful cm players in Scholes, Yaya Toure, Luka Modric on his peak. Lately Kimmich for Bayern. The super creative ball players cm.
All of those 3. Neves, Kessie and Locatelli are not there yet. Like I said in others thread. Current level of realistic cm and cb targets are not close to the top level of football history yet. Joshua Kimmich from Bayern is really really good. One of the biggest reason of Bayern success. A Gerrard for Liverpool. You can put Kimmich as RB or RM and still he will do a really good job there. I can’t come to others name that are close to world class or top level of cm.
Those current cm players has a long way to go. But for CF. It’s different. If Kane is realistic to get this summer. Beside Haaland. Compare the level of cm and cb in the current football market. The level of CF youngsters are higher.
And of course. All of those 3 cm players mentioned above. Over a long run are better than Matic, Fred and McTom with the ball. But in defensive job of a nr.6. Shield, protect and ball winner. I think both of Fred and McTom are better. It’s the top level or very good level of the ball skill Fred and McTom is lacking, the creative with the ball. But both of Fred and McTom have done over a whole season. A really good job to help United got second place, plus unbeaten away. So just because both of the are lacking the offensive and creative part of the game. Then we forgot the defensive contributions.
And with the adding of Sancho. And Rashford, Greenwood and Martial did like the season before this season. Maybe it’s enough with 4 ultra offensive and skillful attacking players upfront. And having to defensive cm players against the big guns.
And against teams United shall dominate. You can a allround nr.6 plus a nr.8 in Pogba. Then it should work. Dominate the ball possession and bossed the ball.
So sum up and back to Neves. He has disappointed me and haven’t met mine expectations. Maybe in the future. With the right manager and teams. That brings the best out of him. We will see the best of him. But not with his current level. So in others words. I will lower mine expectations of a cm. If I want to buy him. Because I have seen and experienced so many better cm players in his category in the past. Personally I will past. And still wait and looking for the best. Someone close to, at least Bayern Kimmich level. To overcome Bayern in Europe. That cm player has to me give top confidence. That he is the real deal and what I’m looking after. Neves is not there yet. Right now. I rate him in the group and level under the best. Just very good. Only a 4 out of 5. Top 5 yet. Sorry Neves. But maybe in the future.
On Neves, i think there are better options in the market.
Sassuolo shouldn't be hard, but are we really interested in him? I haven't seen any credible links so far. And, my intuition says he won't leave Italy, just hunch - I'll be delighted to be proven wrong here if we get him.
I think this guy has gone from overrated while he was in the championship to severely underrated right now.
35m for a cm of good quality that is tried and tested in the prem seems like good value IMO.
There are more exciting players out there but would all cost a fortune.
35m for a cm of good quality that is tried and tested in the prem seems like good value IMO.
There are more exciting players out there but would all cost a fortune.
After reading this thread and even part of the wolves forum I still don't know if he's good or not
Many United fans still don't rate Carrick that highly so is no surprise many don't rate Neves, Wolves fans included. He doesn't run like a mad man and he doesn't jump in to tackles at every occasion. He is a smart DM that defends by his ability to read the game. If he is actually good enough to do that role for United, I don't know, but we have the perfect man to make that judgment in Carrick himself.
How does he perform for the national side? Surely our resident Portuguese can give a better appraisal of him?
@SportingCP96?
@SportingCP96?
Sometimes its worth the gamble and a Neves for 35 is worth the gamble all day long. We cant get top players in all positions DM, CDM. RW. We need one of the positions to be a bargain and Neves is just to good an opportunity to pass up.
He's good but not that good.
If he’s available for £35m then just pay it. He’s got the ability to step up and would be amazing in our midfield.
Not my priority type of midfielder however for the price would let us strengthen all over.
Not my priority type of midfielder however for the price would let us strengthen all over.
I'd be worried about adding another 'okay' player to our set of okay midfielders - Matic, Fred, Mctominay and VDB (okay is optimistic for him)
Although he has similarities with Garner, I’d love Neves here, especially if he ‘only’ cost £35 million.
I think he has the quality to make the step up to a bigger club and become a key cog in our midfield. He is a good ball winner, a leader on the pitch and has an eye for a pass.
I think he has the quality to make the step up to a bigger club and become a key cog in our midfield. He is a good ball winner, a leader on the pitch and has an eye for a pass.
I just don't see how he'd be amazing in our midfield without also buying another midfielder along with him, thus making the bargain, not so much of a bargain? I can't see us going near him. Seems like an Arsenal type of signing.
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