We had a £59.7m sub a couple of years back. This would be progress.
Ross Barkley? Is he Happy?
- Thread starter Inigo Montoya
- Start date
We had a £59.7m sub a couple of years back. This would be progress.
Shouldn't we have the ambition to actually win things? We would go nowhere with these two. Ox is a crock and a couple of good games in CM don't make him United quality all of a sudden. Barkley is neither.
This. We need a couple of world class players not a handful of average ones.
I saw an article on Sky sports yesterday saying he's in the best form of his career right now. I've not seen much of him this season but is he playing well? He used to have quite a few fans on here and I've not heard him mentioned much recently.
Personally I've never been too convinced by him.
Personally I've never been too convinced by him.
Meh, we need to fill out the English player section. Never been a fan of either Lingard or Young, and with the wealth of players going on the wings, let's get some adequate rotation players in
World class players costs that much more, and requires that much more game time. You need to find a balance.
LVG was a fan of buying squad players, Mourinho has been trying to get rid of most of them.
LvG was also a fan of youth products.
LvG problem wasn't buying the wrong players (well maybe, but not really).
Do we desperately need 'domestic' players? Seems pointless to force it if they're not good enough, especially as players like Barkley will cost a bomb. City pretty much have only Sterling and Delph, and Delph never plays. Even whenever Rooney and Carrick leave/retire, we still have Shaw, Rashford, Smalling, Jones and Lingard.
The only English player worth paying what it takes to get is Kane. Even then, I'd probably prefer Lukaku.
The only English player worth paying what it takes to get is Kane. Even then, I'd probably prefer Lukaku.
There's nothing wrong with squad players and I think Mou values them, contrary to belief in here. Probably more than previous managers in way.
The main difference is Mou doesn't rotate too much and his teams don't seem to suffer form injury crises, so he doesn't need as many squad players as he's inherited. And some of our squad players were below the needed quality to provide cover or competition for the starting XI, so he got rid while they still had value.
I expect him to sign squad players, ones he can trust more, when he's finished clearing out the current ones. Perhaps as early as this summer. Those he trusts will get games, like Fellaini, Rashford and Lingard have.
Also Pogba is rated as home grown player, so that's 6 we have in squad and that's excluding players like Fosu Mensah, Januzaj, Periera, CBJ.
I hope he stays at Everton because I don't see him moving to a bigger club and actually getting enough games - and somehow he just does not strike me as a player who will thrive abroad.
He's been very very good for the past few months, lad is supremely talented and in terms of technique easily best English midfielder out there (yes that includes Dele Alli). Biggest weakness is he's perhaps mentally fragile, big confidence player. It pains me to say it but put him in one of the top 4 sides with great players around him and without the hometown pressure and he will hit new heights.
Anyone saying he's average wouldn't know talent if it slapped them in the face. If he played for a glamour club/media darling he'd be getting bummed left right and centre for how well he's playing.
When he's on it, he's special. End of
Anyone saying he's average wouldn't know talent if it slapped them in the face. If he played for a glamour club/media darling he'd be getting bummed left right and centre for how well he's playing.
When he's on it, he's special. End of
Last edited:
We need 8 homegrown players by EPL rules. These were the homegrown players listed in our squad at the start of the year:
Michael Carrick, Ashley Young, Morgan Schneiderlin, Luke Shaw, Phil Jones, Sam Johnstone, Chris Smalling, Jesse Lingard, Wayne Rooney and (yes, he is) Paul Pogba.
That was 10 players of which 1 has left (Schneiderlin) and 3 are nearing the end (Young, Carrick, Rooney). That leaves us with six. The issue with the other 4 mentioned in the post above me (Fosu-Mensah, Januzaj, Pereira, CBJ), is that some will likely leave permanently (Januzaj) or on loan to further their development. You don't wanna have to keep young players in the squad just for the homegrown quota if there's an opportunity for them to go somewhere and gain experience.
In other words, we will need to 1 or 2 homegrown players to be comfortable again. That's partly why I expect us to move for Oxbabe-Chambermaid. Not sure about Barkley though, we don't seem to have an opening in the position he plays. Mkhi would keep him out of the squad almost indefinitely and we have other backup options.
The problem is he's 'on it' once every however many weeks or so. And being mentally weak as his biggest weakness but then chucking him into one of the top four sides where competition is far higher and the pressure is at a level never reached at Everton doesn't quite compute to automatic success.
I've never really understood this forums obsession with him considering there's been zero progression in the past 3-4 seasons, and for what he offers there are better, cheaper, and more consistent alternatives out there.
You don't need 8 homegrown players. But to have the maximum 25 man squad, 8 of those players must be homegrown.
You're allowed a maximum of 17 overseas players (U21s not included). City and Chelsea in the past years have had a PL team of 20/21 players with only 3 homegrown players or so (City's was Hart, Clichy, and Wright a few seasons ago).
Thats just outright false, he was very consistent for 2 thirds of last seasons hitting double figures for both goals and assists in all competitions and only started going downhill when the entire team started refusing to play for Martinez.
This season he has been VERY consistant bar a maybe a 2-3 week spell a few months back.
No, he gets far more pressure at everton where he is the local lad expected to become our messiah, no offence but you don't go to everton games... you've no idea the level of expectation the lad gets from sections of our fans and the abuse he gets if he doesn't live upto it every match... it's insane.
I can totally understand why he's rumoured to be angling for a move away to somewhere like spurs, he'd have far less pressure on him because he'd be surrounded by better players and wouldn't have the entire team reliant on him like at Everton.
Again uninformed nonsense, you obviously don't watch or pay attention to everton matches. the progression has been very noticeable, he is a far more complete player than when he burst onto the scene, his ball retention skills are friggin amazing, he never gives the ball away anymore, no one can get it off him cause he's so technically boss.
You rule. Agree with everything said. He'd grace OT and looks like a sort of replacement for Carrick. He was a class above every other Everton player against Spurs last week, could keep the ball, twist, find acute angles, would love him bought.
As with most brit youngster i discount the hype by 30persen.
The next leon osman
The next leon osman
How do City get around it, only having Sterling and Delph?
John Stones too, forgot about him.
I do rate Barkley however I think the mentally fragile comments are correct.
Conclusion - he would probably fit in well at Arsenal
Conclusion - he would probably fit in well at Arsenal
Yep, to be fair that's correct. It basically means though that if you don't have 8 homegrown players in your main team, you have to tart surrendering spots. If you want to sign another foreign player, you'll have to sell one first.
It's an awkward position to be in. Both because it restricts how you can move in the market and because the stadium-going fans do enjoy seeing some young English players. Anyway, let's not derail this thread too much.
Jose has already said he doesn't want a large squad.
That's why we sold two players without replacing them.
Is anyone? I put my Weetabix in the bowl this morning, only to discover that there was no milk left. Don't talk to me about pain.
Guys like Ox and Barkley, would thrive under a Mourinho. I don't think they're special players but they both have athleticism, fair amount of skill and match-turning ability and work-rate. They wouldn't be starters but as squad options, much more useful than Lingard/Fellaini. They would be decent to have around the squad and having an english contingent is important.
Remember if we get back in to CL footbll, we do need a squad and right now we don't have great options off the bench to change a game hence we have been bad at converting draws into wins. These two guys are unpredictable in that sense.
Remember if we get back in to CL footbll, we do need a squad and right now we don't have great options off the bench to change a game hence we have been bad at converting draws into wins. These two guys are unpredictable in that sense.
Not at all. To elaborate, I meant we have enough squad quality players. I think we should keep the players we have like Fellaini, Lingard, Shaw, Rashford and they can fight for their place but what we really need are 2 big signings to replace Carrick and a goal scorer. I don't think we should be buying players like Barkley as I don't think he offers anymore than Mata/Lingard who play similar position and should be our squad players for next season.
Squad player 100%. Wouldn't really get it to be honest.
Bound to have players in development at our own place with better decision making that can sit on the bench.
Bound to have players in development at our own place with better decision making that can sit on the bench.
Yeah and a couple more will go unreplaced too. But after that the squad size will need to be retained as well as the quota.
We have more than a couple of players nearing the end at the moment. Rooney, Carrick, Young and Basti, that's 4. Some of those will definitely need to be replaced, Carrick and Rooney most prominently.
Maybe I'm a bit old fashioned. But I place value in the English identity of the club. I think foreign fans like it too and it actually helps the club's image and marketability. The class of 92 helped make us famous in more ways than one.
Anyway, let's please stop talking about quotas we are derailing the Barkley thread.
Really?? Kane is way better
I agree we don't need Barkley. We've more than enough cover for that spot. I would happily take Ox from Arsenal because we will need another CM to challenge Pog/Herrera and he's been really good there for the gooners.
Take away Kane's penalties and Lukaku is the more prolific striker this season, with three more goals.
Plus Kane is surrounded by higher quality players.
They are both boss but think Lukaku will go on to have better career (away from Everton)
Not so sure. I think Lukaku is a great finisher who is very dependent on his physical attributes as his all around game is not as good as Kane's. He has a big frame and a lot of mileage already so I think injuries and natural degeneration will take their toll quicker than with Kane.
Up until that happens I expect them to have comparable careers with Kane having a small edge.
We probably don't. Third keeper, Jones, Smalling, Shaw, Pogba, Lingard and Rashford are all homegrown so we already have 7 homegrown players. We can have the eighth one by simply returning one of Januzaj/Pereira, using some academy player, buying a better homegrown player or simply using just 24 players for the squad.
Barkley costs too much and is not good enough to be on the starting lineup, so there is no point on signing him.
Depending on the price, I'd have him at Spurs to provide competition for Eriksen and others in our attacking midfield.
I think he would suit you more than us or Arsenal.
I can't fathom the logic process that would lead anyone to think that Manchester United should sign Ross Barkley.
He's proper class and any funkwit who doesn't recognize it needs those 1970s NHS eyeglasses. Get him bought. Everton are cheekily holding onto our goods. We will dance through the opposition with him and Pogs and Micky.
Yeah and a couple more will go unreplaced too. But after that the squad size will need to be retained as well as the quota.
We have more than a couple of players nearing the end at the moment. Rooney, Carrick, Young and Basti, that's 4. Some of those will definitely need to be replaced, Carrick and Rooney most prominently.
Maybe I'm a bit old fashioned. But I place value in the English identity of the club. I think foreign fans like it too and it actually helps the club's image and marketability. The class of 92 helped make us famous in more ways than one.
Anyway, let's please stop talking about quotas we are derailing the Barkley thread.
Me too.
But Carrick and Rooney(in the past) have shown that you can be English and very good at the same time for us.
I dont think Barkley is. I think most of our English core should be coming from our academy.
Just get the sense that he's a classic big (question marks over that status too) fish in a small pond that would make for a very unhappy small fish in a big pond.