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Ronaldo is the goat
- Thread starter Billy Blaggs
- Start date
Point proven I guess
Ronaldo is the best in the world and has been for sometime now.
Whether he’s the greatest of all time I can’t comment as I never saw pele or maradona play but in the right here and now then it’s no contest.
I don't follow your logic. He did well to come back from his injuries to be WC topscorer, but what's that got to do with winning mentality?
The likes of Stoichkov, Solenko, Suker, Klose, Muller, Villa, Sneijder, Forlan, James have all been WC topscorer. Fine players most of them, but not exactly that amazing an achievement, is it?
He has won very very few trophies for his clubs down the years for someone supposedly so good.
I never mentioned "skills", please do not invent things I said.
As for "creativity", Cristiano has beats Luiz by a long long way in terms of assists.
Agreed, Cristiano and Messi are 1 and 2 respectively in terms of greatest of all time.
Whereas the anti-Cristiano brigade refuse to look at the facts and prefer to go off on so called "eye tests" based on who is flashier on the pitch.
Player's single-handedly winning trophies for their teams.I don't follow your logic. He did well to come back from his injuries to be WC topscorer, but what's that got to do with winning mentality?
The likes of Stoichkov, Solenko, Suker, Klose, Muller, Villa, Sneijder, Forlan, James have all been WC topscorer. Fine players most of them, but not exactly that amazing an achievement, is it?
He has won very very few trophies for his clubs down the years for someone supposedly so good.
I never mentioned "skills", please do not invent things I said.
As for "creativity", Cristiano has beats Luiz by a long long way in terms of assists.
Assists being used as a proxy for creativity.
Do you even watch football?
for all the talk about "Messi brigade/fanboys", they can't really compare to this. literally the same thread every year.
I don't follow your logic. He did well to come back from his injuries to be WC topscorer, but what's that got to do with winning mentality?
The likes of Stoichkov, Solenko, Suker, Klose, Muller, Villa, Sneijder, Forlan, James have all been WC topscorer. Fine players most of them, but not exactly that amazing an achievement, is it?
He has won very very few trophies for his clubs down the years for someone supposedly so good.
I never mentioned "skills", please do not invent things I said.
As for "creativity", Cristiano has beats Luiz by a long long way in terms of assists.
Can't compare team trophies like this for individuals though.
If R9 played for Real Madrid the last three years he would have dominated.
If CR7 played for Inter when R9 did, CR7 also would have won very few club trophies.
I understand creativity under a different perspective. More about dribbling and skills. But i get your point.I don't follow your logic. He did well to come back from his injuries to be WC topscorer, but what's that got to do with winning mentality?
The likes of Stoichkov, Solenko, Suker, Klose, Muller, Villa, Sneijder, Forlan, James have all been WC topscorer. Fine players most of them, but not exactly that amazing an achievement, is it?
He has won very very few trophies for his clubs down the years for someone supposedly so good.
I never mentioned "skills", please do not invent things I said.
As for "creativity", Cristiano has beats Luiz by a long long way in terms of assists.
Many great players in previous decades had less titles than Dani Alves, for example. Teams were not dominant like today. Someone like Benzema. won more than Van Basten.
Also, just to clarify i'm not a Cr7 hater. He is my all times top 5.
GOAT discussions, leave that on the other side of the Atlantic please. I love the NBA, but one aspect of the fandom that leaves me cold is the obsession with MJ v Lebron, Kobe v Lebron, Kareem v Wilt as legacy discussions. Go to an Nba board and many to most of the threads will be over these regurgitated topics.
Can't really compare players across generations. Ronaldo is one of the best ever, so is Messi, don't care to rank them.
Can't really compare players across generations. Ronaldo is one of the best ever, so is Messi, don't care to rank them.
The same collective mentality behind this thread is literally why we have Donald Trump.
I am not even joking about this.
I am not even joking about this.
Not even Real Madrid who had Casillas, Carlos, Zidane, Figo, Raul and Beckham in addition to him, and whom without him had won 3 UCL in 5?
Better hope there are no Messi fans in that circle.I'm in limbo. The mods are having a meeting about me
There are literally many posts in this very thread by the Maradona fans who claim he single-handedly won WC86 and Serie A titles.
As if Luiz Ronaldo played for some shit teams...
I'm not sure that's true at all, Real Madrid won 5 La Liga in a row followed by Barca 4 in a row in the late 80s/early 90s.
In Serie A, Milan won 4 out of 5 with Juve winning 3 out of 4 and no one else won it from 91-99
As for the Premier League, United fans should remember how dominant we were...
This post is not good enough.
C. RONALDO vs MESSI IN COURT*
Judge: Have any of you won the Golden ball?
Ronaldo: Yes, 5 times.
Messi: Yes, 5 times as well.
Judge: Have any of you won the Golden Boot?
Ronaldo: Yes, 4 times.
Messi: Same here.
Judge: How many individual trophies have you each won?
Ronaldo: 16.
Messi: 13.
Judge: Have any of you played for another club’s first team besides your current one?
Ronaldo: Yes! Sporting CP in Portugal first division and Manchester United in BPL.
Messi: No. Only Barcelona.
Judge: Have any of you won a title with your national team?
Ronaldo: Yes! We won Portugal’s first ever European Championship.
Messi: No.
Judge: How many goals have each of you scored for your respective teams?
Ronaldo: Should I count the goals I’ve scored for Man United and Sporting?
Judge: No. Only for Real Madrid.
Ronaldo: 427 goals in 421 appearances or 9 seasons.
Messi: 534 goals in 617 appearances or 14 seasons.
Judge: Who has scored more hat-tricks in La Liga?
Ronaldo: Me. 35 in La Liga.
Messi: Ronaldo has. I’ve scored 28.
Judge: Which is the most prestigious competition in club football?
Ronaldo: Champions League.
Messi: Champions League.
Judge: Have any of you won Champions League?
Ronaldo: Yes, 4 times in total with 2 different teams. Once with Man United and 3 times with Madrid.
Messi: Yes, 4 times as well with Barcelona only.
Judge: Who has scored more goals in the CL between the two of you?
Ronaldo: I’ve scored 114 goals in the CL.
Messi: I’ve scored 97.
Judge: Who has more assists between the two of you in the CL?
Ronaldo: I have 38.
Messi: Ronaldo has. I have 26.
Judge: Who has scored more goals in total in the CL finals?
Ronaldo: Me.
Messi: Ronaldo.
Judge: Which one of you have scored more free kicks?
Ronaldo: I have.
Messi: Ronaldo has.
Judge: Most goals with weak foot?
Ronaldo: Me, I think.
Messi: (Nods in agreement).
Judge: Most goals from outside of the box?
Ronaldo: Me.. again.
Messi: Ronaldo.
Judge: Who has scored more headers?
Ronaldo: Is that a serious question?
Messi: ...
Judge: Who has a better penalty conversion rate?
Ronaldo: I think I do. I’ve scored 82% of the penalties I’ve taken.
Messi: I’ve scored 77% of the penalties I’ve taken.
Judge: Which one of you have scored the most goals in total during your career?
Ronaldo: I think I have. 628 goals.
Messi: I’ve scored 595.
Judge: How many football records do each of you hold in total for both club and country?
Ronaldo: 146
Messi: 110
Judge: Well, after analyzing all of the facts that have been presented to me. I can only draw one conclusion when it comes to comparing you both as football players. That conclusion is that Ronaldo is the better player in almost every category. When it comes to goal scoring and accolades for both club and country, Ronaldo comes out on top. Messi, you are without a doubt Barcelona’s best player of all time. But certainly not the world’s best ever. That is clearly Ronaldo at the moment.
Messi: But I am younger than Ronaldo and haven’t played as many matches as him.
Judge: I understand that, but until you surpass his goal scoring records and win as many trophies both individually and collectively as he has, then Ronaldo will, according to the statistics, be considered as the best football player of all time. Until then, keep pushing on and you just might be able to achieve just as much as Ronaldo ! . Case close.
Can some one disagree with this high court of football?
Judge: Have any of you won the Golden ball?
Ronaldo: Yes, 5 times.
Messi: Yes, 5 times as well.
Judge: Have any of you won the Golden Boot?
Ronaldo: Yes, 4 times.
Messi: Same here.
Judge: How many individual trophies have you each won?
Ronaldo: 16.
Messi: 13.
Judge: Have any of you played for another club’s first team besides your current one?
Ronaldo: Yes! Sporting CP in Portugal first division and Manchester United in BPL.
Messi: No. Only Barcelona.
Judge: Have any of you won a title with your national team?
Ronaldo: Yes! We won Portugal’s first ever European Championship.
Messi: No.
Judge: How many goals have each of you scored for your respective teams?
Ronaldo: Should I count the goals I’ve scored for Man United and Sporting?
Judge: No. Only for Real Madrid.
Ronaldo: 427 goals in 421 appearances or 9 seasons.
Messi: 534 goals in 617 appearances or 14 seasons.
Judge: Who has scored more hat-tricks in La Liga?
Ronaldo: Me. 35 in La Liga.
Messi: Ronaldo has. I’ve scored 28.
Judge: Which is the most prestigious competition in club football?
Ronaldo: Champions League.
Messi: Champions League.
Judge: Have any of you won Champions League?
Ronaldo: Yes, 4 times in total with 2 different teams. Once with Man United and 3 times with Madrid.
Messi: Yes, 4 times as well with Barcelona only.
Judge: Who has scored more goals in the CL between the two of you?
Ronaldo: I’ve scored 114 goals in the CL.
Messi: I’ve scored 97.
Judge: Who has more assists between the two of you in the CL?
Ronaldo: I have 38.
Messi: Ronaldo has. I have 26.
Judge: Who has scored more goals in total in the CL finals?
Ronaldo: Me.
Messi: Ronaldo.
Judge: Which one of you have scored more free kicks?
Ronaldo: I have.
Messi: Ronaldo has.
Judge: Most goals with weak foot?
Ronaldo: Me, I think.
Messi: (Nods in agreement).
Judge: Most goals from outside of the box?
Ronaldo: Me.. again.
Messi: Ronaldo.
Judge: Who has scored more headers?
Ronaldo: Is that a serious question?
Messi: ...
Judge: Who has a better penalty conversion rate?
Ronaldo: I think I do. I’ve scored 82% of the penalties I’ve taken.
Messi: I’ve scored 77% of the penalties I’ve taken.
Judge: Which one of you have scored the most goals in total during your career?
Ronaldo: I think I have. 628 goals.
Messi: I’ve scored 595.
Judge: How many football records do each of you hold in total for both club and country?
Ronaldo: 146
Messi: 110
Judge: Well, after analyzing all of the facts that have been presented to me. I can only draw one conclusion when it comes to comparing you both as football players. That conclusion is that Ronaldo is the better player in almost every category. When it comes to goal scoring and accolades for both club and country, Ronaldo comes out on top. Messi, you are without a doubt Barcelona’s best player of all time. But certainly not the world’s best ever. That is clearly Ronaldo at the moment.
Messi: But I am younger than Ronaldo and haven’t played as many matches as him.
Judge: I understand that, but until you surpass his goal scoring records and win as many trophies both individually and collectively as he has, then Ronaldo will, according to the statistics, be considered as the best football player of all time. Until then, keep pushing on and you just might be able to achieve just as much as Ronaldo ! . Case close.
Can some one disagree with this high court of football?
C Ronaldo is better than Ronaldo number 9 - that's not with me being biased as a united fan. Sure they are not comparable due to differences in playing time - if they played together C. Ronaldo will overshadow him
Explanation please
La Liga was/is a two horses race. Ronaldo played for Inter Milan after leaving Barcelona.There are literally many posts in this very thread by the Maradona fans who claim he single-handedly won WC86 and Serie A titles.
As if Luiz Ronaldo played for some shit teams...
I'm not sure that's true at all, Real Madrid won 5 La Liga in a row followed by Barca 4 in a row in the late 80s/early 90s.
In Serie A, Milan won 4 out of 5 with Juve winning 3 out of 4 and no one else won it from 91-99
As for the Premier League, United fans should remember how dominant we were...
I dont know how old you are and if you followed football in the 90s Early 2000s, but was not like today. For example: the best team i saw in the 90s was Van Gaal Ajax.
Again, the argument of couting titles to decide who is the best means that Benzema is better than Van Basten and Zidane.
Whatever about the last decade or so (and it's been more of a three horse race in the 2010's), La Liga was far more than a two horse race in Ronaldo's time.
Between 95 and 05 there were 5 different winners. Funnily how Cal? only mentioned up until the early 90's eh?
Do you realize Di Stefano used to be mentioned as GOAT, or at least among top 3 or 4?
You're probably right. I remember when was tough to Barcelona even to qualify for Champions League.
Ronaldo joined a Real Madrid side who won 3 out of 5 CLs before signing him.
I never advocated counting titles to decide who's best, but if you are the key player of multiple CL winning team...
Yet between 84 and 95, there were 2 winners.Whatever about the last decade or so (and it's been more of a three horse race in the 2010's), La Liga was far more than a two horse race in Ronaldo's time.
Between 95 and 05 there were 5 different winners. Funnily how Cal? only mentioned up until the early 90's eh?
If he was that good, he'd have dominated La Liga like Cristiano and Messi are doing.
You removed 1 UCL, some percentage points from pens and I think some goals from Ronaldo. Also, added some percentage points for Messi.
We need a better judge who sticks to the facts!
Goats have amazing balance, Ibex Goats can climb up mountains and vertical cliffs and most importantly, they STAY ON THEIR FEET! If Ronaldo was a goat, he'd be at the bottom of that mountain clutching his leg for the next decade.
Messi: (Nods in agreement).
Messi has more league titles than Ronaldo, more domestic cups than Ronaldo, and has won more head to head matches
runs
This obsession with GOAT has to be one of the most sickening trends in modern football. It places the individual over the team (or should I say roster?), values the short term over the long term and reduces this beautiful game into statistical battles. There are culprits on both sides but this forum seems infested with the Ronaldo variety. Having affection for a former player is understandable but this level of devotion is bizarre. I can think of at least three posters on here who'd happily take Ronaldo winning the WC over United winning something.
I have seen many shite performances/bad years from R9, so I am not too sure about that. Also, I am not too sure a 33 year old R9 can still keep up the pace in top games.
We agree, your honor. Cristiano Ronaldo is the GOAT.
Cristiano Ronaldo, without any question of doubt. At 21 already you'd get one of the best players in world plus 12+ years of consistent world class performances. There are players who have had higher peaks than Ronaldo but what sets him apart is his longevity and consistency. Think of it this way, you could clone Ronaldo Nazario. For 2-3 years he's unplayable but slows down due to constant injuries. While the level he achieved during those 2-3 years may not be matched by CR7 but long after that CR7 will continue to score like a machine and win you loads of trophies. In time where Messi lives, he's likely to win his 6th Ballon d'Or at age of 33. That should tell you everything about what a freak he is.
Coming to the G.O.A.T question himself, I agree with what @Pexbo said. At the moment he's ahead but this discussion should be kept for when he's finished his career.
Creativity is an extremely subjective term, I can't help but feel a lot of posters are basing their opinion wrt aesthetics. Also, there's nothing wrong with people thinking there are better players than him or say Messi. What I have a problem with is with folks not even considering Ronaldo as their peers. He definitely is, once all is said and done I doubt there would be single footballer who'd have a career like him.
Ronaldo will go down as one of if not the best goal scorer of all time by the time he finishes up.
Fat Ronaldo however was the best FOOTBALLER I’ve ever seen. You literally felt like something would happen every time he got on the ball.
Fat Ronaldo however was the best FOOTBALLER I’ve ever seen. You literally felt like something would happen every time he got on the ball.
Yep. Judging players purely by stats and titles is utterly asinine in football. Football is not basketball. Judged purely by stats(especially modern trends) Zidane would be an entirely unremarkable player, as would guys like Figo and Giggs, and many other great attacking players who did not focus purely on goals. GOAT and stats removes the moment to moment beauty of watching a great player in their flow, you could watch Zidane play purely in midfield, never play a killer pass, try a shot and still know he was the best player on the pitch, such was his mastery of ball, game and tempo.
We should not lose that appreciation of the subtle brilliance in favour of numbers.
He's the best goalscorer I've ever seen but not the best player I've seen. Today kinda summed him up in my view. Scores a goal which wins the game for his team but did nothing else of note in the game.
The thing that sets him apart from any other player I've ever seen though is how driven he is. His desire and dedication to being the best is insane. Most players would be slowing down at his age yet he's getting better.
As for the other Ronaldo, I think R9 was more talented and a 'better' footballer but CR's longevity, consistency and goalscoring prowess puts him over the top.
The thing that sets him apart from any other player I've ever seen though is how driven he is. His desire and dedication to being the best is insane. Most players would be slowing down at his age yet he's getting better.
As for the other Ronaldo, I think R9 was more talented and a 'better' footballer but CR's longevity, consistency and goalscoring prowess puts him over the top.
Substitute Maradona for Messi in the Judge case and you'd get similar results.
Messi: ...
R9 was the more exciting player. But CR7 is the goat, absolutely.
Best in the tournament so far, but Messi has still been the better player for me. Many of the ballon'dors Ronaldo won I would have given to Messi.
Superb and impressive player nonetheless.
Superb and impressive player nonetheless.