It's a combination of multiple things, once the team gets going and we start actually playing attacking football RVP will eventually come good again.
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This is what i've been saying but a couple have remarked that Van Persie has been missing chances he'd have buried 2 years ago. Can't say i've noticed, i just put it down to what you just said.
I'm not sure. I was defending him for a while and expecting him to still do well, even if he didn't find his very best football again, but I'm not even sure we'll see that now. He just looks incredibly off the pace, and as if his most recent injuries have really affected him badly. I still have a small level of hope you're right though.
I actually meant from the start of last season. People said it was Moyes doing and him not liking Moyes but, the same has transferred into this season.
Alan Smith, Telegraph, reckons RVPs legs have gone and it's looking increasingly so. It's almost as though he's lost his athleticism overnight.
Pogue Mahone, Redcafe, agrees.
He is becoming a liability and I really think he is a fantastic player but right now its like we start games with 10 men. I hope Wilson gets a start against Hull especially after last season and with a fit again Falcao to start getting game time also.
Just think he needs to sit out a game or two, refresh his legs and come back hungry but if a spell being dropped doesn't improve him then he may well be on a terminal decline, if that's the case he doesn't deserve a guaranteed start anymore.
Whether LvG will drop his mate though is a different matter all together.
Just think he needs to sit out a game or two, refresh his legs and come back hungry but if a spell being dropped doesn't improve him then he may well be on a terminal decline, if that's the case he doesn't deserve a guaranteed start anymore.
Whether LvG will drop his mate though is a different matter all together.
With Rooney playing the way he is and Falcao being injured, this is the best time to switch to a one striker system that lends the squad a lot of balance, beef up the midfield with more players who can retain possession and shield an inexperienced defense. RvP could well be gone in the summer, we do not have to pick up the option on Falcao, bring back Chicharito if Madrid do not want him as a back up and go 4-3-3 which is an Gaal's preferred system.
It sort of gets to the point that even if we're seeing a blip and not the beginning of the end, can we really wait for him to get his form back? At his age and with his injury history I'd be amazed to still (possibly redundant) see him doing it at this level in a couple of years. I'm not sure there's an enormous amount to be gained by waiting for a guy who, even forgetting his chequered injury record, is on the way down if most other players are anything to go by.
Maybe we can limit his match time to just diving headers.
Thank god journalists are usually wrong.
I still think he was pretty much at his 12/13 level in the first few months of the Moyes season until he picked up his first injury. A great header in the Community Shield, 2 brilliant goals against Swansea and some other good efforts like the header vs. Arsenal. After he came back in January was when he form became mixed even though he was still scoring.
Yeah, he wasn't anywhere near as bad last season as he is right now. I can't imagine him scoring a goal like the Swansea ones last year, right now. The dramatic dip in quality is quite shocking tbh.
We'll still see occasional flashes of brilliance from him, but I reckon the days of him delivering world class performances week in, week out, or consistently winning matches by himself, are likely over. Bizarre how suddenly things seem to have come on, but it's not like he's the first player that's ever happened to.
This is how I felt during the Arsenal game.
At times I was wondering if he was on the pitch or perhaps getting medical help off the pitch.
On match of the day, they stated that he only had 14 touches (I think)...which is incredible.
It still really pisses me off that Moyes tried to rush him back to fitness from that groin injury last season around December. A player in his prime, when it looked like he was finally beginning get over his problems too. Van Persie ended up missing so many games because of the busy Christmas schedule and despite Rooney & Welbeck salvaging some league wins by the time he came back for the game vs. Cardiff we were in shocking form. Beaten by Spurs who'd just sacked their manager, out of the FA and League Cup, demolished by Chelsea etc.
“I think if I’d brought him off some people would say ‘What are you doing? You are 1-0 down and you’re taking off your top goalscorer.’
He bangs them in for Holland and people still think there's something wrong with him... The truth is he's not getting clean service and there's no point in him dropping deep the past few games because there's nobody else high enough for him to actually do something with it. In the Arsenal game the few times we did actually manage to carry the ball out to him he fluffed up, but both of the times I remember was because of Di Maria's awkward runs across him.
He's been shit for Holland since the first 2 games of the World Cup consistently except the last game where they hammered some minnow.
Many dutch fans wanted him dropped for Huntelaar or sm1 else too.
Bangs them in for Holland? Not true at all. And if he does, its vs Latvia etc. Great vs Spain, good goal vs Australia, that's about it in the past half year for him.
Dont take us too seriously, the majority also wants Blind to be dropped for Clasie.
Doesn't Blind play LB or LWB ?
Yes I also read about his touches or lack of, crazy stat.
There is loyalty and blind loyalty I just hope van Gaal makes the right decision, no one should start every match especially when they are offering so very little.
Yeah, but Willems has picken up some serious form and they want him there, as he offers more pace, power. So Blind is shifted to midfield, and de Jong was/is not available.
Says he could have only played 60/70 minutes, then makes him play 90 incase people criticise him. Then brings him on for 30 minutes in pretty much a dead rubber group game vs. Shakhtar just 3 days later with Hernandez sat on the bench having barely played any minutes.
I've been worried about RvP since last season. At first I just put it down to Moyes-ball not suiting him but then the World Cup came and he wasn't much better (wonder goal and the odd good game here and there). The spark has gone from his play since SAF left. I get the feeling it is a confidence and motivational problem but it could be that he is losing his pace. Not sure dropping him will kick him back to life either, might be he needs a big game to bring the life back into him. Either way, we can't carry him, the team isn't good enough to carry a player right now.
He's in the Torres, Shevchenko phase IMO, I mean he's playing his favourite position under a manager he has a great relationship with and is producing nothing. Look at Suarez at Pool last year or Aguero at City, so much of what they do in games where the team is playing poorly is to make things happen on their own off scraps, not waiting for it on a plate, that's what top #9's are expected to do.
Aguero turning two long balls where he is outnumbered into goals against QPR while City were playing shite is a prime example, Ruud did that with half chances for us back in the day and Rooney did it over and over for us in the 09/10 season when he played up top alone, there were many poor overall performances but time and again he made something happen and got us points. At this juncture RvP can barely even hold the ball up to bring others into play, a main facet of playing as a lone striker.
Aguero turning two long balls where he is outnumbered into goals against QPR while City were playing shite is a prime example, Ruud did that with half chances for us back in the day and Rooney did it over and over for us in the 09/10 season when he played up top alone, there were many poor overall performances but time and again he made something happen and got us points. At this juncture RvP can barely even hold the ball up to bring others into play, a main facet of playing as a lone striker.
I'd convinced myself that the only reason LvG was persisting with him is because of his hold-up play which is probably the only thing he's decent at atm, but it was utterly wank on Saturday - (was good against Chelsea iirc). I was arguing that he should be picked for the game against Arsenal because I thought he'd be well up for it, and although I don't think he's not giving effort, having him in the side is bit like playing with ten men atm.
Who cares? No, we wouldn't have won the title without him. None of those 3 players were a big loss.
I disagree, and does many(most?) others. First of all, the league was way too shite and Fergie way too experienced, for us not to win that year. Secondly, players like Kagawa, Rooney, Welbeck and Hernadez would all most likely have stepped up a notch, making the team better overall.
That is sort of the point. RVP stagnated their progress. If we never signed him, these 3 would have been a big loss now, as they'd all likely have improved immensely. We basically sacrificed 3 promising players + team balance in order to fit in a star that most likely only lasted for a season. I don't think that's worth it.
Unfortunately, it's more than just our team playing bad. On current form, I doubt he'd play much better if the whole team would play well. He's badly out of form (and somehow out of shape). I can't judge on his fitness levels but he's surely not at his physical best (and that for some time now).
Didn't realize RvP was already 31. Yep, he's definitely done.
31 is still young and virile.
Not if you're Owen Hargreaves, Michael Owen, or Robin van Persie.
Agreed. I think people forget that we had no problems scoring goals the season before he came. Welbeck and Rooney had potential, and the little bits of Kagawa and Rooney looked promising.
I definitely agree we could have won the league without him, and we could be better for it now, had we not signed him.
I look back at the signing as unnecessary, and possibly a mistake.
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I remember the early 2000's when Giggs and Scholes were "done" for most fans, funny how life goes.
Definitely a luxury signing that no one anticipated, but still a very important one for the first year he was here.
Time catches up with everyone. Robin was never that quick in the first place, so I think he still has plenty to offer. Reality says that the modern game is heavily influenced by pace and we will needed a complete forward who embodies all the skills necessary to play as a lone striker. RVP will be fantastic coming off the bench when we are chasing a goal.
Someone posted the interview with Comolli, who brought up an interesting stat about the success of teams trailing off significantly when their strikers are over 27. We have some big names up front but they are all at the wrong end of their careers. Rooney's future is as a number 10. Would love to see Wilson get a chance up front, and wouldn't be surprised to see us spend big on a forward in the next 18 months.
Someone posted the interview with Comolli, who brought up an interesting stat about the success of teams trailing off significantly when their strikers are over 27. We have some big names up front but they are all at the wrong end of their careers. Rooney's future is as a number 10. Would love to see Wilson get a chance up front, and wouldn't be surprised to see us spend big on a forward in the next 18 months.
The biggest problem for RVP is that being technically brilliant really isn't good enough for a top level striker anymore - unless you're the icing on the proverbial cake. All of the top teams have forward players that work incredibly hard and extremely 'active' - even if they're not scoring a ton. Players like Benzema spend the whole match running into channels and creating space - as well as harassing defenders. Suarez is probably the peak player of that type, Rooney was similar when deployed up top. Welbz too, though obviously without the goal scoring. And playing against Costa for 90 minutes must be incredibly draining.
Having RVP is like playing with 10 men some of the time. He attempted 3 passes on Saturday. 3!!! A traffic cone would probably of been as productive in that Arsenal defense. It's a little bit like Berbatov - the talent is outrageous - but in today's game application is almost more important. To be solely a goal-scorer you have to either be able to create by yourself (which RVP can't) or have a team that is significnatly better than anyone else. Neither is true for us.
I think he'd be an excellent sub though. Get him on running about for 25 minutes. If his ego can take it.
Having RVP is like playing with 10 men some of the time. He attempted 3 passes on Saturday. 3!!! A traffic cone would probably of been as productive in that Arsenal defense. It's a little bit like Berbatov - the talent is outrageous - but in today's game application is almost more important. To be solely a goal-scorer you have to either be able to create by yourself (which RVP can't) or have a team that is significnatly better than anyone else. Neither is true for us.
I think he'd be an excellent sub though. Get him on running about for 25 minutes. If his ego can take it.
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