Have to say I've never really been overly impressed when I've seen Adler in action, seems far too flappy and 'continental' to be a genuine success in the Prem and for us, but I've hardly seen him huge numbers of times, so who knows.
Rene Adler
- Thread starter Sean_RedDevil
- Start date
Indeed .. that's what I said. Anyway, it'll be more interesting and we'll see whether there was a real difference ... whether it's actually noticeable.
My choice is Craig Gordon ... why ... because I genuinely believe he's the best there is when it comes to value for money over the long term.
Don't really want to piss on your parade but before you start creaming yourself over Adler check out this compilation.
YouTube - Warum wählte Löw Adler aus?!? - Rene Adler Patzer
He's a decent keeper but not on the same level as Neuer
YouTube - Warum wählte Löw Adler aus?!? - Rene Adler Patzer
He's a decent keeper but not on the same level as Neuer
The one German in here says otherwise, that its close to even and that he feels Adler is a bit ahead. I've seen a lot more of Neuer than Adler. Neuer has been more in the spotlight. He played in a u21 tournament in Sweden, became the goalkeeper of the tournament. The reason Adler did not play in that tournament was because he had already went on to the German first team. Then Adler lost his spot too Neuer, before he took it back ahead of the South African World Cup, whom he lost again only because of a injury. The German national team seem to have favored Adler a bit in the past. Adler has been a bit more unlucky with injuries. Career wise, they have very similar careers, both has won the prestigious "best Bundesliga goalkeeper" award Neuer in 2007, Adler in 2008... It seems like its quite the duel between the two. And both of them probably have years left before they hit their peak. Hopefully, if we end up signing one of these, we have our first team goalkeeper spot set for the next 10-15 years.
I have seen matches by Adler and he seems solid. But I've ended up seeing a lot more of Neuer, as he sort of has been more in the spotlight. But when you see the history of Adler, it is just very impressive. At the age of 20, he starts to play his way into Bayer Leverkusen. The goalkeeper there at that time, is German international and current Bayern Munchen goalkeeper Hans Jorg Butt, one of the best goalkeepers in Germany. Something like that has not happened since Buffon took out Bucci at Parma. They are willing to drop a very strong goalkeeper whom had at least 5-6 years ahead of him, to go for a kid its a rare event. In fact Butt had a clause in his contract so he could leave because of this. So Leverkusen was so sure that Adler would become a great goalkeeper so they allowed one of the best goalkeepers in Germany leave for nothing? On top of that he is said to be a Manchester United fan, that makes it less likely that he will abandon us later on. Adler means "Eagle" whom also is a nice symbolic name for a goalkeeper - as eagles see everything.
I just have a feeling that Adler is the one to get, even though I would get thrilled if we got Neuer. They debuted the same time, both for rather strong German clubs. We know that we scout both rather regularly so I bet Ferguson will move for the one his reports finds as the better one.
He has the height and the physic to excel in the Premier League. He is already very good and with really good GK coaches here, he can become one of the best.
I have seen a bit. I am from Norway, worst experience is when he won Aalesund the cup against Molde (my local team) by walking a meter out on a penalty. Saved quite a few efforts that match as well. Aalesund ended fourth this season despite having a decent team, but the best goalkeeper in Norway. I bet they might relegate now that they have lost him (a few followed him out too).
I don't believe in that. Scholes broke threw despite us having Keane and Ince, Giggs knocked Lee Sharpe out to succeed, Beckham went trough Kanchelskis and Poborsky. Fletcher also broke in a strong coveraged midfield. I don't believe in free chances. Want to make it in Manchester United? Then you have to be able to compete with everyone. We should buy one of the best goalkeepers in the world, we are talking less money for Adler and Neuer than some years ago when we signed players for £50m. Glazers just erased a £220m debt, that should free more funds for players. I expect us to sign a few this summer. I don't believe that you need to give them a free chance for a season. I don't think that is the way at all. Lindegaard has potential, if Adler or Neuer sign, I think he will struggle a bit, because he is behind in experience, he really has to step up. But if he does not make that, its not meant to be. Lindegaard expected such a challenge when he joined.
Its a bit sad that van der Sar does not take another year, that would be very healthy for Lindegaard. We have to replace van der Sar when he retires. Or that will end up costing more than not doing it.
Scholes broke through at forward initially, which the club was thin at. He really took to midfield when Keane got crocked by Inge in the 97-98 season.
However, Butt broke through with Keane, Ince and McClair (played both MF and FW) in the way.
Kanchelskis was sold which allowed Beckham to jump right in. Beckham was a fringe player while Andrei was manning the wing. So much Beckham was loaned out in 94-95. He did manage to keep Sharpe out though.
However, Butt broke through with Keane, Ince and McClair (played both MF and FW) in the way.
Kanchelskis was sold which allowed Beckham to jump right in. Beckham was a fringe player while Andrei was manning the wing. So much Beckham was loaned out in 94-95. He did manage to keep Sharpe out though.
Haven't seen much from him except European games and highlights but than bold bit has gotten him the edge over Neuer for me. My name also means 'eagle' so you know he's been raised good.
And yes of course also the fact that he's a United fan and clearly has this confidence that he'd put a clause like that in his contract. Maybe also a plus that he's been a no-show (as far as I know) in the media. All speculations about his character but none of them are bad.
With the daily reports of buying a new goalkeeper in the summer it made me think that SAF must have a list of keepers he would like to buy, and in that list he would have his first choice, second etc. Also, i suspect United have probably spoken to the player or his representative about joining us in the summer.
Therefore, i think the following is SAF wish list, please note this is only an assumption:
1) Reina
2) Neuer
3) De Gea
4) Gordon
5) Adler
6) Buffon
7) McGregor
I think SAF would love to sign Reina, if not possible then he will look at the other possibilities. Does anyone agree with the order of the above list?
Therefore, i think the following is SAF wish list, please note this is only an assumption:
1) Reina
2) Neuer
3) De Gea
4) Gordon
5) Adler
6) Buffon
7) McGregor
I think SAF would love to sign Reina, if not possible then he will look at the other possibilities. Does anyone agree with the order of the above list?
No, I don't think we are interested in Gordon at all and McGregor is surely a joke?
Reina? Seriously? That seems to be as likely as Real Madrid signing Messi...
I'm not sure if there is much of a difference between Neuer and Adler, but Neuer played at the WC which gave him some great experience. However, if not for an injury, Adler would have played.
Although de Gea seems to be a great talent, I just cant see him bought as he's so young and it would be very risky to play him already.
Nevertheless, since Schmeichel, we know how important it is to have a brilliant goalkeeper! A top team just cant afford to have a mediocre keeper, he can be the difference in very tight games. VDS has been nothing but brilliant since he joined us and won us plenty of games (and trophies)
I'm not sure if there is much of a difference between Neuer and Adler, but Neuer played at the WC which gave him some great experience. However, if not for an injury, Adler would have played.
Although de Gea seems to be a great talent, I just cant see him bought as he's so young and it would be very risky to play him already.
Nevertheless, since Schmeichel, we know how important it is to have a brilliant goalkeeper! A top team just cant afford to have a mediocre keeper, he can be the difference in very tight games. VDS has been nothing but brilliant since he joined us and won us plenty of games (and trophies)
I'd be happy with either Neuer or De Gea, both will likely be top keepers.
After Fergie's recent comments about learning from the experience of trying to replace Schmeichel and that he should've got VDS straight away, I think it's almost certain he will be signing someone else as well as Lindegaard. No idea who, but I'd be a bit surprised if it's not one of the Germans or De Gea.
i cant see saf buying a keeper that will be on a par with lindegaard as this will lead to a carroll/howard type battle which doesnt help anyone.
i cant see saf buying a big name young keeper as this will piss lindegaard off straoght away if it is evident that he has been signed as back up.
if vds really does go then i think he will bring in an experienced prier league keeper as a safe pair of hands whilst lindegaard finds his feet and would then be happy enough to be number 2 until amos or another could take on that roll...jaaskeleinen? given? robinson
i cant see saf buying a big name young keeper as this will piss lindegaard off straoght away if it is evident that he has been signed as back up.
if vds really does go then i think he will bring in an experienced prier league keeper as a safe pair of hands whilst lindegaard finds his feet and would then be happy enough to be number 2 until amos or another could take on that roll...jaaskeleinen? given? robinson
lindegaards coming in jan so the transition can happen before the end of the season and a decision taken in may
No I don't think anyone is going to agree with your list. Reina at first and Gordon ahead of Adler? What were you thinking?
Every keeper makes mistake, how should Adler be any different... I could make a similar compilation for Neuer, most recently he had a bad blunder for Germany vs. Aserbaidschan I think, but it's natural; they are both still young in goalkeeping terms but have enough experience and most importantly the mental strength to cope with these kind of mistakes.
Adler has been named one of the three best keepers in Germany once again by the well-respected 'kicker' just this week (with Neuer coming out on top), and they gave a special mention to his European performances (Europa League) which have been exceptional. He has been injured for a while and lacked a proper pre-season, but slowly found his feet again.
You can't be wrong with any of those two. Considering the circumstances surrounding Neuer who, according to various sources, is close to have an agreement with Bayern Munich and Adler having this clause and being a Manchester United supporter (not to mention Leverkusen have a decent replacement coming through their own ranks), I guess it's pretty damn clear who we will go for if it's indeed one of Neuer/Adler.
Gordon is one of the best keepers in the Premier League and an experienced international. I'd be surprised if we weren't at least considering him as an option.
McGregor is an experienced Champions League keeper and international, used to life at a big club. Probably an unlikely signing now we've got Lindegaard but I'm sure he was looked at as well.
One of the best goalkeepers in the Premier League is not enough. Manchester United needs one of the best goalkeepers in the world. Neither of those two are there now. I am not saying that they cant get there, van der Sar did not do amazing at Fulham, playing with the best defence in the world would improve both of them.
Gordon is too injury prone.
Yet funnily enough a lot of folks on here think some of the best keepers in the world play in the EPL - VDS, Reina, Cech, Hart (hohoho), Friedel, Howard.
But how many are there? If you take the 100 best goalkeepers in the world, there are plenty in the Premier League. I am talking about the handful of goalkeepers that are more talented than all the rest, and basically is capable of winning a game on his own on a regular basis. For example when Peter Schmiechel or van der Sar just have a good day, the opposite team is fecked, period.
I would take a man with Reina's qualities but not him as we should not deal with that scum. Same problem with the Manchester City goalkeepers although I'd rather have Given than Hart on a short term basis, because I think he is better, but we should not deal with scum either. Cech is good enough, and would be a great signing. But he is not available. Friedel and Howard are not good enough, I actually think the difference of the level between them and Lindegaard is very thin, they are probably more experienced but less talented.
It all comes down to mental strength - at Manchester United being an excellent keeper isn't good enough. Howard is a very good keeper as he has proven over the years for Everton, Foster looks like a world-beater for Birmingham, but everyone remembers how he crumbled under the pressure at Old Trafford. These German guys, be it Neuer or Adler, have this arrogance and mental strength and are pretty good at actual goalkeeping as well.
Replacing Van der Sar is next to impossible though. We could get Neuer and make a very good deal, but having someone as good at playing football as Edwin and being a goalkeeper is not only rare, but pretty much unique in world football. We will appreciate it much more as soon as Edwin is gone (though I'm sure most of know how precious Van der Sar's footballing abilities are after watching Foster fecking up time after time last season).
Replacing Van der Sar is next to impossible though. We could get Neuer and make a very good deal, but having someone as good at playing football as Edwin and being a goalkeeper is not only rare, but pretty much unique in world football. We will appreciate it much more as soon as Edwin is gone (though I'm sure most of know how precious Van der Sar's footballing abilities are after watching Foster fecking up time after time last season).
I'm not exactly sure how you quantify a good keeper - it seems largely dependent on the quality of the defenders they have in front of them, and relationship they have with them.
Anyway, the main quality I look for in a keeper (at the higher echelons) is one who rarely makes a mistake and there are precious few these days that fall into that category.
Reina has shown that once his rock solid defence start to crumble he doesn't quite look so handy - his decision making is questionable. Hart is okay - questionable positioning, and it is for this reason that I think he doesn't get to some shots that he should. I'm still not really sure about Cech ... he seems to have settled but ... anyway, don't think you could really go wrong with him right now.
I can't really say I've seen enough of the others bar the usual suspects (GB, JC, IC, etc) but I have my doubts as to whether the names mentioned on this site so far are any better than Craig Gordon for instance. In the three years or so he's been in the EPL I bet you can count the number of mistakes he's made on one hand, easily ... and that's playing in front of some pretty dodgy backlines. Actually come to think of it his style is not a whole lot different to VdS though I feel he's a better shot-stopper.
Problem for him would be the expectation placed on him coz he'd cost United ~10-12m ... worth it in my mind.
Anyway, the main quality I look for in a keeper (at the higher echelons) is one who rarely makes a mistake and there are precious few these days that fall into that category.
Reina has shown that once his rock solid defence start to crumble he doesn't quite look so handy - his decision making is questionable. Hart is okay - questionable positioning, and it is for this reason that I think he doesn't get to some shots that he should. I'm still not really sure about Cech ... he seems to have settled but ... anyway, don't think you could really go wrong with him right now.
I can't really say I've seen enough of the others bar the usual suspects (GB, JC, IC, etc) but I have my doubts as to whether the names mentioned on this site so far are any better than Craig Gordon for instance. In the three years or so he's been in the EPL I bet you can count the number of mistakes he's made on one hand, easily ... and that's playing in front of some pretty dodgy backlines. Actually come to think of it his style is not a whole lot different to VdS though I feel he's a better shot-stopper.
Problem for him would be the expectation placed on him coz he'd cost United ~10-12m ... worth it in my mind.
The most important attibutes for our new keeper will be experience, consistancy, mentality and being very good dealing with crosses.
Shot stopping is way down the list. But its the main thing all these young keepers we are linked with, have in abundance. Does Adler really have the right qualities to succeed VDS?
Shot stopping is way down the list. But its the main thing all these young keepers we are linked with, have in abundance. Does Adler really have the right qualities to succeed VDS?
That's the biggest problem. Can't name one keeper who's exceptional at dealing with crosses out of all the keepers we're linked with. Even the German keepers aren't. Is De Gea? He looked shaky too, but he's only 20 and lacks experience, so it's to be expected.
From Wiki ...
Lindegaard
Age - 26
Height - 1.91m
Apps - Den (Odense) 11
Nor (Aalesund) 38
Int (Denmark) 4
Gordon
Age - 28 tomorrow
Height - 1.93m
Apps - SPL (Hearts) 139
EPL (Sunderland) 80
Int (Scotland) 40
Neuer
Age - 24
Height - 1.94m
Apps - Bun (Schalke) 138
Int (Germany) 15
Adler
Age - 26 in a couple of weeks
Height - 1.91m
Apps - Bun (B Leverkusen) 121
Int (Germany) 9
So Ekeke ... wrt to Craig Gordon
Experience ? - Check
Consistency ? - Check
Mentality ? - Check
Dealing with Crosses ? - Times have changed. Smart keepers rarely go all out for these these days.
Lindegaard
Age - 26
Height - 1.91m
Apps - Den (Odense) 11
Nor (Aalesund) 38
Int (Denmark) 4
Gordon
Age - 28 tomorrow
Height - 1.93m
Apps - SPL (Hearts) 139
EPL (Sunderland) 80
Int (Scotland) 40
Neuer
Age - 24
Height - 1.94m
Apps - Bun (Schalke) 138
Int (Germany) 15
Adler
Age - 26 in a couple of weeks
Height - 1.91m
Apps - Bun (B Leverkusen) 121
Int (Germany) 9
So Ekeke ... wrt to Craig Gordon
Experience ? - Check
Consistency ? - Check
Mentality ? - Check
Dealing with Crosses ? - Times have changed. Smart keepers rarely go all out for these these days.
Jorge Campos? Unfortunately I think he retired man
unfortunately ... he had a rather natty line in attire.
Well I didnt say they had to come out and catch the crosses. But they need to have a good idea of when to come and when to stay on their line and if they do come out, they need to deal with it. There'll be the odd mishap where he gets it wrong... But honestly would you have much confidence in Adler vs Stoke? I've barely seen him so I'm just asking the question. That youtube of him pretending to be Akinfeev isnt very encouraging
The problem with GKs is that too often, the media and caftards etc are swept up by every great shot-stopper that comes along.
Just as a strikers highlight reel will undoubtedly be full of spectacular, crazy goals, a GKs "wow" moments are usually when they pull off a great save, and therein lies the problem.
We dont need a shot-stopper. We have arguably the best back four in the world (certainly in the prem), our keepers do not make a lot of saves. A lot of the touted young keepers (the likes of PIG and Foster are included here) turn out to be great shot stoppers and capable of pulling off some fantastic saves but they flop dramatically when they play for us.
Its no coincidence that our most successful GKs have been the commanding ones, screaming at the defenders and brimming with confidence. Similarly it is no coincidence that VDS has been able to continue at the top level for us into his 40's - he isnt required to actually do that much during the game other than keep things organised at the back, come out to claim crosses and loose balls and occassionally make a great save, which he also does.
Ultimately, what we should look for in a keeper is one who commands his area and is great at claiming crosses and good reflexes. Anything else can be taught. The reason we have had so many failed keepers over the years is because whilst they were good shot stoppers and pulled off some phenomenal saves, they lacked the mentality and confidence to succeed in this environment.
Just as a strikers highlight reel will undoubtedly be full of spectacular, crazy goals, a GKs "wow" moments are usually when they pull off a great save, and therein lies the problem.
We dont need a shot-stopper. We have arguably the best back four in the world (certainly in the prem), our keepers do not make a lot of saves. A lot of the touted young keepers (the likes of PIG and Foster are included here) turn out to be great shot stoppers and capable of pulling off some fantastic saves but they flop dramatically when they play for us.
Its no coincidence that our most successful GKs have been the commanding ones, screaming at the defenders and brimming with confidence. Similarly it is no coincidence that VDS has been able to continue at the top level for us into his 40's - he isnt required to actually do that much during the game other than keep things organised at the back, come out to claim crosses and loose balls and occassionally make a great save, which he also does.
Ultimately, what we should look for in a keeper is one who commands his area and is great at claiming crosses and good reflexes. Anything else can be taught. The reason we have had so many failed keepers over the years is because whilst they were good shot stoppers and pulled off some phenomenal saves, they lacked the mentality and confidence to succeed in this environment.
perhaps try an outfield player in goal? rio would probably have the best attributes but perhaps gary neville as that would limit disruption to the defence
I wish the press would ask Fergie on his opinion on Adler and the clause he has with Leverkusen.
Bayers Torwart verrät in BILD Rene Adler: Vertrags-Poker bis April auf Eis! - Sport - Bayer Leverkusen - Fußball Bundesliga - Bild.de
He says.........
- No further talks with Leverkusen about a new deal
- But so far also no contact to United
- But he says again that United is his dream club
He says.........
- No further talks with Leverkusen about a new deal
- But so far also no contact to United
- But he says again that United is his dream club
He is pretty much begging us or at least issuing a come-get-me-plea to Fergie. I hope we get him.
Haven't seen any of them. Only seen Casillas and Igankeev. I cannot see in a million years SAF spending 20m on a goalkeeper. 15m max and more like 12m to be honest.
We're looking for a keeper at a time when none of our rivals is looking for a keeper - either in Domestic terms or Europe terms. £12m max!
Tx
We're looking for a keeper at a time when none of our rivals is looking for a keeper - either in Domestic terms or Europe terms. £12m max!
Tx
Besides arsenal, the club that's selling will know we be needing a keeper soon, which also depends on lindegaard's role, and if we have our sights on a specific goalkeeper, we'll be paying a lot more then the fair price.
Generally I agree, the business of judging goalkeepers for a top club is extremely difficult. Of course you can look for things like commanding the area, being good on crosses and reflexes (although reflexes would surely come under stop stopping?), but you can't really account for things like lapses in concentration. Foster didn't have any fundamental flaws, he was an excellent shot stopper, good on crosses, the reason for his failing at United was that he kept dropping clangers, he didn't have the mentality or the concentration. The problem is, how do you judge a keeper's mentality and his ability under pressure without taking a punt on him? I don't think you can.
We took a punt on Foster, we'll probably do the same with PIG or Lindegaard, or someone like de Gea. I can't see us making another signing like van der Sar, most goalkeepers who have proven themselves at the highest level don't move to midtable Premier League sides. Except maybe Pepe Reina.