Redcafe Snooker

I mostly watched the NI Open Qualifiers yesterday rather than the British Open Final - not a fan of Selby or Higgins, whereas there were plenty of the younger players I'm hoping to do well that were involved in the qualifiers.

Sadly, most fell by the wayside in either the first or second round (held on Saturday and Sunday). But Stan Moody did well again - beating Dylan Emery 4-2, and then coming back from 3-1 down to beat Ben Woolaston 4-3 - with breaks of 96, 64 and 58 in the final three frames.

Though he's got tough draws in the upcoming tournaments - Ryan Day in the Wuhan Open that he's qualified for, and Tom Ford in the International Championship Qualifiers.
 
Stan Moody having a good run of form. :)

Just beaten Tom Ford 6-2 in the International Championship Qualifier.
 
I criticised Ronnie for always pulling out of the British tournaments but always being available for the Chinese ones - so only fair to acknowledge that he's also just withdrawn from the Wuhan Open.

A couple of other players have done so in the last few days as well - Mark Allen and Dave Gilbert.
 
Set my clock to watch Judd Trump at 3am in the morning session of the Wuhan Open. He played well, with 3 centuries in his 5-1 win over Antoni Kowalski (who was poor).

And then got up again for the 7am session, to flick between the Neil Robertson - Jackson Page and Stan Moody - Ryan Day matches. Disappointed to see Robbo lose 5-1, although I like to see Page win as one of the few UK youngsters that look to have potential.

And another good win for another of those UK hopefuls - Stan Moody continuing his good start to the season with an impressive 5-4 win over Ryan Day. He showed good mental strength in the decider, after missing match ball Pink in the previous frame and losing it on the Black to have to go to the decider. He faces another tough opponent in the next round - Barry Hawkins.
 
With quite a lot of big name players already out - either withdrawn, lost in qualifiers or, like Robbo, lost today in the 2nd round - then it's the kind of tournament that's a good opportunity for someone who doesn't normally win / reach later stages.

In previous seasons, I'd once again be thinking 'could this be the one for Jack Lisowski!?' However as last season progressed, and the start of this, he seems to be playing with a very loose game - not bothering much about long safety exchanges and taking on increasingly risky (reckless) pots. It just doesn't look like he's in a good mental place Snooker wise - whether that's solely about Snooker, or an extension of other issues, who knows?

Would love to see him at least put a run together this week and get some momentum into his season. He starts his first game in an hour and a half against Iulian Boiko - a young amateur that I like and who's turning into a bit of a Jack Lisowski himself, as over the last couple of years he keeps losing (bottling) the final match that would see him get back on the tour.
 
Phew! Thank goodness Judd came through that last frame decider. This tournament was fast becoming a nightmare one for me - a Chinese based tournament with 3 Chinese players in the SF's is clearly a glimpse into what to expect going forward, but it's not what I want to see. If, added to that, Jack and Judd had both lost in the QF's, and I wouldn't have fancied watching the remaining matches much.

As much as I wanted him to lose, and was delighted to see the missed brown, I couldn't help but still feel sorry for Chris Wakelin. He looked understandably gutted. I always forget he's much younger than I realise - maybe that's just his baldness (he's 32, 3 years younger than Judd - looks about 10 years older!)

Despite all my reasoned thinking, and vows not to be fooled again, I admit to getting the 'could this really be the time?' feelings ahead of Jack's QF this morning - so, of course, he puts in an awful performance and gets hammered. :(

He seemed to have played so well, and the draw had really opened up so, against all my better judgement, I got my hopes up again. I'll never learn! :lol:
 
Long Zehuang was 4-1 up on Xiao. Now 4-4. Long is a strange one, 27 years old but virtually unknown on tour and has done nothing this season yet other than qualifying for the Northern Ireland Open where he will face Ronnie in Round One. I suppose his Championship League results were steady as well.

I agree with you @Bertie Wooster re: Trump, was hoping he would get through as it just adds a bit more glamour to the lineup.

I've always liked Trump, I know he's not everyone's cup of tea and it's not particularly because of his style that I like him but I just think he's a good competitor and he always got an unfair hard time through his spiked shoe days!
 
I’m watching the most fabulously shit frame between Vafaei & Jimmy White. Honestly, it’s literally one of those frames we all have in the snooker hall, colours everywhere, one red at a time, high break about 12
 
Shame O'Sullivan is pulling out of all the tournaments - especially the British ones. And Luca Brecel's commitment to Snooker is very questionable as well - now even prioritising his Ironman plans.

And another previously British based tourament heading to Asia with the World Grand Prix being held in Hong Kong next year. The first ranking event held there for 35 years but, after recently holding the invitational Hong Kong Masters, then building a new arena and getting this ranking tournament, then it's obviously going to become a regular host from now on.

They were discussing on the WST Snooker podcast (Mark Watson, Stephen Hendry, et al) about how soon over half of the top 16 might well be from China? They were more of the 10-15 year range. I guess that may be the case - but only because Covid, and then the match fixing bans, slowed it down for a few years and it's only just getting back now to the same level it was already at a few years ago. The difference being now, for this new talented group of Chinese youngsters, that it's still the same non-Asian players up there to overtake, and most of them (apart from Trump) are on a downward trajectory these days.

It was an interesting discussion, including things like many of the Chinese players being quite attacking players who don't yet have as good of a B game or 'street smarts' of how to grind out wins often enough - which is why a number have short bursts of form and success, but few have become consistent winners yet so we've seen a number of different Chinese winners rather than one specific one becoming a serial winner.
 
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Bertie Wooster said:
Shame O'Sullivan is pulling out of all the tournaments - especially the British ones. And Luca Brecel's commitment to Snooker is very questionable as well - now even prioritising his Ironman plans.

And another previously British based tourament heading to Asia with the World Grand Prix being held in Hong Kong next year. The first ranking event held there for 35 years but, after recently holding the invitational Hong Kong Masters, then building a new arena and getting this ranking tournament, then it's obviously going to become a regular host from now on.

They were discussing on the WST Snooker podcast (Mark Watson, Stephen Hendry, et al) about how soon over half of the top 16 might well be from China? They were more of the 10-15 year range. I guess that may be the case - but only because Covid, and then the match fixing bans, slowed it down for a few years and it's only just getting back now to the same level it was already at a few years ago. The difference being now, for this new talented group of Chinese youngsters, that it's still the same non-Asian players up there to overtake, and most of them (apart from Trump) are on a downward trajectory these days.

It was an interesting discussion, including things like many of the Chinese players being quite attacking players who don't yet have as good of a B game or 'street smarts' of how to grind out wins often enough - which is why a number have short bursts of form and success, but few have become consistent winners yet so we've seen a number of different Chinese winners rather than one specific one becoming a serial winner.
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Trump, Wilson….are there any other 20’s, early 30’s British talent?

I can’t think of any but I don’t follow the sport as closely as I used to
 
T00lsh3d said:
Trump, Wilson….are there any other 20’s, early 30’s British talent?

I can’t think of any but I don’t follow the sport as closely as I used to
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No, that's pretty much it as regards players currently looking like winning major / any titles.

There's my favourite player, Jack Lisowski, who is 33 and was a top 16 player for a good few years before recently dropping out. He's got bags of talent, and has reached 6 ranking finals - but he's a bottler and has lost them all! His temperament, and lack of tactical play, has prevented him from kicking on - but there's the potential of a top 16 and rankings winner in him: he's already proven the former, and just kept coming short on the latter though it's been a while now since he last threatened a win. :(

There's Joe O' Connor, Elliot Slessor and Chris Wakelin who are 28, 30 and 32 respectively and are just about either side of the top 32 at present. But that's about as high as they've got so far and neither have suggested much more - and certainly not getting anywhere close to the Trump / Wilson level.

Younger wise, the best two are probably Jackson Page (23) and Stan Moody (18). Page has been around for a while now on the tour - he's got good ability but, like Lisowski, lacks an all round game and is currently more about retaining his place on the tour than threatening the top 32/16. Though he did reach a smaller final earlier in the season.

Moody is a promising player who I've been aware of for a few years now. He's in his second season and, after a disappointing first season, he's doing better this year. Though he's going to face a battle to retain his place on tour and might have to rely on the one year list. But hopefully he can continue to progress as he looks to have high potential and certainly seems the best hope out there of any of the youngsters.

But pretty slim pickings, UK wise, once you look past Trump and Wilson at the moment.
 
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Bertie Wooster said:
No, that's pretty much it as regards players currently looking like winning major / any titles.

There's my favourite player, Jack Lisowski, who is 33 and was a top 16 player for a good few years before recently dropping out. He's got bags of talent, and has reached 6 ranking finals - but he's a bottler and has lost them all! His temperament, and lack of tactical play, has prevented him from kicking on - but there's the potential of a top 16 and rankings winner in him: he's already proven the former, and just kept coming short on the latter though it's been a while now since he last threatened a win. :(

There's Joe O' Connor and Elliot Slessor who are 28 and 30 respectively and are just about either side of the top 32 at present. But that's about as high as they've got so far and neither have suggested much more - and certainly not getting anywhere close to the Trump / Wilson level.

Younger wise, the best two are probably Jackson Page (23) and Stan Moody (18). Page has been around for a while now on the tour - he's got good ability but, like Lisowski, lacks an all round game and is currently more about retaining his place on the tour than threatening the top 32/16. Though he did reach a smaller final earlier in the season.

Moody is a promising player who I've been aware of for a few years now. He's in his second season and, after a disappointing first season, he's doing better this year. Though he's going to face a battle to retain his place on tour and might have to rely on the one year list. But hopefully he can continue to progress as he looks to have high potential and certainly seems the best hope out there of any of the youngsters.

But pretty slim pickings, UK wise, once you look past Trump and Wilson at the moment.
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It’s funny how players drop in and drop out. I remember (when they were young) watching Mark Allen vs Jamie Cope, the pistol vs the shotgun. Allen obviously has gone on to have a top career…..Cope I haven’t heard of for years. But, at the time, he said he’d stopped counting maximum breaks he’d made in practice after his 147th :lol:

Shows how hard it is to stay at the top
 
Bertie Wooster said:
Shame O'Sullivan is pulling out of all the tournaments - especially the British ones. And Luca Brecel's commitment to Snooker is very questionable as well - now even prioritising his Ironman plans.

And another previously British based tourament heading to Asia with the World Grand Prix being held in Hong Kong next year. The first ranking event held there for 35 years but, after recently holding the invitational Hong Kong Masters, then building a new arena and getting this ranking tournament, then it's obviously going to become a regular host from now on.

They were discussing on the WST Snooker podcast (Mark Watson, Stephen Hendry, et al) about how soon over half of the top 16 might well be from China? They were more of the 10-15 year range. I guess that may be the case - but only because Covid, and then the match fixing bans, slowed it down for a few years and it's only just getting back now to the same level it was already at a few years ago. The difference being now, for this new talented group of Chinese youngsters, that it's still the same non-Asian players up there to overtake, and most of them (apart from Trump) are on a downward trajectory these days.

It was an interesting discussion, including things like many of the Chinese players being quite attacking players who don't yet have as good of a B game or 'street smarts' of how to grind out wins often enough - which is why a number have short bursts of form and success, but few have become consistent winners yet so we've seen a number of different Chinese winners rather than one specific one becoming a serial winner.
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I wrote this 8(!) years ago…

Pexbo said:
Statistically speaking it's surely only a matter of time before some real wonder kids start popping up? I know Wenbo is no kid but it must be inevitable that a young natural pops up soon. Ding never really kicked on. Perhaps it proves that it's the coaching that makes the difference between natural talent as a 10-14 year old to being able to hold your own in matches against pros at 18-20.

A friend of mine predicted about 10 years ago after he went to a billiard hall while in China that they would be dominating the sport by now. He said it was about 4 or 5 stories with about 50 tables on each floor and a queue of youngsters waiting for their turn on each table. He also said he was told that there are loads of these places all over the country.

If all that is true it just seems crazy that a few more haven't made it, assuming the interest is still the same.
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To be honest without a strong Chinese cast coming though I really worry where snooker will be in the next 8 years. With O’Sullivan winding down the sport is desperate for a Luke Littler emerging. As much as people get bored of the O’Sullivans and more so the Hendry and Davis of this world, it’s really missing a player of that ilk right now. A player in their peak cleaning up and raising the standards of everyone else.

While the standards are higher now than they were 20 years or so ago, it feels like the mental strength and stamina is a lot lower and nobody can be arsed to our the hard practice in to put themselves ahead of the pack.
 
T00lsh3d said:
It’s funny how players drop in and drop out. I remember (when they were young) watching Mark Allen vs Jamie Cope, the pistol vs the shotgun. Allen obviously has gone on to have a top career…..Cope I haven’t heard of for years. But, at the time, he said he’d stopped counting maximum breaks he’d made in practice after his 147th :lol:

Shows how hard it is to stay at the top
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I hadn't thought about Jamie Cope for years!

Just looked him up and it seems that he developed tremors in his arms / the yips not long after breaking into the top 16 and fell down the rankings and eventually off the tour. That's a shame for him.
 
Pexbo said:
I wrote this 8(!) years ago…




To be honest without a strong Chinese cast coming though I really worry where snooker will be in the next 8 years. With O’Sullivan winding down the sport is desperate for a Luke Littler emerging. As much as people get bored of the O’Sullivans and more so the Hendry and Davis of this world, it’s really missing a player of that ilk right now. A player in their peak cleaning up and raising the standards of everyone else.

While the standards are higher now than they were 20 years or so ago, it feels like the mental strength and stamina is a lot lower and nobody can be arsed to our the hard practice in to put themselves ahead of the pack.
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Judd Trump seems to be - and often says in interviews that he feels he 'wants it more' and that defeat hurts him so much.

He's winning the amount of tournaments that should constitue a dominant period, but I guess people always judge it by amount of World Championships and he's still only got the one. Shame really, as I think that it's good that he plays in almost every tournament and treats them all with respect and the same desire for victory - but it probably effects his physical and mental energy when it comes to the longest tournaments like the World and UK Championship.
 
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Bertie Wooster said:
Judd Trump seems to be - and often says in interviews that he feels he 'wants it more' and that defeat hurts him so much.

He's winning the amount of tournaments that should constitue a dominant period, but I guess people always judge it by amount of World Championships and he's still only got the one. Shame really, as I think that it's good that he plays in almost every tournament and treats them all with respect and the same desire for victory - but it probably effects his physical and mental energy when it comes to the longest tournaments like the World and UK Championship.
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I’ve recently got back into playing regularly again (I seem to do that every 5 years or so!) and I’m playing on the circuit Judd played on as a nipper, albeit I’m starting again down in Div 2 and he was clearing up in the Premier division aged 10-15

Between summer league and now the winter league I’ve probably played about 10 matches and the old boys at the clubs I’ve been playing have probably brought his name up 6 times at least. Really lovely to hear first hand accounts of when he was that young though. One guy said he played in a handicapped singles tournament and he was -28 and the guy he was playing was +28 so started with a 56 point head start. His opponent managed to get a break of 30ish and was convinced he’d won the frame at 86 points ahead and then up steps this scrawny 13 year old and knocks in a century total clearance. It was at that point they realised he was built different.
 
Pexbo said:
I’ve recently got back into playing regularly again (I seem to do that every 5 years or so!) and I’m playing on the circuit Judd played on as a nipper, albeit I’m starting again down in Div 2 and he was clearing up in the Premier division aged 10-15

Between summer league and now the winter league I’ve probably played about 10 matches and the old boys at the clubs I’ve been playing have probably brought his name up 6 times at least. Really lovely to hear first hand accounts of when he was that young though. One guy said he played in a handicapped singles tournament and he was -28 and the guy he was playing was +28 so started with a 56 point head start. His opponent managed to get a break of 30ish and was convinced he’d won the frame at 86 points ahead and then up steps this scrawny 13 year old and knocks in a century total clearance. It was at that point they realised he was built different.
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:lol:

Must be amazing to play against a young kid as good as that! Even more so when you see them go on to achieve what the likes of Judd and Ronnie have done.

Good luck with the rest of your season. :)
 
Bertie Wooster said:
I hadn't thought about Jamie Cope for years!

Just looked him up and it seems that he developed tremors in his arms / the yips not long after breaking into the top 16 and fell down the rankings and eventually off the tour. That's a shame for him.
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Crazy to think he’s probably just got a ‘normal’ job now (if he isn’t a coach).

I only found out recently that one of our engineers at work had captained one of the Superleague rugby clubs and had a handful of England caps.
 
Stan Moody's continuing his recent good form. After beating Ryan Day (for the second time this month) 4-3, with a couple of centuries, tonight he's just beaten top 16 player, Jak Jones, 4-0 - with a century and a 92.

Two good scalps again - but he now faces an incredibly tough task in world #2, and reigning World Champion, Kyren Wilson, in the last 16. Hopefully he can at least put in a competitive performance - though, whatever happens, it's already been another successful tournament for him.
 
Fine win for Kyren Wilson in the final yesterday, beating Judd Trump 9-3 and it was as one sided as the scoreline suggests.

Judd had won a frame and looked like he might put up a fight but then missed the yellow altogether when playing a safety shot, hitting the jaw of the middle pocket and rolling behind the blue which meant a free ball for Kyren and he cleared up.

I think that was the point where it was totally lost!

So Kyren beats Judd in a ranking final for the second time this season (Xi'an Grand Prix being the other, 10-8) and would be wishing the World Championship started today!

If they did then I'd back him to break the Crucible curse but we're still way out from Sheffield!
 
Stan Moody just qualified for the Scottish Open - beat Iulian Boiko 4-2 in the first qualifier, then today beat Tian Pengfei by the same score. Though he'll face a tough opening match in the tourament proper in December, against #10 Zhang Anda.

He's also guaranteed minimum £5,000 for the upcoming International Championship in China after beating Tom Ford in the qualifier a while ago. Tricky match awaits there against another Chinese opponent, Xu Si.

He's currently up to #34 on the one year list, and #1 for those not already top 64 or in first year of two year card, so looking promising in terms of staying on the tour one way or another. But it would be better if he could get into the top 64 outright - though currently #72 and would need to continue this much improved form if that's going to happen.
 
Such a great match between Kyren and Mark Williams. Amazed by how entertaining Kyren has become to watch now and Williams has always been one of the best players to watch
 
Ayush_reddevil said:
Such a great match between Kyren and Mark Williams. Amazed by how entertaining Kyren has become to watch now and Williams has always been one of the best players to watch
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Wilson is playing so fast and Williams just has a classy elegance about his play
 
Ronnie surrenders a 3-0 lead to lose 4-3 to Xiao.

If there was any question that his heart isn't in it anymore see the above. No way anything close to prime Ronnie does that, as recently as last year he would have moved in for the kill and had no problem finding it.

Good standard to be fair with, unusually for a best of seven, four breaks in the 90s as well as a big century each.
 
Xiao’s secret tactic... bore his opponent in to submission
 
Brilliant match between Selby and Lisowski. Fantastic quality, Selby playing outstanding snooker to go 3-0 up, then Lisowski matching the standard to reel off three frames of his own. Currently 3-3 with five to play.
 
Very nice post match show with Ronnie & Jimmy really compliemtary of Jack. Jack mentioning that he has been getting a lot of advice from Ronnie recently
 
MemphisDepay said:
When did Allen become so boring
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Murphy is adamant it’s tactical and he’s trying to drag Hawkins down but I reckon that is bollocks. He looks shot of confidence and doesn’t trust the table. His body language is awful, he looks beat already this isn’t some Ebdon style psychological battle.
 
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