Rasmus Højlund | Signed for United

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We need a player that can guarantee 20+ goals right now plus good holdup play, so this guy ain't it.
 
Adnan said:
Fergie created a structure at the club which he relied on to sign players hence he trusted the judgement of the scouts. Fergie wasn't identifying the players to sign but he was rather overseeing the staffing and strategy on the football side of the club and hence he set the direction for the football structure to follow. Wenger did the same at Arsenal when arrived in 1996 and created a recruitment structure which was led by Damien Comolli.

All the top teams sign players by working with their head coach. Rangnick has even gone on record and said he didn't sign a first team player if the head coach didn't agree.

Mourinho and Solskjaer went against the grain and utilised people independently from the club's recruitment structure to sign players. It was reported that the scouts told Woodward about Maguire not being any better than the options that the club already had it's disposal and he shouldn't be signed under Mourinho. Mourinho then went to war with the club's recruitment structure and started maligning them in public by stating how good West Ham's scouts were due to them identifying talents like Issa Diop. Solskjaer comes in with Phelan as his advisor and Woodward seemingly ignores the head scouts and allows Maguire to be signed with Maguire's former manager at Hull, Mike Phelan likely playing a key role.

Both Solskjaer and Mourinho were reportedly relying on their personal scouts and David Ornstein reported about Solskjaer not having communication with the club's recruitment department and Sokskjaer and Phelan were seen scouting players in several stadiums around Europe. Fergie and Wenger didn't operate like this and they developed their club's football structure and utilised the resources of their club's which benefited both the club and manager.

Erik ten Hag from the evidence at hand is working with John Murtough and the scouts, data and video analytics teams. He doesn't have independent scouts from what I've heard and read, and he's part of a football structure that is looking to streamline the process, which has only started happening now since Fergie retired. So if ten Hag is interested in signing someone he's familiar with, he has to inform the heads of scouting who will run the rule over said players. And it has been reported about ten Hag asking the scouts to compile reports on players he knows about. And that is normal at clubs who have a streamlined approach to their football structure.

Paranoia is deep among many fans on here, which is understandable. But the only issue I see right now are the owners who need to back the team below. And this is a team of people who need the backing on the football side of the club.

John Murtough: Head of football
Erik ten Hag: Head coach
Andy O'Boyle (deputy head of football)
Matt Hargreaves: (transfer/contract negotiations)
Jose Mayorga/Simon Wells (head scouts)
Dominic Jordan (head of data science)

And the article below from the people at the transfer ground guru from January 2017, goes into more detail about the scouts that were brought in and how no stone was left unturned in bringing the best in class recruiters.


https://trainingground.guru/articles/man-utd-scouts-summoned-for-meeting-after-huge-overhaul

Woodward put Lawlor and Bout in charge of the scouts at first team level and allowed Solskjaer and Mourinho to operate independently from the scouts. And that there is Man Utd's problem and why we couldn't develop the football structure to a high level. Liverpool had the same issues under Rodgers until they hired a head coach in Klopp who came in and revived a much ridiculed football structure that was led by Michael Edwards.
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Scouting is simply not the issue. See post above.

We definitely have a plan B & besides, the clamour for a “hidden gem” is incredibly disingenuous, because if we did sign an unproven gamble, risk of a player playing in Brazil or Ecuador in Caicedo’s case. This place would be in uproar at how they’re not ready and how are we supposed to challenge the likes of City with this unproven young player / striker. Can’t have it both ways. Same goes for run of the mill players at middling clubs who could explode playing for a big team, this place would then their noses up at them.

Escobar said:
Wow, seems like a sensitive topic to you.

In the past 8 years or so, our scouting has been mediocre at best, and we heavily overpay for players. If you look at all the signings in the past 8 years, who has really been a top performer over a long period of time? And more often than not, we do not seem to have an alternative in case we cannot buy a particular player, latest example is Antony. So yes, other team's scouting has been much better than ours.
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The problem with the striker department is that there aren’t that many options out there in the price range we’re willing to pay. I honestly think we might not sign a striker at all. Makes the fact that we didn’t go for Thuram in a free even more ridiculous.
 
Strelok said:
I mean if you talk about overpaying massively for some raw talent Nunez is not a very good example?
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Thinking about this tbh I couldn't find a single case that worked out well. Has ever we have a case where a team paid massively for a raw talent and that raw talent went on to justify his price later?

I could only think of Rooney and Mbappe but despite being young both were actually already pretty matured when we and PSG bought them. They were definitely not raw.
 
Klean said:
These are always interesting opinions when it comes to tactics. Good thing we have stats to look at.

Vlahovic (2022-2023) scored 8 Non penalty goals from an npxG of 7.3
Hojlund (2022-2023) scored 9 Non-penalty goals from an npxG of 9.5

Vlahovic has had a longer career and has scored 48 Non Penalty Goals from a npxG of 42.2. I think it comes down to personal preference here, and I know i prefer Hojlund. He is more dynamic and can do much more on top of being younger, so I think he has a level above Vlahovic he can get too. Vlahovic is a great player, but I think we know what his game is and will be. Hojlund we do not.
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I'm not trying to debate who is better necessarily, but I don't like people thinking Vlahovic is some scrub because of him playing in a fecked up squad led by a dreadful manager. Me personally I don't put too much faith in these stats because I don't think they reflect what he can be. He's on an island in a 3511 with two washed wingbacks besides him. My point is he would be way better off playing for a team like us so his npxG for Juventus doesn't really matter to me all that much. Think he needs a move away from Allegri's shitshow so he can score goals for fun again like he did for Fiorentina and Serbia.

We do have a bigger sample size on what type of player he is but I think he could improve in many areas under ETH and be a good fit due to his link up play being pretty good at Juve when he gets the opportunity to show it and he was a genuine threat from even outside the box at Fiorentina. Hojlund may be a way better fit for all I know but I haven't watched enough of him and I'm not going to pretend I did. Can you tell me what he does better?
 
Strelok said:
Thinking about this tbh I couldn't find a single case that worked out well. Has ever we have a case where a team paid massively for a raw talent and that raw talent went on to justify his price later?

I could only think of Rooney and Mbappe but despite being young both were actually already pretty matured when we and PSG bought them. They were definitely not raw.
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Vinicius Junior, Rodrygo, Ødegaard (although not exactly massively) that I can think of quickly
 
zaafi said:
Vinicius Junior, Rodrygo, Ødegaard (although not exactly massively) that I can think of quickly
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Yeah not really massively. I checked and Madrid paid 40m for Vinicius. With the current market it's about the same what we paid for Ronaldo and Nani back then I think.
 
The only way they'd get €80m is if it's €60m upfront and €20m in add-ons if he reaches the potential otherwise we will need him to hand a transfer request and we can actually negotiate a realistic deal.
 
Redcy said:
Felix is not a nine, he is lightweight, gets absolutely bullied by defenders when he plays centrally. He is not even a 10 really. If Felix is the answer why bother? Just use Sancho, he is probably more effective than Felix, will cost nothing, and is more suited to a false 9.
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As a false striker I think Sancho can do well because he's looked good playing further up than running up and down life a galavanting winger
 
Strelok said:
Yeah not really massively. I checked and Madrid paid 40m for Vinicius. With the current market it's about the same what we paid for Ronaldo and Nani back then I think.
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But that ist not current market either, it was in 2018. Only 3 transfers had a higher fee in/out LaLiga during that summer. Kepa, Ronaldo, Lemar.

So yeah, 60m for Hojlund today is a pretty good comparison to the 40m for Vinicius back then. Same fee as Rodrygo a year later, also from a smaller league/market.

Did the same search in the premier league, under 20yo transfers for above 30m: Martial (51m), Rooney (31m), Shaw (31m), Fabio Silva (34m), ....
Anything around 60m or even higher would be quite a crazy fee. You surely must see some world class in him to pay that.
 
Rampant Red Rodriguez said:
As a false striker I think Sancho can do well because he's looked good playing further up than running up and down life a galavanting winger
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he was shocking against Leeds tbf, but I would rather sancho than felix, both v similar, and I figure sancho is not costing us extra cash.

Vlahovic I am not against at a cut price say 65m, he is extraordinarily one dimensional and will limit our play, we have bought in players to play a style and Vlahovic does not fit at all, but maybe our only way ahead for now

Hojlund plays the way we want but we really should not be spending anywhere near 80m

Mitrovic would not be a terrible option but it looks like he wants the big Saudi pay day so I dont see him coming
 
swissgenius said:
But that ist not current market either, it was in 2018. Only 3 transfers had a higher fee in/out LaLiga during that summer. Kepa, Ronaldo, Lemar.

So yeah, 60m for Hojlund today is a pretty good comparison to the 40m for Vinicius back then. Same fee as Rodrygo a year later, also from a smaller league/market.

Did the same search in the premier league, under 20yo transfers for above 30m: Martial (51m), Rooney (31m), Shaw (31m), Fabio Silva (34m), ....
Anything around 60m or even higher would be quite a crazy fee. You surely must see some world class in him to pay that.
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Martial was not 51m, there was a lot of add ons. And it's not a very good example either.

When I said massively I mean 80-100m which is what Atalanta reportedly is asking us. Or 30m back then when the market hasn't gone crazy yet. The market started to go crazy after the Neymar transfer in 2017 I think.

Btw Rooney was not raw I said that already. Shaw was not raw either he's already a regular in the PL for a couple years before we bought him. Fabio Silva was bought in 2020 so 34m is not massive.

OmarUnited4ever said:
I see, fair enough, maybe Osimhen when he moved from Lille to Napoli, they paid a hefty price for him as 21 yo.
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Agree that might be a good example. They paid 70m for him I think. I don't follow the guy though so no idea how he was back then.
 
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Have a feeling if he wants to move to United, Hojlund would have to request for a transfer.
 
LawCharltonBest said:
Dead in the water
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Eventually I think Atalanta will realise that Hojlund is desperate for United, and if they prevent him from living his dream after they had a very good offer a) they will actually get less from another club in the future, and b) it will harm their reputation as a stepping stone club. Dortmund can attract the best talent because they always allow their players to go if a decent offer comes in.
 
croadyman said:
There seems a significant gap on valuations here compared to the Mount & Onana situations. I honestly couldn’t call how this striker search is gonna end up right now
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Every target so far has started out with an asking price of £85m and ended up at £55m. Hojlund will be the same but it'll probably take all summer.
 
Real Name said:
Whenever you see big conversations with barely any news it usually means it is.
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I just posted a tweet a few posts up from Sky saying we are negotiating with them? People need to stop waffling in here. The consensus also is we are trying to get Onana over the line before focusing on it fully
 
Lyng said:
Have you seen the comments from the Porto fan in the Taremi thread? Really doesnt sound like the right player for us.
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Yeah grim to say the least,however wouldn't be averse to him as back up option
 
We need a striker to guarantee 20 or 25+ goals. Höjlund scored 9! in the inferior Serie A.
Höjlund is nothing special.
Höjlund only look fast against slow defenders.
He can't control a ball if his life depended on it. (Come on. Did'nt you see that Fail-Video-Compilation of laughable first touches?)
Atalanta are such greedy Bastards!
Vlahovic, Muani, Felix etc. are all much better.
He never played PL = He is barely better than our academy players.
40 mio tops. Everything above that sum is overpayed.
We need Kane or Osimhen ASAP! Who cares about FFP?
It would take time (years or even decades probably) for him to adjust to the mighty PL.

I really don't know what we are discussing here. After reading all these things it must be clear to everyone.

Our scouts are like Jon Snow.

Same goes for Erik ten Hag.

Rasmus Höjlund is absolutely crap.

Best Regards
 
L1nk said:
I just posted a tweet a few posts up from Sky saying we are negotiating with them? People need to stop waffling in here. The consensus also is we are trying to get Onana over the line before focusing on it fully
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Its just like your opinion man.
 
Zico1982 said:
We need a striker to guarantee 20 or 25+ goals. Höjlund scored 9! in the inferior Serie A.
Höjlund is nothing special.
Höjlund only look fast against slow defenders.
He can't control a ball if his life depended on it. (Come on. Did'nt you see that Fail-Video-Compilation of laughable first touches?)
Atalanta are such greedy Bastards!
Vlahovic, Muani, Felix etc. are all much better.
He never played PL = He is barely better than our academy players.
40 mio tops. Everything above that sum is overpayed.
We need Kane or Osimhen ASAP! Who cares about FFP?
It would take time (years or even decades probably) for him to adjust to the mighty PL.

I really don't know what we are discussing here. After reading all these things it must be clear to everyone.

Our scouts are like Jon Snow.

Same goes for Erik ten Hag.

Rasmus Höjlund is absolutely crap.

Best Regards
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Højlund is fast and NOT slow at all - you must have watched the wrong player. And some fans, like you, are going to give him a hard time, if he comes here - he is just 20 years old and still needs time to develop. So he probably won't score 20-25 goals in his first season. If you want a striker like that, you need to look for a more mature and established player like Kane. But can United buy him?

You claim that Atalanta are greedy. But the truth is that they are just happy with Højlund and would rather not sell him. They bought him last summer and still have a long contract with him and are happy with him. They want him for at least 1 more season. So why should they sell for the price, United want to?

That you rate Højlund as "crap" is nonsensical. He is, as I said, very young and 9 goals in Serie A in his first season are approved. In addition, 6 goals in his last 3 international matches.
 
Giggsy13 said:
Imagine going into next season with the exact same striker options. Get this done FFS.
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The main concern seems to be will he be able to score enough goals,that's why I feel we need to sign an experienced name too
 
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