[Bon1803]

Saddens me to see the way things have gone for Rasmus. He looked to have the raw tools to do well for us but it’s just not happening and his weaknesses are becoming very evident.

Are we utilising him properly ? He seems to want to play hold up but can’t as he doesn’t have the required skill set. He’s more of a runner in behind but we don’t play the balls for him to do so. Given our recent struggles his lack of hold up actually hinders us to a point where you wonder what the point of him being on the pitch is.

It’s a tough situation to resolve , he is not showing enough to get minutes but needs them to gain any sort of confidence. Could a good pre season give him the boost he needs ? Or is a loan to a less demanding environment the answer ?

Honestly thought he would have worked out a lot better and still hope he can recover but what can’t go on as is.

 

[Pronewbie]

Saddens me to see the way things have gone for Rasmus. He looked to have the raw tools to do well for us but it’s just not happening and his weaknesses are becoming very evident.

Are we utilising him properly ? He seems to want to play hold up but can’t as he doesn’t have the required skill set. He’s more of a runner in behind but we don’t play the balls for him to do so. Given our recent struggles his lack of hold up actually hinders us to a point where you wonder what the point of him being on the pitch is.

It’s a tough situation to resolve , he is not showing enough to get minutes but needs them to gain any sort of confidence. Could a good pre season give him the boost he needs ? Or is a loan to a less demanding environment the answer ?

Honestly thought he would have worked out a lot better and still hope he can recover but what can’t go on as is.

Bruno and Casemiro thrive on inshallah balls so there's no excuse for his poor movement. It's a pity he's regressed from his early and end of season form last year. I thought he'd come back a smarter player, or at least show the same form, but this frankly is unacceptable.

 

[yamo123x]

Even though we didn't watch the game i could still tell you Hojlund was atrocious
Feel sorry for him

 

[zertz]

How bad has he been on a scale from 0 to 10 this season?

 

[Bobski]

How bad has he been on a scale from 0 to 10 this season?

A 1 or 2. He has been abysmal, offered next to nothing. The focus is on goals but what about other elements?

Good in the air?

No, won 17/76 aerial challenges in the league.

At least he works hard, surely..

No, he has won 1 out of a total of 3 tackles attempted in the league this season.

You could go on and on, he might be the most ineffective player who is getting starting mins in a major league.

 

[LukeChadwick36]

A 1 or 2. He has been abysmal, offered next to nothing. The focus is on goals but what about other elements?

Good in the air?

No, won 17/76 aerial challenges in the league.

At least he works hard, surely..

No, he has won 1 out of a total of 3 tackles attempted in the league this season.

You could go on and on, he might be the most ineffective player who is getting starting mins in a major league.

There was a point when, i think it was Tarkowski just pushed him and Hojlund fell over.

Its not just that hes shot of confidence, its like hes lost any semblance of how to play football.

I do feel terrible for him as he seems a genuine guy. Hes just found himself completely out of his depth at such an early point in his career.

With our luck i bet he will find his feet in 5 years in another league and become a Forlan Version 2.

 

[Lay]

At one point for Denmark he had 7 goals in 10 games.

He now has 7 goals in 22 games.

 

[WeePat]

We’ve been linked with Garnacho, but Hojlund is a player I absolutely do not mind taking a cheap-ish punt on, if United want to move on from him.

 

[sourdough satellite]

I'm being optimistic here, but I still think he could be a great player in the Bulgarian 2nd division.

 

[bringbackbebe]

We’ve been linked with Garnacho, but Hojlund is a player I absolutely do not mind taking a cheap-ish punt on, if United want to move on from him.

Yes, please bid! Swap with Palmer?

 

[BorisManUtd]

How bad has he been on a scale from 0 to 10 this season?

2 league goals (and 0 assists) while playing most of the time is really bad. I actually feel sorry for him as he's only 22 and is having pressure of being United's first striker but he's worse than last season instead of improving on it. 4 goals and assist in 8 Europa League games makes it bit better so he's been a 3/10 this season overall imo (mostly available as well so that's a plus).

 

[Oscar Bonavena]

How bad has he been on a scale from 0 to 10 this season?

Well, if you're going off the average player ratings for the season on this site, he's 4.9, the same as Zirkzee.

Zirkzee has been poor but at least he's showing signs that he might offer something, anything to the team. Hojlund has offered nothing. Almost literally nothing. So even 4.9 is probably generous!

Just to compare, Garnacho is 5.5 (not great but he had a very poor start to the season) and Diallo is 6.2 (doesn't look that good but I think he's our highest rated player this season!)

 

[Fobal]

Cocky and having swagger/ego are generally part of a young person’s human condition; life hasn’t battered them with hardships yet and left them humbled and vulnerable, mostly, so they know no different and aren’t generally begrudged their youth and hubris. It’s more, each youngster will learn and mature, leaving most of that behaviour behind, eventually.

The ego being a resource and a fuel that begets quality output is also part and parcel for many a player and perhaps particularly youngsters, who are then often labelled “fearless,” which is usually just naïveté and literally not knowing any better, manifest - it’s mostly a great thing for them to have that cockiness, so long as it is harnessed correctly. When you are that age and everything is going well for you, you feel invincible and are highly likely to be your most expressive and assured. Hojlund is like Aslan shorn of his mane; he’s a husk of the player who arrived here and it’s a given that will lead him to go into a shell and even be fearful of doing things for angst about standing out for the wrong reasons. This is often when players hide on the pitch and actively don’t want the ball.

The club has played a major role in how things have turned out and it was more likely to happen than not because the young nearly always have to learn and be protected until they are ready and we actively went against that in a display of unprecedented incompetence that was a concern regarding Hojlund in his transfer thread before we had even signed him. Varane said this the other day:


At Madrid, you can see that for years there has been a framework”, Varane explained. “A player is added, some leave, but there is always a solid foundation.

“When you recruit young, talented players, they have to learn before they can play. It gives them time to develop. When I arrived, at the age of 18, I had no responsibilities in the dressing room. I was just there to learn.”

Varane then explained that at United, 18-year-olds are expected to perform right away with a heavy spotlight – due to the fact no established stars are taking the burden.

“At United, they can recruit a very expensive young player and immediately play him, with all the responsibilities in an extremely difficult league. He’s got a huge weight on his shoulders straight away.”

—

It’s the most basic of principles, and we see here, time and time again what happens to these young players who are neither protected or have/had older veterans that bore the brunt of the pressure - Hojlund is just one of many by now, unfortunately.

Yeap, yet I was just playing Devil's advocate for what probably some scout might have seen in him.

And it's true that in a better enviroment young players develope better, 100% true, yet when people threw known names from the past or current ones and talk about them at 22 in the mix with Rasmus, a lot of them played with more condifence and better overall perfomances even in similar or even worse scenarios. I know that for younger fellas to not be thrown to the jungle it's always better, but the age right now (more being 22) it's not that much of a scapegoat, even if it should be and United should have provided a better strategy.

 

[LDUred]

We should have signed a free agent during the window.

There were a few names being bandied about - Costa, Diaz, Vela, etc - admittedly not brilliant options, but Hojlund badly needs to step out of the firing line because each game the confidence is just draining out of him. An extra striker would have helped massively just for rotation.

You could see him potentially coming back refreshed, scoring a goal as a sub, perhaps; but just playing him game after game is very counter productive at this point.

 

[Scriblerus]

He's regularly isolated up front, chasing balls lumped forward. I can remember plenty of matches where Rooney was put in a similar position and looked awful. Obviously he's short of confidence and form but we don't give him much to work with. I think there's a good player there if he's allowed to develop.

 

[Jaae]

To anyone who thinks we are somehow holding Hojlund back, he also has 0 goals in 12 games for Denmark last year. He just isn't very good.

I wouldn't sell him just yet but he either needs to go out on loan, or be back-up to a more experienced striker next season.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Needs to be dropped. For an extended period. Really poor.

 

[Mainoonited]

Bruno and Casemiro thrive on inshallah balls so there's no excuse for his poor movement. It's a pity he's regressed from his early and end of season form last year. I thought he'd come back a smarter player, or at least show the same form, but this frankly is unacceptable.

I've never heard that term before but I love it.

 

[Chaky_Best]

We should have never splash that money on him.

Not the level we need, not the talent needed either.

Too much pressure on him and he falls.

Formation is poor, slow and without flair, but he doesn't help.

To be honest except Harry Kane that can do many things alone, I don't see who can really help us (except God)

A really tough job to to this summer

 

[Fortitude]

He's regularly isolated up front, chasing balls lumped forward. I can remember plenty of matches where Rooney was put in a similar position and looked awful. Obviously he's short of confidence and form but we don't give him much to work with. I think there's a good player there if he's allowed to develop.

This is fanciful assessment that has somehow become legion on here. He is asked to do what strikers do, and he is incapable of doing so. You literally only have to look at any other starting striker in the league to see what Hojlund is not doing for this team. And I mean literally.

A huge role for your point man is to bring others into the play and up the pitch with their ability to act as a hub for others. You don't need the second coming of Benzema or Drogba up there, just someone who can be passed into and either relay the ball to someone else in the attacking chain, or hold on to it long enough for others to either run past him or use him as a conduit in the progression of the ball. When your striker cannot do that, the team has no means of progressing the ball assuredly and with the consistency that gives others confidence to make off the ball runs with abandon. In other words, your own team get stuck and hemmed in behind the striker and the ball has nowhere to go unless you have some marvels on the flank who can consistently progress the ball by themselves, which is not how teams play in this day and age.

The saying 'it's like we're playing with 10 men' comes down to there being no way to make use of a striker who cannot perform the literal, bare basics of the position - strikers are an essential component in how a game flows and where the ball can go in times of need (particularly in alleviating a crushing press in midfield) and this is also where we see our midfield swarmed time and time and time again as the ball constantly gets placed in a matrix there where for other teams, the striker has received, held up or turned and not only relieved that press but stretched the opposition with his actions thus giving his own midfield a chance to breathe and go on to exploit open space running in behind him.

This thing of being a flank runner is also being taken out of context as flank roaming/running strikers are absolutely superb at dragging central players into horrid places to pick them up whilst bringing their own teams into the mix.

Using Rooney in any relation to Hojlund is going to kill your argument.

 

[SilentWitness]

This is fanciful assessment that has somehow become legion on here. He is asked to do what strikers do, and he is incapable of doing so. You literally only have to look at any other starting striker in the league to see what Hojlund is not doing for this team. And I mean literally.

A huge role for your point man is to bring others into the play and up the pitch with their ability to act as a hub for others. You don't need the second coming of Benzema or Drogba up there, just someone who can be passed into and either relay the ball to someone else in the attacking chain, or hold on to it long enough for others to either run past him or use him as a conduit in the progression of the ball. When your striker cannot do that, the team has no means of progressing the ball assuredly and with the consistency that gives others confidence to make off the ball runs with abandon. In other words, your own team get stuck and hemmed in behind the striker and the ball has nowhere to go unless you have some marvels on the flank who can consistently progress the ball by themselves, which is not how teams play in this day and age.

The saying 'it's like we're playing with 10 men' comes down to there being no way to make use of a striker who cannot perform the literal, bare basics of the position - strikers are an essential component in how a game flows and where the ball can go in times of need (particularly in alleviating a crushing press in midfield) and this is also where we see our midfield swarmed time and time and time again as the ball constantly gets placed in a matrix there where for other teams, the striker has received, held up or turned and not only relieved that press but stretched the opposition with his actions thus giving his own midfield a chance to breathe and go on to exploit open space running in behind him.

This thing of being a flank runner is also being taken out of context as flank roaming/running strikers are absolutely superb at dragging central players into horrid places to pick them up whilst bringing their own teams into the mix.

Using Rooney in any relation to Hojlund is going to kill your argument.

Sometimes those things come down to confidence too. I mentioned it in another thread but Beto under Dyche and Beto under Moyes are two different strikers. Ultimately I think you first and foremost have to play to what a specific strikers strengths are and then those other things become better through confidence as much as ability.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

To anyone who thinks we are somehow holding Hojlund back, he also has 0 goals in 12 games for Denmark last year. He just isn't very good.

I wouldn't sell him just yet but he either needs to go out on loan, or be back-up to a more experienced striker next season.

Yeah, since his hat trick against Finland, he's looked as bereft of confidence in the national team as he has at United. Our last manager even used journeymen strikers ahead of him during the last tournament after losing faith. He has enthusiasm in abundance and a willingness to work but he is woefully under developed right now and being asked to do a job he is frankly quite under qualified for, which is causing regression in his game. A season long loan at a Bundesliga side would do him a world of good. If Sesko leaves, I'd try to sell him on a loan to Leipzig.

 

[Fortitude]

Sometimes those things come down to confidence too. I mentioned it in another thread but Beto under Dyche and Beto under Moyes are two different strikers. Ultimately I think you first and foremost have to play to what a specific strikers strengths are and then those other things become better through confidence as much as ability.

For sure, but in the interim, the team itself is in trouble and the player is really stuck between a rock and a hard place. Hojlund's confidence is rock bottom and it shows because he has to be better than this.

At the same time, the more we play him, the worse it gets for him and us. It's really embarrassing for him to be hooked for an academy player and I think that's going to knock his confidence even more, especially so if this kid goes on to do the things he isn't.

 

[Hughes35]

It's a shame our finances are so bad. If money wasn't an issue then Rasmus is the perfect candidate for a loan move. Go and learn, build confidence and come back a better player.

My fear is that we either need to play him, or sell him due to finances.

I see a player in him and really wouldn't be surprised if we look foolish after a sale..... again.

 

[DanNistelrooy]

To anyone who thinks we are somehow holding Hojlund back, he also has 0 goals in 12 games for Denmark last year. He just isn't very good.

I wouldn't sell him just yet but he either needs to go out on loan, or be back-up to a more experienced striker next season.

What is the reason behind this significant drop off do we think? Because when he joined I remember him being really bright, could hold the ball up, looked lightning quick and strong. The game against Galatasary sticks out but even the Brighton/Arsenal games early on - he was flying for Denmark back then as you point. Now he looks incapable of doing any of the basics, doesn't look fast whatsoever - is it confidence / injury / burnout? Or was he just not very good to begin with - can't believe how bad he has been this season after a relatively promising first season.

 

[LawCharltonBest]

If he hadn’t come for ridiculous money, and we had other options, I’d have said he needs a loan

 

[Fobal]

This is fanciful assessment that has somehow become legion on here. He is asked to do what strikers do, and he is incapable of doing so. You literally only have to look at any other starting striker in the league to see what Hojlund is not doing for this team. And I mean literally.

A huge role for your point man is to bring others into the play and up the pitch with their ability to act as a hub for others. You don't need the second coming of Benzema or Drogba up there, just someone who can be passed into and either relay the ball to someone else in the attacking chain, or hold on to it long enough for others to either run past him or use him as a conduit in the progression of the ball. When your striker cannot do that, the team has no means of progressing the ball assuredly and with the consistency that gives others confidence to make off the ball runs with abandon. In other words, your own team get stuck and hemmed in behind the striker and the ball has nowhere to go unless you have some marvels on the flank who can consistently progress the ball by themselves, which is not how teams play in this day and age.

The saying 'it's like we're playing with 10 men' comes down to there being no way to make use of a striker who cannot perform the literal, bare basics of the position - strikers are an essential component in how a game flows and where the ball can go in times of need (particularly in alleviating a crushing press in midfield) and this is also where we see our midfield swarmed time and time and time again as the ball constantly gets placed in a matrix there where for other teams, the striker has received, held up or turned and not only relieved that press but stretched the opposition with his actions thus giving his own midfield a chance to breathe and go on to exploit open space running in behind him.

This thing of being a flank runner is also being taken out of context as flank roaming/running strikers are absolutely superb at dragging central players into horrid places to pick them up whilst bringing their own teams into the mix.

Using Rooney in any relation to Hojlund is going to kill your argument.

yeah it's a tendency in this thread that actually plays in a cringe style against him

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

It's a shame our finances are so bad. If money wasn't an issue then Rasmus is the perfect candidate for a loan move. Go and learn, build confidence and come back a better player.

My fear is that we either need to play him, or sell him due to finances.

I see a player in him and really wouldn't be surprised if we look foolish after a sale..... again.

Yeah, spend 70 odd million on a player to send him out on loan, then fork out another 70 million to bring someone else in who can actually do the job. Absolutely perfect way to run a club.

 

[The Mitcher]

Yeah, spend 70 odd million on a player to send him out on loan, then fork out another 70 million to bring someone else in who can actually do the job. Absolutely perfect way to run a club.

We literally did that with a player more expensive and, yet not as bad, in Antony. We can do it to Rasmus.

 

[honirelandboy]

Is there another premier league club he would start for. I honestly don't think so bar maybe Southampton and Leicester but that's about it. He really needs to go on loan somewhere for a year. You got to love our transfer policy, no established striker and splash 70 million pound on an inexperienced kid. I can go on an on with signings like declining Casemeiro for 70 million when we should of signing an established midfielder and 50 million on an injury prone Mount. Will these transfer shenanigans ever end. Honest to God how are our transfers been so bad. May as well throw Anthony into the loop and Sancho too. How do we keep getting it so wrong.

Compare Rasmus with someone like Isak and he's a million miles behind him,

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

We literally did that with a player more expensive and, yet not as bad, in Antony. We can do it to Rasmus.

No, i don't think we can. If anyone believes that our finances will allow us to "overlook" an investment of 100+ million pounds (Hojlund and Zirkzee) on a single position and spend another 70 million for the same role on the pitch lives in La-La Land. We're not City. Someone will have to be sold. Either one between Hojlund and Zirkzee or Garnacho. We can take the hit with Antony because the <20 million investment in the same role looks ready to pick up the mantle. Otherwise, we'd be similarly fecked. Now, in the case of Amad, that's who you send on loan to learn his trade.

 

[lex talionis]

I feel bad for Rasmus. He's carrying himself personally extremely well for a man of his age and thrust into the global spotlight at Old Trafford, in contrast to other players (primarily forwards) who have disgraced the club with self-absorbed antics of one kind or another. But he's just not been good enough for United need.

If there's any financially doable way to bring in a real striker this summer I'd like to see Rasmus go on loan while we keep Zirkzee as a backup. I do think there is a decent striker in Rasmus Hojlund but he needs a reset in his career to realize his potential.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

i just dont get why we keep playing a way that highlights his flaws. He is a pretty decent player and has shown well when running into channels and playing facing the goal, yet we keep playing it to him like he is a hold up CF and asking him to battle CBs with his back to goal. Just dont get it.

 

[USREDEVIL]

Give him another year. Graveyard shift and everyone knows it. I imagine having a starting no. 9 who is experienced would help him. We paid so much for him we really have to ride this out.

 

[ChrisNelson]

Is there another premier league club he would start for. I honestly don't think so bar maybe Southampton and Leicester but that's about it. He really needs to go on loan somewhere for a year. You got to love our transfer policy, no established striker and splash 70 million pound on an inexperienced kid. I can go on an on with signings like declining Casemeiro for 70 million when we should of signing an established midfielder and 50 million on an injury prone Mount. Will these transfer shenanigans ever end. Honest to God how are our transfers been so bad. May as well throw Anthony into the loop and Sancho too. How do we keep getting it so wrong.

Compare Rasmus with someone like Isak and he's a million miles behind him,

Put Isak in our team though and his goal tally would decrease massively because we don't create enough chances for our strikers.

Too often the players behind them are trying too hard because of the pressure we're under as a club and they're making the wrong decisions i.e. shooting instead of playing the ball.

 

[Bobski]

Put Isak in our team though and his goal tally would decrease massively because we don't create enough chances for our strikers.

Too often the players behind them are trying too hard because of the pressure we're under as a club and they're making the wrong decisions i.e. shooting instead of playing the ball.

Isaak would still look like a good and capable footballer without goals. That is the problem, if he is not scoring what does Hojlund offer?

Fortitude has made the point more eloquently than I could, but strikers are not just there to score, and people not understanding how much value a striker who does the basics well brings to a team has always baffled me.

Especially given we have already been through this with Lukaku and Hernandez, who sadly probably both had better all round ability than Hojlund.

 

[Insanity]

Isaak would still look like a good and capable footballer without goals. That is the problem, if he is not scoring what does Hojlund offer?

Fortitude has made the point more eloquently than I could, but strikers are not just there to score, and people not understanding how much value a striker who does the basics well brings to a team has always baffled me.

Especially given we have already been through this with Lukaku and Hernandez, who sadly probably both had better all round ability than Hojlund.

Good post. Very important points & examples.

 

[Mike Smalling]

Fortitude has made the point more eloquently than I could, but strikers are not just there to score, and people not understanding how much value a striker who does the basics well brings to a team has always baffled me.

Yeah. Probably the biggest problem with Højlund in our side, is that he doesn't hold on to the ball and bring others into play. If he could successfully lay it off, turn his man or win a header, we would more frequently progress the play and create more chances. He is himself one of the reasons we don't create many chances.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

There are no doubts his hold up play is pretty rubbish, but then on occasion he somehow takes down or controls ridiculous passes in to him and then feeds them out.

But people trying to claim he isn’t left isolated is a new one. I mean just at the weekend he took the ball down with 4 Everton players on him, no support, turned Tarkowski I think and then tried to break free of the four.

As a forward he just needs to make it difficult for the CB, try and get anything on it so that others can compete for the 2nd ball. However there is never anyone near him to do this so he is left having ti try and take a ball down whilst fighting a CB or two. Who have people cleaning up 2nd balls.

He also at one point took down a ridiculous ball and somehow managed to control it under preasure on his chest and passed the ball on.

I just feel the narrative has gotten to such a point people only recall the bad and not the actual good stuff he does.

Then there is his tactical job which he does reasonably well which is dragging the CB’s deep to free a space behind to allow the two 10’s space. However this fails because the 10’s get dragged wide where the Wingbacks are supposed to be ruining our tactics.

There is a lot of issues with our team which for me means we aren’t seeing the best of all these players. He needs to vastly improve, but surely we’ve all seen that given the chance he can score.

The club bought him not to be the guy right now but to be the guy in 2 or 3 years. Ideally we would have someone experienced with him, but doesn’t look like that is going to happen. So we as a fan base probably need to suck it up and be patient whilst we put all the parts in place to hopefully peak in 3 years time.

 

[AndySmith1990]

There are no doubts his hold up play is pretty rubbish, but then on occasion he somehow takes down or controls ridiculous passes in to him and then feeds them out.

But people trying to claim he isn’t left isolated is a new one. I mean just at the weekend he took the ball down with 4 Everton players on him, no support, turned Tarkowski I think and then tried to break free of the four.

As a forward he just needs to make it difficult for the CB, try and get anything on it so that others can compete for the 2nd ball. However there is never anyone near him to do this so he is left having ti try and take a ball down whilst fighting a CB or two. Who have people cleaning up 2nd balls.

He also at one point took down a ridiculous ball and somehow managed to control it under preasure on his chest and passed the ball on.

I just feel the narrative has gotten to such a point people only recall the bad and not the actual good stuff he does.

Then there is his tactical job which he does reasonably well which is dragging the CB’s deep to free a space behind to allow the two 10’s space. However this fails because the 10’s get dragged wide where the Wingbacks are supposed to be ruining our tactics.

There is a lot of issues with our team which for me means we aren’t seeing the best of all these players. He needs to vastly improve, but surely we’ve all seen that given the chance he can score.

The club bought him not to be the guy right now but to be the guy in 2 or 3 years. Ideally we would have someone experienced with him, but doesn’t look like that is going to happen. So we as a fan base probably need to suck it up and be patient whilst we put all the parts in place to hopefully peak in 3 years time.

Any guy who is lined up to be our striker in 2-3 years should at least resemble a decent striker right now. Potential I think is the word. What's he showing to give anyone hope he'll be much better in a few years? It's pie in the sky, the equivalent of arguing a manager should be given time based on absolutely nothing but blind faith