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Is it too cheeky to want a DM added to this window? I’m full muppet on Varane now and would be delighted to sign him and Sancho but a man can dream
Raphael Varane | Signed for United!
- Thread starter davidmichael
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It's also that the defence doesn't actually look strong, having conceded 44 goals in the league last season. So 'same impact as Bruno' overstates Maguire's contributions by a lot.
Players still want to come to United. Who would have thought.
If we manage to get him for 50m euros then its a steal in this market. Will make us solid day one onwards.
I’m with you mate. And I’m pretty sure the reason we’re trying to wrap up this Varane deal quickly is not just so he can settle in before the season starts but also to focus on acquiring another player or two after his deal is done. It’ll give us a clearer picture of available funds.
I’m secretly hoping Varane can help positively influence the Camawinga deal by showing him he’ll have a French connection or two should he decide to pick us over Madrid.
I've felt much more comfortable this summer in contrast to the last few as we've known that Heaton, Sancho and Varane are genuine targets and, providing you don't buy into the ever changing dichotomy of reports every day, throughout the days, as to the stage of the Varane deal (which I try not to do), then it's been an easier summer to handle all the 'we're set to sign' bs that you get umpteen times a day.
The only rumours I'm unsure about have been the potential Trippier and CM links - but l'm seeing them as a bonus if anything develops this summer and, so long as we got Sancho and Varane, then I'm delighted with that window (unless Pogba leaves and the CM position becomes an immediate priority needing addressing).
The only rumours I'm unsure about have been the potential Trippier and CM links - but l'm seeing them as a bonus if anything develops this summer and, so long as we got Sancho and Varane, then I'm delighted with that window (unless Pogba leaves and the CM position becomes an immediate priority needing addressing).
Think we all know that's because of Maguire's partner, no because of him.
Our defence is a lot better since Maguire has arrived. Just like our attack is a lot better since Bruno has arrived.
Let’s not rewrite history here. He hit good form towards the end of the season and at the Euros, but he was very average in his first season and fecking abysmal at the start of the second. Whether this was a purple patch or his actual level still remains to be seen.
Maguire's partner was here even when we conceded fewer goals than last season so I don't quite agree with blaming everything on Lindelöf. Considering that we often play two primarily defensive-minded midfielders, our defensive record is nothing to shout about, and at least statistically, it's below the average of the post-Fergie era.
If it wasnt for the spurs debacle and the PL games that actually didnt matter (Leicester with the kids and Liverpool without Maguire) we would have had one of the best in the league, so I think thats pretty harsh.
Blaming everything on Lindelof is a bit silly. He's probably not the standard we want week in week out to challenge for the title but he's not the liability you're trying to narrate.
Thing is, if you just remove the Spurs debacle, you also have to remove Liverpool's 7-2 mauling at Villa which happened on the same day and then they still have a better defensive record than us. And they played half a season without actual centre-backs.
I'm not saying Maguire's terrible. I think he's OK and that his biggest strength is his availability. But he had nowhere near the impact that Bruno had.
Similar to Bruno then but in reverse.
Feck me, mental that a video of some cracking comebacks can instead have be a highlight reel for just how much a weak CB can be a handicap.
So who does Varane replace in the current first choice back 4 of AWB. Lindelof, Maguire and Shaw?
Your question is completely immaterial to the post I made.
He always looks more solid and comfortable, to me, when I see him play for Sweden. I wonder if that's because they play a more pragmatic style with packed defences defending deep, with tall, strong teammates good in the air, and the freedom just to hoof it clear? And so plays more to his limitations.
He's maybe more suited to that size of club / country and pragmatic style? Rather than an attacking team where he has to pass the ball out of defence more, defend higher and have people get in behind him more, and not have as many teammates around him in a packed defence, or as many dominantly aerial ones, to help him out with that side of the game? And therefore his limitations get more exposed?
I never blamed all on Lindelof. But why are people trying to avoid the fact that Varane comes into replace Lindelof in the starting back 4?
You did. When a poster said that we conceded 44 goals, you said that's because of Maguire's partner.
So yeah you basically shafted the entire blame of the goals on him.
I would agree our defensive problems are not all down to Lindelöf. If you analyse last season you will see a significant amount of goals conceded were as a result of Wan Bissaka either caught out of position in the box or caught up the pitch and was slow to get back. I can see Varane improving him as he'll be better cover when he's caught out of position but Wan Bissaka will need to improve if he's to the long term RB,
Lindelöf is not the solution as Maguire's partner, he is a good player that maybe better suited to a different back 3. If we don't land the right CDM I'm going to put it out there that Lindelöf would be worth trying as the CDM as he has the intelligence for the role, good tackler, reads the game well and can pass through the lines.
We're not, but it's irrelevant when discussing Maguire's impact over the past two seasons.
Okay, I retract that comment back. I'll clearly state now that one person can't take the blame for the whole attack or defence of a team. I clearly didn't make myself clear in saying that out of Maguire and Lindelof, Lindelof is the weaker link.
So why is Bruno's impact bigger than Maguire's?
Because he walked in half way through the season from another country and single handedly lifted the team to a ridiculous run of form. His impact was absolutely massive.
Why do people overate Lindelof, it drives me mad. He’d have been given the transfer list elsewhere
Varane replaces Lindelof.
He's a squad player, Varane will be a huge upgrade.
He's a squad player, Varane will be a huge upgrade.
Maguire was not very average in his first season at all, his immediate levelling up the defence was clear to anyone who isn't a complete idiot
Preparing a bid
And what about the fact our 3 last games didnt really matter ?
Its really hard to compare a defender and a no10 , but I agree that Bruno had has had a better payoff to his fee.
At that stage it was a lift. But if it was as massive as people make it out to be, where were the trophies? Where were the "big game" performances that dragged us into a final in his first half season? Or the win in the EL last season?
Before people get it twisted, Bruno has been fantastic for us. But so has Maguire. Attackers are always going to grab the headlines but not for one minute will I say that Bruno been more important than Maguire. And our end of season form without Maguire proved that!
I have developed this innate hate for the word 'preparing'Preparing a bid
Exactly.
The way people underrate Maguire's addition to the team is ridiculous. I feel it has to to of the VVD impact to LFC, which were two completely different scenarios.
Just look at our form pre and post Bruno, compare that to Maguire, and you'll see why Bruno made a bigger impact on the team.
Trophies are irrelevant to the topic, you're asking why one made a bigger impact than another.
Resorting to calling me “a complete idiot” within out first exchange shows how valid you consider your point yourself and is also a good indication of your ability to argue it and your intelligence overall.
Hey if you're categorising yourself as someone who can't see how much he levelled up the defence that's on you
He's still right. Maguire instantly leveled up our defence and played basically every minute of every game. Not to say he didn't have issues. There was a phase in his first season where he started holding on to the ball a bit too long and Ole called him out on it and he had a poor first month last season. But to argue that was was "very average" is kind of idiotic.
Our defense quality increased a lot only if you consider Mourinho's meltdown period as the norm. It wasn't, the quality of defense now is very comparable to the period between 2014-2018. It even compares unfavorably to some of these years. We had back then Smalling, Rojo, Bailly, Blind, and Jones. All defenders very few rate around here.
If anything his impact has been overrated lately, mainly because our backups are very average and it showed in his absence and partly due to his performances for England.
Why can’t people agree that BOTH Bruno and Maguire have done excellent jobs. They really can’t be compared the way some of you are trying.
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