Ralf Rangnick's consultancy role has been scrapped
- Thread starter L1nk
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They could have done far worse than listening to Rangnick. He said we need ten players out, ten players in, and that we are six years behind Liverpool. For telling some home truths he was sacked.
What Ralf Ragnick has never been able to explain with his giant football brain is how Solskjaer did so much better than him with the same squad that he claims needed ripping up? Plain to see there’s a confidence problem and listening to some wannabe guru prattling on about poor you are is just fuel on the fire. Why would you keep on somebody like that??
Yeah, like Ralf had a preseason or a single player he wanted bought. Not comparable.Give Ralf a summer for transfers and training tactics etc I'm sure he would do way better than counter attacking Ole ball.
And before you mention his interim spell, ole was rubbish as soon as he got the permanent job.
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Rio was saying Ralf was out of order at the time speaking his mind against the team
Ole got fired (i) in the same season (ii) with the same squad (iii) with a full preseason (iv) with players he actually bought. Assessing future managers is clearly more complex than saying they played well once upon a time.
Many said those results would prove unsustainable and surprise, surprise, they did. These posters weren't prophets, they just used basic deduction. it was glaring to anyone who took a closer look at what was happening in the games.
It was not so much open heart surgery needed but spinal surgery by getting Maguire, fernandes, ronaldo, mcfred and de gea out of the first 11, eth won't be able to play his style with that spine
And didn't bring his own coaches or any staff. Rangnick had no chance, arriving alone to try to turn around a shambles.
In hindsight its a miracle we didn't finish in the bottom half.
All manager from Jose to ETH has realised the squad is utter terrible! They’ve also experienced and realised United struggle big time on the transfer market.
The difference is that they have expressed it more or less directly/indirectly in media or not at all.
It’s no reason for a manager to raise this issue in media, except from trying to save his own skin or reputation. We don’t accept players criticising managers and coaching team in media. Why should managers be allowed?
Ferdinand is the epitome of a flip flop. Guy is pathetic.
Did ge really want that? What are you basing that on - one interview where he explained how the two dominant teams in England operate and what would be necessary to install something like that? Also the names he brought up weren't a list of who he wanted to bring in - it was him telling the journalists that he, in contrast to some people in club, thought that there was some value in the market.
But he didn't really say that. He explained what you could do if you try to adopt Liverpools or ManCitys way. He explained that at first you need to decide how you want to play and once you do that, you evaluate the squad and decide who suits that sort of football and who isn't.
I agree to some degree, talking about it so swiftly wasn't the smartest move seeing how so many took it as a reflection on them. But I'm not sure, if it was intended like that by Ralf. As a German myself, I can tell you, that we are pretty direct and we tend to answer the questions we are getting asked. He should have anticipated that media (and fans) took it wrongly but I don't think, anybody with a bit of understanding of football, would tell him that anything he said was wrong.
And while so many in here are talking about him being clueless as a coach. When he took us over, we were lacking goals left, right and center. He brought a certain level of organisation and the defense got better. Sure, in exchange, the little attacking play we had, broke down and at some point, it was obvious that the players didn't take him seriously. To me, this was when he didn't got even one transfer in the winter, which, on first impression makes sense because you want to make sure to bring players in that fit the manager. But as soon as you think about it, it isn't a sure shot at all. There some universal player types that always make sense. We could have went for a 2nd goal keeper with a more modern style. We could have gone for a decent RB. We could have brought in any midfielder - we lacked defensive ones and progressing ones. It was just another wasted opportunity. Showing that Murtough seemingly doesn't want to be the one calling the shots in terms of recruitment strategy.
Think it was six windows not years, basically three seasons which I think is probably correct if we buy well (with a mistake or two) and ETH is a top coach.
I doubt he even does it on purpose, just follows the prevailing narrative and adds his popularity to it. Remember him after the PSG game asking them to give Ole a blank check to sign his contract on. He offers zero insight otherwise.
What pisses me off about the vindication of Rangnick that I see amongst our fanbase is how they've absorbed him of literally any responsibility for his time here. Nothing Ralf did or said during his time here was revolutionary. Infact, we could argue the team didn't 'down tool' seeing how we were very unlucky in his first few games, even the Arsenal game that ultimately decided our fate last season, we were the far better team and were only crazy unlucky to have lost that game.
Win a couple of those first few games that Rangnick managed and got a bit of confidence as a group and he would have been hailed as the genius that transformed our season, maybe even been rewarded with a permanent contract (which he himself alluded to being interested in).
There's no convincing me that the man didn't actively sabotage our season as well after seeing that the fanbase believed all his nonsense in press conferences. Little wonder he got more and more toxic as the season drew to a close knowing he was never going to be held accountable.
Yes and when Greenwood got suspended he wanted an emergency striker. The club him non was available and then he found out that the scouting department was not even looking at a striker by that stage. In his opinion the scouting department should always be on the look out for any position so if something happened at least the club knows who are or could be available.
It is an absolute shambles at the club and ETH is not finding out. He should have proposed to keep Ralf so that at least someone who understands football is there. Actually they should sack Murtough and bring back Ralf as DOF.
If we're talking that same squad, Ole actually did worse last season than Rangnick did. Ole had an average of 1.41 points per game after his 12 league matches in charge. Rangnick had 1.54 over his 24 matches. That's with Ole having the players that he himself bought, with his coaches, and after a preseason. Rangnick came in to a dressing room with obvious huge problems, lost Greenwood a day after sending Martial out on loan and wasn't able to sign an attacker, lost the club coaches and had to go far down his list to find someone available for an interim role, and had a huge injury list in the second half of the season. Rangnick didn't do a good job, but Ole did even worse last season.
Rangnick should be put in charge of scouting and player recruitment
It seems that giving the manager complete control over the playing squad has been detrimental to the club and a DOF was indeed needed to keep the club on a planned long term path. ETH has been a victim of his own arrogance by not using RR as a tool for his own period at the club. Nor has this stupid ownership of the club realised that its best to have a steady figure above the manager to keep the state of affairs as consistent. Stupidness all round, like the blind leading the blind.
Looking back, hiring Rangnick was nothing more than pleasing fanbase at the time.. so called consultancy role was just a carrot to lure a pretty settled Rangnick, thus the snub when Rangnick spoke truth when he was just supposed to keep 4th. Murtough's job simply should be given to Rangnick given this summer's utter failure with transfers. of course ETH's arrogance not to listen to Rangnick and Murtough's complete nonsensical support of ETH to go for ETH's ex players also did not help.
Rangnick was spot-on with his analysis. He was quite blunt in his assessment and I guess this was also the reason why the current board didn't want to work with him anymore.
It's not just that some players need to be replaced, the management itself is lacking quality. You would think that a massive club like Manchester United is run by professionals and not amateurs.
It's not just that some players need to be replaced, the management itself is lacking quality. You would think that a massive club like Manchester United is run by professionals and not amateurs.
His asswipe at Stretford Paddock now wants us to apologise to Ole and he's putting Cardiff and Rangnick in the same basket. Well I am sorry but it's really not the case. Ole was at the club for a long time, he sanctioned contract extensions to certain players and he was able to spend over 400m on this hot garbage. I dare to say that this is Cardiff's team. Rangnick wasn't thrown in the deep end with a team that wasn't his, he wasn't allowed to bring any new players in and he even struggled to bring some of his staff in. The situation was completely different. As Mou once said, I wished to have had access to the same funding Cardiff had.
"Results are unsustainable" is a far cry from "United will be losing 4-0 to Brentford and look like relegation candidates in a year."
He did want them to spend money. He made many comments about needing new players. Here are just a few.
I'm just going to give you the benefit and assume you missed what was being talked about in the original post and aren't actually trying to pass Ole off as superior to ETH. We're passed the point of directly comparing ETH's results like the circumstances the managers have to work with are the same.
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It’s amazing how wide of the mark these people can be when their job is to talk about football. Ole, ignoring the fact he was unqualified and hands off, had multiple windows, big signings across the first XI and basically build a team moulded in his image. We were comfortable albeit boring and winning nothing when he was allowed to have us play in a passive way, as soon as he tried to make us more progressive the wheels feel off.
That’s the hard part of coaching, it’s very easy to set up as a counter attacking team - even more so in a PL where every team is now taking risks and pressing and there will be space - but to actually coach a team to play offensive possession based football is a real skill. That’s what we tried to do with LVG but then Woodward shat his pants and hired Mou, now we’re back where we were then.
So Erik Ten Hag will soon finish a summer of transfers and training tactics etc. If he doesn't have the team flying by the end of the season and doing better than Solskjaer's first season and playing way better football than Ole ball. Does that mean Ralf Rangnick's a better coach than Ten Hag?
Agreeing with what he was saying doesn't mean he also doesn't think he was out of order for saying it publicly.
The thing is, Ragnick was right about squad/club assesmnent. He should have never gone public with it though.
@stevoc Ralf really rubbed you up the wrong way mate; 138 posts in here, the next behind you has 37 
It wasn't ETH who refused RR's help. That's just some BS briefing from the Glazers to the media.
Even RR said and he and the club agreed they need to end the collaboration, nothing about ETH. Added to that, I think the reasons were obvious.
Just like Jose and LVG, RR noticed the club is going nowhere and started demanding shit in public, a structure, 10 players, etc.
No fecking business owner these days will accept his employees to "wash their dirty laundry" in public, not in a million years. RR was his own victim for not playing along with the stupid mentality existing at the club, be it from players, staff, executives and owners.
Team was on the decline already, Ronaldo/Varane moves didn't work out, Pogba was looking for a way out, and a few other issues. We should never made Ralf a coach, but it's easy to see in the hindsight.
The need to move on Ronaldo is another thing he got right.
Say you have zero knowledge about football without directly stating it ...
Rangnick is certainly not a bad coach, which his time in Germany showed.
He's not the charismatic/motivational type like Klopp or Guardiola, but he's absolutely fine as interim manager (btw Rangnick's point per game ratio was better than Ole's ratio last season).
On top of that his by far biggest strength lies in actual squad planning/management - sth he wasn't even given the chance to do here, because he made a lot of snowflakes feel uncomfortable.
That's how he established two 4th division sides in the Bundesliga, both of them even competing for international spots on the regular. How difficult that is in Germany - even with a good financial situation - becomes clear when you look at former "giants" like Hamburg (struggling to even get out of the 2nd division for years now) or 1860 München (went all the way down from 2nd to 4th division AFTER they got an investor).
It's absolutely baffling to me how you can't realize that none of the former managers were the real problem.
Moyes, van Gaal, Mourinho, Ole, Rangnick ... now ten Haag.
None of those coaches could bring United back to old glory, yet it surely was never on the piss poor front office situation and the lousy squad (assembled without actually thinking about how each player fits into the system).
At least Mourinho and Rangnick had the stones to state what is wrong here.
@stevoc Ralf really rubbed you up the wrong way mate; 138 posts in here, the next behind you has 37
I don't mind Ralf so much as the narratives that are built around him. Plus make a post that is in any way negative towards Ralf or the current narrative and you get 5-6 replies from random Ralf fans.
I keep seeing this, but is it based on anything or is it just one of those things that people say because why not?
I mean, we knew we were getting a new manager in. Ragnick’s “consultancy” role was vague to begin with.
What are people basing their “was sacked for telling the truth” assessments on?
You seem to be a one man army battling anything that's said about his time here, though.
I mean, does it really matter what perceived narratives there are around his tenure? Absolutely none of us have any inside knowledge of what actually went on. I just don't know why it seems to irk you so much - the bloke will literally be a forgotten piece of history at the club over the next few years.
LVG, Mourinho, Rangnick. All respected throughout the football community (all have flaws too) and all isolated and removed for having the temerity to point out the shocking lack of football knowledge and organisation at the club. ETH is last chance saloon for us. Someone in another thread used the phrase 'existential crisis' and it's exactly that.
Forget about his actual performance as a manager, he was an average at best manager at Schalke, but how people can watch what happened with this guy and not be worried is shocking to me. You get a guy to come and offer him a project and a job/role, supposedly with a previous background check, then you go and part ways after 4 months. It reeks of lack of leadership and planning.
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