Assuming what you're saying to be true would require some faith that the board know what they're doing. I have absolutely none and as yet have seen nothing from Arnold to suggest he's any more of a clue than the last CEO. We can't afford to feck up the summer window, it's a golden opportunity for the club to get new players in that suit a new manager and instead we're sitting on our hands wondering who the manager will be. Wouldn't even surprise me at this point if United gave Rangnick another fecking season.
Ralf Rangnick | ex-interim manager | does anyone rate him?
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Assuming what you're saying to be true would require some faith that the board know what they're doing. I have absolutely none and as yet have seen nothing from Arnold to suggest he's any more of a clue than the last CEO. We can't afford to feck up the summer window, it's a golden opportunity for the club to get new players in that suit a new manager and instead we're sitting on our hands wondering who the manager will be. Wouldn't even surprise me at this point if United gave Rangnick another fecking season.
With what right do people act as if progressing over Atletico should be expected? That's what they do, clutch a goal, hold on to it, destroy the game, frustrate the opposition, occupy the referee. And they have genuine quality too. No offense, but better teams than you have suffered that fate.
You were actually playing great in the first half, probably the best I've seen you play in a while. Some great stuff. But you can't sustain performances over 90 minutes, that's not a new story. Rangnick hasn't solved it, but then interim managers can only do so much. On top of that he and the team have been somewhat unlucky to not get rewarded more for and during the good patches in games.
As for people starting with "not better than under Ole", the point is moot, Ole had to be fired. He had to.
You were actually playing great in the first half, probably the best I've seen you play in a while. Some great stuff. But you can't sustain performances over 90 minutes, that's not a new story. Rangnick hasn't solved it, but then interim managers can only do so much. On top of that he and the team have been somewhat unlucky to not get rewarded more for and during the good patches in games.
As for people starting with "not better than under Ole", the point is moot, Ole had to be fired. He had to.
This is what happens when you refuse to buy a midfielder in January and you let a rotten squad decide what they will and won’t do. Doesn’t matter who the manager is
Agree. Lots of people saying the interim decision is wrong but hindsight is always perfect. At that time when OGS was fired, who was on the market? Poch was not allowed to go. Ten Hag was staying at Ajax and gave no indication that he was leaving mid-season. Realistic top candidate was Conte and the argument for and against him goes both ways and if the club decided they wanted someone more sustainable, I would back that.
The problem was, and I think the board knows this all to well, the players as a collective massive underperformed no matter who was in charge. There are many reasons for that and I hope the club (and I don’t think these people are dumb, despite all evidence to the contrary) really understand they need to restructure the entire ops and not just stick with some flimsy vague notion of a cultural reboot. Bottom line is a lot of these players have to go. In some ways fortune favours us because so many are out of contract.
Let's put it this way.
I'd rather trust Ralf to turn around this shower of shit than leave it in the hands of the players to turn themselves around.
I'd rather trust Ralf to turn around this shower of shit than leave it in the hands of the players to turn themselves around.
Some of these players are in their teens and early 20's. Ralf hadn't coached for nearly a decade.
I think, as ever, lots of people on here were chatting nonsense pretending to know all about him. Some will know of him of course but many didn't.
I don't follow Bundesliga football at all so I hadn't really heard much of him. Think I'd seen the name but wouldn't have been able to pick him out of a lineup.
Gets to many excuses here. Many managers are capable of taking over from a terrible situation and turn it around, even Ole did that not to mention Tuchel and a number of lower level team have their season turn around with new appointments. It just hasn't worked out for him.
Last night's first half is the first time in 8-9 years where I could actually see Man United play according to a god damn plan.
In regards to it falling off in the 2nd half, I don't even think it's to do with the players' discipline, they just don't have the stamina for it.
I said this when Jose, Ole and now Rangnick were in charge and got accused of being a fanboy, but it’s the truth so it applies to any manager. I’m sure Rangnick didn’t tell Dalot to make sure he was the only defender marking 3 attackers.
The question I have for Jose and Ole is why they didn’t buy better players, but individual errors leading to goals is hardly their fault.
It brings us back to the board and who makes decisions in planning, transfers, scouting, strategy, etc. It goes back to Woodward.
The decision to not hire Conte might look like it was based on arguments against his sustainability, but I’m afraid that’s not the case here, given how our board has made decisions, they probably just left it too late and were reactive instead of being proactive. Also, because Conte would call out their incompetence publicly, he would demand better coaches, he’d want to sell players who’re not good enough and would want his transfer targets, these are the reasons we did not hire him, not his lack of sustainability.
It’s the same with RR, we’re outside top 4 and are KO’d from the CL, I can bet anything that if RR had managed to get the team perform well, our board would’ve given him a 3 year contract.
Even in the summer, we’re going to hire the next available manager, Poch most probably, not because we think of him as the solution or trust him for a long term project, but because he’ll most likely be available in the summer.
This board is useless and I have no hope in them to do the right thing.
He needs to be given the time to finish what he's started.
Bringing in Poch or anyone else at this point will be a disaster and would be a clear signal to the likes of Rashford etc that player power still rules.
Let him clear out this summer and pick up a few sensibly priced, committed additions along the way.
Supporters need to accept that this squad is rotten to the core and needs gutted. I'd rather see that happen now under the watch of RR than handing another manager a complete poisoned chalice.
Bringing in Poch or anyone else at this point will be a disaster and would be a clear signal to the likes of Rashford etc that player power still rules.
Let him clear out this summer and pick up a few sensibly priced, committed additions along the way.
Supporters need to accept that this squad is rotten to the core and needs gutted. I'd rather see that happen now under the watch of RR than handing another manager a complete poisoned chalice.
I have no opinion on Rangnick purely because the club is so rotten.
Player power, undeserved wages, laziness, arrogance, downing tools whenever they feel like it.
We've tried 5 managers Inc Rangnick...it's time to rip apart the squad and accept a few years of guaranteed near mid tableness if necessary.
I can live with De Gea, Varane, Fred and Sancho at the moment (not including Elanga). The rest could all kindly disappear and I wouldn't care.
Player power, undeserved wages, laziness, arrogance, downing tools whenever they feel like it.
We've tried 5 managers Inc Rangnick...it's time to rip apart the squad and accept a few years of guaranteed near mid tableness if necessary.
I can live with De Gea, Varane, Fred and Sancho at the moment (not including Elanga). The rest could all kindly disappear and I wouldn't care.
Wasn't it Shaw who didn't know who Tony Adams is? fecking idiot that he is. Such an unlikeable squad, they disgust me.
. So spot on.I'm not sure what some have been smoking. When he came in no one expected top 4 or to progress deep into the champions league because we were in a truly awful state.
I think people have forgot just how bad we were.
I think people have forgot just how bad we were.
"Paul Pogba he's our best player" Remember people saying this? Or how people wanted him to sign the contract extension, based on a few good performances against shite teams, after his return from injury?
Made me go all Robert De Niro in Raging Bull, the scene he got thrown in the nick. Punching the wall screaming WHY!! WHY!! WHY!! WHY!!
I just don't see why he didn't throw the kitchen sink earlier with the subs around the 65 min mark. Except that Ralf really can't do much with this group of players.
Move him up, cant be worse than a business man making big picture decisions at the club.
Hire ETH.
Thats all I want. It might take another 2 years to see the fruits but at least it would be something completely different that we attempt.
Hire ETH.
Thats all I want. It might take another 2 years to see the fruits but at least it would be something completely different that we attempt.
One particular area of frustration has been his backing of Maguire - the guy has been completely awful for a sustained period of time but seems undroppable if fit.
Lindelof looks like prime Baresi in comparison but can't get a sniff of a start if Varane is fit - there are only so many scenarios for this.
1) Ralf thinks Maguire is our best option and should play regularly
2) Maguire has something in his contract that says he plays when fit
3) Ralf is not prepared to take on the big names in the dressing room regardless of performance levels
Whatever it is, it certainly does not bode well for Ralf's capacity to get us over the line and our hopes of reaching top four.
Lindelof looks like prime Baresi in comparison but can't get a sniff of a start if Varane is fit - there are only so many scenarios for this.
1) Ralf thinks Maguire is our best option and should play regularly
2) Maguire has something in his contract that says he plays when fit
3) Ralf is not prepared to take on the big names in the dressing room regardless of performance levels
Whatever it is, it certainly does not bode well for Ralf's capacity to get us over the line and our hopes of reaching top four.
Good to get outside perspective from a non united fan. I think too many are still upset about last night to post sensibly.
honestly i dont blame Ralph because this team is really rotten, and unless we bring in some strong manager, with a long term plan, then we will continue to blame managers and the cycle will repeat. Im not sure that will happen with our owners and current structure being as it is, but it is the only way to start actually rebuilding. its gonna be a long process.
I think he is not good enough. It was not an easy situation, but he has improved very little.
He isn't good enough to be Manchester United manager but that's a pretty irrelevant point as we knew he wasn't good enough to be Manchester United manager. That's why he is only here on an emergency interim basis.
Nonetheless I thought we might get top four and it looks like we won't, so that's dissapointing. But then am I particularly surprised that an interim manager dropped in this shit didn't do that well? Not really.
So yeah. We've played a bit better, not got the results we wanted from it and the entire season has been a waste of time. That's mostly the fault of everything that led up to us having to appoint Rangnick though.
The potential upside with him was the influence he might have at the level above manager after his stint as interim was done. Hopefully we get that at least and the new guy gains from Rangnick being around.
Nonetheless I thought we might get top four and it looks like we won't, so that's dissapointing. But then am I particularly surprised that an interim manager dropped in this shit didn't do that well? Not really.
So yeah. We've played a bit better, not got the results we wanted from it and the entire season has been a waste of time. That's mostly the fault of everything that led up to us having to appoint Rangnick though.
The potential upside with him was the influence he might have at the level above manager after his stint as interim was done. Hopefully we get that at least and the new guy gains from Rangnick being around.
My position on him was always that I'd judge him on how we performed in the two Atletico matches. By then, he'd have had enough time to assess this squad and put out a team that could go up against an experienced European team and hold their own.
Verdict - he gets a pass from me. We were outplayed in the first half over there but IMO the better side over the next three halves. I thought we actually looked a pretty good side last night but this tie was always going to be decided on fine margins and those margins went against us. If Elanga's shot doesn't hit the keeper in the face we probably go through last night. Ultimately he's walked into a problematic situation and he's shown some traits that these players needed from a manager. Unafraid to drop players. Refreshingly honest & candid when he speaks. I genuinely wouldn't mind if we kept him on next season. I think he would improve us with more time and some money to spend.
Verdict - he gets a pass from me. We were outplayed in the first half over there but IMO the better side over the next three halves. I thought we actually looked a pretty good side last night but this tie was always going to be decided on fine margins and those margins went against us. If Elanga's shot doesn't hit the keeper in the face we probably go through last night. Ultimately he's walked into a problematic situation and he's shown some traits that these players needed from a manager. Unafraid to drop players. Refreshingly honest & candid when he speaks. I genuinely wouldn't mind if we kept him on next season. I think he would improve us with more time and some money to spend.
He's not a miracle worker.
No one is.
And that is why every managerial appointment will fail until they are not expected to be miracle workers.
No one is.
And that is why every managerial appointment will fail until they are not expected to be miracle workers.
Very fair assessment. Refreshing to read
No new manager bounce to speak of, no improvement over the time he's had to implement his ideas. I'd say we've potentially got worse. Between now and the end of the season we're solely reliant on Ronaldo to win us games that we'll not deserve to win.
Maybe the interim should have been someone with premier league experience.
Maybe the interim should have been someone with premier league experience.
We haven't got worse, we were a bottom half side under Ole.
No new manager bounce is probably a good thing because now we can actually analyse the situation clearly and not get swept up in romanticism.
Which interim with PL experience would you have gone for Allardyce? Hodgson?
He is an awful manager.
Laughable decisions last night. Simone totally made a fool of him, he was incredibly naïve.
He is lacking tactically they must have been joking when they said he was strong tactically and his man management skills are very poor.
Hopefully we don't bother keeping him on in any role at the end of the season.
An interim managers job was to steady the ship and get the best out of the players until the new manager was brought in. He has failed miserably and now to top it of we now have some very unhappy players that will likely be hard to get rid of.
He has been a disaster really, can't imagine even if Carrick has stayed on that it would have been this bad.
Nobody in the ground last night thought it was a good idea to bring on Rashford and to take off Bruno. He seemed to bring on Mata purely because his name was brought up in the presser before the game, perhaps he forgot he was even part of the squad.
You couldn't even make it up, he has been a terrible appointment.
He seems to not really care either, hardly made a whisper about the poor referring decisions during the game and seemed to do very little to motivate the players. It's bad when Darren Fletcher is the the only coach showing any sort of emotion in a game like this.
Laughable decisions last night. Simone totally made a fool of him, he was incredibly naïve.
He is lacking tactically they must have been joking when they said he was strong tactically and his man management skills are very poor.
Hopefully we don't bother keeping him on in any role at the end of the season.
An interim managers job was to steady the ship and get the best out of the players until the new manager was brought in. He has failed miserably and now to top it of we now have some very unhappy players that will likely be hard to get rid of.
He has been a disaster really, can't imagine even if Carrick has stayed on that it would have been this bad.
Nobody in the ground last night thought it was a good idea to bring on Rashford and to take off Bruno. He seemed to bring on Mata purely because his name was brought up in the presser before the game, perhaps he forgot he was even part of the squad.
You couldn't even make it up, he has been a terrible appointment.
He seems to not really care either, hardly made a whisper about the poor referring decisions during the game and seemed to do very little to motivate the players. It's bad when Darren Fletcher is the the only coach showing any sort of emotion in a game like this.
I thought the early signs were promising but we've not really kicked on since he came in. That said I still want him to stay at the club after the summer, just not as the manager. His reputation as a behind the scenes club builder means he should absolutely be given the chance to do that. He also has a great knowledge of our players both in terms of ability and personality. He should be involved with the new manager and should pass on everything he knows to give them the best possible head start.
Was a rotten January for him with all the loan deals which occurred pre-Greenwood and all the unhappy players such as Lingard, Martial and Van de Beek. There's a lot of things that need to be fixed, and there'll be a lot of movement this Summer with further outgoings so it's very difficult to put a mark on Rangnick, he's merely just keeping us going but a passenger whilst a lot of the uncertainty unfolds on a new manager, arrivals, outgoings etc. This isn't his United, I don't feel he has that much authority and that's shown with those Ronaldo holidays etc.
My comment on Jan 3rd was spot on.
I've not been happy with him but it's gone exactly as I expected with these players.
The next manager doesn't stand a chance of success without a huge overhaul of the squad, which isn't going to happen short term.
There will be initial excitement when we appoint Ten Hag or whoever but it be short lived once football is actually played.
Agreed in principle.
Why did he bring Rashford on, though? He surely knows that he's a nothing player these days.
I don't think he'll even stick around after the summer in any role. He'll have had enough of this shambles.
I think he's doing OK with whatever tools he has.
We clearly can't play the gegenpressing game which is his style, because the players are either too stupid, too unfit or too unmotivated to try it.
He's been trying to apply bandages to this team since he got here with all these personnel and formation changes every week, but there's just too many deep wounds.
We clearly can't play the gegenpressing game which is his style, because the players are either too stupid, too unfit or too unmotivated to try it.
He's been trying to apply bandages to this team since he got here with all these personnel and formation changes every week, but there's just too many deep wounds.
His main asset will be to build long-term from upstairs. Which means he probably wasn't going to do well as a short term fix manager. My main hope is it gives the next manager a bit of a head-start. Guardiola didn't just turn up at City, they'd been laying the groundwork for him for a while.
Hopefully there's a plan witha long-term vision for success ongoing.
Hopefully there's a plan witha long-term vision for success ongoing.
I think we need to be a little more realistic about the situation we are in. Rashford is a shadow of the player he was. Greenwood vanished overnight. Cavani rarely available. Martial rightly sent out on loan. Is it really any surprise that we are relying on Ronaldo to score goals?
What we saw last night was a fairly well structured team without a cutting edge. We shouldn't underestimate that we largely dominated open play against a team that know how to keep the ball. The commitment was there. The shape was good. We were set up deliberately to push them back and we did it pretty well. It wasn't a bad performance, but the weaknesses in our team are significant. That isn't on Ralf.
That line “Scholes didn’t say a thing about Ole but now is ranting against Ralf” is extremely childish.
Everyone knows Ole is a former team mate so that’s the reason.
Doesn’t mean that he can’t criticize any other manager.
Carragher critizised Ole a lot, but I can guarantee you if Gerrard gets the Liverpool job and doesn’t succeed he will hardly say a word.
Again that wouldn’t mean that he shouldn’t have said stuff against Ole either.
But hey, if Scholes critizising one manager and not the other is what people want to focus on, then I guess everything else is fine, no worries.
Everyone knows Ole is a former team mate so that’s the reason.
Doesn’t mean that he can’t criticize any other manager.
Carragher critizised Ole a lot, but I can guarantee you if Gerrard gets the Liverpool job and doesn’t succeed he will hardly say a word.
Again that wouldn’t mean that he shouldn’t have said stuff against Ole either.
But hey, if Scholes critizising one manager and not the other is what people want to focus on, then I guess everything else is fine, no worries.
Ateltico is one of the most defensively solid teams in the world.
To play against that - he goes and chooses Mctominay and Fred to go defensive against them.
What happens? Unable to be creative enough to snatch a goal whilst Ateltico get just one off us.
Rubbish manager that has no ability to look at the players he has, what gets the best out of them and his oppositions weaknesses.
Looking forward to the end of the season like it's my birthday.
To play against that - he goes and chooses Mctominay and Fred to go defensive against them.
What happens? Unable to be creative enough to snatch a goal whilst Ateltico get just one off us.
Rubbish manager that has no ability to look at the players he has, what gets the best out of them and his oppositions weaknesses.
Looking forward to the end of the season like it's my birthday.
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