[Boycott]

What's all this tosh in the media about this 'not being the Utd way', or it's a 'far cry Fergie's flamboyant attacking teams'.

Sir Alex set up to win ugly/not lose plenty of times, especially against teams like Arsenal in their pomp.

There's been some serious historical revisionism since he retired.

The difference between what happened under Fergie is we would have the counter attack to use and nick a goal or two.

Yesterday we executed a game-plan well but there was only one phase for 90 minutes. That can be put down to the forwards having an off night but in the last 20 minutes or so I think we chose to shut up shop and take the point. At least in the first half we were passing the ball confidently.

 

[cyberman]

The first 20-25 mins our passing was atrocious .. and not from pressure, it was just extremely inaccurate. SOme of that had to do with Can coming in for his first starting PL game of the season so it was understandable he was on another wave-length, however after 20-25 mins he settled down and so did the team. From then on, bar another 10 mins at the beginning of the second half when they seemed to need time to settle into a rhythm again, we dominated. But for De Gea proving what a world-class keeper he is with one stupendous save (low-down from Can) and one very fine save (top of his left from Coutinho) you'd have lost and nobody would be saying a good point won.

For the first 20 mins, due to our passing ineptitude, Mou's tactics and United's initial enthusiasm, it looked like United had come to play but even then whenever we got the ball United resorted to 10 men behind the ball. It seemed like we were playing against a relegation fodder team made up of stars rather than United, I've never seen a United team this negative, even under Moyes or LvG. It was however a typical Mou team when playing against a team he fears, in essence his tactics and team were totally anti-Liverpool and not designed in any way to play the United way or to their real strengths.

Fine if that is what the fans are willing to accept and fans can say that it's only while the team is in transition but you don't make that transition if you are reading from a defensive bible. The comments in this thread make grim reading ... happy with a point but not the style of play people want to see .... is repeated over and over. Do the United faithful really want to hear Mourinho say "This is a point that stopped them winning three," ?

As for us and dropping 2 points, we played a top team full of quality players, intent on nullifying us, and even then came close to winning it, we were totally dominant over the final 30 mins. So I'm disappointed not to win but still somewhat satisfied that that is how far we have come in one season under Klopp, that fear of our attacking play can now force United to adopt such a defensive posture and tactics. Starting this season without a single defeat to any of Arsenal (A), Spurs (A), Leicester (H), Chelsea (A) and United (H) ? Every Liverpool supporter would have taken that considering where we were over the previous 2 seasons.

Bullshit. There was a stat towards the end of the first half that the ball was in Liverpools half twice as long than in Uniteds.
We pressed high v you lot and Herrera and Fellaini ate you up. We were first to all the second balls and pressured your defensive players that aren't comfortable on the ball into mistakes.
Possession stats are the biggest joke in football btw. Do you know how they work?
It's the amount of passes each side makes. Liverpool played shorter passes which allowed us to put you under pressure while we negated your pressing with forward balls. It took you 2/3 passes to get across the pitch to our 1. That made you slow and predictable and easy to nullify. The possession stat is a damning factor on how slow you used the ball rather than United hanging on v a superior side.
You can accuse of of playing direct fooball but this overly defensive narrative that has come out from the game is ridiculous. If pressing high is defensive then Liverpool are defensive every game. Heck you set up the exact same way with Can and Henderson ffs.
This is the only way to beat the press if you like it or not, it even shows our flexibility. Pep has no plan b to the same problem (so far) as shown v Celtic and Spurs for example.

 

[ottosec]

Good performance and decent result.

 

[RedDevil@84]

Yeah right, a single chance from Zlatan is all you had to show. Suggest you look at those 2 world class saves from De Gea again .. you seem to be the only one in the world dismissing them as anything other, now who's being disingenuous ?

When one team has 2 shots and another has 1, this, my d*** is bigger than yours, kind of argument hardly makes sense.

 

[Rafateria]

The thing with Liverpool is that they can press hard but they collapse under pressing as well. They don't have a lot of really technical players to play out of a tight corner and that is what we showed up yesterday. It was funny how they struggled against pressure but the resident Pool fans lay it down to Can not starting well

He didn't start well - are you saying he did ? It shouldn't come as too much of a surprise that he started poorly, considering his lack of match time and retrning from injury. He was well in the game after 30 mins though which is a good indication that he just needed to re-orientate himself and get up to speed. There is also no denying that even not under pressure in the first 20 mins we were putting the ball into touch or just passing to a United player. It was very poor before we switched on.

As for a lack of players with technical ability - are you just wumming ? Coutinho, Firmino, Lallana, Matip, Sturridge (though he was awful yesterday), Wijnaldum, Origi (showed lovely feet yesterday at one time), Mane .. need I go on ?

 

[LuisNaniencia]

Yeah right, a single chance from Zlatan is all you had to show. Suggest you look at those 2 world class saves from De Gea again .. you seem to be the only one in the world dismissing them as anything other, now who's being disingenuous ?

Sorry, where did I say they weren't world class saves? I said they weren't as good chances as the Ibrahimovic chance.

 

[Oneunited26]

Sorry, where did I say they weren't world class saves? I said they weren't as good chances as the Ibrahimovic chance.

On another day we score that chance and win the game, so really jose did everything that was asked, its a long ass season plenty of games to go, our attacking play at times is really needs something different, but like many have said on another day zlaten scores 3 pts for us

 

[dwd]

Loving the fact all the Liverpool fans, the media and fans of practically of every other club are absolutely furious about the result.

 

[Zoo]

Yeah right, a single chance from Zlatan is all you had to show. Suggest you look at those 2 world class saves from De Gea again .. you seem to be the only one in the world dismissing them as anything other, now who's being disingenuous ?

You had one chance to show from Can which even then had some slight fortune with the ball falling kindly.

 

[johnny boy]

Loving the fact all the Liverpool fans, the media and fans of practically of every other club are absolutely furious about the result.

Sorry to p1ss on your chips but we aren't exactly furious.

We didn't play well yet could have won, as a team we are moving in the right direction and getting better with a great manager at the helm.
It's because of our improvement that we are disappointed we didn't win.

United fans are happy to have scraped a 0-0 draw - how times change eh?

 

[sunama]

A draw away against an inform Liverpool team is a good result for us, I think.
There are some who think that we are the dominant team right now - this is not the case.
Basically, we played a tactical and pragmatic game yesterday and got a point.

Onto the next game...

 

[Rafateria]

Bullshit. There was a stat towards the end of the first half that the ball was in Liverpools half twice as long than in Uniteds.
We pressed high v you lot and Herrera and Fellaini ate you up. We were first to all the second balls and pressured your defensive players that aren't comfortable on the ball into mistakes.
Possession stats are the biggest joke in football btw. Do you know how they work?
It's the amount of passes each side makes. Liverpool played shorter passes which allowed us to put you under pressure while we negated your pressing with forward balls. It took you 2/3 passes to get across the pitch to our 1. That made you slow and predictable and easy to nullify. The possession stat is a damning factor on how slow you used the ball rather than United hanging on v a superior side.
You can accuse of of playing direct fooball but this overly defensive narrative that has come out from the game is ridiculous. If pressing high is defensive then Liverpool are defensive every game. Heck you set up the exact same way with Can and Henderson ffs.
This is the only way to beat the press if you like it or not, it even shows our flexibility. Pep has no plan b to the same problem (so far) as shown v Celtic and Spurs for example.

Wonderful revisionism. No need for me to go and buy a novel !

 

[Rafateria]

Sorry, where did I say they weren't world class saves? I said they weren't as good chances as the Ibrahimovic chance.

They were better because Ibra didn't even hit the target whereas De Gea needed to be world class.

 

[dwd]

Sorry to p1ss on your chips but we aren't exactly furious.

We didn't play well yet could have won, as a team we are moving in the right direction and getting better with a great manager at the helm.
It's because of our improvement that we are disappointed we didn't win.

United fans are happy to have scraped a 0-0 draw - how times change eh?

My chips are being pissed on at all. It's hilarious. You should be disappointed you created next to nothing, considering you're this swashbuckling scintillating team that everyone talks about.

Harry Redknapp was furious on TalkSport this morning. Love it, johnny boy.

 

[VeevaVee]

That attitude means you're not allowing the team to be a work in progress. Surely the best we can hope from with a new manager and so many new players is gradual improvement? Which means you should take each game as it comes and don't try to downplay the result because of previous, less good, performances.

I can see what you mean, but I am prepared to give it time. It's just after 3 years of 'giving it time' and not seeing any progress, and still not seeing much progress now, it's becoming a bit disheartening. I know that it's nowhere near the be all and end all after so few games into the season with Jose though. I guess on the whole we're playing more positively though....meh

 

[johnny boy]

My chips are being pissed on at all. It's hilarious. You should be disappointed you created next to nothing, considering you're this swashbuckling scintillating team that everyone talks about.

Harry Redknapp was furious on TalkSport this morning. Love it, johnny boy.

Who gives a monkey's what Harry chuffin Redknapp thinks?

I already said we are disappointed - "furious"? get a grip!

 

[SwansonsTache]

@Rafateria is our scouse contingents version of @GlastonSpur

I am contemplating having someone Shanghai you and put you in a soundproof casket with a lid on.

 

[DuncanEd]

Quietest visit to their ground yet, it is getting worse and worse once YAWN stops they were awful, could only muster 'Liverpool, Liverpool' at different tempos.

Never seen as many tourists in my life, even at the end instead of singing songs back at us the majority stood smiling at us filming on their phones as we launched wave after wave of abuse towards them. Very bizarre.

 

[cyberman]

Wonderful revisionism. No need for me to go and buy a novel !

Obviously you will need to buy a pair of glasses first...

 

[Rafateria]

Sorry to p1ss on your chips but we aren't exactly furious.

We didn't play well yet could have won, as a team we are moving in the right direction and getting better with a great manager at the helm.
It's because of our improvement that we are disappointed we didn't win.

United fans are happy to have scraped a 0-0 draw - how times change eh?

In a nutshell.

 

[Rafateria]

@Rafateria is our scouse contingents version of @GlastonSpur

I am contemplating having someone Shanghai you and put you in a soundproof casket with a lid on.

Ha ha ! Love it.

 

[johnny boy]

Never seen as many tourists in my life, even at the end instead of singing songs back at us the majority stood smiling at us filming on their phones as we launched wave after wave of abuse towards them. Very bizarre.

I agree on part of that, never seen so many people taking pictures on their phones instead of watching the game, it's a bit poor - bet it's the same at OT though.

A lot of the true or more vocal fans can't afford to go to the game anymore.

 

[Rafateria]

Quietest visit to their ground yet, it is getting worse and worse once YAWN stops they were awful, could only muster 'Liverpool, Liverpool' at different tempos.

Never seen as many tourists in my life, even at the end instead of singing songs back at us the majority stood smiling at us filming on their phones as we launched wave after wave of abuse towards them. Very bizarre.

It's a sad reflection of modern day football I'm afraid. The larger the grounds get the more tourists there are. The hard core are only so many. Same goes for every club in the land.

 

[LuisNaniencia]

They were better because Ibra didn't even hit the target whereas De Gea needed to be world class.

Complete non sequitur.

 

[Kraftwerker]

Expected a far more aggressive riposte from you - says it all really.

Rather than saying 'you didn't attack enough' you need to give your defenders more credit : Bailly, Smalling and Herrera as a DM were outstanding yesterday and De Gea world class (again). It was tough to get through a quality 10 man defence (Mourinho said it would be an 11 man defence so I guess he went with a little more attacking intent than he originally intended) however the fact it took two world class saves from De Gea says it all. Had he missed one of those you'd be singing a different song.

Also what is this 'ride out the initial 20 minute bum rush and there's little to worry about' BS ? If you had taken even the slightest notice of our performances this season you'd know that is about as far from the truth as it's possible to get in a football match. Here are our goal times FYI : 49, 45, 56, 63, 43, 13, 89, 31, 56, 17, 36, 17, 30, 71, 36, 52, 54, 84. So basically from 30 mins thru about 60 mins seems to be when we score the most often, not that we don't score in the opening 20 mins but it's not our most effective period. In some matches I suspect we've eased off hence the lower numbers in the final 30 mins.

De Gea made two saves that he would've been criticised for missing. It was fairly standard for him, nothing out of this world. Can's was a tame effort and Coutinho couldn't have advertised his long-ranger any more. Zlatan missed the chance of the game. If he buried that no one could have any complaints.

Liverpool had every man behind the ball when United were attacking. In fact most of the first half was played in your half. How many times did you play the ball back to your dodgy keeper and try to play keep ball in defence. You almost got caught out a couple of times too. It might have bumped your possession stats but it was sterile and negative for a home team. Hence your mostly silent crowd groaning and moaning most of the game especially with the call going backwards. Part of this was down to United's effective pressing and Herrera's dominance of midfield.

I'll wager any money we'll trouble you far more at OT than you did us last night.

 

[royboy16]

Was there any trouble at the game ?

 

[Hoof the ball]

How did we control the game?

Ok, we pushed them for twenty minutes in the first half, but then they came back into it and looked more likely to score than we did.
In the second half they had Can's effort goalbound but for a miracle De Gea save, Coutinho's wonder-strike, also goal-bound, but for another miracle De Gea save, plus a passage of play that almost was a one-on-one between Firminho and De Gea, but for a last ditch tackle by Valencia, meanwhile, we carved out one real chance with a wonder pass from Pogba to Ibrahimovic, which was a difficult header anyway to re-direct to the far corner.

We can say we improved, or contained them, but on any other day when De Gea isn't having a worldie, then it's 2-0 them.
The positives are individual performances by Herrera, Bailly and De Gea.

 

[johnny boy]

Was there any trouble at the game ?

I didn't see any bar the usual bit of chanting near the King Harry pub, and a few United fans shouting abuse near Stanley Park was all I saw - but that's just normal.

 

[Hoof the ball]

De Gea made two saves that he would've been criticised for missing. It was fairly standard for him, nothing out of this world. Can's was a tame effort and Coutinho couldn't have advertised his long-ranger any more. Zlatan missed the chance of the game. If he buried that no one could have any complaints.

I'll wager any money we'll trouble you far more at OT than you did us last night.

No chance. Coutinho's shot was as far into the corner you can get. Standard save, my foot! It was a wonder save.

 

[Klopper76]

No chance. Coutinho's shot was as far into the corner you can get. Standard save, my foot! It was a wonder save.

Agreed, I thought it was in.

 

[Kraftwerker]

No chance. Coutinho's shot was as far into the corner you can get. Standard save, my foot! It was a wonder save.

De Gea would've known where it was going even before he hit it. Then it's a case of getting in position to get a hand on it. Too many shit keepers in the league letting those sort of shots in.

 

[MartialsBeard]

How did we control the game?

Ok, we pushed them for twenty minutes in the first half, but then they came back into it and looked more likely to score than we did.
In the second half they had Can's effort goalbound but for a miracle De Gea save, Coutinho's wonder-strike, also goal-bound, but for another miracle De Gea save, plus a passage of play that almost was a one-on-one between Firminho and De Gea, but for a last ditch tackle by Valencia, meanwhile, we carved out one real chance with a wonder pass from Pogba to Ibrahimovic, which was a difficult header anyway to re-direct to the far corner.

We can say we improved, or contained them, but on any other day when De Gea isn't having a worldie, then it's 2-0 them.
The positives are individual performances by Herrera, Bailly and De Gea.

But it wasn't 2-0. And because DDG plays for us and is a world class keeper he made two world class saves and because Liverpool play a high press and counter-gengenpress we nullified it by going longer and because their players are mostly small fast technical players we were able to push them up and make them defend at crucial parts of the game and because Jose knows all of this, it was a plan and we executed the plan perfectly with some outstanding performances from key players and selections, we absolutely controlled the game from min 1, any game any opposition they will have spells in which their plan looks to have worked, the point is, it didn't we came away with the point and now its up to us to beat them at home, what will their approach be?

I think Jose isn't getting enough credit here, when I saw that team sheet, I had thoughts of LVG style random teams with Ashley Young at wing back and 3 at the back, random tactics that would only work in foreign leagues.

Last night Jose basically did what he does best and provided a world class tactical game plan only he could possibly achieve, why? how? let me explain.

Its no secret that we are in yet another transition 3 years on we finally have the manager we should always have had in charge in-between then we have collected some amazing players and some specialized players for certain roles that suit certain game plans.

Jose has been tasked with taking those players and making them work together as a cohesive TEAM when all their qualities are vastly different, the squad is lacking balance but certainly has quality.

My point is Klopp is much further along the development of his team and Liverpool weather it is now or 10 years ago have always been a force at home, added with thier flying start and killer instinct we could not afford to take chances or "click" in this game, w tried that vs City and Jose learnt that these players need time to work together and develop their play style.

So what do you do? the press have us beat already, our fans are nervous, there are intense and hard games to come and the first test is our flying rivals. What you do is piss on their parade and accept that now is not our time to hammer them at home if there ever is a time for that.

Jose executed a tactical masterclass in shutting down the quick press and counter from liverpool, the game to me was enjoyable because I was fascinated by the confidence in the plan and the first half specifically. Pogba/Ibra pushing up onto the defence and keeper was fascinating, the way Rashford and Young were used to blunt the flanks and the press from ourselves was incredibly disciplined.

Yesterday was the first time Jose really impressed me tactically and I thought to myself, ok, if he can do it here and now this is an amazing platform to build from it was smart, switched on and alert. It was the perfect way to stop the new era of hyper press/ tempo play. We may just do alright this season (if not winning the league).

The next test, Conte, he is also a tactical master, lets see how he plans to stop our attack and break us down.

 

[Steven Seagull]

Surprised how shit Liverpool were. We started well and matched them for an hour. Then we probably decided a point was a decent result and let Henderson have the ball all night. He picks out a good pass every few weeks so I'd take my chances in the same way if we played again tonight.

It was in no way a park the bus job like some people are making out.

 

[johnny boy]

Surprised how shit Liverpool were. We started well and matched them for an hour. Then we probably decided a point was a decent result and let Henderson have the ball all night. He picks out a good pass every few weeks so I'd take my chances in the same way if we played again tonight.

It was in no way a park the bus job like some people are making out.

You did start well and we were pretty average, especially first half.
Really missed the fluidity Wijnaldum and Lallana have provided, that's not an excuse as you have to adapt and cope with injuries and different tactics used against you.

What is the opinion on Pogba? Do you not want more from him given the £89m fee? He didn't stand out at all for me.

 

[DuncanEd]

I agree on part of that, never seen so many people taking pictures on their phones instead of watching the game, it's a bit poor - bet it's the same at OT though.

A lot of the true or more vocal fans can't afford to go to the game anymore.

It's a sad reflection of modern day football I'm afraid. The larger the grounds get the more tourists there are. The hard core are only so many. Same goes for every club in the land.

Yeah same most places but used to it at Old Trafford now, I have witnessed the decline of Anfield previous years at least we got some back but last night I saw a Klopp lookalike eating a pizza during the game. Gobsmacked.

Was there any trouble at the game ?

Seen nothing before or after. No chants either en masse.

There was maybe 8 people who tried a justice for heysel chant which stopped pretty quick and I heard maybe one person shout murderers but soon stopped when absolutely no on else joined in. Considering what it was last season I would say that is an improvement.

 

[LuisNaniencia]

But it wasn't 2-0. And because DDG plays for us and is a world class keeper he made two world class saves and because Liverpool play a high press and counter-gengenpress we nullified it by going longer and because their players are mostly small fast technical players we were able to push them up and make them defend at crucial parts of the game and because Jose knows all of this, it was a plan and we executed the plan perfectly with some outstanding performances from key players and selections, we absolutely controlled the game from min 1, any game any opposition they will have spells in which their plan looks to have worked, the point is, it didn't we came away with the point and now its up to us to beat them at home, what will their approach be?

I think Jose isn't getting enough credit here, when I saw that team sheet, I had thoughts of LVG style random teams with Ashley Young at wing back and 3 at the back, random tactics that would only work in foreign leagues.

Last night Jose basically did what he does best and provided a world class tactical game plan only he could possibly achieve, why? how? let me explain.

Its no secret that we are in yet another transition 3 years on we finally have the manager we should always have had in charge in-between then we have collected some amazing players and some specialized players for certain roles that suit certain game plans.

Jose has been tasked with taking those players and making them work together as a cohesive TEAM when all their qualities are vastly different, the squad is lacking balance but certainly has quality.

My point is Klopp is much further along the development of his team and Liverpool weather it is now or 10 years ago have always been a force at home, added with thier flying start and killer instinct we could not afford to take chances or "click" in this game, w tried that vs City and Jose learnt that these players need time to work together and develop their play style.

So what do you do? the press have us beat already, our fans are nervous, there are intense and hard games to come and the first test is our flying rivals. What you do is piss on their parade and accept that now is not our time to hammer them at home if there ever is a time for that.

Jose executed a tactical masterclass in shutting down the quick press and counter from liverpool, the game to me was enjoyable because I was fascinated by the confidence in the plan and the first half specifically. Pogba/Ibra pushing up onto the defence and keeper was fascinating, the way Rashford and Young were used to blunt the flanks and the press from ourselves was incredibly disciplined.

Yesterday was the first time Jose really impressed me tactically and I thought to myself, ok, if he can do it here and now this is an amazing platform to build from it was smart, switched on and alert. It was the perfect way to stop the new era of hyper press/ tempo play. We may just do alright this season (if not winning the league).

The next test, Conte, he is also a tactical master, lets see how he plans to stop our attack and break us down.

Excellent post.

 

[LuisNaniencia]

You did start well and we were pretty average, especially first half.
Really missed the fluidity Wijnaldum and Lallana have provided, that's not an excuse as you have to adapt and cope with injuries and different tactics used against you.

What is the opinion on Pogba? Do you not want more from him given the £89m fee? He didn't stand out at all for me.

Yeah we absolutely want more from him. I for one think it was unlikely for him to hit the ground running due to the expectations re the fee. But I also think he will come good and be a key player for us.

 

[Klopper76]

Yeah we absolutely want more from him. I for one think it was unlikely for him to hit the ground running due to the expectations re the fee. But I also think he will come good and be a key player for us.

At least he is still young. It would be different if he was a 27 year old who was supposed to be at his peak. He's got time on his side.

 

[NK86]

The fact you're only talking about one fluffed chance from Zlatan (as if strikers usually have a 100% record), the fact we had 66% possession and the fact that De Gea made two world class saves.

The fact that you needed a Coutinho special from 35 yard out which is a bread and butter save for DDG and one other half chance to Can to try to justify your "dominance" says everything I need to know. What exactly did you do with that possession? Hit crosses, play sideways and backwards. That was what we did last season and it didn't get us anywhere. Just like it didn't get you anywhere yesterday.

 

[Steven Seagull]

You did start well and we were pretty average, especially first half.
Really missed the fluidity Wijnaldum and Lallana have provided, that's not an excuse as you have to adapt and cope with injuries and different tactics used against you.

What is the opinion on Pogba? Do you not want more from him given the £89m fee? He didn't stand out at all for me.

He was largely crap and laboured on the ball. Herrera and even Fellaini dealt with any pressure far more calmly. In last nights system it's difficult for him though. He's only really got a 35 year old ahead of him to work with so I won't be too harsh. Same way Ibra didn't have much to work with. It's our first big away match under Mourinho missing Martial and Mkhitaryan who I think could make a big difference without losing the shape.

I don't care about the fee. Will complain about that if he has 4 crap seasons