[Ayoba]

My word, I've not seen such a poor united attack in all my years of supporting united.

 

[Tosicsleftpeg]

Sorry, but that's nonsense. He is a midfielder, as important as it is winning the ball and protecting the defense it is also important to be decent with the ball. No one expects him to be prime Pirolo; however, he needs to pass it much better. Also, it wasn't some tough passes that he floundered. They were all pretty simple. He put the team in a couple of dangerous situations because of his atrocious passing; once twice in the same sequence.

The idea that a defensive minded midfielder can be a 70% passer is simply wrong.

His passing wasn't great but he was putting in an absolute shift trying to shield the defence as the rest of the team parted like the red sea as usual. We've missed someone doing that job and it's a really important one. His technical play will hopefully improve a bit as time goes on.

 

[G-manc]

It was pretty poor from both sides. Not sure why Neville was so disappointed on Chelsea’s behalf - I can’t remember one chance for them after that early header off the post.

United had 2-3 decent chances but as Palace and West Ham, the composure was lacking.

 

[Buster15]

It was pretty poor from both sides. Not sure why Neville was so disappointed on Chelsea’s behalf - I can’t remember one chance for them after that early header off the post.

United had 2-3 decent chances but as Palace and West Ham, the composure was lacking.

It was certainly a game pretty devoid of real quality, from both sides. But I thought Chelsea had a stronger bench.

 

[SoCross]

Story of the season - if we had our finishing boots on, we’d have won the game.

De Ligt and Martinez, especially the former, had a few iffy moments but generally, thought they were solid. But Martinez seems to have one dangerous play moment per game.

Mazraoui is a gem, technically so good. Onana was quite solid too, one fluff aside.

 

[ColvaleGoa]

That chance Garnacho had to play in Maz. Could have set it on a plate for JZ.

JZ is so slow that he would have not be in position till the ball crossed the corner flag.

 

[ColvaleGoa]

I agree some of the comments are out of line but I disagree that it's short sighted. Garnacho simply isn't good enough for United and at no point has he performed to a level that indicates he is, I'm talking about performances over a decent sample size not just a game here or there.

Savinho is the same age as him and performed to a far higher level for longer, last season in La Liga only Vinicius was avg more dribbles per game than him. Foden was also far outperforming him by a similar age as was Saka.

I could go on but there's really nothing in his game that indicates he's anything better than a decent prospect, to make another comparison Adnan Januzaj was also outperforming him at the same age and we know how that turned out.

He might score a decent goal here or there but overall the numbers just don't like. Dribbles per game/chances created/every passing stat has his numbers as being decent but nothing more.

The way some people talk about him you'd think he was performing like young Cristiano.

Not sure if serious.


Agreed that Garna had a bad game yesterday, but that's a shocker of a take.

 

[Jaffa Cakes II]

That was a grim watch. It seemed to me that Chelsea just had to get going for a moment or two for it to be all over - that they didn't says more about them than anything that United were doing. Overall United were shockingly poor.

 

[pratyush_utd]

Was bewildered how Lisandro slight touch inside penalty box was shown after like 20 min with zoom cameras and mistimed tackle on Rashford inside the box was not shown.
Even Jim Beglin was like “why we are seeing this again” for that Lisandro tackle.

They ( broadcaster and referees) need to be called out by manager and club. Right now they are promoting any slightest controversy against Manutd

 

[SuperSub81]

Erik Ten Hag is the problem..

 

[Craig Ward]

Odd performance from us - much more desire to win the ball bag, some good signs. Playing with more intensity but lacking in real quality.

Fernandes was so wasteful but had a few touches of real quality.

The most alarming thing for me was how poor Dalot & Garnacho looked. Both seemed 2nd best for everything they done. The drop off in Dalot has been a real negative for me this season. Rashford and Garnacho have swapped bodies it seems.

A draw is better than a loss though so well done to Ruud. Better times ahead though

 

[Wolfbot]

I agree with this. I think our players are underrated and would be considered much better than their perception if they were elsewhere. De Ligt imo, has been good, but our team as a whole has been poor. He's now being discredited since he hasn't made as much impact as had been hoped, despite actually showing great attributes.

Hojlund is forced to feed off scraps, yet is blamed for our lack of goals, despite the fact that the chances never fall to him, not because of his lack of movement, but because our chances are created to chaotically. Bruno gives at least 3 key passes per game, and on a better team would be in a position where he won't need to run all over the pitch as he does for us, nor be respnsible for every creative avenue we have. Onana has been great since the season started, but noone notices this as United as a team have been poor.

I genuinely don't believe we have many poor/average players still left at the club. Lindelof, Evans and Antony are the only ones I would consider deadwood. We've had squads where Pereira, Dan James, Lingard, Brandon Williams etc have actually been starting players for us. I think that currently, our attack is a little bit immature, but with time have potential.

Evans is absolutely not deadwood. You don't want to be relying on an aging player to play a huge amount of games, but he's largely been quality when called upon, his commitment can't be questioned either.

 

[Xaviboy]

I'd say our new head coach watched that yesterday thinking postives are we can run and put effort in but everything else is rubbish.


Big task ahead of him to get us in to shape tactically in and out of possesion.

 

[gerdm07]

When did you rate these players to be world class? I don't remember any top teams fighting over their signature at any point. I don't remember anyone including them in the list of great midfielders in any context, PL or European. Do you mean you personally rated them world class? If so, I respect that as that's your opinion, but if you mean it was some general consensus built over many years of performances, I am going to have to disagree with that.

As for your second point, again, Gravenberch was used as an example of why Liverpool are lacking this summer. He had the same tag as De Ligt and Mazraoui of a talented player who can't be any good if a team like Bayern are selling him and he showed nothing last year to prove that wrong. Mac Allister was the lesser desired option at Brighton's midfield and Szoboszlai had a very average profile and reputation before their transfers. So again, my question is do you mean they have players "performing" better or are we saying they are categorically better players and Liverpool saw something nobody else did at the time of transfer?

I might have been too quick to say Partey was world class. I just remember him having some very good matches against us.

Henderson has 81 caps for England, one of the top 6 national teams in the world. Isn't that world class? Even SAF gave him praise a few years back.

Liverpool had a midfield problem when Henderson and company were aging and their results suffered. They bought new players and were competitive last season and are at the top of the table today. Doesn't that mean something? We, on the other hand, buy aging stars like Matic, Casemiro and Ericksen and don't solve anything. Surely you will agree that Liverpool has had a better overall midfield than we have had for at least the past 8 years. No?

 

[Wolfbot]

Erik Ten Hag is the problem..

It wasn't going to get significantly better by the next league game after his departure, especially under an interim who's been at his side since the beginning of the season.

 

[Oranges038]

Was bewildered how Lisandro slight touch inside penalty box was shown after like 20 min with zoom cameras and mistimed tackle on Rashford inside the box was not shown.
Even Jim Beglin was like “why we are seeing this again” for that Lisandro tackle.

They ( broadcaster and referees) need to be called out by manager and club. Right now they are promoting any slightest controversy against Manutd

Looking for something to talk about to make it look like Utd got away with one after last week.

Didn't look at the 2 questionable offsides called way too early and the 2 penalty shouts for Utd as much.

 

[Wrecking ralf]

Looking for something to talk about to make it look like Utd got away with one after last week.

Didn't look at the 2 questionable offsides called way too early and the 2 penalty shouts for Utd as much.

The one that got me was the instant whistle blow for a foul even though the ball landed and Hojlunds feet in the box. It's lucky he didn't put that away or there would have been uproar again.

 

[The-Mezzala]

My word, I've not seen such a poor united attack in all my years of supporting united.

That’s the worry. We just look so toothless and the decision making when we get in good positions is Sunday league level at times. I can’t work out if it’s confidence or just poor quality. Amad deserves a run now.

 

[Theonas]

I might have been too quick to say Partey was world class. I just remember him having some very good matches against us.

Henderson has 81 caps for England, one of the top 6 national teams in the world. Isn't that world class? Even SAF gave him praise a few years back.

I am not sure that tells us anything really. Harry Maguire played 64 times for England and we don't hear anyone using that to laud his world class qualities. Henderson is a good player, a workhorse who did brilliantly for Liverpool who found an environment at Liverpool where his weaknesses were covered by being asked to do what he's good at. Something the players we buy don't find here as they get exposed and get asked to do an awful lot more.

Liverpool had a midfield problem when Henderson and company were aging and their results suffered. They bought new players and were competitive last season and are at the top of the table today. Doesn't that mean something? We, on the other hand, buy aging stars like Matic, Casemiro and Ericksen and don't solve anything. Surely you will agree that Liverpool has had a better overall midfield than we have had for at least the past 8 years. No?

If we bought what Liverpool or even City did, I am positive we would be talking about how could we expect to compete when we're buying relegation players like Wijnaldum or Brighton's lesser midfielder in Mac Allister when proper ambitious clubs beat us to prime talent like Caicedo and Lavia. We would be blaming the money people for not being able to compete. Hell even looking at City we'd be talking about how no one wanted or showed any interest in Nunes and how can anybody be deemed not good enough for Chelsea but good for us in Kovacic.

Narratives change with hindsight. I have no idea how good or bad our players are because it's very clear that before they join us vs before they join Liverpool or Arsenal or even City, it really doesn't look that different in terms of profile if we look at the past decade. We all bought aging players and cast off by bigger clubs. If anything we bought more established players than them, yet no one seems to perform. Isn't it then more logical to deduce that it has something to do with how we use them?

The top clubs and organizations in general recruit personnel with a clear defined role that optimizes their strengths and hide their weaknesses. They are asked to do a specific job that is part of a greater system that is defined by an in sync hierarchy. It just makes sense that this goes a long way in producing the best version of these players as opposed to what we do which is the equivalent of a startup hiring talented engineers and designers and going "ermmm it's a big of a mess here, could you please help us?".

 

[Maticmaker]

One we could have won on the night if we'd have had better decision making in and around the box. Until we solve that particular problem, we will always be vulnerable.

RVN has seemingly got a better balanced display out of the same players as ETH had, why is that?

Ugarte is getting more confident and is now doing the 'fetching and carrying' and disrupting, more effectively.... almost reminiscent of Darren Fletcher.

Garnacho had a bit of a 'stinker', his moves are becoming very predictable, although last night it was mostly about miskicking and again more poor decision making.

Rashford looked more committed for longer periods, but still had his sulky moments when he seemingly says "I don't want to play".

 

[thisisnottaken1]

Remind me…why do you use the term ‘vermin’ when you talk about the glazers?

A general term I use when referring to detestable people. Maybe “scumbags” would be better.

 

[lex talionis]

I expected Chelsea to have us in their teeth but in truth we had more good quality chances than they did, quite a few more actually, but our diabolical finishing condemned us to more dropped points once again.

 

[JediSith]

Genuinely don’t understand the negative reaction. Was not a very boring match. The football was not as great as we’d like but when has it been with United? We actually created more chances just didn’t have the final ball.

Garnacho. He’s still young and still had our best chance near the end. Having watched the match I was surprised that the Sky Sports News highlights didn’t show Bruno’s rugby shot in injury time.

 

[GueRed]

Mazraoui - Solid again
Martinez - Glad he didnt get sent off
Garnacho - Wasted a couple of good opportunities to score
Bruno - Passes were hit and miss as usual. Third goal in two games though. Hopefully he hits a purple patch

Positives - Created chances. We've played a lot worse this season

 

[The Irish Connection]

Get with it mate… they were good, we were crap and we only drew against a team well up the table and in form

Haha, they were not good. Gave the ball away stupidly and couldn’t get control of it as much as us while really only threatening a couple of times from set pieces.
You get with it.

 

[Denis' cuff]

Haha, they were not good. Gave the ball away stupidly and couldn’t get control of it as much as us while really only threatening a couple of times from set pieces.
You get with it.

Whoosh

 

[Redderp]

It was not happening this game, but lets hope Amorim can get us to win some of these home games against the top 5. Getting a point away against top 6 is always a win for the away team.

Drawing home and losing away is not gonna help us, we need to beat these feckers at Old Trafford.

 

[FlawlessVictory88]

Not sure if serious.


Agreed that Garna had a bad game yesterday, but that's a shocker of a take.

I am being serious and I can support any of the claims made.

Here is Garnacho performances vs Savio/Olise/Yamal/Doue. I can also show you Wirtz/Musiala or a host of others.

https://ibb.co/w4h5K0F

I choose these players as they're the same age as Garna or a year older. If I start to include players 2+ years older like Palmer/Vini/Saka it just get's embarrassing.

Could you please give me evidence that support the case he's an elite level player or even talent?

One major problem with United's recruitment strategy has been the lack of an evidence based approach. Truly elite level talents *actually perform like elite level talents* and this will show up in the evidence.

18 year old Messi was basically off the charts for all of the attacking metrics, Mbappe was sensational as was Neymar and Hazard.

There's literally nothing about Garnacho that suggests he's elite except for fans who say so, and many of these fans said the same thing about Adnan and co.

Could you please give me evidence that supports the case he's an elite level player or even talent? You're own opinion is not evidence btw.

 

[Gator Nate]

Some of the expectations exuded in this thread are disturbing.

Having just sacked the manager and already named the incoming manager, we're on the second game of an interim who's a holdover from the first. I mean, come on! What reasonable expectation did you have of a sudden mastering of football we haven't seen in the last three years? The board (read: Ineos) recognized the issue and did what had to be done.

So, we faced a club that seems to be challenging for the top four. On a weekend when three of the then-top four lost. And we held them to one goal.

Frankly, I thought we were the better team. Until the last ten minutes or so, I never felt too threatened in the final third by Chelsea.

Our front line is playing garbage, but that's been the case for months. On the other hand, it felt like we actually played for 90 minutes - a rarity in the ETH era.

Yes, I can't wait to see what Amorim can do. But I'm not expecting more than what we've had until he arrives.

 

[The Irish Connection]

Whoosh

Oh right sorry