[rollingstoned1]

We fielded a side filled with players whose got experience with both club and country. Man United have, in fact, the second highest salary bill in the EPL. Do you think that we should have been able to beat Blackburn without the need of Pogba and Ibra?

Football doesn't work like that mate. The FA cup especially is notorious for small teams being very hard to beat, plus many of our players have been playing non-stop for a while and those that haven't lack the match fitness to match the intensity of these motivated lower league teams. Any win is a good result if we don't have to play a replay.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Have you ever watched a domestic cup match before? It's never that simple, and that's hardly unique to this match, this team or our club.

Exactly. Look at Wigan. Cup winner and relegated. If you were looking at league position and form that should never have happened. Should Southampton have beaten United in '76. Sould Wimbledon have beaten Liverpool. It is the cup.

 

[Thepinhead]

Am I the only one who is thrilled about our performances lately?

Yes we didn't play the best attacking football. But come on, we play 2 games a week. It is really difficult to be creative and play attacking football every single game. What matters is that even when we aren't creative we work hard and grind out those victories anyway. That is something only top teams do. It shows league winning form. I an really positive about this team. There are a few players in our squad I'd like we got rid of, but all in all we have some really good professionals. I rarely see anyone who ain't working their socks off when they get playingtime even though they don't have the best of days.

 

[devilish]

Football doesn't work like that mate. The FA cup especially is notorious for small teams being very hard to beat, plus many of our players have been playing non-stop for a while and those that haven't lack the match fitness to match the intensity of these motivated lower league teams. Any win is a good result if we don't have to play a replay.

Mou fielded a very competitive side filled with internationals. You'll expect them to be able to win against the Championship strugglers without the need of Pogba and Ibra.

However its not just today's game. If you take the EPL, Pogba/Ibra scored 20 goals out of the 38 goals we've scored and contributed 7 assists out of the 30 assists we had. The slice get bigger and more damning if you compare Mou's signings against the rest.

However who needs stats when you can rely on common sense? We're relying on 36 year old to score the goals, our best DM is 35 years old and that despite showing clear signs of ageing and our best 2 defenders is a makeshift winger and some kid who was able to swiftly win a regular first team role despite having previously played around 35 games at top flight. That's not good enough especially considering the salaries we're paying for our players

 

[devilish]

Am I the only one who is thrilled about our performances lately?

Yes we didn't play the best attacking football. But come on, we play 2 games a week. It is really difficult to be creative and play attacking football every single game. What matters is that even when we aren't creative we work hard and grind out those victories anyway. That is something only top teams do. It shows league winning form. I an really positive about this team. There are a few players in our squad I'd like we got rid of, but all in all we have some really good professionals. I rarely see anyone who ain't working their socks off when they get playingtime even though they don't have the best of days.

I am thrilled. All Mou's signings were top notch which means we finally got a manager who knows what he's doing. Our performances had improved since Mou signed with us

However it goes without saying that this is just the beginning. There's too much dead wood in the time. Also some players should start justifying the hype surrounding them.

 

[Thepinhead]

I am thrilled. All Mou's signings were top notch which means we finally got a manager who knows what he's doing. Our performances had improved since Mou signed with us

However it goes without saying that this is just the beginning. There's too much dead wood in the time. Also some players should start justifying the hype surrounding them.

completely agree. But we haven't really been giving our talents the most stabil environment to flourish in. Hopefully we have now found a manager who can give them that, and maybe already next year we will see some epic performances from our talents.

 

[Virgil]

Nothing much I can add to what's already been said I think. Largely underwhelming but job done. I think we're starting to see a winning mentality establish itself again, not so long ago this would have been a banana skin, especially after going 1 down early doors.

My two'penneth:

Romero is a top draw back up - Liverpool fans must look at our goalkeeping line up and just think WTF!!!!
Darmian is nowhere near the type of player we need in that position.
Rojo and Smalling as a CB pairing is the stuff to give you nightmares.
Young put his usual decent if not exactly world beating shift in.
Lingard is well short of the squad quality we need.
Martial needs to do more.
As does Rashford.
Hererra isn't exactly pulling trees up at the mo'
Miki had a frustrating day of sorts but showed hes the type of player who just has that little spark of magic.
Pogba showed exactly why he's going to establish himself as a world beater.
Ibra showed exactly why he is a world beater.

I know Chelsea away isn't exactly a favourable tie but its going to be a real test and barometer of where we really are as a team. Bring them on.

Could not have put it better.

 

[devilish]

completely agree. But we haven't really been giving our talents the most stabil environment to flourish in. Hopefully we have now found a manager who can give them that, and maybe already next year we will see some epic performances from our talents.

That's my initial point all along. If our experienced squad players can't do the job then we might as well get rid off them to free space for new players/youth players to play. For example I've yet to see what Young or Bastian can offer at this point that TFM can't.

I don't mind experienced squad players but they need to add competition and options to the manager (ie people like Teddy, Ole, Blomqvist, Butt etc) rather then just provide bodies to the team. Youths can do that.

 

[Hammerfell]

Out of interest, what does Ibra have to do to show he is premiership class? I have been critical of him from time-to-time but to say he isn't PL class is a bold statement.

It's not bold, it's downright moronic.

 

[Thepinhead]

That's my initial point all along. If our experienced squad players can't do the job then we might as well get rid off them to free space for new players/youth players to play. For example I've yet to see what Young or Bastian can offer at this point that TFM can't.

Well I think this is what is the difference between Mourinho and SAF. Mourinho prefer stabillity in a players performance. He is a control freak who doesn't like too many surprises. Where SAF was really good at selecting players who would have a good day at the Office. I guess that had something to do with SAF knowing his players and the club inside out. Mourinho hasn't been in the same club long enough to have that skill.

 

[devilish]

Well I think this is what is the difference between Mourinho and SAF. Mourinho prefer stabillity in a players performance. He is a control freak who doesn't like too many surprises. Where SAF was really good at selecting players who would have a good day at the Office. I guess that had something to do with SAF knowing his players and the club inside out. Mourinho hasn't been in the same club long enough to have that skill.

I don't think Mou has too much of a choice really. Most of these players are on crazy salary and long term contracts. Why would someone like Young take a paycut to spend the rest of his football years at Sunderland, when he can stay at United? I bet we're finding it very hard to get rid of some of our players.

 

[Robertd0803]

Was fairly irritated that we needed to bring Pogba and Ibra on but Jose showing why he thankfully is our manager. Under LvG we probably still would be trying to find a winner after subbing our full backs. Blackburn made it tougher than we would have wanted to be fair to them.

And my reaction to the draw against Chelsea was ffs

 

[Raw]

Tunnel cam.

 

[m1y2]

Was fairly irritated that we needed to bring Pogba and Ibra on but Jose showing why he thankfully is our manager. Under LvG we probably still would be trying to find a winner after subbing our full backs. Blackburn made it tougher than we would have wanted to be fair to them.

And my reaction to the draw against Chelsea was ffs

well you have to win the touch games, when you want a trophy, isn't it how it should be?

Als I didn't expect an easy game, every away game is tough, the opponents raise their game, we should be careful when critisizing our players in a tough away game. sure the chelsea away will be way tougher but we will be much more motivated, if we get a win there I am sure we can win it all and would deserve so because there won't be a tougher game than that

 

[Thepinhead]

I don't think Mou has too much of a choice really. Most of these players are on crazy salary and long term contracts. Why would someone like Young take a paycut to spend the rest of his football years at Sunderland, when he can stay at United? I bet we're finding it very hard to get rid of some of our players.

I agree. It is not his fault at all. He can only do the best with what he has gotten. Besides SAF had the time to go watch u18 matches etc. So he knew all his players from a very early age and knew what to expect from them. This will come with Mourinho as well if we give him 5-6 years. But it means that we as fans probably have to come to terms with our minimum requirement being top 4 instead of challenging for the titel every year. Times have changed. PML is not like La liga anymore where we can buy the best players from our rivals. I think we have to come to terms with us winning the title in average every 3rd year perhaps.

 

[Robertd0803]

well you have to win the touch games, when you want a trophy, isn't it how it should be?

Als I didn't expect an easy game, every away game is tough, the opponents raise their game, we should be careful when critisizing our players in a tough away game. sure the chelsea away will be way tougher but we will be much more motivated, if we get a win there I am sure we can win it all and would deserve so because there won't be a tougher game than that

True, but with the amount of games that we have coming up, I was hoping that yesterday would be more straightforward. Unfortunately despite not being in the same league as us Blackburn still gave us a tough game which they nearly always do at Ewood Park. I didn't criticize any of our players, but expecting the starting eleven that was put out to win the game isn't expecting too much surely?

 

[devilish]

I agree. It is not his fault at all. He can only do the best with what he has gotten. Besides SAF had the time to go watch u18 matches etc. So he knew all his players from a very early age and knew what to expect from them. This will come with Mourinho as well if we give him 5-6 years. But it means that we as fans probably have to come to terms with our minimum requirement being top 4 instead of challenging for the titel every year. Times have changed. PML is not like La liga anymore where we can buy the best players from our rivals. I think we have to come to terms with us winning the title in average every 3rd year perhaps.

Its undeniable the fact that SAF left an immense hole at United. The guy was a genius and its only fair that United structure reflected that. David Gill used to say that the club is broken into two. The financial side which was lead by him and the football side which was lead by the manager. I wonder if that structure can still successful with managers who aren't as good or as committed as SAF.

Don't take me wrong, I believe Mou is a great manager. However managers these days see clubs as projects. They go there, they win and then they leave to another club. Their transfer strategy often reflect such ideology too. Youths are of course, a long term strategy and they tend to score low in the typical continental manager agenda.

Which makes me wonder if its time to build a strong football structure which is there for the long haul and whose got the club's long term interest in mind. Most top clubs have that (Bayern, Barcelona, Juventus etc). Its main aim would be to work alongside the manager but there might be times when it would stop the manager from doing silly mistakes (ie like handling mates a long term contract ex Bastian)

 

[Thepinhead]

Its undeniable the fact that SAF left an immense hole at United. The guy was a genius and its only fair that United structure reflected that. David Gill used to say that the club is broken into two. The financial side which was lead by him and the football side which was lead by the manager. I wonder if that structure can still successful with managers who aren't as good or as committed as SAF.

Don't take me wrong, I believe Mou is a great manager. However managers these days see clubs as projects. They go there, they win and then they leave to another club. Their transfer strategy often reflect such ideology too. Youths are of course, a long term strategy and they tend to score low in the typical continental manager agenda.

Which makes me wonder if its time to build a strong football structure which is there for the long haul and whose got the club's long term interest in mind. Most top clubs have that (Bayern, Barcelona, Juventus etc). Its main aim would be to work alongside the manager but there might be times when it would stop the manager from doing silly mistakes (ie like handling mates a long term contract ex Bastian)

Hmm ye but SAF is pretty much mourinhos idol. And Mourinho is one of the few managers who has declared that his dream is to be in a club for many years. Though I agree that if it fails with Mourinho we should maybe look to change our structure.

 

[kiristao]

Tunnel cam.

What does the kid say at 3.24?

 

[Drz]

He was being talked up a couple of years ago as a potential talent, I was surprised to see him still there to be honest.

Emnes (sic) their dutch second striker impressed me more. Our midfield was struggling with him, notably Carrick.

 

[2 man midfield]

Emnes (sic) their dutch second striker impressed me more. Our midfield was struggling with him, notably Carrick.

Yeah he was lively. I think I heard that he doesn't even start for Blackburn usually, or wouldn't have played yesterday but for an injury anyway.

 

[Raw]

What does the kid say at 3.24?

He's asking the ref to not give any reds or yellows to Rovers, only United

 

[SalfordRed1960]

Is the season over?

Of course not, but we still expected to be a lot more fluid in our play and in a better league position. Hence, my comment on where we thought we would be, not where we ended up. Still loads of points to play for, and if we do not get fatigue, we have lots to look forward to.

 

[AltiUn]

Nobody on this sub should be scared of Chelsea, we're as good as any team on our day, Chelsea included. Maybe they'll come with the mentality that they'll just walk over us again, Spurs have shown these lot are very beatable.

 

[roseguy64]

Comeon we shouldnt be relying on them to win a struggling championship side

And we didn't need them against the previous sides but stuff happens. Who knew?

 

[devilish]

And we didn't need them against the previous sides but stuff happens. Who knew?

If you take the EPL, Pogba/Ibra scored 20 goals out of the 38 goals we've scored and contributed 7 assists out of the 30 assists we had. The slice get bigger and more damning if you compare Mou's signings against the rest.

Maybe there's a reason why this squad isn't competing for the EPL title?

 

[roseguy64]

If you take the EPL, Pogba/Ibra scored 20 goals out of the 38 goals we've scored and contributed 7 assists out of the 30 assists we had. The slice get bigger and more damning if you compare Mou's signings against the rest.

Maybe there's a reason why this squad isn't competing for the EPL title?

The reason is we haven't been good enough as a whole and the play is set up so that most of the chances fall to Zlatan. The others get chances too and they should score so poor from them.

Also, my point was simply we've played other Championship slide's in the competition and beat them with a Fellaini-Schweinsteiger combo being one. So.... Guess what? Sometimes we just don't play well regardless of the quality or the lack thereof

 

[devilish]

The reason is we haven't been good enough as a whole and the play is set up so that most of the chances fall to Zlatan. The others get chances too and they should score so poor from them.

Also, my point was simply we've played other Championship slide's in the competition and beat them with a Fellaini-Schweinsteiger combo being one. So.... Guess what? Sometimes we just don't play well regardless of the quality or the lack thereof

Exactly. Which makes you wonder why we're paying so much money in terms of salary when we're being carried by a handful of players. We might as well get rid of the dead wood and play youths or bring players who can actually play football.

 

[Red Dreams]

All 4 players Mourinho brought in have been top quality. Summer will see some clear outs and hopefully some of the names being mentioned come in.

As for the Chelsea draw and some already writing us off, I expect us to spring a surprise.

 

[Shiva87]

Mou fielded a very competitive side filled with internationals. You'll expect them to be able to win against the Championship strugglers without the need of Pogba and Ibra.

However its not just today's game. If you take the EPL, Pogba/Ibra scored 20 goals out of the 38 goals we've scored and contributed 7 assists out of the 30 assists we had. The slice get bigger and more damning if you compare Mou's signings against the rest.

However who needs stats when you can rely on common sense? We're relying on 36 year old to score the goals, our best DM is 35 years old and that despite showing clear signs of ageing and our best 2 defenders is a makeshift winger and some kid who was able to swiftly win a regular first team role despite having previously played around 35 games at top flight. That's not good enough especially considering the salaries we're paying for our players

Salaries aren't relevant on the pitch. The reason why we pay those salaries is to make sure that we have the quality in the squad to win most matches, but its not a guarantee of victory.

I think this was one of the first times that Rash, Martial, Mhiki and Lingard played together as a front 4. I'm glad Mou didn't start with Zlatan or Pogba. Them coming on to get us over the line is only relevant because Blackburn were quite good yesterday. They played out of their skin and their goal was impressive. If Mhiki had made that assist - we would have been raving about it and posting videos all over the internet.

Also, the age point is correct but we are going to be in a dogfight for the next few months to get into the top 4. I don't think we are in that good a position yet, and it may come down to the last 2 games. Mourinho playing experienced players to ensure that they are match fit if injuries do happen is prudent. I'd like some youth to come on (like TFM), but if we are playing the last game of the season to stay in the top 4, I'd rather Young start than TFM.

I'd get worried about the youth aspect if Mourinho doesn't play TFM in the St. Etienne game. That tie is almost done now and he should use it for some rotation.

 

[devilish]

Salaries aren't relevant on the pitch. The reason why we pay those salaries is to make sure that we have the quality in the squad to win most matches, but its not a guarantee of victory.

I think this was one of the first times that Rash, Martial, Mhiki and Lingard played together as a front 4. I'm glad Mou didn't start with Zlatan or Pogba. Them coming on to get us over the line is only relevant because Blackburn were quite good yesterday. They played out of their skin and their goal was impressive. If Mhiki had made that assist - we would have been raving about it and posting videos all over the internet.

Also, the age point is correct but we are going to be in a dogfight for the next few months to get into the top 4. I don't think we are in that good a position yet, and it may come down to the last 2 games. Mourinho playing experienced players to ensure that they are match fit if injuries do happen is prudent. I'd like some youth to come on (like TFM), but if we are playing the last game of the season to stay in the top 4, I'd rather Young start than TFM.

I'd get worried about the youth aspect if Mourinho doesn't play TFM in the St. Etienne game. That tie is almost done now and he should use it for some rotation.

Do we have that though? Our best striker is 36 year old and we can barely afford resting him. Same thing about our DM (Carrick is our best option). Meanwhile our best defenders are Bailly whom, despite his inexperience, he was able to easily brush off competition quite easily and a makeshift winger.

 

[Drz]

Yeah he was lively. I think I heard that he doesn't even start for Blackburn usually, or wouldn't have played yesterday but for an injury anyway.

He was lively and rather good with his back towards his marker. Trapped the ball well on every occasion as far as I can remember. If he is not a regular for Blackburn, then that performance should atleast get him to start the next game and the next till his form drops.

In fact, his performance made me wish for Pogba in the middle (maybe a first sign that he is becoming influential to our play) and Pogba delivered (not only an assist) by doing a lot better with Emnes than whoever was supposed to mark him out before.

 

[unitedforeveral]

Oh My God! Oh My God! Our performances are so damn boring still. I will not like many others say it is because of the lingering effects of the LVG philosophy, it certainly is not! I think our players are still learning to play with each other and i know it is a process. A few have clicked but in several parts all over the pitch, like Pogba and Zlatan or MkhiT and Mata, Martial and Mata. I do not yet believe we are a team on the pitch, we are playing together because we should and that's not helping. I can still see that we choose to move the ball at our feet more looking for a better option and that's slowing the game way too much. Need to trust everyone and move the ball as quickly as possible. United should not play slow possession based football, for heaven's sake we played 4-4-2 for major part of the 21st century. SAF adapted to the modern era but some managers cannot let go of their ways. I'm very glad Jose is experimenting, he'll improve this team in a big way come 2017-18 season.

Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs can wait to bask in our GLORY!

#goreds

 

[superdry]

Thought their crossing of the ball was much better than ours.
Our crossing was normal ( our normal is terrible)

 

[kiristao]

He's asking the ref to not give any reds or yellows to Rovers, only United

 

[roseguy64]

Exactly. Which makes you wonder why we're paying so much money in terms of salary when we're being carried by a handful of players. We might as well get rid of the dead wood and play youths or bring players who can actually play football.

That's not how it works. Besides there's very little dead wood in the squad. Based on playing time anyway the only dead wood would be Schweinsteiger, Young and Shaw.

 

[sunama]

However its not just today's game. If you take the EPL, Pogba/Ibra scored 20 goals out of the 38 goals we've scored and contributed 7 assists out of the 30 assists we had. The slice get bigger and more damning if you compare Mou's signings against the rest.

It is possible that LVG really did serious damage to a lot of our players. Effectively reducing them permanently.
Jose came in and signed 2 attackers and 1 midfielder, who seem to immediately be our best players. While last year's attackers are continuing to do what they did last season.
Hopefully, this Summer, Jose will bring in more players, who will be able to help score/create goals. If Ibra got injured for a month or 2, we are basically screwed, though I do think Rashford can do a job for us.

On a side note, I do wonder what on Earth Giggs was doing when LVG was turning us into a non-attacking team. Was he keeping silent? Was he telling LVG that in the EPL, the non-attacking style will not work and at MUFC, this style of play will get you fired? I really would like to know.

 

[devilish]

That's not how it works. Besides there's very little dead wood in the squad. Based on playing time anyway the only dead wood would be Schweinsteiger, Young and Shaw.

Some might wonder if the players we've got are good enough or at least justify the salary being paid to them. People like Rooney, Fellaini and Jones for example. Rooney is nowhere near to a 200k a week player. Fellaini is not a DM and yet we're playing him there because he's shit elsewhere. Jones is injury prone. There's alot of players who simply do not justify the salaries their getting.

 

[devilish]

It is possible that LVG really did serious damage to a lot of our players. Effectively reducing them permanently.
Jose came in and signed 2 attackers and 1 midfielder, who seem to immediately be our best players. While last year's attackers are continuing to do what they did last season.
Hopefully, this Summer, Jose will bring in more players, who will be able to help score/create goals. If Ibra got injured for a month or 2, we are basically screwed, though I do think Rashford can do a job for us.

On a side note, I do wonder what on Earth Giggs was doing when LVG was turning us into a non-attacking team. Was he keeping silent? Was he telling LVG that in the EPL, the non-attacking style will not work and at MUFC, this style of play will get you fired? I really would like to know.

Well I beg to differ on that.

I think that the problem started when SAF was there. The man hated the idea of super agents and made sure he didn't do any work with them. Unfortunately that meant that we would turn down most of the top quality players. To keep United competitive the old fox tried to squeeze every drop of talent left in his old guard by putting as many workhorses on the pitch as possible to do the donkey work. It was a strategy that worked magnificently for him. However once the old guard grew too old, we were left with a bunch of donkeys and very little talent.

Moyes and LVG made matters worse. The former bulldozed over a delicate system SAF had carefully built + he brought 2 players we really didn't need, one of which was the epitome of donkey. The latter made a mess by forcing a philosophy that would never work in the EPL and signing a horde of players to fit that philosophy most of whom turned to be useless for us.

What Mou inherited was a hotpotch of three flawed philosophies. Most of these players will never earn the money they are currently earning here elsewhere. I mean can you imagine the type of clubs who would step in for the likes of Jones, Young, Fellaini, Bastian, Rooney and co? Therefore they'll probably dig their heels and remain on our payroll till the end of their contract.

Its frustrating because we're paying alot of money in terms of salary and we're getting very little back from them. Hopefully Mou will be able to kick their butts out of OT

 

[Shimo]

Really thought with the team we put out, we'd see some real quick and direct attacking football but, we played very very slow. I really did not like the fact that most of the time we had 4,5,6 players right crowded in middle attacking third and surrounded by Blackburn players and we were trying to make passes into players and they'd inevitably lose the ball. I don't recall a single save by their keeper and there were maybe a couple blocks by them but, none overly threatening.

I find it a bit weird that our rb often is the player that carries the most threat or desire to make things happen. Good on Young to take on Valencia's role but, could really do with a bit more of that throughout the team.

Anyway - glad to have gone through and no replay. We've got a lot of games coming up, so as long as we can keep our confidence up, am sure the performances will come along.