Pogba vs De Bruyne: who is the better passer?

SwSw said:
When has he dismantled counter attacking teams? Our game against City, we weren't outplayed by them. Lukaku's brain fart cost us.

DDG facing shots is, imo, a midfield issue. Pogba vacating his position is one of the biggest reason why our defense looks wobbly at times.
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You were played off the park and even Gary Neville said the scoreline flattered United.

Also Jose is the master of sitting deep counter attacking football and has a shocking record vs Pep. Atrocious.
20 game for Jose 4 wins, 10 wins for Pep. Pep also hammered him 5-0, I'd call that dismantling a counter attacking team no?

Klopp by comparison has 6 wins to 5 losses in 12 games.

It's a myth counter attacking football is what beats Guardiola football. Taking every meeting they've had in terms of points per match, Wenger and Klopp (neither of whom are counter attacking managers) have the best record vs Pep that have played him more than 5 times.
 
Infordin said:
So do you think that Pep > Jose?

Many people on this thread are unconsciously bashing Mourinho and his tactics/system to defend Pogba.
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Unconsciously? Many have said Jose isn't setting up team properly and its coaching issue.
 
One of them has been consistently brilliant for about 3-4 years in two leagues and is now bandied around as a potential Ballon Dor contender - he also seems to pull a world class assist out in every other game, sometimes two or more in a single match. And one of them has one good game in 5 against poor opponents and gets bossed around by Shelvey before being taken off.

No contest here for me as a neutral, I'd take De Bruyne all day long as I'm sure any club in world football would, I'm not even sure I'd swap Pogba for Wijnaldum, and that's really saying something cos Gini is garbage. I think a lot of United fans really do have red tinted glasses on when it comes to Pogba, some of you come across as mums at school protesting their son's an angel when everyone else knows they're a menace. Has he ever really shown anything consistent to justify the pedestal he's on? Whilst in the Prem I mean, harking on about him at Juve doesn't wash.

The United mates I've got that are refreshingly honest all pretty much say he's been hugely underwhelming at best, and a massively overrated fairweather player at worse, one even wants him to be sold before clubs finally click on he's not quite elite level and his value bombs. People sound a bit like some Liverpool fans with regards to Pogba, permanently waiting for next week, next month, next year for him to come good. How much time does he get before the realisation dawns.

Yet with De Bruyne, no matter who you support people can't hide the fact he's a class above everyone else in the league. It's not purely cos he's at City either, he was doing the same at Wolfsburg, hardly a hot bed of talent and £50m players all around him.
 
padr81 said:
You were played off the park and even Gary Neville said the scoreline flattered United.

Also Jose is the master of sitting deep counter attacking football and has a shocking record vs Pep. Atrocious.
20 game for Jose 4 wins, 10 wins for Pep. Pep also hammered him 5-0, I'd call that dismantling a counter attacking team no?

Klopp by comparison has 6 wins to 5 losses in 12 games.

It's a myth counter attacking football is what beats Guardiola football. Taking every meeting they've had in terms of points per match, Wenger and Klopp (neither of whom are counter attacking managers) have the best record vs Pep that have played him more than 5 times.
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Bollocks.

How did we get played off the park when the plan was to give them the ball. Do you even understand what you are saying?

Hammered a RM team that isnt defensively sound. Shocking. How about Inter vs Barca? RM vs Bayern? Stop cherry picking poor examples.

It isnt a myth. He got bested in the UCL many times by counter attacking teams Just ask Mou, Simeone and Heyckness.
 
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Hullyback said:
One of them has been consistently brilliant for about 3-4 years in two leagues and is now bandied around as a potential Ballon Dor contender - he also seems to pull a world class assist out in every other game, sometimes two or more in a single match. And one of them has one good game in 5 against poor opponents and gets bossed around by Shelvey before being taken off.

No contest here for me as a neutral, I'd take De Bruyne all day long as I'm sure any club in world football would, I'm not even sure I'd swap Pogba for Wijnaldum, and that's really saying something cos Gini is garbage. I think a lot of United fans really do have red tinted glasses on when it comes to Pogba, some of you come across as mums at school protesting their son's an angel when everyone else knows they're a menace. Has he ever really shown anything consistent to justify the pedestal he's on? Whilst in the Prem I mean, harking on about him at Juve doesn't wash.

The United mates I've got that are refreshingly honest all pretty much say he's been hugely underwhelming at best, and a massively overrated fairweather player at worse, one even wants him to be sold before clubs finally click on he's not quite elite level and his value bombs. People sound a bit like some Liverpool fans with regards to Pogba, permanently waiting for next week, next month, next year for him to come good. How much time does he get before the realisation dawns.

Yet with De Bruyne, no matter who you support people can't hide the fact he's a class above everyone else in the league. It's not purely cos he's at City either, he was doing the same at Wolfsburg, hardly a hot bed of talent and £50m players all around him.
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KDB wasnt consistently brilliant last season.

A Liverpool neutral? Suggesting Wijnaldum is better just lost u all sort of credibility. I cant speak for the rest but im not wearing tinted glass since i am well aware Pogba doesnt suit a midfield two and plays well in a midfield three. Reason: wants to overcomplicate simple matters.

Oh please, stop with the KDB praises. He isnt Messi. The system Pep implemented helps a ton. It isnt hard to know where to pass when you know where your team mates will be.
 
Mourinhonista said:
Pogba is much more than a so-called 'teenager'. During the season he has had some absolute brilliant matches for United, and some of the passes were out of this world, de Bruyne is no better. At his best Pogba makes us tick.

Sadly injuries and in this particular state of mind downplays his accolades this season, but make no mistake he's already shown at United that he can deliver and is nothing but a top class player. United don't have to worry about Paul Pogba.
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Guys he's amazing. Don't worry about the rubbish performances of late. If you can just ignore him. Because he is Paul Pogba. Who is amazing.
 
padr81 said:
It's a myth counter attacking football is what beats Guardiola football. Taking every meeting they've had in terms of points per match, Wenger and Klopp (neither of whom are counter attacking managers) have the best record vs Pep that have played him more than 5 times.
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Klopp is definitely a counter attacking coach. Counter attacking teams do not have to sit back all the time trying to soak up pressure like Mourinho's teams. Heynckes Bayern was for example just a better version of Klopp's Dortmund with better players, same with Ancelotti's RM or Enrique's Barca that floored Pep's Bayern. Actually teams that have quick attackers and fast transition from defence to attack have always been Pep's cryptonite over the last years.
 
Stacks said:
Mikihitaryan, Zlatan, Lukaku, Rashford and now Sanchez. No movement what so ever from any of these guys then?
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You don't see the difference in how for example Liverpool players, City players, Spurs players move off the ball compared to ManUtd?
 
padr81 said:
You were played off the park and even Gary Neville said the scoreline flattered United.

Also Jose is the master of sitting deep counter attacking football and has a shocking record vs Pep. Atrocious.
20 game for Jose 4 wins, 10 wins for Pep. Pep also hammered him 5-0, I'd call that dismantling a counter attacking team no?

Klopp by comparison has 6 wins to 5 losses in 12 games.

It's a myth counter attacking football is what beats Guardiola football. Taking every meeting they've had in terms of points per match, Wenger and Klopp (neither of whom are counter attacking managers) have the best record vs Pep that have played him more than 5 times.
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This is classic lying to oneself.
Klopp is the ultimate counter attacking manager. That is the whole purpose of his style and why his team struggles against side sthat cede him possession. Its called "counter pressing' for a reason...Furthermore almost every defeat Pep has ever faced has been against a counter attacking opponent. That's how Inter beat him under Mourinho twice. That's how Mourinho eventually started to beat him at Real. That is how Ancelotti dismantled him as Pep was at Bayern. That is how Simeone beat him and that's how Klopp almost always destroys him. Only Barca due to Xavi and MSN could do it another way.

Fact is the counter attack is literally the only sound way to beat a Guardiola team because you are unlikely to ever have enough of the ball against them.
 
Hullyback said:
No contest here for me as a neutral, I'd take De Bruyne all day long as I'm sure any club in world football would, I'm not even sure I'd swap Pogba for Wijnaldum, and that's really saying something cos Gini is garbage.
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This has to be one of the most ridiculous things I’ve read on this forum. You’re not sure about swapping Pogba for Wijnaldum?

I mean, I personally rate Coutinho on the same level as Pogba (something that is understandably an unpopular opinion here), but to even mention Wijnaldum in the same breathe as Pogba is ludicrous.
 
Hullyback said:
No contest here for me as a neutral, I'd take De Bruyne all day long as I'm sure any club in world football would, I'm not even sure I'd swap Pogba for Wijnaldum, and that's really saying something cos Gini is garbage. I think a lot of United fans really do have red tinted glasses on when it comes to Pogba, some of you come across as mums at school protesting their son's an angel when everyone else knows they're a menace. Has he ever really shown anything consistent to justify the pedestal he's on? Whilst in the Prem I mean, harking on about him at Juve doesn't wash.
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:lol:

Liverpool fan being Neutral on ManUtd players. Not sure which is more ridiculous, Liverpool fan being Neutral or not swapping Pogba for Wijnaldum.
 
SwSw said:
When has he dismantled counter attacking teams? Our game against City, we weren't outplayed by them. Lukaku's brain fart cost us.

DDG facing shots is, imo, a midfield issue. Pogba vacating his position is one of the biggest reason why our defense looks wobbly at times.
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We were massively out played, barely ever had the ball or got out of our own half.
 
I also believe that Eriksen is very close to the same level as Pogba and De Bruyne.

Unfortunately, like Coutinho before him, his reputation suffers from the misfortune of playing for a team that doesn’t win trophies.
 
Fortitude said:
Strikes me every time I watch either of them that given enough time, either one of them can make practically any pass
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Strikes me every time I watch them that only one of them does.
It’s KDB in case you’re unsure.
 
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Hammondo said:
We were massively out played, barely ever had the ball or got out of our own half.
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Have no idea how many times I have to repeat this but here goes.

If we both went to the track and ran 100m. It took you 10 seconds to finish the race and it took me 1 minutes to do so, so yes, is safe to say you totally out ran me that day. However, did we actually try to play a possession game that day? There you go.
 
SwSw said:
Have no idea how many times I have to repeat this but here goes.

If we both went to the track and ran 100m. It took you 10 seconds to finish the race and it took me 1 minutes to do so, so yes, is safe to say you totally out ran me that day. However, did we actually try to play a possession game that day? There you go.
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How would you know if we tried to play possession football? we couldn't even if we tried our best. There is very little difference in the outcome if we did or did not.
 
No contest in who the better player and passer is. KDB is ahead by a country mile.

I like Pogba though, he's just too lazy off the ball to be considered world class IMO.
 
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SwSw said:
1. Rashford's movement is non-existent. Martial and Sanchez all prefers the ball to their feet. Not saying they don't move tho. Same applies to Lukaku, but he generally moves more compared to the rest.

2. It is not. KDB looks better because with Pep's system. Players know where players are. So actually, i would argue KDB isn't better player because the system is there. Is like in batch processing where the workers are trained to do the same job repeatedly. ofc, they look great.

3. Again, is the system. KDB has options to pass to. City players generally makes off the ball movements. Ours rarely do.

One thing i'll give credit to KDB is he is better at the simpler things. Pogba seems to prefer to do the hollywood stuff. Kinda annoys me at times.
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So Sanchez never used to look for the runs in behind at arsenal (which is a lie obviously), also don't KDB assists at Wolfsburg before he was in this "system" that makes him so great, beat anything pogba has created in a season and he was playing in a much better team?

You don't need to give credit to KDB, as you will notice in this thread there is literally only united Fans even entertaining the thought that KDB isn't a better passer than pogba, which always says something when every neutral fan knows KDB is superior.
 
Stacks said:
Mikihitaryan, Zlatan, Lukaku, Rashford and now Sanchez. No movement what so ever from any of these guys then?
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Dont forget the "Amazing,2nd to only Muller in terms of movement " Lingard:wenger:.


KDB,all day( for now at least)
 
Pogba is capable of doing anything De Bruyne does, he has that ability but is just nowhere near as consistent.

Pogba had a huge athletic advantage too. Until this season.
 
SwSw said:
Bollocks.

How did we get played off the park when the plan was to give them the ball. Do you even understand what you are saying?

Hammered a RM team that isnt defensively sound. Shocking. How about Inter vs Barca? RM vs Bayern? Stop cherry picking poor examples.

It isnt a myth. He got bested in the UCL many times by counter attacking teams Just ask Mou, Simeone and Heyckness.
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No mate you're spouting bollocks. Giving the ball and letting the opposition dominate the game is being dominated. Everyones wrong but the Jose lovers, he let City dominate the game an it backfired like his cowardice does more often then not vs Pep.

"The goals were scruffy and Jose won't believe they've conceded two goals from set pieces, but not many teams have come here in the last 25 or 30 years and dominated like that." - Gary Neville

Madrid under Jose were defensively excellent, ffs, do you know anything about football?

Inter vs Barca was one win in one leg and then hanging on by the skin of their teeth in a second leg that they lost. RM vs Bayern? Now whose cherry picking?

20 games, 4 wins, one of which against half a city team in the league cup. 1 win in 5 for the master of the counter attack against Pep. Why is his record so bad, even he tried to say it was false?
 
There's basically nothing in it. They are both capable of pretty much the same passes.
However, in years to come, De Bruyne will go down as the better player, I predict.

He appears to just understand football better than Pogba.
Pogba has been blessed with balance, quick feet, agility, strength, touch but he won't make the most of it. He hasn't been blessed with the non-physical skills to match unfortunately.
 
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It's similar to Scholes vs Gerrard. One could quietly run a game with his intelligence and awareness, the other more of a highlights player who was better the less defensive responsibility he had.
 
Leftback99 said:
It's similar to Scholes vs Gerrard. One could quietly run a game with his intelligence and awareness, the other more of a highlights player who was better the less defensive responsibility he had.
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De Bruyne is a bit more highlights also. I feel Silva is more the game runner and De Bruyne hits you with the screamers and adventurous passes.
 
I struggle to think of a single footballing or mental attribute that Pogba is better than De Bruyne at. Physically, yes.
 
Stacks said:
De Bruyne is a bit more highlights also. I feel Silva is more the game runner and De Bruyne hits you with the screamers and adventurous passes.
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I think there is a kernel of truth in that. What Guardiola has successfully done this sesson is getting Silva and de Bruyne to operate in tandem. For the first half of the season I thought Silva was the more effective but since his unfortunate absence it looks like KdB has really stepped up. I'm looking forward to Silva returning for the crunch part of the season. I couldn't say who has been better this season between Silva and KDB but both are better with the other in the side.
 
Seems to me like a comparison between Xavi/Iniesta and Gerrard (his best position was on the right during that season they came second, iirc, like an opposite Pogba, and no, I'm not saying Pogba is as good as Gerrard was... yet).

De Bruyne is a weird player. Excellent in defense, incredible in attack. I hate City but he's a hard player to dislike. Could be one of the best in PL history. Pogba could be too, and I think he will, but they have different attributes. Pogba has physicality and pace, more trickery in terms of beating players. De Bruyne is just supremely intelligent, also deceptively physical in terms of shrugging off challenges.. The Xavi/Iniesta comparison may be off, but it's hard to think who he's similar to.

I do think Pogba's long passing will prove to be better over the course of their careers, and Pogba will be remembered as the more dynamic of the two. This may seem out of place based off this season and last, but just a feeling that Pogba will come good and win POTY at least once or twice, possibly more.

tl;dr

Both superb players, de Bruyne is the better of the two at the moment, but don't write Pogba off. He'll come good.
 


Pogba has definitely regressed since his Juventus time. He doesn't produce performances like this anymore. If used correctly he can be unplayable. Watching this back now it's hard to believe this is the same player we have now. By contrast KDB played in the same game and had no effect on it. Look at the difference now. He has gone forward under Pep and Pogba has gone backwards under Mourinho. No-one can say coaching doesn't make a difference. It clearly does.
 
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abdo99 said:


Pogba has definitely regressed since his Juventus time. He doesn't produce performances like this anymore. If he used correctly he can be unplayable. By contrast KDB played in the same game and had no effect on it. Look at the difference now. He has gone forward under Pep and Pogba has gone backwards under Mourinho.
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What a player.
 
Mciahel Goodman said:
Seems to me like a comparison between Xavi/Iniesta and Gerrard (his best position was on the right during that season they came second, iirc, like an opposite Pogba, and no, I'm not saying Pogba is as good as Gerrard was... yet).

De Bruyne is a weird player. Excellent in defense, incredible in attack. I hate City but he's a hard player to dislike. Could be one of the best in PL history. Pogba could be too, and I think he will, but they have different attributes. Pogba has physicality and pace, more trickery in terms of beating players. De Bruyne is just supremely intelligent, also deceptively physical in terms of shrugging off challenges.. The Xavi/Iniesta comparison may be off, but it's hard to think who he's similar to.

I do think Pogba's long passing will prove to be better over the course of their careers, and Pogba will be remembered as the more dynamic of the two. This may seem out of place based off this season and last, but just a feeling that Pogba will come good and win POTY at least once or twice, possibly more.

tl;dr

Both superb players, de Bruyne is the better of the two at the moment, but don't write Pogba off. He'll come good.
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De Bruyne is like Lampard with pace. Or Lampard with Gerrards legs and crossing ability. Due to his previous as a wide midfielder I feel he has the ability to go past players with pace and energy as well as put in excellent deliveries, but he is more Lampard in that he does the final ball and goal scoring from range, as opposed to tracking back making last ditch tackles.

I also don't believe Pogba will win a POTY. It usually goes to attacking players and even while the main guy at Juve, Bonucci won it. I feel he would need to be perfect to win it as a midfielder or post absurd numbers.
 
Synco said:
First of all, I've been a big fan of De Bruyne since his Bremen days, believe me that I don't have to be convinced of his talent or achievements. It's also obvious that this season so far KDB plays at a level that has not been reached before by either Pogba or him, Balon d'Or top 3 with Messi & Neymar imo.

My whole point was that there's a hyperbolic tendency in the KDB/Pogba comparison (for several reasons), and that the claim that talent-wise or performance-wise it had "not even been a contest" throughout their careers is an example of this.
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Well it is a contest and one that Kev is currently getting on top in.
Pogba has the fundementals to be right up there but he's not currently got the work ethic or the desire to take hold of a game like some players have (KDB and Sanchez are two of them) and this will hold him back.
Maybe Jose will sit him down and school him to show him what he needs to do to be the player he can be or maybe Pogba will go his own way and remain a nearly man (as a previous poster compared him to Mad Mario).
 
Gentleman Jim said:
Well it is a contest and one that Kev is currently getting on top in.
Pogba has the fundementals to be right up there but he's not currently got the work ethic or the desire to take hold of a game like some players have (KDB and Sanchez are two of them) and this will hold him back.
Maybe Jose will sit him down and school him to show him what he needs to do to be the player he can be or maybe Pogba will go his own way and remain a nearly man (as a previous poster compared him to Mad Mario).
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If anyone compares Pogba to Balotelli they should be banned for being so stupid.

Pogba has work ethic, he has everything in his locker, that doesn't make him the player he isn't.
 
Gentleman Jim said:
Well it is a contest and one that Kev is currently getting on top in.
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Which is what I said too, both parts.
Gentleman Jim said:
Pogba has the fundementals to be right up there but he's not currently got the work ethic or the desire to take hold of a game like some players have (KDB and Sanchez are two of them) and this will hold him back.
Maybe Jose will sit him down and school him to show him what he needs to do to be the player he can be or maybe Pogba will go his own way and remain a nearly man (as a previous poster compared him to Mad Mario).
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Reducing individual performances to "mentality" mostly strikes me as nonsense, and that Balotelli comparison somewhat confirms that. Besides, I thought Pogba has mostly been good to very good this season up until the last few games, so I already disagree with the main presumption many people here make.
 
Pogba at his best offers you ~70% of Kante and ~70% of Ozil at the same time(Kante's ability to be everywhere and win the ball back+Ozil's attacking creativity and impact). He's an absolutely ridiculous player. That said, De Bruyne right now is better, and he's better than Pogba's ever been. But Pogba's younger. I think he might yet reach that level too. But one thing he will never be, he'll never be the creative force that is De Bruyne. He just doesn't have it
 
Hammondo said:
How would you know if we tried to play possession football? we couldn't even if we tried our best. There is very little difference in the outcome if we did or did not.
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Mourinho's MO is big games.

Don _ Conte said:
So Sanchez never used to look for the runs in behind at arsenal (which is a lie obviously), also don't KDB assists at Wolfsburg before he was in this "system" that makes him so great, beat anything pogba has created in a season and he was playing in a much better team?

You don't need to give credit to KDB, as you will notice in this thread there is literally only united Fans even entertaining the thought that KDB isn't a better passer than pogba, which always says something when every neutral fan knows KDB is superior.
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I give credit where credit is due. However, Pogba is playing at a position he isn't comfortable with.

Going with your logic of every neutral fans. So, since Pogba was voted by his peers as best (insert award he won, which i forgot), that makes your point redundant?

padr81 said:
No mate you're spouting bollocks. Giving the ball and letting the opposition dominate the game is being dominated. Everyones wrong but the Jose lovers, he let City dominate the game an it backfired like his cowardice does more often then not vs Pep.

"The goals were scruffy and Jose won't believe they've conceded two goals from set pieces, but not many teams have come here in the last 25 or 30 years and dominated like that." - Gary Neville

Madrid under Jose were defensively excellent, ffs, do you know anything about football?

Inter vs Barca was one win in one leg and then hanging on by the skin of their teeth in a second leg that they lost. RM vs Bayern? Now whose cherry picking?

20 games, 4 wins, one of which against half a city team in the league cup. 1 win in 5 for the master of the counter attack against Pep. Why is his record so bad, even he tried to say it was false?
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No mate, you're the one full of shit. So, by your silly logic, every team that sets up to play on the counter is dominated? LOL.

I've watch more football than you ever had mate. LOL!!!

I was cherry picking? I said counter attacking teams beats Pep. I gave you few examples. Notice the "s". You gave me one.
 
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