Paulo Dybala

Sayros said:
Honestly, people using his current form as a beating stick for his overall value as a player are being a bit harsh.

It's a major adjustment to play with CR7, who can be a black-hole for other offensive players. We've seen with Benzema the difference between how he plays with and without him.

I think Dybala is a gamble that's worth the risk. However, if it's at the cost of losing Pogba then you're not really making any progress and it's a lateral move at best.
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One the bolded, how so?

Step away for a second from the idea that we simply replace one big-name player with another. The fact is Pogba hasn't really worked out for us even though he is undoubtedly a very good player. Therefore Dybala is a lateral move "at worst". If he doesn't work out, we're no different to where we are now. If it does work out and he makes our attack click, we're considerably better off.
 
MadMike said:
One the bolded, how so?

Step away for a second from the idea that we simply replace one big-name player with another. The fact is Pogba hasn't really worked out for us even though he is undoubtedly a very good player. Therefore Dybala is a lateral move "at worst". If he doesn't work out, we're no different to where we are now. If it does work out and he makes our attack click, we're considerably better off.
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And how is your offense going to click with Dybala and no Pogba behind him? As far as Pogba not having worked out for you, he has been pretty consistently your best player. His stats are way above average for a CM. Now, I get it, if the results don't follow or if he goes missing in the big games, it's a valid criticism but it doesn't equate him not working out. Pogba is a key piece to becoming a winner again, but it's not going to work with guys like Matic and Herrera/Fred or guys like Lukaku/Rashford/Martial up front. Pogba is A piece, not THE piece, and neither is Dybala. To get one just to lose the other is silly, especially if the two appreciate and enjoy playing with one another given their history. And I completely disagree that it's a lateral move at worst, it could very well get worse with just Dybala and no Pogba.
 
Judas said:
Same people saying we shouldn’t sign him will be moaning like mad if one of our rivals got him.
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I wouldn't care. Although if he does go to a rival and starts banging in goals, I'll moan.
 
Can't we utilise him in an Aguero/Firmino role? All round forward but also getting in 'wingers' who contribute heavily. He's surely going to be better than Rashford, and Lukaku is next to useless anyway. Would be one of our best bets for doing this kind of switch properly, would he not? A first step to a heavily improved attack.
A young but quality right sided player added and we're nearly there. We could see how Sanchez fares in the new setup then get the left side sorted the transfer window after if he's the same.
 
MadMike said:
One the bolded, how so?

Step away for a second from the idea that we simply replace one big-name player with another. The fact is Pogba hasn't really worked out for us even though he is undoubtedly a very good player. Therefore Dybala is a lateral move "at worst". If he doesn't work out, we're no different to where we are now. If it does work out and he makes our attack click, we're considerably better off.
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He's head and shoulders above the other players on the pitch even when he's not at this best. Most number of assists and goals if I'm not mistaken and if there are stats like chances created etc, I'm sure he'd be topping them too. If he's a case of it 'not working out', we need 11 new players.
 
Wonderful player. Very good as a forward, a false nine and on the right. He is also very good at making play, something that can not be said of any of our forwards (bar sanchez...). A front 3 of Martial Dybala and Rashford would be a nightmare for defenders especially on the counter. He has been sacrificed in role to make way for Ronaldo and that's a shame, but maybe it's to be to our advantage.

His playmaking ability in the false 9/nr 10 would also relieve some of the pressure of of Pogba so that we don't expect everything from him all the time.

If he is available he should be our main priority along with a defensively solid and offensively capable right back (Meunier?).
 
Varun said:
He's head and shoulders above the other players on the pitch even when he's not at this best. Most number of assists and goals if I'm not mistaken and if there are stats like chances created etc, I'm sure he'd be topping them too. If he's a case of it 'not working out', we need 11 new players.
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It's just incredible to read some of the things about Pogba on here at times. Some want to say it's misleading stats because of the overall performance and results, but GOOD LUCK finding another midfielder that would have those numbers in this team.
 
Sayros said:
And how is your offense going to click with Dybala and no Pogba behind him? As far as Pogba not having worked out for you, he has been pretty consistently your best player. His stats are way above average for a CM. Now, I get it, if the results don't follow or if he goes missing in the big games, it's a valid criticism but it doesn't equate him not working out. Pogba is a key piece to becoming a winner again, but it's not going to work with guys like Matic and Herrera/Fred or guys like Lukaku/Rashford/Martial up front. Pogba is A piece, not THE piece, and neither is Dybala. To get one just to lose the other is silly, especially if the two appreciate and enjoy playing with one another given their history. And I completely disagree that it's a lateral move at worst, it could very well get worse with just Dybala and no Pogba.
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On the bolded, because certain players work in certain teams and others don't. Simple as.

Pogba has his own problems unrelated to the others around him. On Pogba's first season here Herrera, who supposedly ain't good enough for Pogba to work with, was far the superior player and voted player of the season with a better output and work than Pogba. Pogba flattered to deceive and his best season (this one) is actually the club's worst.

The problem with Pogba is he's neither focused enough to be a CM over a season (does silly dribbles on his own half and fails to track players) neither is he productive enough to be a #10 or forward. Leaving stats aside the problems are clear when you see him. He requires "accommodation" in a way few other players do.

We've been talking for 3 years about what's the best position for Pogba and how to get the best out of him and we still haven't answered that. Which tells you how much he's worked out.

Varun said:
He's head and shoulders above the other players on the pitch even when he's not at this best. Most number of assists and goals if I'm not mistaken and if there are stats like chances created etc, I'm sure he'd be topping them too. If he's a case of it 'not working out', we need 11 new players.
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Half his goals are pens. But besides that you can't have 11 players of +100m value and on 300k pw. He's not on the same expectation level as Scott McT. And like I said before it's not even about the stats. He can do great stuff on occasion but regularly fails to do the basics right and that's the reason why everyone pretty much has doubts about him, his impact on the team and his best position.

I don't really want to derail this thread and make it a Pogba thread though, so I'll refrain from replying to Pogba-related responses. Feel free to quote me on the Pogba thread instead and I'll pick it up there, if you feel like continuing this.
 
He is another one of Pogba's good mates, isn't he? Well if this signing convinces Pogba to stay and allows them both to play together, i don't see why not? The two had a good telepathy and understanding at Juventus and they will enjoy it together again here
 
MadMike said:
On the bolded, because certain players work in certain teams and others don't. Simple as.

Pogba has his own problems unrelated to the others around him. On Pogba's first season here Herrera, who supposedly ain't good enough for Pogba to work with, was far the superior player and voted player of the season with a better output and work than Pogba. Pogba flattered to deceive and his best season (this one) is actually the club's worst.

The problem with Pogba is he's neither focused enough to be a CM over a season (does silly dribbles on his own half and fails to track players) neither is he productive enough to be a #10 or forward. Leaving stats aside the problems are clear when you see him. He requires "accommodation" in a way few other players do.

We've been talking for 3 years about what's the best position for Pogba and how to get the best out of him and we still haven't answered that. Which tells you how much he's worked out.



Half his goals are pens. But besides that you can't have 11 players of +100m value and on 300k pw. He's not on the same expectation level as Scott McT. And like I said before it's not even about the stats. He can do great stuff on occasion but regularly fails to do the basics right and that's the reason why everyone pretty much has doubts about him, his impact on the team and his best position.

I don't really want to derail this thread and make it a Pogba thread though, so I'll refrain from replying to Pogba-related responses. Feel free to quote me on the Pogba thread instead and I'll pick it up there, if you feel like continuing this.
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I think you want the perfect player and they don't exist. You have to take some of the stupid decisions Pogba takes with dribbling to get the moments of brilliance where he actually pulls it off and follows it up with a goal or a magical assist. You have to accept that, at times, he won't be doing the basics right and there should be other players far more limited in creativity but more industrial and defensive to cover for that, along with a solid defense. There's no player that brings nothing but positives without some drawbacks. You're focusing your entire attention on how Pogba isn't working out because the team hasn't figured out how to best use him, etc....but what is working out in this team? I mean, I'm genuinely asking, what is one thing you can point to on this team, across the field, that has worked out this season? Or the season before? Or the one before that? If you want to throw away your best player because you're so certain that there's something better along the way, you're in for a rude awakening, especially with no CL next season, no one who can do a better job from the center of the field is going to rush over to work out for this team (if even such a player actually exists or is even remotely available).

Pogba is the only player that belongs on a contender right now in your team, he has shown it in the short-term with France at the WC, he has shown it in the long-term at Juventus before without being THE star in either scenarios. This is a long-term project to become a contender, and Pogba is a part of it; nothing more, nothing less.

Fair enough, this is a Dybala thread after all. Sorry for the derailment, but this stuff is mind-blowing to me.
 
VeevaVee said:
Can't we utilise him in an Aguero/Firmino role? All round forward but also getting in 'wingers' who contribute heavily. He's surely going to be better than Rashford, and Lukaku is next to useless anyway. Would be one of our best bets for doing this kind of switch properly, would he not? A first step to a heavily improved attack.
A young but quality right sided player added and we're nearly there. We could see how Sanchez fares in the new setup then get the left side sorted the transfer window after if he's the same.
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It’s kinda how I envisaged how he’d play too, especially if we want to utilize pacy wide forwards
 
Sayros said:
It's just incredible to read some of the things about Pogba on here at times. Some want to say it's misleading stats because of the overall performance and results, but GOOD LUCK finding another midfielder that would have those numbers in this team.
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Yeah its sad how all the fans have turned against Pogba. The amount of chances he creates which are not taken by our players is staggering. Could have easily had 5-10 assists more if he had a clinical striker in front of him. Tbh he only has himself to blame, the constant flirting with Real might work for clubs like Arsenal or Chelsea but wont work here at OT.
 
Sayros said:
It's just incredible to read some of the things about Pogba on here at times. Some want to say it's misleading stats because of the overall performance and results, but GOOD LUCK finding another midfielder that would have those numbers in this team.
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It's actually a worse move. No point buying some shiny new attackers just as you get rid of the creative midfield that's supposed to supply them.
 
Sayros said:
It's just incredible to read some of the things about Pogba on here at times. Some want to say it's misleading stats because of the overall performance and results, but GOOD LUCK finding another midfielder that would have those numbers in this team.
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To be fair, we don’t need those numbers from a CM. Especially one who compromises the stability of the side tactically more often than not.

It’s horses for courses, but I would much rather us buy some proper attackers and shore up the midfield with players who can actually control a match.
 
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I see him at PSG to be honest. If he moves to the PL, i can only see City or Pool. Spurs and Arsenal dont have the money and not sure Chelsea and United would interest him at the moment. Real and Barca dont want him either

Unless City, Pool or PSG come out of nowhere, i think staying at Juve might be on the cards, unless they want him desperately out and he would look for a new club. That would increase our chances
 
abdo99 said:
It's actually a worse move. No point buying some shiny new attackers just as you get rid of the creative midfield that's supposed to supply them.
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Exactly! Dybala is a player to go after if there's any chance to get him, but that move should never include letting Pogba go, especially because it's Dybala.

The Nani said:
To be fair, we don’t need those numbers from a CM. Especially one who comprimises the stability of the side tactically more often than not.

It’s horses for courses, but I would much rather us buy some proper attackers and shore up the midfield with players who can actually control a match.
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Again, Pogba is far from being the main culprit of compromising the stability of the side tactically (whatever those tactics are, I haven't figured it out in three years and neither have the players).

Fair enough if it's about the supposed flirting with Real Madrid, etc...fair enough, but if we're talking strictly football and what a player can bring to a team, I can't really take too seriously any opinion that thinks getting rid of Pogba is a good idea to start with. You can shore up the midfield in any way you want, as long as Pogba is part of that midfield. If you can, somehow, shore up the attackers first, and get a decent midfield, and actual elite defenders in the back and Pogba is still a tactical imbalance, then you move him, but in the unlikeliest scenario that United managed to shore all that up, I'm fairly certain the idea of selling Pogba by then will be seen as blasphemous because the positives he can bring in a balanced team outweigh the negative.

And yeah, why would you want your only creative player to have great stats in goals, assists, and chance created? If this is the conversation we're having about Pogba now, I can't imagine what it would be like if he was performing like those other stable midfielders in this team, or where the goals would even come from for the forwards. Get a proper defense, get some forwards who can control, hold up, and finish with decent movement, and let's see if Pogba is a tactical liability or an actual asset.

Dybala is a step in the right direction if Juventus are silly enough to let him go, the club should do everything to get him. It won't guarantee top 4 without a proper defense first, but it's actual progress because Dybala brings a lot to the table that the other forwards don't have in his hold up, skills, and vision. I would love to see him and Pogba play together again.
 
The Nani said:
To be fair, we don’t need those numbers from a CM. Especially one who compromises the stability of the side tactically more often than not.

It’s horses for courses, but I would much rather us buy some proper attackers and shore up the midfield with players who can actually control a match.
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. Why is United fans the only one that doesn't want to add quality to quality just like any ambitious club does? Pogba sale is actually a real possibility and if he decided to go we must replace with 2/3 mid but whoever came in is certain to be downgrade without even starting to address the actual holes in the team. very confusing to me why fans is so certain pogba is this conundrum that must be removed. Dybala will just take his place as the CAF new scapegoat next year I could already see it.
 
If this goes through (Big big IF) I can see it being another flop. No doubt he's got talent but this just feels like the next major signing coming for the wrong reasons who will probably disappear 1 games in every 2.
 
Nou_Camp99 said:
If this goes through (Big big IF) I can see it being another flop. No doubt he's got talent but this just feels like the next major signing coming for the wrong reasons who will probably disappear 1 games in every 2.
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My worry is that we don't have the structure to allow someone like Dybala to succeed.

One week he's playing alongside Ronaldo, D.Costa, Pjanic, Sandro, next week he's playing alongside Young, Lingard and Matic while Jones is two footing him in training...
 
Sayros said:
Again, Pogba is far from being the main culprit of compromising the stability of the side tactically (whatever those tactics are, I haven't figured it out in three years and neither have the players).

Fair enough if it's about the supposed flirting with Real Madrid, etc...fair enough, but if we're talking strictly football and what a player can bring to a team, I can't really take too seriously any opinion that thinks getting rid of Pogba is a good idea to start with. You can shore up the midfield in any way you want, as long as Pogba is part of that midfield. If you can, somehow, shore up the attackers first, and get a decent midfield, and actual elite defenders in the back and Pogba is still a tactical imbalance, then you move him, but in the unlikeliest scenario that United managed to shore all that up, I'm fairly certain the idea of selling Pogba by then will be seen as blasphemous because the positives he can bring in a balanced team outweigh the negative.

And yeah, why would you want your only creative player to have great stats in goals, assists, and chance created? If this is the conversation we're having about Pogba now, I can't imagine what it would be like if he was performing like those other stable midfielders in this team, or where the goals would even come from for the forwards. Get a proper defense, get some forwards who can control, hold up, and finish with decent movement, and let's see if Pogba is a tactical liability or an actual asset.

Dybala is a step in the right direction if Juventus are silly enough to let him go, the club should do everything to get him. It won't guarantee top 4 without a proper defense first, but it's actual progress because Dybala brings a lot to the table that the other forwards don't have in his hold up, skills, and vision. I would love to see him and Pogba play together again.
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Of course optimally I would love to add Dybala and other needed improvements to a side including a committed Pogba. I never said otherwise. I'm just saying we can replace him in the aggregate more easily than most seem to think. Like going from no quality attackers to two. Or God forbid maybe even three.

The simple fact of the matter is couldn't give two shits about Pogba at this point. His inconsistency along with his lack of commitment make his potential departure an opportunity to further retool a failing team.

If you don't wanna take such an opinion seriously, fine. But I'm done wasting brain power even worrying about the guy aside from getting a good price from Madrid. And this is the Dybala thread.

abdo99 said:
. Why is United fans the only one that doesn't want to add quality to quality just like any ambitious club does? Pogba sale is actually a real possibility and if he decided to go we must replace with 2/3 mid but whoever came in is certain to be downgrade without even starting to address the actual holes in the team. very confusing to me why fans is so certain pogba is this conundrum that must be removed. Dybala will just take his place as the CAF new scapegoat next year I could already see it.
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I might be more worried about it if we were losing consistent quality. But Pogba simply hasn't been consistent or committed. Again, I don't care to discuss him at all. Never mind in this thread.
 
abdo99 said:
It's actually a worse move. No point buying some shiny new attackers just as you get rid of the creative midfield that's supposed to supply them.
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I kinda think there's no point not buying better players just because of this mindset though. We'll never improve otherwise. We have to buy enough players in one window to make a decent difference though. We can afford Dybala and Sancho, plus Brandt's release, plus Meunier's. That's 'only' £250m spent, which should be plenty doable, especially if Lukaku and Martial leave, and especially especially if Pogba does.
 
::sonny:: said:
Veron, Heinze, Tevez, Di Maria, Rojo, Romero

No thanks
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What's wrong with Tevez and Romero? Yes Tevez sold us out to our close rivals for more money like a cnut, but he was class for us. In fact, exactly the sort of forward we need right now. Romero was one of our best buys recently all things considered.
 
Lennon7 said:
What's wrong with Tevez and Romero? Yes Tevez sold us out to our close rivals for more money like a cnut, but he was class for us. In fact, exactly the sort of forward we need right now. Romero was one of our best buys recently all things considered.
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By definition then he wasn't class for us at all

Whether how Tevez left the club was his 'fault' or not the point remains the same, our record with Argie's isn't good and he is another example of that

And while you can argue whether the way he left the club was his doing or not you shouldn't forget how he acted at City either, going AWOL for months

Dybala regardless of nationality is another Galatico signing that'll go the exact same way they all have. No no no no NO!!!
 
izec said:
I see him at PSG to be honest. If he moves to the PL, i can only see City or Pool. Spurs and Arsenal dont have the money and not sure Chelsea and United would interest him at the moment. Real and Barca dont want him either

Unless City, Pool or PSG come out of nowhere, i think staying at Juve might be on the cards, unless they want him desperately out and he would look for a new club. That would increase our chances
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None of these options mentioned, bar Chelsea perhaps, make any sense.

I thought PSG had FFP troubles and can't sign expensive players after splashing on Neymar and Mbappe. Also where would he fit? He's not a Cavani target-man to play on the tip of a 4-3-3.

Pool's attack is also settled for first teamers. They might need some depth but they won't splash 100m on depth. City have Aguero and Jesus. Their priorities are in CM and LB, so I don't see that either.
 
Dybala's been pictured in London, meeting Ed maybe?

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