[MadMike]

Mourinho is being stubborn for sticking with this 4-2-3-1 rubbish. Pogba isn't a happy player I sense and like another poster mentioned it's no different to playing KDB at DM. How you can you put your main creative asset in a defensive role? Just look at the freedom he had against Everton compared to today. That is 100% Mourinho's fault.

He's playing CM. It's not a majorly defensive role. KDB has to do a shit load of tracking and defensive work in Pep's system. But it's easier to blame Mourinho than the player I guess.

 

[edgar allan]

He always walks with a limp so I'm not reading too much into that.

He looked in pieces when he was on the bench. Something isn't right.

Looked like he was suffering from a bruised ego?

 

[Synco]

KDB is only older than him by 2 years and he's one of the main reasons City are clicking.

We should be expecting Pogba to put similar performances to him and lift our team as KDB do.

You're treating the player/team relationship as a one-way route here, which is why the expectations expressed in the second sentence are illusionary to me. I don't think any midfielder can consistently deliver KDB-level displays outside of a well-oiled attacking machine like Guardiola's City team (closest might perhaps be a fully fit Modric). Seems not even De Bruyne himself can do that, judging by the difference in his displays for Belgium and City.

 

[Neilwij]

He had a poor game today but i think he needs to play further up the pitch in games. Playing him in a 2 man midfield just doesnt work.

For me mourinho should not just try to play martial, lingard, sanchez, pogba and lukaku all at the same time he needs to drop one of them and play 433 if he wants to get the best out of pogba otherwise we just get overrun in midfield.

 

[el3mel]

You're treating the player/team relationship as a one-way route here, which is why the expectations expressed in the second sentence are illusionary to me. I don't think any midfielder can consistently deliver KDB-level level displays outside of a well-oiled attacking machine like Guardiola's City team (closest might perhaps be a fully fit Modric). Seems not even De Bruyne himself can do that, judging by the difference in his displays for Belgium and City.

KDB is one of the main reasons that Pep's well-oiled machine is working, not the opposite. Pogba should be doing the same for us. Expecting that from him is fair enough.

 

[Synco]

KDB is one of the main reasons that Pep's well-oiled machine is working, not the opposite. Pogba should be doing the same for us. Expecting that from him is fair enough.

Well, that is what I'm questioning. It's a symbiosis of a great player and a stellar team. Diminish one factor and you won't have the same result in terms of individual performance.

 

[el3mel]

Well, that is what I'm questioning. It's a symbiosis of a great player and a stellar team. Diminish one factor and you won't have the same result in terms of individual performance.

You're not getting my point. The great team is formed on the basis of great players, not that that great players are performing because of a great team. Players form the team. KDB is doing it for City, we need Pogba to do it with us.

He has been doing well for most of the season but something seems off since that Spurs game.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

He can’t be played alongside Matic, as a DM, and then be criticised for poor performances. It’s not his position. Why not play to his strengths? He is that good.

 

[Synco]

You're not getting my point. The great team is formed on the basis of great players, not that that great players are performing because of a great team. Players form the team. KDB is doing it for City, we need Pogba to do it with us.

I'm getting it, I just don't agree. To me it's obviously both, as I said: a symbiosis. The KDB/Belgium argument was an attempt to highlight this: same player, lower level of collective play -> lower individual output.

He has been doing well for most of the season but something seems off since that Spurs game.

Agree with this. Didn't see today's game, but a drop off was noticable as of late.

 

[el3mel]

I'm getting it, I just don't agree. To me it's obviously both, as I said: a symbiosis. The KDB/Belgium argument was an attempt to highlight this: same player, lower level of collective play -> lower individual output.

Agree with this. Didn't see today's game, but a drop off was noticable as of late.

Let's agree to disagree then.

 

[Synco]

Let's agree to disagree then.

Okay, no problem.

 

[Mercurial]

Pogba is a superstar, we have greater problem areas than Pogba in the team, it makes no logical sense to stir an argument from the perspective of Mourinho.

 

[Adnan]

So it's a crap video.

I think that was pretty clear with what the Journo tweeted.

 

[gaucho_10]

Maybe in your imagination, he's overhyped and overrated by modern day football hipsters. Pogba has achieved so much more than him so far.
Put Pogba in Barca or Real midfield and he would be hailed as the worlds greatest midfielder.

Pogba doesn't work for your team. He doesn't get stuck in (key issue) and doesn't know how to defend. He also doesn't have the intelligence to lead the team on the pitch. He's got the flashy moves but I've got friends at our five a side team with flashier moves then his. Them alone mean nothing.

He is a limited system player, like Kroos. He can't play in midfield two, he can't do this, he can't do that. Modric is the ultimate midfielder. He can play anything as showed in Madrid, CDM in 3 man midfield or on the side where he usually plays. He can play as playmaker in double pivot or even as a CAM. He's better then Pogba and Kroos combined so no, Pogba would never come close to Modric even if he played at Madrid. He just doesn't have it in him.
De Bruyne works hard for his team. He is a tean player and that alone makes him twice the player Pogba is right now.

 

[Ban]

I think that was pretty clear with what the Journo tweeted.

He tweeted a video in which it doesn't show he's limping.

 

[edgar allan]

Pogba doesn't work for your team. He doesn't get stuck in (key issue) and doesn't know how to defend. He also doesn't have the intelligence to lead the team on the pitch. He's got the flashy moves but I've got friends at our five a side team with flashier moves then his. Them alone mean nothing.

He is a limited system player, like Kroos. He can't play in midfield two, he can't do this, he can't do that. Modric is the ultimate midfielder. He can play anything as showed in Madrid, CDM in 3 man midfield or on the side where he usually plays. He can play as playmaker in double pivot or even as a CAM. He's better then Pogba and Kroos combined so no, Pogba would never come close to Modric even if he played at Madrid. He just doesn't have it in him.
De Bruyne works hard for his team. He is a tean player and that alone makes him twice the player Pogba is right now.

Sadly I think that Pogba is proving this true.

 

[GM K]

Now I am seeing it more clearly.

Pogba is an artist at heart, an entertainer, a showman.

KDB is a craftsman, a technician and a competitor.

Pogba wants to give you art on the pitch. KDB wants to win, period.

Pogba thinks a lot about his looks and how he is perceived . KDB cares less. He is ruthless and always desperate for the killer pass or run or strike.

I am convinced Pogba is more talented but KDB is more hungry. As things stand, if you were in a ring and about to fight, the guy you will want at your ringside is KDB simply because he is a guy who just wants to get on with it and knock your opponent out.

And this is coming from a big fan of Pogba. There was a one-two months period after his injury when Pogba played so differently. It's like he had cut off the excesses and showmanship from his game. He looked changed. More efficient, more imposing on games. When I saw that, I said to people, "this guy will be totally unstoppable. No one will be able to touch him." Unfortunately, the kid looks like he has gone back to type.

 

[Adnan]

He tweeted a video in which it doesn't show he's limping.

He alluded to that in his tweet.

 

[Devil81]

Get a solid midfielder alongside Matic and give Pogba complete freedom to express himself. That's what I think we need to do with him otherwise we may as well cash our chips and move him on.

He's not interested in playing a restricted midfield role.

 

[royboy16]

at around minute 34:18 in the first half i had the impression i saw him bend over and touch his leg. it looked like he pulled/felt something on his left leg

may @GifLord could work his magic and capture the moment?

Sky also said in the first half that he gave the thumbs up to mourinho to say he was ok.

 

[edgar allan]

Get a solid midfielder alongside Matic and give Pogba complete freedom to express himself. That's what I think we need to do with him otherwise we may as well cash our chips and move him on.

He's not interested in playing a restricted midfield role.

Well he wasn't interested full stop today.
If he doesn't show a positive response to today's abject performance then I would drop him from the team until he does.

 

[Rista]

He is a limited system player, like Kroos. He can't play in midfield two, he can't do this, he can't do that. Modric is the ultimate midfielder. He can play anything as showed in Madrid, CDM in 3 man midfield or on the side where he usually plays. He can play as playmaker in double pivot or even as a CAM. He's better then Pogba and Kroos combined so no, Pogba would never come close to Modric even if he played at Madrid. He just doesn't have it in him.

I agree with this. A great midfielder should be able to play anywhere in midfield. It's not like Pogba is being asked to do flying tackles and being judged on that. If he really needs to play in a very specific position in a specific system with specific players around him, then the calls for Mourinho to build his entire team and system around him are a bit bizarre unless getting the best out of a single player is our only goal.

 

[Jeffthered]

Now I am seeing it more clearly.

Pogba is an artist at heart, an entertainer, a showman.

KDB is a craftsman, a technician and a competitor.

Pogba wants to give you art on the pitch. KDB wants to win, period.

Pogba thinks a lot about his looks and how he is perceived . KDB cares less. He is ruthless and always desperate for the killer pass or run or strike.

I am convinced Pogba is more talented but KDB is more hungry. As things stand, if you were in a ring and about to fight, the guy you will want at your ringside is KDB simply because he is a guy who just wants to get on with it and knock your opponent out.

And this is coming from a big fan of Pogba. There was a one-two months period after his injury when Pogba played so differently. It's like he had cut off the excesses and showmanship from his game. He looked changed. More efficient, more imposing on games. When I saw that, I said to people, "this guy will be totally unstoppable. No one will be able to touch him." Unfortunately, the kid looks like he has gone back to type.

Steady on. KDB is paying at the top of his game, in a superbly managed, and well-drilled side. Remember, Pep moved KDB's role in the team.... he is a creative warhorse for City. And look at the players around him, AND that is before we look at the coach. Pogba is playing for a team that has no real system of breaking teams down; his coach is still in 2008 with Drogba, and Damian Duff; our attacking players are simply not of the same quality as the teams around us, and our defence has been the best side of our game.

Mourino is strangling the creative talent out of many, many players at United. And why should we be surprised? Ask KDB? Ask Arjen Robben? Ask Salah? Pogba in a two man midfield does NOT get the best out of him.. everyone else can see it except the 'special one'. For Juve, for France, Paul Pogba isd a majestic, creative powerhouse... a joy to watch, unique, beautiful and fun. Course he is a competitor. Put Pogba in that Real team. The Barca team. The Man City team... you will see him in all his footballing glory.

But at United with Mourinho? You have nothing more that moments... Everton away, Arsenal away etc.. the guy looks like he is playing a different game.

Mourinho is not getting the best out of any of the attackers in the team. It's all about him. He is taking this squad backwards, people can see it, we watch it, we observe it. Everyone can see it.

 

[Full bodied red]

Get a solid midfielder alongside Matic and give Pogba complete freedom to express himself. That's what I think we need to do with him otherwise we may as well cash our chips and move him on.

He's not interested in playing a restricted midfield role.

Awww....Diddums, PaulyPauly....

The guy needs a wake up with a kick up the arse and a month on the Subs' Bench, or a ticket back to Turin.

I'd happily trade him for a good Right Winger if he won't cut out the self-centred hype and simply put in the effort everyone should put in when they have the priveledge to wear our shirt.

 

[AP88]

I agree that Pogba has a beautiful touch....and that he's a joy to watch sometimes....but I don't think he's effective enough to justify the hype.

I can't help but see Veron when I watch him.

It could be argued that Veron was the most 'talented' in the midfield of 2001-2003, despite it including Giggs, Scholes, Keane and Beckham. He could do things with the ball that they couldn't, but ultimately they each contributed more relevant, decisive things in assistance to the team, and that's how I see Pogba now; a misfit.

A midfield base of an energetic ball winner and Matic offer the perfect platform for 3 attaching midfielders behind Lukaku to be destructive. Accommodating Pogba either sabotages those foundations, or sacrifices one of the creative players ahead of them; he's neither consistent enough in his passing or defensive work to justify playing deep, or productive enough to play in the final third.

It might take another season or two of underwhelming performances for everyone else to realise, but I'll live and die by my opinion of him now.

Matic is the key this season, potentially a title-winning catalyst for the stability and balance he provides.

Looked like he was suffering from a bruised ego?

The illusion is shattered with him; he’s a mercenary who sulks when he isn’t utilised exactly how he wants to be.

He’s a supremely talented superb athlete with all of the tools to dominate the Premier League in the same way Vieira did, but he’s also a lazy coward who’s reputation eclipses his impact. He’s Veron 2.0.

Neymar is only passing though Paris, so they’ll have the cash and desire to acquire another glamorous mercenary in the summer - perfect opportunity to offload him and give Mourinho players tailored to his system.

If he’s putting in 110% but simply falling short in effectiveness, then you can question José’s tactics and utilisation of him, but while he’s downing tools because he hasn’t got his own way, it’s unacceptable and he should take his circus act elsewhere.

 

[AP88]

Awww....Diddums, PaulyPauly....

The guy needs a wake up with a kick up the arse and a month on the Subs' Bench, or a ticket back to Turin.

I'd happily trade him for a good Right Winger if he won't cut out the self-centred hype and simply put in the effort everyone should put in when they have the priveledge to wear our shirt.

Agree - a few proper midfielders, a right winger and another 10 would be more useful instead. It’s cringeworthy how people appear to be Pogba > Jose and United, when he’s done feck all for the club to justify such obsession.

 

[hn4manunited]

Get a solid midfielder alongside Matic and give Pogba complete freedom to express himself. That's what I think we need to do with him otherwise we may as well cash our chips and move him on.

He's not interested in playing a restricted midfield role.

What a load of nonsense! What restricted midfield role??? It is called box-to-box. It is the least restricted role on the pitch!!! You go the entire length of the pitch where the ball goes! It’s simply a lazy excuse to call that restrictive! Every player has defensive duties. Do you not see City players defending? I would say they defend with more intensity than attacking when they lose possession. Pogba’s got in his head that a superstar can do something flashy, lose the ball, mope and complain and leave the defending to other players of the team. A player can maybe be excused when they do that if they score majority of the team’s goals! Not pogba!!! He is a midfielder!

Also please look over on the previous page. It appears that he was played in a midfield 3 today! I guess it didn’t matter whether it was a 2 or 3. He just isn’t doing his job!

Awww....Diddums, PaulyPauly....

The guy needs a wake up with a kick up the arse and a month on the Subs' Bench, or a ticket back to Turin.

I'd happily trade him for a good Right Winger if he won't cut out the self-centred hype and simply put in the effort everyone should put in when they have the priveledge to wear our shirt.

I agree. If he doesn’t want to fight for his teammates, his manage, this club, and us fans, he can move on and make his millions elsewhere.

 

[Kostov]

I'm not one to advocate for players being bigger than the manager, but Jose either plays him and uses him in a way he is effective or this will get ugly very fast. Pogba can't/won't play in a midfield two, and most of us knew this long ago and it's not like the whole thing is working with any pairing we have.

 

[AndyJ1985]

For me the answer is simple; drop Lingard who is useless 95% of the time, and play a midfield 3 with Pogba the most advanced.

 

[el3mel]

I was thinking in some way he seems to have lost his "untouchability" under Mourinho. He was always completing 90 minutes no matter what, no matter the opposition or the result, but these last 3 games he's getting benched and subbed for "tactical reasons".

 

[Di Maria's angel]

People need to stop with the excuses. The midfield two-three stuff seems like crap. He was perfectly fine in a number of games around his injury and suspension regardless of the midfield numbers. He's dropped off from the Spurs game but that happens, could simply be a dip in form. He's been a little for too complacent and lazy in recent games which isn't helping. He just needs a bollocking from Jose, if not already.

Having shit center backs doesn't help as they do absolutely nothing is moving the ball forward which means Pogba ends of dropping back far more often than you'd want him to. How many times do you see us shifting the ball sideways for about 15 seconds before one or two of our midfielders have to drop back? It's a pain to see anyone of our back four receive the ball as it's so blatantly obvious what they're going to do and I wouldn't be surprised if every team has a tactic to deal with these issues. Play Lindelof or Rojo, at least they're willing to take a risk in getting the ball up field quickly, which means Pogba can be higher up the pitch to be a part of an attack.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

I've defended Pogba a lot but you have to look at things in an honest way.

We paid £90m for him, or near enough, and yet after almost 2 seasons I think it's fair to say he's nowhere near lived up to expectations. I thought he'd cracked it at the start of the season but his form has slowly deteriorated and his last two starts against Spurs and Newcastle he's actually been disgracefully bad.

You can argue he's not being played in his best position but that is no excuse for the way he's just sauntered around the pitch doing feck all. Really feel let down by him.

 

[hn4manunited]

Pogba would have been shite in that game no matter the system (and many other games).

We did play a '3 man midfield'. Several times Lingard was at the edge of our box doing midfield work because Pogba was jogging for the whole game.

People, please read this.

Neville pointed this out in commentary. We played with a midfield three. Lingard wasn’t playing as a forward. Won’t stop the excuses and looking for other people to blame, mind you.

People, please read this!

Also, a 2 or 3 in a midfield two does not mean you can’t play forward and it doesn’t mean you don’t have to defend!

 

[AndyJ1985]

People, please read this.

A midfield 3 that Lingard is a part of may as well not be called a midfield 3. He's as much a CM as Smalling is a full back.

 

[James Peril]

We lack a leader on the pitch, our players don’t seem to give a shit when we lose. Pogba is a maverick, but he is not a tactical leader and he is not a defensive player. I actually think our biggest issue right now is Matic, he seems very average, slow and old. Not controlling anything out there since 2017... played too many games?

 

[iluvoursolskjær]

Pogba doesn't work for your team. He doesn't get stuck in (key issue) and doesn't know how to defend. He also doesn't have the intelligence to lead the team on the pitch. He's got the flashy moves but I've got friends at our five a side team with flashier moves then his. Them alone mean nothing.

He is a limited system player, like Kroos. He can't play in midfield two, he can't do this, he can't do that. Modric is the ultimate midfielder. He can play anything as showed in Madrid, CDM in 3 man midfield or on the side where he usually plays. He can play as playmaker in double pivot or even as a CAM. He's better then Pogba and Kroos combined so no, Pogba would never come close to Modric even if he played at Madrid. He just doesn't have it in him.
De Bruyne works hard for his team. He is a tean player and that alone makes him twice the player Pogba is right now.

Good post.

 

[Ban]

Pogba doesn't work for your team. He doesn't get stuck in (key issue) and doesn't know how to defend. He also doesn't have the intelligence to lead the team on the pitch. He's got the flashy moves but I've got friends at our five a side team with flashier moves then his. Them alone mean nothing.

He is a limited system player, like Kroos. He can't play in midfield two, he can't do this, he can't do that. Modric is the ultimate midfielder. He can play anything as showed in Madrid, CDM in 3 man midfield or on the side where he usually plays. He can play as playmaker in double pivot or even as a CAM. He's better then Pogba and Kroos combined so no, Pogba would never come close to Modric even if he played at Madrid. He just doesn't have it in him.
De Bruyne works hard for his team. He is a tean player and that alone makes him twice the player Pogba is right now.

Good post I'm afraid. Modrić is a complete midfielder. Pogba, although he's talented, is not. And I don't he'll be.

 

[sunama]

He always walks with a limp so I'm not reading too much into that.

He looked in pieces when he was on the bench. Something isn't right.

You are right.
He is playing badly and the manager is benching him for stinking up the place.

 

[sunama]

Sanchez has come in and shown them all what it means to actually play with quality and be a relentless worker throughout the game. I’d be incredibly pissed if I was Sanchez at the moment, the rest of them (bar Lukaku) needed to show so much more today.

I agree that Sanchez' work rate is high (so is Valencia's). But as a senior Galactico class player, he needs to drive his team-mates harder. This is what top class players are able to do. Not only do they perform impressively themselves, but they elevate the performance of those around them.
I think Sanchez should've given Pogba the look he gives, as if it say, "WTF MAN!".

I believe Jose is trying to play Pogba into form, but each time he sucks, he gets subbed after 60 minutes. He doesn't want to give up on Pogba, but at the same time, he can't keep him on the pitch when there are better options on the bench.

 

[eat_grass]

Embarrassing performance from Pogba. His clear lack of effort, and his fake act on the bench all speak very poorly of his character. SAF saw it and shipped him out because of it.

He's not an idiot, though. He knows the media will back him. "He's a special player that needs coddling to truly shine. Set Pogba free! Won't anyone think of his feelings?!" Disgraceful.