How many enemies must you have to need a dog for protection?
Any dog can flip.
Out of control dogs/dog attacks
- Thread starter Solius
- Start date
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c154ne70kzeo
I'm sorry but if you have a dog as big and strong as these around kids then you're thick as shit.
I'm sorry but if you have a dog as big and strong as these around kids then you're thick as shit.
There’s absolutely no need for it. I don’t care how sweet and affectionate they have been raised to be, they have the power in their neck and jaw to rag doll a grown adult and no animal is 100% safe from turning on you. That means they are dangerous, you wouldn’t keep a large cat as a pet because it could kill you so why keep a dog?
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/xl-bully-attack-leaves-scots-34059418
A five-year-old boy has been left with life-changing injuries after he was attacked by an XL Bully.
Little Teddy Kerr has had to have his face reconstructed after the beast tore into his head and body at a house in Paisley.
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Is it only these dogs being reported on?
Boy is lucky to be alive.
A five-year-old boy has been left with life-changing injuries after he was attacked by an XL Bully.
Little Teddy Kerr has had to have his face reconstructed after the beast tore into his head and body at a house in Paisley.
—
Is it only these dogs being reported on?
Boy is lucky to be alive.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/xl-bully-attack-leaves-scots-34059418
A schoolgirl mauled to death by her family's pet dog has been named as Savannah Bentham. The 10-year-old has been hailed as a "wonderful girl" by loved ones. Police confirmed yesterday that the youngster had lost her life following the shocking attack. And today officers confirmed the child'sidentity.
A heartbreaking statement was released through police by her family. It read: "We are utterly shocked and devastated by what happened to Savannah. We can’t believe we have lost our wonderful girl who we love so much. We thank everyone for their support and kindness as we struggle to come to terms with our loss.
—
A schoolgirl mauled to death by her family's pet dog has been named as Savannah Bentham. The 10-year-old has been hailed as a "wonderful girl" by loved ones. Police confirmed yesterday that the youngster had lost her life following the shocking attack. And today officers confirmed the child'sidentity.
A heartbreaking statement was released through police by her family. It read: "We are utterly shocked and devastated by what happened to Savannah. We can’t believe we have lost our wonderful girl who we love so much. We thank everyone for their support and kindness as we struggle to come to terms with our loss.
—
I feel incredibly sorry for that girl. What a gruesome and terrible death.https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/xl-bully-attack-leaves-scots-34059418
A schoolgirl mauled to death by her family's pet dog has been named as Savannah Bentham. The 10-year-old has been hailed as a "wonderful girl" by loved ones. Police confirmed yesterday that the youngster had lost her life following the shocking attack. And today officers confirmed the child'sidentity.
A heartbreaking statement was released through police by her family. It read: "We are utterly shocked and devastated by what happened to Savannah. We can’t believe we have lost our wonderful girl who we love so much. We thank everyone for their support and kindness as we struggle to come to terms with our loss.
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For the parents however, I reserve the same amount of sympathy they would get, If they had thrown their daughter into a tiger enclosure. God forsaken dimwits.
I find it absurd each and every time, having a dog that can kill your child in the blink of an eye as your pet. When it goes wrong it is not a surprise and it is a ridiculously high stakes game to play - it’s literal lives on the line each and every day.
Exactly. They are irresponsible morons. They are the sole reason their daughter is dead. It wasn’t an accident. It was sheer negligence and stupidity.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/xl-bully-attack-leaves-scots-34059418
A schoolgirl mauled to death by her family's pet dog has been named as Savannah Bentham. The 10-year-old has been hailed as a "wonderful girl" by loved ones. Police confirmed yesterday that the youngster had lost her life following the shocking attack. And today officers confirmed the child'sidentity.
A heartbreaking statement was released through police by her family. It read: "We are utterly shocked and devastated by what happened to Savannah. We can’t believe we have lost our wonderful girl who we love so much. We thank everyone for their support and kindness as we struggle to come to terms with our loss.
—
It's always out of character for these dogs.
There should be no exemption for these types of dogs. Euthanize the lot of them, they are a danger to everyone around them for christ sake.
Is it only these dogs mauling kids to death or leaving them in hospital?
I know a guy who's dog started growling at his partner, it was big German Shepherd, they had the dog for over a year from a pup and for some reason he just started doing this and with other family and kids around I suppose they just had to get rid. They brought it back to the breeder, who basically just said, he's not a dog that is wired to be a house pet and took him back and retrained him as a guard dog.
They were bred for a specific reason and genetic traits were deliberately kept. Certain violent fighting traits from pitbulls, the bite, hold and shake is said to have been bred in from terriers. Who use that tactic to when hunting and killing vermin.
From my reading on them they're also said to have a very low gene pool. Many of them are basically dumb inbreds prone to violent outbursts. I doubt the people who own them are much better.
This makes for interesting reading on them.
https://banthebullyxluk.wordpress.com/breed-genetics/
No idea why anyone would want one of those around their house or kids. You wouldn't have a dangerous violent half wit inbred human around your kids. So why the feck would you want a dangerous violent half wit dog near them.
When the subject was about pit bulls I had a fair amount to say because I have known the breed for a long time and have known of quite a few people doing exactly the same (having them as family pets in the same household as infants and toddlers) as we’re hearing about with XL’s. I thought that was an incredibly dangerous and risky thing to do with zero margin for error, taking the people doing it to task and getting the usual responses back. It’s nearly always: “nah, not our dog, he’d never hurt us or harm a fly” etc. said with such conviction that it kills the discussion as they won’t hear anything to the contrary.
As you say, the way these XL’s come into existence is from a considerably smaller gene pool, which means more unpredictability and potentially shorter hair trigger response; it’s an even more unstable bomb than the traditional threat from a Pit, so it stands to reason that there will be more incidents, and it seems as though we are seeing that, although I don’t know if reporting on other breeds is as fervently pursued - reactions to XL’s are hardwired to be overwhelmingly negative, for example, thus more clicks for stories about them, I think.
Personally, I would never have these kind of breeds around kids. I’m not even sure I would want them around grown adults who have no hope if the dog decides today is the day it turns.
Degs.
This is what people don't get, these breeds were created to be violent it's in their genetics and I count all pitbulls in this. I know some claim they won't hurt anybody when trained right, but it only takes one incident for it switch and it will result in a person or animal to be maimed or killed, it's not worth the risk. There are plenty of other dog breeds that can be kept that don't have the capacity to kill or seriously injure, but I get the impression having a scary menacing looking dog is too much of an ego boost for some to turn away.
You can never trust any dog, anyone who thinks otherwise is a moron.
Probably a combination of negativity driving clicks and the injurie usually being more severe. There's probably not that many other dogs that can leave people so badly maimed in hospital.
My brother (who is in wheelchair) had an Amstaff called Anakin. He was very good with people, but my God, he was a dumb feck. Loved him to bits but he was genuinely stupid, even for a race not very known for their intelligence. If he saw another animal, he would try to go and kill it.
And when he was 5, my brother and his wife had the first kid (4 years later the second). Luckily nothing happened to them, and Anakin passed away this year (I think 13 years old), which to some degree was a relief, despite feeling lots of sadness (I lived with my brother’s family during my masters so was very connected with him).
So, while I think keeping these killer dogs is insane, and double insane if you have kids, the question is what do you do in these circumstances where you get them before even thinking to have kids, and then at some stage have kids. You have that emotional connection with the dog, they are gentle near you and other humans, but you know that in a second they can snap and cause the worst.
‘Luckily’ I live in a flat so won’t ever have this dilemma.
And when he was 5, my brother and his wife had the first kid (4 years later the second). Luckily nothing happened to them, and Anakin passed away this year (I think 13 years old), which to some degree was a relief, despite feeling lots of sadness (I lived with my brother’s family during my masters so was very connected with him).
So, while I think keeping these killer dogs is insane, and double insane if you have kids, the question is what do you do in these circumstances where you get them before even thinking to have kids, and then at some stage have kids. You have that emotional connection with the dog, they are gentle near you and other humans, but you know that in a second they can snap and cause the worst.
‘Luckily’ I live in a flat so won’t ever have this dilemma.
Any dog 30kg and heavier could in theory maim a child or adult
You can definitely trust some dogs. The dogs who won’t put you in hospital if they go for you. And there are a LOT of breeds of dogs in this category.
Do you trust any humans?
Any dog can harm a child, all depends on the size of the dog. i know someone who was bitten on the face by small dog as child and needed plastic surgery to rectify it. There was also a child near us growing up that got bitten badly by her relatives dogs, got some terrible scars from it. I knew those dogs, they were fecking horrible cnuts and we were always warned to stay the feck away from that house or have a good stick at hand when going by it.
To be fair, it takes bigger more aggressive dogs to seriously harm adults, but it might all depend on whether they take you by surprise or not. I have 2 that are about 25kg each and they are very very strong, they aren't agressive breeds but if they really wanted to take someone down I'm sure they could.
In theory you can. But in reality, All it takes is one pull of a tail or something small and the dog can lash out. Doesn't matter what type of dog it is or how nice it is, if the dog feels blindsided or threatened it's just how they are programmed to react. Growing up around farming, this is something I've learned from experience with all different types of animals, they all react differently when they feel threatened, but some are just mean and agressive and that's just the way they are.
You can never trust any animal, but you treat them right and show them respect, it's the way I was brought up to deal with them. And I've never been on the wrong side of any aggression.
I wouldn't trust dumb inbred humans who are prone to random acts of aggression.
You can trust them not to kill you, or any of your family, is my point. Under any circumstances. Choosing to own a dog you can’t trust to this extent is fecking madness IMO. And it is a choice.
You can probably trust most dogs not to kill you.
But you can't trust that they'll never snap or bite or cause some other serious damage.
Any dog is dangerous to some extent, around children. I have a Shih Tzu - he's obviously tiny, and could do limited damage, but I still watch him like a hawk around my youngest son (older one knows how to behave with dogs)
What possesses people to have these dogs around their kids is beyond me. It's not just about their temperament, it's their capabilities. When I have played with Staffies that my friends own I have been amazed at their strength, and that is a fairly normal family dog. I can only imagine the strength an XL bully has.
What possesses people to have these dogs around their kids is beyond me. It's not just about their temperament, it's their capabilities. When I have played with Staffies that my friends own I have been amazed at their strength, and that is a fairly normal family dog. I can only imagine the strength an XL bully has.
Never trust a scouser.
Probably? There were 58 deaths caused by dogs in the US last year. There were 24849 homicides. 40990 car related deaths. There are 4 humans for every 1 dog in the US.
You grew up on a farm? Farms are even more dangerous than dogs. For every 100.000 workers on farms in the US about 450 of them die in their work from occupational injuries.
Things more dangerous than dogs: Sitting a lot. Eating certain foods. Eating in general. Drinking. Smoking. Living in a city with a poor air quality. Leaving your house. Any kind of travel. Living in a house. Entering a swimming pool. If you are in the US, going to school.
How many of those farm deaths are caused by dumb, inbred animals who are bred to keep their fighting and aggressive traits randomly attacking people?
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Jesus, is this thread just an echo chamber for dog haters to reaffirm each other?
There's plenty of dogs you can easily trust around kids.
There's plenty of dogs you can easily trust around kids.
I love dogs and don't have kids but I don't think it's outrageous to suggest that any dog (xl , large, medium or small) could have a "moment" and bite someone and cause an injury.
So no, even as a dog person, I would be wary of leaving a small child around even my inlaws Cavalier King Charles who up until now is more likely to lick someone to death than ever bite them.
It really depends whether the dog is accustomed to children, how well they know them, how accustomed the children are to dogs. It's not something that happens automatically.
I am absolutely comfortable leaving my nephew and niece with our dog as are the parents. But the first six months they were never without supervision and there's been a lot of child instruction to go with it.
I think it's madness to contemplate leaving a very young child alone with even a sausage dog never mind a bigger sized dog.
I have had dogs and cats and I'd never even leave the kids alone with the cat when they were very young.
Maybe it's a cultural thing or maybe it's because I was bought up on a farm/countryside for some of my life as a kid (maternal side lived in country, paternal were city folk). The attachment to animals is there but ultimately they are an animal.
I have had dogs and cats and I'd never even leave the kids alone with the cat when they were very young.
Maybe it's a cultural thing or maybe it's because I was bought up on a farm/countryside for some of my life as a kid (maternal side lived in country, paternal were city folk). The attachment to animals is there but ultimately they are an animal.
I have 2 and have been around dogs all my life. So I don't hate them, quite the opposite, but you have to respect that they are animals and like all animals they can get annoyed and at times can react in certain unexpected ways. Ways that nobody saw coming. How many times do people say their own actions were "out of character" in courts etc.
Yes, you can trust plenty of dogs around kids, but it works both ways. Can you also trust the kids to know how to behave around the dogs?
There's a relationship that has to be built up, you can't just throw a dog in with kids and expect both to know how to handle the situation.
These xl dogs aren't bred to be family pets, they're bred to be big and strong, look scary and to keep their fighting and aggressive traits. Because that's what their owners want and a lot of breeders don't give two fecks about how they get pups to sell, they just want them to look a certain way so they get as much money as possible.
Their genetic line comes from a small pool, there's lots of health issues that come along with those. Issues with internal organs, brain function, bone growth, skull formation and all that stuff. So, it maybe a lot of the sudden reactions come because they have some underlying issues stemming from bad breeding and that affects their temperant and all of a sudden causes them to lash out.
Indeed, as I also addressed myself just above.
That's a far cry from "you can never trust any dog, anyone who thinks otherwise is a moron" or "Any dog can flip" or that "having a dog that can kill a child" is putting a life on the line. I grew up with German Shepherds, they could certainly have killed me if push came to shove. Absolutely zero chance of that ever happening. When you start factoring in those probabilities, we get into stuff like never going into traffic as risks that should also be acted on.
This is not the case for all dogs, obviously, and I'm sure there are many dog owners who poorly assess and read their own dogs and fail to train both dog and child to interact properly. But it is perfectly possible to have large dogs around children as a safe environment for both.
I would still say that anyone who thinks you can trust dogs all of the time is a moron. You can never trust any animal 100% of the time.
You have to have a healthy respect for them at all times, if you have kids around they all need to be socialised so they know how to behave around each other. But regardless of the breed I'd never leave any dog unattended with small children.
just a random thought. Instead of putting down a dangerous dog. Or if people have dangerous dogs that are a danger like x bullies. Why dont they just remove their teeth? Bit cruel but much better than being euthanized and I think dogs can lead happy normal lives without teeth.
I think that's cruel too, depriving an animal of an essential part of their anatomy just so humans can please them.
This will probably sound harsh but since humans stopped partaking in blood sports (legally) they don't really have a use, which is the case for most dogs in the modern age but most other dogs are not equivalent to a dangerous weapon. It would be best to let the breed die out naturally via stopping them being bred. Ofocurse this is difficult due to all the backyard breeders and it would take every country in the world to enforce it.
This reminds me of a story I am told about myself being a toddler that I myself have no recollection of. My parents and our neighbours at the time were very tight. Those neighbours looked after me plenty of times, even. They had a border collie who was apparently the loveliest, friendliest dog. I’m told he used to guard me, sitting around wherever I was facing outwards. One time I apparently pulled his tail and instinctively he yelped and promptly nipped me on the face, leaving marks on my cheek and jaw. Again, I have no recollection of this incident whatsoever, but imagine a very likely scenario where a kid does something it shouldn’t and the dog reacts in kind instinctively. The more dangerous the breed, most likely the worse the outcome, even if the dog doesn’t go all out.
Sounds like I was lucky it was only a Border Collie and despite it being entirely my own fault I got bit, the speed at which those things can happen is insane. If anything, a young child is the crazy random variable, and knowing that, it is the parents with the responsibility to protect and be aware of the potential dangers.
It can very easily happen, small children just aren't aware of how a dog might react to different movements or it could be something accidental like standing on a paw or a playful gesture. I've seen my own dog turn and start growling and snarling at someone that was round the house just because they put on a hat before they left.
People can say they trust their dogs, but you can't trust them 100% in every scenario. But when kids are involved it becomes a lottery, you don't know when someone or something might spook them into a reaction and dogs really only have one go to self defence mechanism.
I agree and I wouldn’t even apportion it to blame: a child is a child and children mostly learn through mistakes. A dog is a dog and even the best behaved can have a moment of distress or confusion. There are countless stories and vids of the most dangerously labelled dogs truly appearing to be the absolute guardian of children, seeing them as family and members of the pack - you may have seen that rather famous one with the 4 or 5 pit bulls with the little girl in America? They chaperone her everywhere and it looks awesome, but wow, on the other hand, the element of risk to that is crazy.
Unsupervised, it would just be negligent. I’ve known many households with dangerous dogs being in and around the kids in the home, thankfully without incident, but I wonder if the dogs are left unattended with the children, as that’s another aspect entirely.
I saw similar when my young nephew was playing with the Boston Terrier. It's the most passive friendly dog, and handled everything the children did. My nephew pushed it a bit far and it just turned round and growled in his face. I stepped in, and it's great it gave a warning it wasn't happy but even a small dog like that could have caused a lo of damage, and on another day it may have just bit.
Well adjusted dogs would not just have bit though. Growling in it's face shows good communication skills. I think this is really the assumption I take issue with in this thread. The notion that any dog might just 'flip'.
Well adjusted dogs have a wide range of means they will resort to before going so far as to bite in a hurtful way. They are pack animals, they have social skills for this stuff (and in regards to the example above of the pit bulls, the fact that they are a pack probably means those social skills will be higher than a solitary dog).
The issue is when those communications are ignored or worse yet scolded. That's when you end up with those situations where the dog's boundaries aren't respected and it will feel the need to escalate if those boundaries keep being crossed.
We've had to do a fair bit of training with our nephew (he's four) around our dog, because my dad's enormous German shepherd tolerates everything or else just knocks them over with her body when tired of the kids. Great for kids becoming comfortable with big dogs, not so great for learning how to behave around dogs.
He didn't understand that our dog who is 15kg is not someone you can jump double punch into like I've seen him do to my dad's dog, both due to size and the fact that our dog had probably never met a kid in his life before we adopted him and was legit confused and scared of them. The next phase was tolerating whilst not really liking them and training the kids to step off when he gave signs he didn't want to interact.
Today he's a dog who genuinely likes kids (including ones he doesn't know) and will often choose to spend time with them over adults when they are all together. And the kids have learned that dogs are for petting and feeding treats and not for playing kid games with. So it's a safe relationship. But it didn't happen on its own and took about a year to become solidly established, with work for both kids and dogs.
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