Ole Sack Watch

[Tomuś]

Interesting that he's the second reporter now who is saying players are unhappy. I know it was the sun but they mentioned how Bruno was pissed at oles tactics and Ronaldo gave them the halftime speech.

Will probably boil over soon. Glazers want to appease the fans without spending money so firing ole if the fan base finally turns on him is an easy out. Think the players have to do it first though

Ole's still got his cult. Not too big in numebers but vocal, which was even heard when they sang his song at the end of the match.

Best way is to sack him now, get somebody good enouh to use this season for introducing actual tactics and indentity while getting top 4. Also hopefully bringing actual coaches with him.

Second season fight for the serious tarfets.

 

[FatTails]

Jose and LvG were CV managers and look how that worked out.

Can this silly argument die? If a company hires an experienced CEO and it doesn’t work out, they look for another experienced CEO or someone who has shown they can do the job.

They don’t go, “Oh well, let’s try the janitor this time around since an experienced CEO didn’t work out last time”

 

[pocco]

Duncan Castles on Transfer Window Podcast: Apparently Utd haven't put out any feelers for discussions with potential managers. Glazers are not happy with the performances considering their investment this summer.

Theres been discontent and arguments with Ole and his staff in the dressing room. The training and match preparation isnt up to the level some of the elite players expectations.

Apparently Conte's agent has briefed journalists that conte would be interested in the job as hes desperate to win the CL and thinks the squad is good enough.

Though Conte comes with his own caveats for taking the job if it was ever offered. Plus Conte prefers to have a full preseason rather than takeover midseason.

Zidane was mentioned as well. These are the two biggest profile managers who are free and the glazers wouldnt have to pay compensation for. Not to say Glazers wont go for a manger who is contracted to another club. So far all speculation.

Anyway sounds like Ole has time, though if things go badly over next 5-7 games who knows what glazers will do.

A glimmer of hope.

 

[Womp]

Jose and LvG were CV managers and look how that worked out.

You're right mate. They've also never given a chance to a random bloke from Australia with absolutely no coaching qualifications.

Should throw my hat in the ring. May as well, given we've already gone down the 'qualified for the position' route.

 

[Womp]

Duncan Castles on Transfer Window Podcast: Apparently Utd haven't put out any feelers for discussions with potential managers. Glazers are not happy with the performances considering their investment this summer.

Theres been discontent and arguments with Ole and his staff in the dressing room. The training and match preparation isnt up to the level some of the elite players expectations.

Apparently Conte's agent has briefed journalists that conte would be interested in the job as hes desperate to win the CL and thinks the squad is good enough.

Though Conte comes with his own caveats for taking the job if it was ever offered. Plus Conte prefers to have a full preseason rather than takeover midseason.

Zidane was mentioned as well. These are the two biggest profile managers who are free and the glazers wouldnt have to pay compensation for. Not to say Glazers wont go for a manger who is contracted to another club. So far all speculation.

Anyway sounds like Ole has time, though if things go badly over next 5-7 games who knows what glazers will do.

It's Castles so in reality the board are probably happy as feck with him.

Also I think we need to go with a progressive coach next. Just get a caretaker in and look to bring in Ten Haag or Enrique.

 

[Ferguson’s Hairdryer]

Look we have to accept that this vote isn’t an accurate reflection and Ole has a huge amount of fans who want him to stay. Go do this poll on the forums for City, Liverpool, Chelsea, Spurs, and every other prem team and you’ll find that 100% vote Ole stay as long as possible.

 

[NextSeason]

What kind of silly argument is that? Absolutely no relevance to selecting the next manager when the time comes.

It’s a perfectly sound argument that a better CV does not necessarily mean better performance in a job which is equally applicable to many roles at organisations.

Can this silly argument die? If a company hires an experienced CEO and it doesn’t work out, they look for another experienced CEO or someone who has shown they can do the job.

They don’t go, “Oh well, let’s try the janitor this time around since an experienced CEO didn’t work out last time”

Not true at all and here’s a good example for you.

Take Apple, they hired an experienced CEO, John Scully, in the 80s and it didn’t work out so they replaced him with the original founder of the company, Steve Jobs, to restore the company to its original values. After Jobs passed away in 2011, the CEO was appointed internally - Tim Cook who had no previous CEO experience but understood what the company was about. Just so happens they are the most valuable company in the world.

You're right mate. They've also never given a chance to a random bloke from Australia with absolutely no coaching qualifications.

Should throw my hat in the ring. May as well, given we've already gone down the 'qualified for the position' route.

Weird analogy given Ole had 10 years managerial experience before he became our manager. No offence but your tagline makes sense.

 

[FatTails]

It’s a perfectly sound argument that a better CV does not necessarily mean better performance in a job which is equally applicable to many roles at organisations.



Not true at all and here’s a good example for you.

Take Apple, they hired an experienced CEO, John Scully, in the 80s and it didn’t work out so they replaced him with the original founder of the company, Steve Jobs, to restore the company to its original values. After Jobs passed away in 2011, the CEO was appointed internally - Tim Cook who had no previous CEO experience but understood what the company was about. Just so happens they are the most valuable company in the world.



Weird analogy given Ole had 10 years managerial experience before he became our manager. No offence but your tagline makes sense.

Congrats, you’ve found an anomaly. An exception to the rule.

The issue with your original argument is that you make it sound like a stacked CV is the cause of LVG’s and Mourinho’s “failures” (failure is subjective since Mou had a higher points per game and two trophies to his name by this point). A more reasonable explanation is that a qualified CV is only one of the requirements, necessary but not sufficient. The solution is not do away with it as a requirement, but rather find what other factors contribute to a successful managerial appointment.

 

[Foxbatt]

It’s a perfectly sound argument that a better CV does not necessarily mean better performance in a job which is equally applicable to many roles at organisations.



Not true at all and here’s a good example for you.

Take Apple, they hired an experienced CEO, John Scully, in the 80s and it didn’t work out so they replaced him with the original founder of the company, Steve Jobs, to restore the company to its original values. After Jobs passed away in 2011, the CEO was appointed internally - Tim Cook who had no previous CEO experience but understood what the company was about. Just so happens they are the most valuable company in the world.



Weird analogy given Ole had 10 years managerial experience before he became our manager. No offence but your tagline makes sense.

10 years managerial experience in managing a small club and Cardiff and got sacked for relegating them. Tim Cook doesn't need to have previous CEO experience. He was the acting CEO for two years from 2009 to 2011 before he was appointed as the CEO in 2011. He had the knowledge and experience of running Apple for two years.

 

[stw2022]

I wonder how remedial the coaching is compared to other top clubs. I think the players like the manager as a person and that’s probably prevented a lot of disgruntlement from leaking but you can tell from watching us that the coaching probably isn’t very detailed or intense; passages of play or team movements aren’t being drilled.

 

[Tyrion]

Apparently Conte's agent has briefed journalists that conte would be interested in the job as hes desperate to win the CL and thinks the squad is good enough.

 

[Flying_Heckfish]

Waiting 5-7 games is mad, considering it's quite clear which way the wind is blowing. If he is going, it should be now.

 

[Caesar2290]

Duncan Castles on Transfer Window Podcast: Apparently Utd haven't put out any feelers for discussions with potential managers. Glazers are not happy with the performances considering their investment this summer.

Theres been discontent and arguments with Ole and his staff in the dressing room. The training and match preparation isnt up to the level some of the elite players expectations.

Apparently Conte's agent has briefed journalists that conte would be interested in the job as hes desperate to win the CL and thinks the squad is good enough.

Though Conte comes with his own caveats for taking the job if it was ever offered. Plus Conte prefers to have a full preseason rather than takeover midseason.

Zidane was mentioned as well. These are the two biggest profile managers who are free and the glazers wouldnt have to pay compensation for. Not to say Glazers wont go for a manger who is contracted to another club. So far all speculation.

Anyway sounds like Ole has time, though if things go badly over next 5-7 games who knows what glazers will do.

Feck no. Last thing we need is another manager that is going to implode in 2 years time. After which we'll hear that we need another rebuild. The manager needs to get all his ducks in a row to compete, yada yada.

We need someone who's going to play attacking football and give chances to the youth(considering the amount of talent we currently have in the academy). Ten Hag fits the bill perfectly. Not sure about other managers though.

 

[Caesar2290]

Waiting 5-7 games is mad, considering it's quite clear which way the wind is blowing. If he is going, it should be now.

Something tells me that if Liverpool beat us, the decision will be made. Not straight away, but come the end of the season we will have a new manager.

 

[Flytan]

Feck no. Last thing we need is another manager that is going to implode in 2 years time. After which we'll hear that we need another rebuild. The manager needs to get all his ducks in a row to compete, yada yada.

We need someone who's going to play attacking football and give chances to the youth(considering the amount of talent we currently have in the academy). Ten Hag fits the bill perfectly. Not sure about other managers though.

The whole "rebuilding after manager leaves" thing is completely overblown. It's why we hired a director of football, unless we are operating moronically (entirely possible with this club's hierarchy) we are targeting players based on a pre-conceived way we want to play. The players will not have to be replaced as a whole as managers change. Obviously new managers will get new players in because that's how it works, but we should NEVER try to go full rebuild again like we did when we hired LVG. Again, only if the club is running in an intelligent way. This would means managers are then hired under the idea that they can implement their tactics with our current structure of buying players and developing them. If that means Conte, Ten Haag, Zidane, I don't have a clue, it means (again unless we're still as badly run as ever) this whole process is planned.

Also judging by how the rest of the world functions with coaches, most managers are around for only a few years anyways. We have to have a recruitment process that continues to work even if managers are changed.

 

[VP89]

Something tells me that if Liverpool beat us, the decision will be made. Not straight away, but come the end of the season we will have a new manager.

Think we can beat Liverpool and still have a new manager come end of season.

Its more about WHEN we pull the plug this year.

 

[stw2022]

If the club is leaking they’re not putting feelers out it means they’re putting feelers out and want to get the denial in ahead of any story that might break. Even if results were brilliant it would be part of the club’s emergency contingency planning to be in contact with potential replacements should the need arise

 

[FatTails]

Something tells me that if Liverpool beat us, the decision will be made. Not straight away, but come the end of the season we will have a new manager.

The decision really should not be based on one game. In an ideal world, a 5-0 loss or 5-0 win against Liverpool is just one game and shouldn’t sway the decision massively either way

You’ve gotta believe that people at the club are exploring other managers at this point, even if the decision of if and when to replace Ole has not been taken yet.

 

[NextSeason]

Congrats, you’ve found an anomaly. An exception to the rule.

The issue with your original argument is that you make it sound like a stacked CV is the cause of LVG’s and Mourinho’s “failures” (failure is subjective since Mou had a higher points per game and two trophies to his name by this point). A more reasonable explanation is that a qualified CV is only one of the requirements, necessary but not sufficient. The solution is not do away with it as a requirement, but rather find what other factors contribute to a successful managerial appointment.

It's not an exception, it's the norm. Internal promotions in companies are more common than hiring externally which shows you don't necessarily need bags of experience in carrying out a job, you just need to be able to do it when you're in it. And you took the way I made my original point wrongly, I was making the point which you cemented in that a CV isn't everything or even really that important - just look at what Zidane did at Real with little managerial CV.

10 years managerial experience in managing a small club and Cardiff and got sacked for relegating them. Tim Cook doesn't need to have previous CEO experience. He was the acting CEO for two years from 2009 to 2011 before he was appointed as the CEO in 2011. He had the knowledge and experience of running Apple for two years.

Experience is experience, I never said it was glittering. Yes exactly, Tim Cook picked up the reigns in a similar way to Ole, on an interim basis due to the former post-holder leaving abruptly. Ole actually had managerial experience when he was appointed whereas Tim Cook had no CEO experience so had to learn on the job. They both have continued in their jobs for performing well in the eyes of their boards.

 

[stw2022]

The decision really should not be based on one game. In an ideal world, a 5-0 loss or 5-0 win against Liverpool is just one game and shouldn’t sway the decision massively either way

You’ve gotta believe that people at the club are exploring other managers at this point, even if the decision of if and when to replace Ole has not been taken yet.

Footballing denials are worse than political ones. Every club has feelers out for next their next managerial appointment. Even City. They don’t know if tomorrow Guardiola will quit to become a Tibetan monk. Business contingency planning applies to football too.

 

[Foxbatt]

It's not an exception, it's the norm. Internal promotions in companies are more common than hiring externally which shows you don't necessarily need bags of experience in carrying out a job, you just need to be able to do it when you're in it. And you took the way I made my original point wrongly, I was making the point which you cemented in that a CV isn't everything or even really that important - just look at what Zidane did at Real with little managerial CV.



Experience is experience, I never said it was glittering. Yes exactly, Tim Cook picked up the reigns in a similar way to Ole, on an interim basis due to the former post-holder leaving abruptly. Ole actually had managerial experience when he was appointed whereas Tim Cook had no CEO experience so had to learn on the job. They both have continued in their jobs for performing well in the eyes of their boards.

Tim Cook had two years to see if he is capable of running Apple or not before he got appointed to the position of CEO. Before that he was VP at Apple. he did not have to learn on the job. He was only appointed after he did two years and they found that he is perfectly capable of doing so. Ole got it after 3 months of interim manager. One was already in the company and acting as the CEO for two years. The other was plucked out of a small corner shop(compared to Apple) and put in charge.

 

[Member 58925]

It’s a perfectly sound argument that a better CV does not necessarily mean better performance in a job which is equally applicable to many roles at organisations.



Not true at all and here’s a good example for you.

Take Apple, they hired an experienced CEO, John Scully, in the 80s and it didn’t work out so they replaced him with the original founder of the company, Steve Jobs, to restore the company to its original values. After Jobs passed away in 2011, the CEO was appointed internally - Tim Cook who had no previous CEO experience but understood what the company was about. Just so happens they are the most valuable company in the world.



Weird analogy given Ole had 10 years managerial experience before he became our manager. No offence but your tagline makes sense.

Any supposed correlation is a figment of your imagination, but as long as you’re enjoying yourself why not.

 

[Red00012]

I can see Conte taking over and it going terribly wrong

 

[EtH]

I can see Conte taking over and it going terribly wrong

Why would we hire a toxic prick who has only ever disappointed in the CL ?

 

[NewYorkRed]

After its too late.

We have a good team right now. A bit top and bottom heavy, but good enough to challenge. We should bring someone else now.

And no, even if we win against the scouse and city, I won’t change my mind. It would just be a false dawn- we will just end up dropping points elsewhere.

The proof is in the pudding, and its been out there for a long time now.

 

[Red Dreams]

Win or lose tomorrow, I want him gone.

 

[Demaw]

Right? Why would you want someone who won 3 CLs, 2 La Liga titles, and 2 Spanish cups in 4 years of management?

I personally prefer a manager who wins nothing in 3 years and has less points per game than Mourinho yet somehow dupes most of the fanbase to think that things are so much better now If that is not skill, I don't know what is.

But he scored that amazing goal to win us the Cl.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

After more than 3 years, it's just not acceptable to hear anymore excuses:

1. Need a CDM/CM before can play proper football

2. Need more coaches in different department

3. Need more time to implement style of play. And also because we just signed 3 world class players and we have no clue how to integrate them into the team.

4. The players at the club now is not suitable to play attacking football as promised when appointed from interim to permanent manager.

5. The defence is still not good enough after spending close to 200 mil.

6. Forget about shit football, we are making progress and challenging for Top 4 every year now. Next year is the year, rinse and repeat.

 

[Womp]

It’s a perfectly sound argument that a better CV does not necessarily mean better performance in a job which is equally applicable to many roles at organisations.



Not true at all and here’s a good example for you.

Take Apple, they hired an experienced CEO, John Scully, in the 80s and it didn’t work out so they replaced him with the original founder of the company, Steve Jobs, to restore the company to its original values. After Jobs passed away in 2011, the CEO was appointed internally - Tim Cook who had no previous CEO experience but understood what the company was about. Just so happens they are the most valuable company in the world.



Weird analogy given Ole had 10 years managerial experience before he became our manager. No offence but your tagline makes sense.

No what's a weird analogy is suggesting we should give up on managers with good CV's because it didn't work with Jose and LVG. It was a fecking laughable opinion. Especially when it was very clear LVG and Jose were no longer great managers in the modern era. Their time had passed.

How many years Ole has been a manager is irrelevant. If anything it's even more reason to determine he isn't good enough given he hasn't won a trophy himself in 7 years.

An individual without an acceptable or appropriate CV can still do well, but to suggest that hiring someone without a proper CV is the way forward, simply because we had two highly controversial appointments fail in the past is ridiculous. Hiring someone without proof of success or without experience is far more of a risk to an organisation than hiring otherwise.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

And what else are we supposed to do on a forum? Say things like: nice goal, what a sick pass by Bruno, I wonder what version of iPad is Ole using? By this logic, what’s the point in discussing Fred’s performances as he’s going nowhere this season? Just park it and get behind the club by supporting Fred.

Aren't you bored of repeating the same thing day after day though?

All the sounds coming out of the club say that the manager's job isn't under immediate threat. It's about time fans actually started being fans and getting behind the boys.

if we win today are you going to be disappointed then as it will no doubt give Ole more time? If so then remove yourself from this forum and club. You're not a Utd fan.

 

[Mainoldo]

Even if we lose tomorrow he's not being sacked. I think it would have to be an absolute walloping or say 4 or 5 for that to even be a possibility and I still don't think they would do it.

Ole will probably get the season now and see how we do. If we don't finish top 4 he's definitely gone. If we finish 4th but are miles behind the winners he will probably go.

Ole outers need to park it now. He's going nowhere for now. Just get behind the club for a bit and revisit the manager situation again.

So if we get beat 7-0 today you are still behind him?

 

[UnitedSofa]

If the club is leaking they’re not putting feelers out it means they’re putting feelers out and want to get the denial in ahead of any story that might break. Even if results were brilliant it would be part of the club’s emergency contingency planning to be in contact with potential replacements should the need arise

What a way to spin things to suit your agenda.

Literally taken something & gone….nah that means the total opposite! Conspiracy theory central over here.

 

[Mainoldo]

Will be funny to hear what posters like Nou Camp have to say when Gareth Southgate says he’s leaving England at the end of the World Cup!! We all know who will be after him

 

[Longlivekeano]

ole ‘s job was always INTENDED to be temporary stabilising measure. The owners misread the initial post-Jose run as evidence of Ole’s managerial expertise.

3 years on, it’s clear that ole is not cut from the same cloth as SAF, Klopp, Tuchel, Conte

 

[Mainoldo]

ole ‘s job was always INTENDED to be temporary stabilising measure. The owners misread the initial post-Jose run as evidence of Ole’s managerial expertise.

3 years on, it’s clear that ole is not cut from the same cloth as SAF, Klopp, Tuchel, Conte

Clear to who? Not them or the fans singing his name every week. You’d think he’s still coming of the bench to score goals.

 

[Gandalf Greyhame]

I don't know how much Ole and his staff have learnt from the 4-2 against Liverpool despite having a better XI at their disposal since then. We'll know today.

Should have ideally gone in today with a new manager, someone who won't replicate the same mistakes/underlying weaknesses from games like that.

Atalanta second half was a good high to part ways.

 

[stw2022]

What a way to spin things to suit your agenda.

Literally taken something & gone….nah that means the total opposite! Conspiracy theory central over here.

It’s no agenda everyone knows all clubs have contingency plans. If tomorrow Guardiola decided he wanted to live on Canvey Island as a recluse do you think City will start planning for his successor only after he leaves?

Not being naive isn’t being a conspiracy theorist. Every top player always has feelers out for their next club, every manager has feelers out for their next job, every top club has feelers out for their next manager

Do you really think what’s now a multibillion pound industry with as high player/staff turnover as this sport has is run by those who are constantly caught unawares by routine occurrences?

The club briefing it definitely isn’t doing something we all know all clubs, including them, do must be for a reason

 

[UnitedSofa]

It’s no agenda everyone knows all clubs have contingency plans. If tomorrow Guardiola decided he wanted to live on Canvey Island as a recluse do you think City will start planning for his successor only after he leaves?

Not being naive isn’t being a conspiracy theorist. Every top player always has feelers out for their next club, every manager has feelers out for their next job, every top club has feelers out for their next manager

Do you really think what’s now a multibillion pound industry with as high player/staff turnover as this sport has have people running who are constantly caught unawares by routine occurrences?

The club briefing it definitely isn’t doing something we all know all clubs, including them, do must be for a reason

If so,which personally I doubt, then that’s a very sad state that we live in, in modern times. Personally I believe that the real world of football isn’t as glamorous or as sneaky or as dramatic that we as football fans make out in our heads, I believe it’s a lot simpler than we think.

No one ever happy, always looking for the next thing.

Why can’t we cross that bridge if and when it comes to it?

When a manager goes from a club like United/City there’d always be interested parties, you wouldn’t need to put out feelers. Why do you think it sometimes takes weeks to get a manager in? It’s because they’re looking for managers.

Like when do you out out feelers? As soon as a new manager takes over? 2 months in?

 

[red4ever 79]

I don't know how much Ole and his staff have learnt from the 4-2 against Liverpool despite having a better XI at their disposal since then. We'll know today.

Should have ideally gone in today with a new manager, someone who won't replicate the same mistakes/underlying weaknesses from games like that.

Atalanta second half was a good high to part ways.

Agree. Havent been happy to hear both Ole and McTom come out this weekend saying we are the underdogs in the match today. It's this whole lowering expectations and accepting nothing but challenging. This excuse and approach has to stop. Neville also tried doing it last weekend saying if Ole gets top 4 and wins the FA Cup and Europa cup then it's a good season. Nonsense, with this squad and the money he has now spent he has to challenge this season for the title.

 

[stw2022]

If so,which personally I doubt, then that’s a very sad state that we live in, in modern times. Personally I believe that the real world of football isn’t as glamorous or as sneaky or as dramatic that we as football fans make out in our heads, I believe it’s a lot simpler than we think.

No one ever happy, always looking for the next thing.

Why can’t we cross that bridge if and when it comes to it?

When a manager goes from a club like United/City there’d always be interested parties, you wouldn’t need to put out feelers. Why do you think it sometimes takes weeks to get a manager in? It’s because they’re looking for managers.

Like when do you out out feelers? As soon as a new manager takes over? 2 months in?

Constantly. It’s sensible. Moronic to only start planning for something after it has already happened. Manager’s are the same. Do you think Ferguson ever stopped searching for the next star forward or would it have been a sad state of affairs if he didn’t recall all the scouts once we signed RvN?

Like it or not it’s necessary long-term thinking. There won’t be a top club in Europe who don’t have some idea who’d be interested in taking over should their current manager retire, leave, get fired or spontaneously combust

Which brings me back to my point, if we’re leaking we’re not doing that there must be a reason