About time someone pulled him up on this:
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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Seriously why do people give this absolute nonsense statistic so much value and credibility?
Let’s take an xG map of the average Messi/Ronaldo season then call them ‘lucky’ for getting for than 20 a season.
I wish they would just get on with appointing him. Its annoying the level of scrutiny he and his decisions come under as if Sir Alex never lost or had poor games.
We were never going to go unbeaten. These things happen. We were lucky against Paris, unlucky against Arsenal and off pace yesterday. It happens. Especially with the injury difficulties we have had.
We were never going to go unbeaten. These things happen. We were lucky against Paris, unlucky against Arsenal and off pace yesterday. It happens. Especially with the injury difficulties we have had.
No manager is immune from criticism, but the fact that people are so devastated by a couple of defeats is testament to how much he’s done in such a short amount of time.
People surely can’t forget how impossible top 4 even seemed after Liverpool defeat? PSG were looming we then drew arsenal and Chelsea in the cup under solskjaer. It’s a miracle we’re even this close to 4th and have put PSG out.
People surely can’t forget how impossible top 4 even seemed after Liverpool defeat? PSG were looming we then drew arsenal and Chelsea in the cup under solskjaer. It’s a miracle we’re even this close to 4th and have put PSG out.
I agree with you. The fact we won so many at the beginning has tainted our view now he has lost 2 on the trot. If say we had lost to Spurs and beaten Arsenal he wouldnt have the doubters he has now. Of course he might yet lose 2-3 more and not qualify for the Champions League, but before we say "no, hes no good" lets see if he can learn and pick us up first. Obviously the reason they havent announced him yet is because they expected a few losses to happen.
Word. When he became a manager, 90% of the fans were, like, no way we can reach top 4
The old cracks are showing again now as the positivity that Ole generated begins to become the norm and stops having such an impact.
Was to be expected. If he gets top 4 he's earned the coach job. If not, there's a decision to be made about who the club trusts with sorting this squad out in tandem with an experienced DoF. In my opinion getting that recruitment right is even more important than choosing the manager.
Was to be expected. If he gets top 4 he's earned the coach job. If not, there's a decision to be made about who the club trusts with sorting this squad out in tandem with an experienced DoF. In my opinion getting that recruitment right is even more important than choosing the manager.
It is a test for his tactical abilities in big games. Against Barcelona you need to really adopt if we should stand a chance.
He has done well, but this season still look to be a failure. Bad luck with the draws no doubt, but City and Liverpool to win most things and us to win nothing is just terrible. Down to Mourinho in two tournaments and Ole has two he should fight for. One left and hopefully we do well in the champions league.
There is nothing you can do tactically if the players you're up against are much better and believe more than your set of players. Fergie was never judged on his tactically ability against the likes of Barcelona or Real Madrid, I don't see why we should now start judging Solskjaer against his players being able to contain possibly the greatest footballer of all time and try to win the game.
This season is anything but a failure, and thanks to him. When he took over we weren't even dreaming about 4th place, now we have a very real chance of finishing 3rd if we get our shit together for the run in. Not winning the CL or the FA cup in your first 4 months in charge of a football club as interim manager is not a disgrace or a failure at all, managing a team for 5 years and saying 'cups are for egos' or being 3 point within first place all season to find yourself closer to 5th come the last 8 games is a failure.
There's nothing we can do about City or Liverpool. They've been building on each seasons success and we've been sabotaging our own with poor recruitment of players and staff. We can't judge our manager on what trophies they win, what fecked up logic is that? Considering it all happened before Solskjær even took the job.
There's no reason not to give Soslkjær at least next season now. He's our out and out best option, and Pochettino isn't going anywhere now. It's going to be interesting how next season plays out.
Totally agree with this - the 'will he/won't he' be manager thing has now become a distraction.
Announce his appointment now. Start planning for next season and fixing the holes in the squad.
Yeah. I was against announcing it when we were on that great run, just for superstitious reasons of "if it ain't broke". But now that's no longer an issue just announce it and let's have done with it.
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Of course there is things you can do. Swansea showed it against City and that is a bigger gap of quality. The season is a massive failure overall, but Ole has done well of course.
Liverpool don't have more financial muscles than us so for Klopp to have taken them to a much stronger position is really bad from us.
I think Ole is a manager to keep, but this season is a failure and I do think Ole thinks it too and wants to do much better next season.
The problem is we've got too many flaky players like Martial and Lingard. Nothing the manager can do about that.
To be fair, they're coming back from injury last night but I agree that we need players that are more consistent and drag the team to a win even when we're not playing well. We have a lot of fair weather players and not a lot of leaders.
So after 2 games all season Greenwood went back to being unavailable again? And people slated me when I just mentioned some shades of Owen Hargreaves there.We surely don't want another case with a sick note/injury all year getting salary like a player who contributes week-in week-out, right?
no wonder you got slated. He's barely even grown into his adult teeth and you're comparing him to one our biggest sick notes we've had in recent times based on barely anything.Seems to struggle against teams who play 5 at the back. Not blaming him for last night, but I think he put into too many unfit players against a team who are that tough.
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Matic showed he was not match ready against Arsenal, no?
They'll probably rest a few players as they will have a FA cup semi 4 days later to worry about. Still, a win is not a given.
You reckon a new manager that comes in during the summer is more likely to upgrade on, for example, Lingard, than Ole who's seen the team's weaknesses for half a season?
We've said that for the past three managerial stints and every single one has come in and said "I'm going to give everyone a chance and assess the squad", which is why we're still sitting here with a squad containing Rojo, Darmian, Jones and Valencia, to name a few. And even then I've left out a bunch who should be happy to be squad players at a club with our supposed ambitions, but who are still in and around the first team.
You're forgetting to mention that he hasn't got the squad for it. If he wanted to change the game plan, sit back and go with a counter-attacking style and thought Martial/Rashford/Lingard weren't fit enough for it, who should he have brought on? Mata? Pereira? Fred? Those were literally his only attacking players on the bench due to injuries.
I'm all for giving him the summer to see what he does with the squad, because that's going to shape the way we're able to play next season. Our squad is ridiculously short on players that fit the same style of play, so if you're going to let Martial, Rashford and Lingard rest you're sitting there with an attacking three of Alexis, Lukaku and Mata. How are they going to play the style of football that I'm assuming Ole wants them to play in training?
I am not sure about the ole appointment, while Jose was in charge most of us agreed we had a better team than the results we were getting, we had a team that were kept on a leash watching other teams around us playing how we should have been and getting frustrated more and more week after week.
They were chomping at the bit and Ole came in and let them off the leash, he basically let them go wild, if we’re honest there was no tactical managerial masterclass just footballers loving football again.
Now to the games we’ve lost under Ole, has he had the ability to change the game or formation and counteract what the opposition are doing?
Football is a fikkle game and within a week we dropped out of the top 4, are out of the F.a cup and face Barcelona in the champions league, Wolves are a good team I knew they’d be a problem when we were drawn against them and a lot of our players never turned up but were the tactics right? Ole let the team off it’s leash after being tied up for so long and we ran riot but now the team is physically and mentally tired, this is now were management and tactics come into play.
Poch has the same ethics as what Ole is doing at Man united but he is also tactically a great manager, i think appointing Ole now would be a mistake, let’s at least wait till the end of the season.
They were chomping at the bit and Ole came in and let them off the leash, he basically let them go wild, if we’re honest there was no tactical managerial masterclass just footballers loving football again.
Now to the games we’ve lost under Ole, has he had the ability to change the game or formation and counteract what the opposition are doing?
Football is a fikkle game and within a week we dropped out of the top 4, are out of the F.a cup and face Barcelona in the champions league, Wolves are a good team I knew they’d be a problem when we were drawn against them and a lot of our players never turned up but were the tactics right? Ole let the team off it’s leash after being tied up for so long and we ran riot but now the team is physically and mentally tired, this is now were management and tactics come into play.
Poch has the same ethics as what Ole is doing at Man united but he is also tactically a great manager, i think appointing Ole now would be a mistake, let’s at least wait till the end of the season.
Ole and the mgt team last night set out the team that many fans have wanted. Unfortunately, it was perhaps the wrong night with too many players coming back from injury but then top players need time to get up to speed again. I do think we have horses for courses and at times some players fail in high intensity games. For example Jesse didn’t look right last night, Martial was being channelled and Rashford looked petchulant. Wolves did a job like us in Paris. Maybe we need to be a little more flexible going into the final stage but I do think in another game that squad could destroy any side.
Just because someone has the flu once or twice does not mean they'll end up with my health-history.So after 2 games all season Greenwood went back to being unavailable again? And people slated me when I just mentioned some shades of Owen Hargreaves there.
Same with McTominay. Matic just walked back in the team over him.
Yeah we better release him. Not pulling his weight.So after 2 games all season Greenwood went back to being unavailable again? And people slated me when I just mentioned some shades of Owen Hargreaves there.
I still want Ole as permanent manager, and what he has achieved so far is still absurdly good (not just Paris, he won 9 away games in a row ffs!) but there are a few things that I'd like to see him address sharpish (and I'm confident that he can)
1. In a few recent games we have set up with what is clearly the wrong formation, fortunately he has had the nous to change this early on but he needs to learn from his mistakes and not put us on the back foot early on in games
2. Rushing players back from injury - this has been a big problem also in the last few games, one or two players coming back can work but when it's several it completely disrupts the team. Some of them clearly aren't ready and need minutes as subs before getting thrown back in in must win games (which lets face it right now is all of them)
3. Is he too nice? Yes people around the club clearly want to promote his mean side, and I sort of believe he has it in him, but when things are going badly will he be able to motivate the players using the stick method?
4. His talk of the United Way - it's been music to our ears so far but I still think there is clearly a mentality problem in some elements of our team, and can see some of our lads thinking just believing is enough instead of working your bollocks off and thinking fast and creatively in every moment of every game. He is tempering this with talk of hard work which is the right thing to do, but is this message landing with players and will he have the guts to drop the stars when they don't work hard enough?
1. In a few recent games we have set up with what is clearly the wrong formation, fortunately he has had the nous to change this early on but he needs to learn from his mistakes and not put us on the back foot early on in games
2. Rushing players back from injury - this has been a big problem also in the last few games, one or two players coming back can work but when it's several it completely disrupts the team. Some of them clearly aren't ready and need minutes as subs before getting thrown back in in must win games (which lets face it right now is all of them)
3. Is he too nice? Yes people around the club clearly want to promote his mean side, and I sort of believe he has it in him, but when things are going badly will he be able to motivate the players using the stick method?
4. His talk of the United Way - it's been music to our ears so far but I still think there is clearly a mentality problem in some elements of our team, and can see some of our lads thinking just believing is enough instead of working your bollocks off and thinking fast and creatively in every moment of every game. He is tempering this with talk of hard work which is the right thing to do, but is this message landing with players and will he have the guts to drop the stars when they don't work hard enough?
I still see no reason not to give him the job and next season however his in game management has been poor and the selection yesterday was short sighted.
It looked like he just wanted to go back to a selection that had previously worked despite those players not looking ready. If only management was that easy.
It looked like he just wanted to go back to a selection that had previously worked despite those players not looking ready. If only management was that easy.
Well, that was exactly my point. After 10 matches everyone wanted Ole to get a job. It's understandable because we were on great form but at the same time it was stupid as we need to wait until the season ends to make a decision IMO. I am just not fully convinced Ole is the man for the job (and no, I don't change my opinion after each game), our attack is still mostly disjointed and we rely on individual brilliance. We should wait these 10 or so remaining matches and see how we do.
Great post Crossy. Ole should be given the job but the squad definitely needs surgery in the summer.
Set the team up wrong from the start yesterday. Should have played Fred if we were going to try and keep possession and break them down, or should have played a counter attacking team and sat back, forcing Wolves out of their own half. This much was obvious after watching them play Chelsea. Probably thought that having his best side out would be enough to win, which it should have been.
Still fully support him though, the amount of vitriol on here is pathetic. The only way to criticise him is to hold him to higher standards than Jose and LVG, despite those managers getting 2+ years and many transfers to build their team. He's also outperforming Pep and Klopp's first seasons in the PL too. On the same day, City should have been knocked out 2-1 by a Championship side. We lost by the same margin to the PL's 7th best side.
All of the people having a go were complaining that our players weren't good enough under Jose, yet now Ole is here apparently that's not the problem, the manager is. The truth is Jose had them underperforming, Ole had them overperforming. Now it's starting to level out. We need big investment in the summer, a great DoF and lots of training for fitness and tactics to prepare for next season.
Nothing has changed.
Still fully support him though, the amount of vitriol on here is pathetic. The only way to criticise him is to hold him to higher standards than Jose and LVG, despite those managers getting 2+ years and many transfers to build their team. He's also outperforming Pep and Klopp's first seasons in the PL too. On the same day, City should have been knocked out 2-1 by a Championship side. We lost by the same margin to the PL's 7th best side.
All of the people having a go were complaining that our players weren't good enough under Jose, yet now Ole is here apparently that's not the problem, the manager is. The truth is Jose had them underperforming, Ole had them overperforming. Now it's starting to level out. We need big investment in the summer, a great DoF and lots of training for fitness and tactics to prepare for next season.
Nothing has changed.
Complete bullshit. Actually if you looked at it yourself, our xG stats since Ole took over have us just behind Liverpool (with Cith top, but comfortably ahead of the rest), but with the 2nd best attack in the league over that time.
Next time if you want to try and make a point, probably actually look into it instead of claiming something that isnt true.
We're like Arsenal under the Wenger.
We've got some fantastic first XI players. And we're as good as anybody in Europe when everyone is on song. But if only one player is slightly off it, nothing quite works.
Rashford's direct risk taking is vital, Martial inside-to-out threat is vital, Lingard's movement is vital, Pogba's creativity is vital. Take any of that away and we misfire like crazy.
The squad needs better options off the bench and better contingencies on the pitch. In particular, Herrera and Matic are not good enough passers to step in when Pogba has an off day.
We've got some fantastic first XI players. And we're as good as anybody in Europe when everyone is on song. But if only one player is slightly off it, nothing quite works.
Rashford's direct risk taking is vital, Martial inside-to-out threat is vital, Lingard's movement is vital, Pogba's creativity is vital. Take any of that away and we misfire like crazy.
The squad needs better options off the bench and better contingencies on the pitch. In particular, Herrera and Matic are not good enough passers to step in when Pogba has an off day.
Also I think a full pre season of preparation will be vital for Ole. You look at since hes come in, it's been pretty much been games every 3-4 days with the very rare mid week off. That's basically motivational work and instructing them to do certain things but a lot of match preparation without that much time to actually focus on the way he wants to play. Also when you take into account the injuries, partly because all season they were prepared for a different style and then Ole takes over and has his different style. All this improves with a full pre season together, and one where we'll surely plug at least some of the gaps in our squad.
Do we have to update the title with an asterisk for the cup wins against Reading, Arsenal and Chelsea?
This is a very good point. I also wondered why he expelled the hard working squad players for the finesse primadonna types of players, all in one go.
I don't mean it in a bad way, it's just the way psychology works. If you feel entitled then you don't fight as hard as the ones that are outside.
Another negative psychological effect is that when the 2nd choices are fighting with all their willpower, and loses their spot, it is at risk they will be losing motivation to fight for the spot when they are not rewarded for good display.
The psg midfield was really strong and hard working. Towards a team like wolves which fights for life, we should have players matching this.
Ole was disappointed afterwards. In hindsight he sees the same. I hope it will reflect the next starting XI
People attacking OLE? one bad game and 2 bad results. We have a long break were the injured players will get up their fitness.
You're new here but eventually you'll understand.
He can expect a lot more of that from here if he is appointed permanent manager.
In Ole's case though it will be worse than normal. We were convinced he was the right choice based on a very small sample size of games. As such it will only take relatively small amount of bad results to make people doubt again.