Thanks for clearing that up.
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
- Start date
Bodybagged him with that you did. The crazy thing here is that you provide the facts and that other guy is the crazy one. His points would seem very reasonable 99,9% of the time on this forum. Only in this current timeline the facts is Ole is so far bossing it beyond imagination, and denying it in any way truly is delusional.
A poster yesterday actually suggested Phelan was the master tactician and Ole was just the clown making people smile. The lengths people will go to, to not give him credit, yet kiss Pochettino's arse, are just unreal.
He won 2-1 over City in 2016, won at Stamford Bridge last season (3-1) and against us this season (3-0). That's in four and a half years as the Spurs-manager.
That record is definitely really bad from someone who's apparently tactically brilliant.
And some people do the opposite. Perhaps we should just consider the possibility that they are both quite good at what they do.
There's a degree of sensationalism going on when people speak about both the managers when the reality is they're both tactically astute and know what they're doing. Some are trying to paint one as Pep and the other as Sherwood...
I'm yet to see a single person arguing that Poch's staff members are the masterminds while he is just the guy that makes people smile. So no, 'some people' do not do the opposite.
I've seen plenty of people argue that he is not good tactically, or that he is a bottler, or just lucky with Kane, and so on.
You have to give Ole credit for the way we have bounced back after the PSG defeat. I don't think you'd have expected better results from any other manager (including Sir Alex).
Ole's performances have raised expectations so much that people are using them to slate him. Goes to show just how much of a success he's been.
Here are a few things I've seen him do absolutely brilliantly:
1. Complete change in tactics, allowing more fluid attacking football. This has reduced pressure on our defense and our defensive record has been extremely impressive. Far cry from Mourinho justifying Fellaini hoofball tactics by blaming the defense.
2. Players with potential have been absolutely brilliant in his system. Pogba - world class. Rashford, Martial and Lindelof, Herrera - excellent. Some have easily forgotten how horrible Matic looked in the first half of the season. He's been tremendous as well.
3. Handling of the media. Ole doesn't stir shit up in the press and everyone knows he's 100% in United's corner and doesn't have personal agendas. Doesn't slate players in the press etc. This is the first time we're fully focussed on our football since Sir Alex.
4. Handling of the squad. Recognized that Rashford is strongest as a striker. Got rid of Fellaini as he saw no future / utility in having such a player. Didn't succumb to trying to get Lukaku and Sanchez back into form based on their price tag.
The only negative (barely) so far is the PSG game but even there we were fairly alright till Martial and Lingard got injured and our game plan went to shit. Our squad is paper thin in quality past the first 11 so it would have been extremely difficult keeping them out even with better tactics in the second half.
Ole's performances have raised expectations so much that people are using them to slate him. Goes to show just how much of a success he's been.
Here are a few things I've seen him do absolutely brilliantly:
1. Complete change in tactics, allowing more fluid attacking football. This has reduced pressure on our defense and our defensive record has been extremely impressive. Far cry from Mourinho justifying Fellaini hoofball tactics by blaming the defense.
2. Players with potential have been absolutely brilliant in his system. Pogba - world class. Rashford, Martial and Lindelof, Herrera - excellent. Some have easily forgotten how horrible Matic looked in the first half of the season. He's been tremendous as well.
3. Handling of the media. Ole doesn't stir shit up in the press and everyone knows he's 100% in United's corner and doesn't have personal agendas. Doesn't slate players in the press etc. This is the first time we're fully focussed on our football since Sir Alex.
4. Handling of the squad. Recognized that Rashford is strongest as a striker. Got rid of Fellaini as he saw no future / utility in having such a player. Didn't succumb to trying to get Lukaku and Sanchez back into form based on their price tag.
The only negative (barely) so far is the PSG game but even there we were fairly alright till Martial and Lingard got injured and our game plan went to shit. Our squad is paper thin in quality past the first 11 so it would have been extremely difficult keeping them out even with better tactics in the second half.
But but but Poch always faced teams in top form and Ole faced very poor Chelsea and Arsenal sides and got out played by Spurs*
* he didnt, Spurs tunred the screw after the hour mark. Before that we should have been 3 -0 up.
That's a fantastic stat.
Bud, we relied on De Gea against Spurs and won.
You think Poch is tactically superior;
So why could Poch not have Lloris perform like De Gea performed under Ole. Also, why could Poch not have his defense who he has worked with for years, perform as good as Ole had the Man United defence performing
No, United were taking a calculated risk and tried to dominate the game. In hindsight, a more defensive approach could perhaps have given a better result, but I thought being offensive and taking risks were the United way. Then sometimes you get beaten.
That said, I can imagine the team starting with the diamond on top against Liverpool.
I'm sold
He should get the job.
He should get the job.
Definitely different premise. Your starting point is that we have s squad to compete with these teams, and that Ole should get them to perform in perfect synergy after 2 months in charge, like managers who’ve had years (or in Tuchel’s case £200M).
Supports:Mauricio Pochettino. Check!
Excellent and sensible post. Ole is raising the bar and expectations are rising so much that there may be an irrational reaction to losing to City and Liverpool.
Whether Ole wins or loses those 2 matches does not change the fact that we need to address holes in the squad, and that a new manager will still need time to implement their philosophy and system.
Funny you should say that since Ole has been quoted on playing a lot in his playing days. Guess there's hope for all of us!
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Do you have stats for other managers as well by any chance?
Our last two managers had plenty of top flight experience, and look how that turned out. Besides, all managers start somewhere. Pep and Zidane had basically no managerial experience when they took over Barca/Madrid. Fergie had "only" managed Aberdeen before he took the United job.
Or, maybe our performance will tend to suffer when 2 of our most important attackers go off injured at the same time halfway through the match...
This is such a breath of fresh air. Jose was reduced to nothing but a depressing loon. Just seeing him speak the day before a game set a bad tone. Imagine what that was like for the players day in day out.
Ole hasn't just made it feel like a weight has been lifted off our shoulders, but that he's massaging them on a Mediterranean beach while Phelan strolls over with a cocktail.
I haven't. I'm surprised you think the Caf feels negatively about Poch.
There seems to be a (correct) acceptance that Pochettino is one of the best managers in the world and was the overwhelming favourite as manager before Ole. And now he is pretty much everyone's second choice behind our own club legend.
Just look at the treatment Klopp and Pep get on here! Attitude towards Poch is very positive.
Tactically excellent against Chelsea. Pinpointed the spaces on either side of Jorginho as the place to attack. Pushed Herrera and Pogba into that space and they score one each. Great stuff.
I have to say, every credit goes to Woodward for this appointment. It was so left field that nobody would have even thought of Ole. Now, it would be madness to choose anyone else.
I have to say, every credit goes to Woodward for this appointment. It was so left field that nobody would have even thought of Ole. Now, it would be madness to choose anyone else.
Any sniff of questioning Poch and hellohello and Amadeus are quick to jump in his defense.
He's full of contradictions and constantly moves goalposts just to prove how brilliant Poch is.
It's strange that people keep saying that Spurs dominated us for majority of the match and that DDG had to make so many godlike saves to get us out of trouble, when I remember it only being mostly happening for the last 25 minutes or so in the game, and that Lloris had to pull off a couple of super saves as well at least to keep Spurs in the game....
Amadeus would be happy for Zidane to take over Chelsea because he's a nothing coach that got carried by his players...while Poch is one of the best in the world and hasn't won anything because of a budget (forget quality of players, that only matters for Zidane).
Same people saying 'what's the rush?' will no doubt rock up in the summer to lambast the club's lack of preparations for the upcoming season.
Some players just need freedom to be at their best, Ronaldo got it under Fergie and Messi under Pep and 9 goals and 6 assist in 12 games is a pretty good fecking return if you ask me. If the other team man marks your best player (as they often do) you cant just flick a magic manager wand and suddenly give him all the space he needs. Also funny how you bring up Sarri, who right now is really struggling because he bogs down the team to much with his complicated tactics.
Also that bolded part is just completely fecking unreasonable. You expect him to punch well above his weight, after two months with a squad he just inherited and give you a "complete performance" nonetheless? Would you apply the same sky high standards to Poch if he was the one who took over in December, because as it turns out, his record against the top 6 away from home is pretty bad
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/footbal...e-terrible-away-record-against-top-sides-win/
I voted no on Ole getting the job when he was first appointed due to his time at Cardiff. Now he has changed my mind simply because I actually like watching United now and expect to win every match. The only way he won't get the job now is if we get outplayed completely by all three of City, Liverpool and PSG. We need to have those matches out of the way to make the final decision.
Even then though, being outplayed by those three wouldn't be a huge surprise? They are all considered better sides at present. Would be harsh to exclude him from consideration because we lost against teams we would be expected to lose against. Do think we will get something out of Liverpool game though.
Good post! Some have just decided they want Pochettino no matter what, which is fair enough. It becomes ridiculous when they try to qualify it though.
For all doubting OLE, its been 13 games now, the honeymoon period is well over, we played big teams PSG- spurs - arsenal - chelsea, and we won almost all of them and the performances are great, teams started to fear us again, tactical we doing well as well, what more do people what? If Ole manages to reach an FA cup final and a top 4 finsih, it is a NO BRAINER.
Losing against those teams is fairly likely for most managers. Being completely outplayed is a different thing altogether. If we compete and lose Ole should still get the job but if he is shown to be out of his depth against the absolute top sides then that should give the board pause and see what is the best option. I expect a combination of Ole and Phelan to compete with those teams but fall short due to the lack of quality in several areas of the pitch in our team.
Tuchel had time to adapt his team as they were injured well before the game. Ole had two injuries around half time.
Against Chelsea we looked so much better because he had time to find a solution.
Ole has exceeded expectations and has done better than any other manager would have in the same situation. There are still question marks because of his lack of experience at the top level, but there are also questions over Poch: does he have the killer instinct to win trophies and will he sign the right players when given a big budget?
Against Chelsea we looked so much better because he had time to find a solution.
Ole has exceeded expectations and has done better than any other manager would have in the same situation. There are still question marks because of his lack of experience at the top level, but there are also questions over Poch: does he have the killer instinct to win trophies and will he sign the right players when given a big budget?
I am all for different opinions on a forum but why are people bothering to argue with Amadeus. It’s pretty obvious now that nothing can convince him Ole is better than Poch. Always making excuses and skewing the argument for Poch while downplaying Ole.
Fair enough. Agreed.
When this thread was created the poll asked "Do you think Ole is a good interim manager".
It was obvious he was going to be and I'm still surprised so many people voted no. Whether he's the right permanent choice is a different question.