Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Do you understand what coaching is?

Lets forget about coaching. Lets ask what we are doing in training. Ole has had 10 months with this squad. His teams still can't
  • Put a passing move together
  • Put pinpoint crosses to the CF, or atleast the CF never knows where to expect a cross
  • Attack as a cohesive unit, meaning none of the front four actually knows whats going to happen next
From this I can easily deduct that these things never happen on training. If it did, we would not have witnessed the gross cluelessness while attacking. There are no patterns instilled and players just do whatever they think is the best and considering the knobheads playing for us, most of the chances go down the drain.

You talk about Matic unable to pass the ball. Have you ever witnessed that majority except for Pogba never make themselves available for an easy pass? We have a coward in Lingard, and there are acres of space in our midfield whenever one of our midfielders has possession. This results in mostly diagonal passes, sideways or backward passing. We don't play with triangles. Again, easily seen that there is feck all coaching.

We aren't qualified to be coaches but we atleast have witnessed enough football to see if a team is playing with a plan. So keep the FM stuff to yourselves and stop insulting avid watchers of the game.
I have some idea of what coaching is, yes. But i am not the one making claim its the worst since the beginning of time. I am one of those claiming you have no clue what goes behind closed doors. I am sorry, I’m sure i could have used better examples so they could easily translate!

But I’m pretty sure you don't train on basic skills every week as a senior player. Its all included in other drills. Like patterns of play..


Im not sure how to respond to your view on patterns, as i don’t see it the same way. I am not as good as Enigma 87 (You know who) or you watching games and making analysis. I am to clouded with emotions and excitement watching a game live. So i usually have to sit down another time watching the game again, having some stats in front of me. If there are things i think are good or bad, i usually freeze frame and watch the details and movements. Maybe thats why I’m not in tune, or maybe I’m not that good understanding what so many think i obvious?


My opinion i could see those patterns of play against Chelsea, Wolves, Palace and Southampton. I could see what the team was trying to do, but also that it was work in progress.

Its those margins and timing Ole is talking about. Movements are a bit off, passes don't cut it etc.

But i could see it, and the pace in it wasn’t all bad. Like I’ve posted earlier, i can see the same problems at Inter, Juventus, Atletico etc. So far this season. Its those small details that make teams click. Like I’ve also posted, i believe things like this take time. Sometimes it doesn't, when for example Sarri has laid some good foundations for Lampard to go forward. Still a bit of work, but you know what i mean. Against Leicester i didn’t see it. I saw a good tactical approach with a limited available squad. In the games i saw Leicester earlier, they created chances, but not this time. They where completely nullified. I thought this was a sensible approach given the players available. I saw the same thought behind the game against West Ham. Problem was there was a big hole in midfield. Matic and Mata couldn’t move quick enough, so the entire team was unbalanced most of the match. That again forced the wingers covering to deep to compensate, leaving Rashford isolated. My God, the kid run himself to the ground! I cant believe people are even having a go at him for that. One poster was even complaining him closing the keeper, and a few posts later he was complaining about not pressing.

But, i only saw this game once, so my emotions might cloud my judgement. Mata had a really off game to his strength to - Passing. It stopped a lot of transition play. I really don't pay to much attention to cup games with b sides of the b side -other than watching youngsters. But i respect others to believe it is the world cup. Won both games by the way. But not even if i tried i could say anything about what goes on in training just because the rhythm in the team is off. I could complain he didn’t play Fred for Matic, but truth is i don't think it would make much difference.


Nice to see you agree with Ole! He said post West Ham exactly that about taking the easy options on passing. I agree with you both, but i also think players was isolated with that big hole in midfield against West Ham. Unbalance is a real bitch in football in my opinion. But you have what you have in material..


But again, i am not the one posting 6k post every day (You know who) on how bad coaching is and how bad the manager and club is at planning. Im just saying how fecking dumb it is to claim it because you have seen it on tv. Or NOT seen it as it goes..


I listened to the presser yesterday and I think Ole does a fair assessment. I agree with him from what i have seen. I read between the lines when he say he has invested in defense -that he is not happy with a lot of things. He even address the need to work on relationships and patterns during matches, and say how disruptive having key players out is for the process. Im sure there is over 1000 posts on here claiming they don't work on it in training. You have to admit, that is a pretty embarrassing claim!? There are a few more absolutely gold comments, but lets not..


I believe there is a lot of armchair managers here trying to play football experts on things none of us know anything about. And i think a lot of posts is beyond embarrassing and stupidity. That is fine, but when it goes from opinions and turn into anti manager propaganda, you are no longer a fan. You are a glory hunter. And I think a few of them posters on here are a bit weak. They can dish it out, but cant take it back. Call manager, coaches and players all sorts. But if someone call their post embarrassing, which they truly are, then its all cry baby. Calling him Gollum? That was class! Football fans are really going south..


But if i read your second post right. We can at least agree we have no clue what goes on behind closed doors. For all we know Pogba is pushed out of the team and there is a war going on. We just don't know. But if anything has been transparent it has been the need for building a dressing room. I think Ole would rather have an unbalanced squad than have forces within the team working against him. That would make this project impossible, and its still hard because you cant ditch them all at once. If learned anything, he learned that at Cardiff.


Or maybe it is just like Enigma 87(you know who) and a few very persistent posters says, they make millions, have years and years in football. Top education and top people around them, but they don't have the ability to plan ahead or coach. They don't know the easy basics the posters are talking about, and its all to obvious. Ole studying attacking play with SAF and Mulensteen as mentors before acing his exams made him an idiot. His time with Klopp and so on made him even more dumb. Not being able to make peace in a war zone Cardiff deprive him pedigree, and he looks like Gollum, not Yasser Arafat. Making a nothing Molde to a talent factory with some success in Europa league don't count for anything. Nothing that counts anyway. So sack him!


I remember reading about Oles exams for Pro License, and his collaboration with them professors who invented fitness training for the modern football game. He should know about both if he payed any attention. And for those who are wondering. No they do not run, run and run. They play football with very high intensity and have 30 minutes with 4x4 and squats after the main session..

We could go on, but whats the point..


But the worst thing about it all. There are a lot of posters on here hoping for a loss against Arsenal so they can keep feeding on negative energy and say i told you so. Such a depressing state of mind when watching football. And with the state of the squad, they will probably have the best of times monday and tuesday..

The project is exiting! Just watching AWB every game is a joy. But then again, i don't let the obvious fails get me down, naive as i am. Bit of a rant, i know. Enjoy the weekend!
 
I’m still really happy with how things are going.

I think the football has got better, the signings have been better and the sales have been brilliant.
:lol:

Yes, all the opposition fans I know think the same. In fact they’re hoping Ole is given the job for life ....they love him!
 
I’m still really happy with how things are going.

I think the football has got better, the signings have been better and the sales have been brilliant.
:lol: Come one now. You've been delighted with relegation level form?
 
No we don't know what goes during training. But what we know is that the team can't even get a corner kick right. Cannot pass to a team mate and is always looking to pass sideways or back.
 
I don't think anyone really believes that Ole was happy without any replacement players.
But he should have been looking at more than a few options. When there was no Longstaff that seems to be it.
He should have gone for Mandzukic too. He was there on the cheap. He should have strengthened his midfield before the defence.

Completely disagree. Mandzukic is 33 and probably has only 1 good year left and we have no idea if he would actually do well in the PL. These panicky stop gap signings is what has left our squad in such a dire state in the first place.

Personal opinion, but right now i'd much prefer us ending 6th-8th while looking for young, hungry players, than scraping 4th while signing old stars/deadwood that will just be a burden 1 year later
 
Klopp finished 4th. So let’s hope we can match that.

No he wasn’t. But he had an unfit Sturridge; no Benteke and Origi who was as good as Calvin- Lewit.
He was 8th
Let me restate these facts:

Fact is, Klopp had Liverpool scoring the 2nd most goals behind Spurs since he was manager of Liverpool in that first season. 55 goals in 30 matches in fact. If you remove his first 3 months (manager bounce in October, November, and December), he had Liverpool 1st in goals scored in his first season or in other words first in goals scored since January. Since the start of February (if you want to be favorable to Ole), he had Liverpool in 1st in goals scored.You could clearly see what he wanted from his side.

Ole had United with 4th most goals since he was caretaker manager (since December) and 15th most goals since the start of February. So clearly, Ole relied on a 1 month period.

Want more damning statistics to finally shut up the Klopp comparisons? Liverpool scored 16 goals in 8 matches in the first season after Klopp had a full preseason with Liverpool. Ole currently has 8 goals in 6 matches after a full preseason. Does this mean Ole doesn't want to play attacking football like he stated after Mou was sacked? Or does this mean that he needs even more money than Klopp had at the time to get his side to play entertaining football or to even have his side play in the image that he wants? Enough with the excuses. There are excuses for results, there are no excuses for failing to coach the side into something that looks different from our boring dire football.


United fans are asking Ole to simply make our side look more fluid in attack. Our football is dire. Don't get it twisted, just because Klopp didn't get the results (due to defense), doesn't mean you couldn't see his imprint on his side. It's rewriting history to suggest that just because results didn't come that he somehow played dire football. Either that, or you guys are completely missing the point with the criticisms labeled at Ole. The bar has been lowered for all of our managers. The central point to all this is that we want to enjoy watching United play football. If we can see that, we can trust he'll get us back or at least set us off on the right track. None of them achieved this. And Ole has shown no signs of achieving this in the past 6-7 months.
The facts are that Klopp finished 8th then 4th in his first two seasons. It took investment to turn it around.
If the Glaziers were in charge of Liverpool they also would still be playing for 6th
 
The facts are that Klopp finished 8th then 4th in his first two seasons. It took investment to turn it around.
If the Glaziers were in charge of Liverpool they also would still be playing for 6th
No they would not. Let’s not pretend Liverpool’s board is much different than ours, Klopp constantly needs to wait to get his targets, and many times they fail. They just hit the jackpot hiring a very good manager while we have not. That’s the main difference.
 
How are we in relegation form if we are 8th?
Because the form extends over two seasons. Of course it was positive form over two seasons I'm sure you'd consider it relevant.

Our buys have been good. But the football has been poor. You don't have to pretend everything is going swimmingly.
 
Completely disagree. Mandzukic is 33 and probably has only 1 good year left and we have no idea if he would actually do well in the PL. These panicky stop gap signings is what has left our squad in such a dire state in the first place.

Personal opinion, but right now i'd much prefer us ending 6th-8th while looking for young, hungry players, than scraping 4th while signing old stars/deadwood that will just be a burden 1 year later

Agree about Mandzukic. Very few players could come into the PL at 33 from a new league and score 20+ goals. Why we didn't look at Ben Yedder I'll never know. He's 29, fast, very good at pressing and more importantly knows how to score goals. 317 appearances 145 goals and 44 assists. He's the perfect age to get a few seasons out of him taking the pressure off players like Rashford and Greenwood. He wanted to leave Sevilla, Sevilla wanted to sell him and his price was £30m. Very little risk in this day and age. Instead we're left with a 17 year old who'll probably lead the line against Arsenal. If we couldn't afford to pay £30m then we really are in trouble.

Even if Lukaku had of stayed we still would of needed top class back up. No one else in the squad has proved they have what it takes to play as number 9 but Lukaku leaving makes it almost criminal no one was brought in.
 
He was 8th

The facts are that Klopp finished 8th then 4th in his first two seasons. It took investment to turn it around.
If the Glaziers were in charge of Liverpool they also would still be playing for 6th

Jesus!!!! In his first full season with a summer transfer widow he finished 4th. Not 8th!!!
 
I’m about to go bed but I’m gonna leave you wit


This guy gets it

Seriously sick of hearing united fans thinking Solskjær was happy with no replacements.

Why would any manager want this?
Yeah I imagine the board tied his hands. The recent financials show that our wages were 53% of turnover in the last fiscal year and that's a worryingly high number. Maybe that explains why we flogged a number of big earners without replacing them.
 
Yeah I imagine the board tied his hands. The recent financials show that our wages were 53% of turnover in the last fiscal year and that's a worryingly high number. Maybe that explains why we flogged a number of big earners without replacing them.

You can still replace them and that wage percentage goes down. The only time it will be a problem is if we keep offering higher wages to new recruits and giving out large contracts like we did to DDG.
 
Yeah I imagine the board tied his hands. The recent financials show that our wages were 53% of turnover in the last fiscal year and that's a worryingly high number. Maybe that explains why we flogged a number of big earners without replacing them.

That's not a worryingly high number at all. It'd be quite low in the league.
 
Yeah I imagine the board tied his hands. The recent financials show that our wages were 53% of turnover in the last fiscal year and that's a worryingly high number. Maybe that explains why we flogged a number of big earners without replacing them.

Not having to pay wages for Lukaku, Valencia, Fellaini, Herrera and half of Sanchezs the club are probably saving about 35-40m a year which cuts the wage bill by about a quarter. Still no excuse for not bringing players in. Could of probably brought Bruno and Ben Yedder in for a combined wage of 10-12m. There's still a significant amount saved by the club and we'd be a lot better off playing wise which would generate even more money.
 
He was 8th

The facts are that Klopp finished 8th then 4th in his first two seasons. It took investment to turn it around.
If the Glaziers were in charge of Liverpool they also would still be playing for 6th
First, they didn't invest heavily in Liverpool at first. We outspent them for a while, up until Klopp spent it on VVD, Alison, etc... Secondly, you've missed the point entirely. A lot of us aren't results oriented. We want United to be playing great football and see that the manager is coaching (and it working) the side into his vision. The problem for all of our managers has been that portion. None of them have achieved this, so everyone could see we weren't building a side that was going to morph into something successful. Why do you think I was suddenly happy in Ole's initial period? It was because of this. I wouldn't have cared that he didn't finish in 4th with that. In fact, I was willing to ignore the entire 2nd half of his first season with United because of the excuse that he needed a pre season to instill his coaching into the players. That excuse is no longer valid. He needs to show that, and thus far, he hasn't.

And just to set the record straight, Klopp did not finish 8th. He finished 7th in his first season with Liverpool. He tied City (and West Ham) in points, during the time he was coaching. What's the point in the final table when it's based on another manager's bad results? This is beside the point though. What matters is believing in the process, and Klopp showed that he was building something, Ole hasn't.

In fact, if it was all about results, one would think that Ole was doing better than Klopp in that first season based on results. Ole had United in 3rd since he was appointed. Klopp had Liverpool 7th as I said. Guess what? It was entirely predictable that the opposite happened the very next season because obviously short term results aren't the best indicator for long term success. Liverpool clearly upgraded in attack just from Klopp's influence and this was seen with goals scored to finish that first season. Meanwhile Ole's side only got worse as the season went on so it's no surprise that we're still looking like that May 2019 side.

edit: And just to be clear, I don't want him sacked now. I want to see how he integrates the youth. If he does that, but the football is still dire and results are crap, then I want him gone at the end of the season, but I won't want him out now. I'll see Ole as a stepping stone to a greater manager to come in next season. Still, this could ruin our chance at getting someone like Sancho, so I obviously won't be happy at how impatient and inept United's board were.
 
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I’m still really happy with how things are going.

I think the football has got better, the signings have been better and the sales have been brilliant.
I don't know who you have been watching but the football really is beyond. He is back to deploying Pogba as a holding mid, just like Mourihno was doing. He is playing 4-2-3-1 again like Mourihno. The football is not worth watching.
 
The one area of the pitch that should never be neglected is the attack. To be honest none of Martial or Rashford show any signs of ever being man utd level players. Can easily be judged by how many big clubs covet any of these players the way Bayern have been pursuing Hudson Odoi etc. I said at the time it was crazy to sell Lukaku when we did. Right decision would have been to hold off for another season even if it meant getting less for him. A fee of £10m less would be worth what he would have meant for our season plus we would have a replacement lined up.
You are right, if Ole felt that Lukaku had to go we should have brought in his replacement earlier and accepted a cut on the fee, now we stand to lose more should we fail to go deep in the EL and finish in the top four. Another poor decision, don't know who to attribute it to, was going into the season without replacing Herera and Matic (any person who knows football would have seen that he is done at top level football). The holes in the squad show ridiculous it was to spend what we spent on Maguire and Wan Bissaka and when you realize that shopping on the continent would have brought in more players.
 
That's what I'm trying to say. Right now the job is such that one screw up and you're very close to the sack. Other managers might get another window or two, or a bit more time to correct their mistakes and learn, but at Man Utd, it's immediate massive pressure.

Putting Ole to the side, you must admit that's not too enticing for top managers, and also very hard conditions to succeed under.

No. Screwing up his transfer window is just one of the things. The main thing is that his been in charge 9 months and the football is rubbish, no sign of coaching to improve our players, no sign of a style of play.
 
Well he is the manager who gave Paul Pogba a full 90 minutes against a lower division side after he had just returned from injury. Ah and then proceeds to say that "it was important to give Pogba some minutes", yeah some minutes but not a full 90 given the circumstances. As for Marcus Rashford, he has been playing on and off injured for a while and the coaching staff should know this. Not to mention the high injury record already at the club, lets not forget the reports before the season even started regarding the "outdated" training methods that many feared would be putting the players at further risk of injury and miraculously look what happens.

Seriously, my respect for Ole and for what he has done for this club won't change but when you take on the role of manager you have to meet the standard, in my opinion he hasn't. Is it all his fault? Of course not and we all know what the biggest problem at the club is but this does not change the fact he is not capable to managing at this standard.
 
I've avoided this board for a while, because I couldn't handle the negativity. But is that truly what you think?

Yes. We are just relying on Blind hope. Alan Pardew could promise us all the things Ole is saying and be backed to sign Maguire, AWB and James but at the end of the day I can only judge him as a manager.. from what I’ve witnessed the more he implements his identity the worse we are getting.
 
Well he is the manager who gave Paul Pogba a full 90 minutes against a lower division side after he had just returned from injury. Ah and then proceeds to say that "it was important to give Pogba some minutes", yeah some minutes but not a full 90 given the circumstances. As for Marcus Rashford, he has been playing on and off injured for a while and the coaching staff should know this. Not to mention the high injury record already at the club, lets not forget the reports before the season even started regarding the "outdated" training methods that many feared would be putting the players at further risk of injury and miraculously look what happens.

Seriously, my respect for Ole and for what he has done for this club won't change but when you take on the role of manager you have to meet the standard, in my opinion he hasn't. Is it all his fault? Of course not and we all know what the biggest problem at the club is but this does not change the fact he is not capable to managing at this standard.
Outdated methods? People are so lazy posting so much crap.. Ole have travelled holding seminars with the people behind this, EVERY big club in the world use it! It is the same method used in small variations. Here, watch a small part of the theory behind it. It is also published as research and broken down to details on how to set it up. Common knowledge in most coaching environments..

Edit: I’m not allowed to post media links..
TED Talks on YouTube, the Norwegian method by Hoff. If it gets to complicated, just watch from 3 minutes and outward.
 
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Can you imagine if the Glazers appointed a chief executive from the Norwegian league team to manage the clubs commercial business? When it comes to generating money, they wanted the best in class but it's a pity they didn't apply the same logic to the football side of the club.
 
Worst immediate start since 92-93. He’s already under pressure for results. Patience is going to be difficult
But what were we expecting? I don't get it. Ole came to United with zero qualifications for elite club level management. His last stint in a top flight club ended in relegation. We knew this when we appointed him. Ole's only qualification (if you can call it that) was his association with the club and the fact that he made us feel good for 11 games after Joe's sacking. Since April Ole's record has been that of a manager battling relegation. If he had been manager at another club he would probably have been sacked by now. The only thing keeping Ole in a job is emotion and sentiment.
 
To those saying sack him, what’s the point if it will just be a caretaker manager stepping in probably from Ole’s own backroom staff? It’s a nonsense, Allegri is the only top level manager available.
 
To those saying sack him, what’s the point if it will just be a caretaker manager stepping in probably from Ole’s own backroom staff? It’s a nonsense, Allegri is the only top level manager available.

Same as always. We have an opportunity to get top 4. We have to get it. Our 'long term' future and summer transfers depend on it.

Ole is not getting us top 4.
 
You are right, if Ole felt that Lukaku had to go we should have brought in his replacement earlier and accepted a cut on the fee, now we stand to lose more should we fail to go deep in the EL and finish in the top four. Another poor decision, don't know who to attribute it to, was going into the season without replacing Herera and Matic (any person who knows football would have seen that he is done at top level football). The holes in the squad show ridiculous it was to spend what we spent on Maguire and Wan Bissaka and when you realize that shopping on the continent would have brought in more players.

Unfortunately it looks like the people who were saying the Lukaku money will be spent on Maguire rather than a direct replacement were actually spot on. I didn't want to believe it either at the time but sadly looks like that was true.

We all know we needed to sign a striker too but obviously the yankee leeches just weren't willing to part with any more money.
 
Fecking hell! The absolute state of that squad..

Yup exactly.

Imagine such a dire squad still having better defensive mid, central mid, attacking mid, and striker options than us!! Maybe even a better winger with Lallana vs Dan James (hopefully James can prove this to be false).
 
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