The team Ole inherited is better than the one Jose inherited. If you are going to downplay Jose winning both the Europa League and League cup in his first season then I wonder what people expect from Solskjaer this season.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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At every club he worked at, Mourinho's best came either in the first or second season. He collapsed at Madrid, he collapsed at Chelsea, and it was entirely predictable he would collapse at United, too. He was grumbling throughout the second half of 2017/18, he publicly attacked the players at every opportunity, most notably at the Sevilla press conference. Our style of play was absolutely unwatchably awful, I could barely name a good performance in the calendar year of 2018. Yeah, yeah, "he wasn't backed" - but it all clearly started to turn sour long before the summer of 2018.
So yeah, his usual methods gave us the peak of 2nd. It was only ever going to be downhill from there.
Yes he wouldn't be on £350k, BUT even Taibi is less of a flop than Sanchez! So you really cant put De Gea in that bracket!
City in 16/17 spent 213.5m EUR
17/18 - 317.5m EUR
18/19 - 78.5m EUR
Total - 609.5m
Liverpool in 16/17 spent 80m EUR
17/18 - 174m EUR
18/19 - 182m EUR
Total - 436m
Jose spent 432m - The Sanchez deal was a swap.
When Jose was outspending Klopp he arguably did better in both seasons. Last year one got the biggest budget he had so far and Mourinho wasn't backed.
I'm not saying Jose was a success or he wasn't backed in the first two seasons - to me he had to win PL or CL to be one, but the notion that Klopp or Pep didn't spend to be miles ahead of us is completely untrue.
Also bear in mind that our style under LvG was vastly different to what Jose style is, hence the needed reinforcements.
It's not his fault he inherited a much different to his liking team, it's his fault that he didn't manage to improve certain areas with the money he had.
Which managers have lasted longer than 3 years at Chelsea and Real Madrid? Which manager has lasted longer than 3 post SAF and under Woodward? All three clubs have questionable board rooms.
Not sure where the inaccuracy is, we were miles behind Liverpool and City when he was sacked and we were at same level when he was hired.
Pep did spend a shit ton, true.
Klopp spent a roughly similar amount as Mourinho from a weaker starting position while selling his best player. There is simply no defending Mourinho compared to Klopp. Again: similar spending, worse starting position, selling his best player yet by the time Mourinho got fired they were miles ahead. Klopp spent the money a lot better, coached his players a lot better, did a lot better job.
I'm not talking about him being a flop, I'm talking about having a player on daft wages that no one else will touch because he's massively on the decline
Here we go
If you actually read his post there isn't much wrong with it. We all thought the manager can do better than 81 points with what he had, and we haven't come close since. Nor do we look likely to.
I think that it upsets you we had our best season under a manager you clearly hate, so anything that's not a bitter post towards Jose is stamped as "fanboy worshippers"
Yeah it clearly upsets me that club I supported did well. Don't assume everyone is like you, who hates Manutd player and start posting nonsense about him no matter what he does.
There are people who can give credit for the work and also criticize them. I gave credit to Jose for his first season and winning Europa league but when you judge his work over 2.5 years, he took us backwards and the gap between us and top teams increased.
Post i replied was wrong. Jose was backed as much as klopp was, Liverpool had great seasons winning bigger trophies and very stable team, on the other hand we ended up with shit squad.
I don't hate him, I just don't rate his work as highly as others.
Except Mourinho was given a lot more money to fix that (net spend).
I see, so when Mourinho fails, it's the board's fault at every club, when he succeeds, it's his genius.
But you don't worship him, no.
They both spent about 150 million. No one told Ole to sell Lukaku. If we don't score enough goals that’s his problem.
No, but its not as black and white as you make out.
So both spend same money? Jose didn't even lose his best player, Klopp did. They backed him just like ManUtd backed Jose. They had great results to show for the investment, we had nothing. Yeah about time Jose fans give their head a wobble and see how different everything was from Klopp and Liverpool.
He definitely did do a terrible job, if you look at his full tenure here and the aftermath.
The aftermath proves he did well to get us to 81 points and that the summer window before he was fired was atrocious.
I think using Sanchez was a horrible example. I think what he's trying to say is giving de Gea a giant new contract would be like when we gave Rooney a giant new contract. Legend for the club, formally world class, but on the decline with a contract nobody will touch.
I think that's what he's saying anyway.
2.5 years, shit loads of money and more holes in the team than swiss cheese but he didn't do terrible job and wasn't backed.
I think we tried to sign Longstaff but were priced out. I expect us to be back in for him next Summer, as well as for Rice and maybe Maddison if Pogba leaves.
2.5 years, shit loads of money and more holes in the team than swiss cheese but he didn't do terrible job and wasn't backed.
Yeah and the board are fantastic. Thanks for the debate, I’m off.
Lukaku was openly pushing for a transfer and obviously Ole wanted a replacement which he didn't get. Bit weird to shove the blame on Ole instead of Ed. It's not like Ole didn't say anyone that left would need to be replaced. It's not like Ole didn't say he wanted the club's transfer business to be done early (before pre-season started). Ed and co. failed in both regards.
True that he did a lot better, he also had almost a full season to asses the squad and zero expectations which Jose didn't.
Jose is a manager that needs backing and produces results like he has shown in the past. He's not one that works under budget. Club knew that when he hired him. First two seasons he did good and he was backed. As soon as he didn't the natural progression was what happened.
It's true that he should be held responsible for not spending the money that well, but also it's true that the board knew what they were getting and still didn't back him in the last season. When they did the results were I'd say good.
How did Klopp spend more than us to be ahead?
Do you think adding Maguire last season would have transformed the team into 90+ points team? Klopp also lost his best player and then reinvested the money, something Jose never had to face.
So after 3 summer window, both spent same amount of money (Liverpool way less going by net spend) but Liverpool have one of the strongest team thanks to the profile of players Klopp wanted and his coaching methods, on the other hand we have average one thanks to the profile of players Jose signed and his coaching methods.
Ole could've vetoed that transfer since we didn't get a replacement.
It’s somewhat clutching at straws to constantly reference our points total. I don’t really care. Neither to the majority of our fanbase I would guess. What matters is we never came close to challenging that season and he clearly couldn’t build upon that.
He was a terrible manager for us and now he’s gone, move on.
He wanted to leave because Ole did not want him. It is very possible that Ed let Ole down as well, I’ll give you that.
No manager would have challenged with that squad. That’s the point.
Or it means the United infrastructure for identifying and prioritising transfer targets suck major balls, which is the most likely reason.
No, they are the reason why Jose was competing with Bournemouth after spending nearly/around 400 million.
Klopp wanted VVD in 2017-18 summer window, didn't see him throwing his toys out when he couldn't sign him. They waited and got him 6 months later, while Klopp was continuing his work. On the other hand, everything should be perfect for Mr. Toxic man. CB wasn't signed and somehow from 2nd we were competing with likes of Bournemouth.
Jose is a checkbook manager - you, me, everyone knows that. If you want results you have give him money. As said when the board backed him he produced.
They knew who they were getting, most probably they promised him he would be backed every season.
And be stuck with a player that didn't fit his system, didn't want to be here, didn't show up for training, leaked training info, and openly confessed his love for another manager and wish to play in a different league? Stuck between a rock and a hard place.
And somehow the team that was signing Andy fecking Carroll, Benteke started to sign players like Salah, Fabinho. Must be great coincidence that their recruitment improved once Klopp took over.
Jose actually booted Lukaku from Chelsea for not being good enough when they were both there. It's almost like he brought Lukaku to Man United as a deliberate sabotage! I wouldn't put it past him tbh
.We gave him money and he didn't challenge for the league, embarrassed vs Sevilla in CL. He was backed but his results wasn't good enough.
Pretty sure Commoli had left by then?
It's not like he has shown since his tenure that he values him as a first team member did he? He knew he was most likely going for the whole transfer season and we didn't even bring in a squad player in his place.
Thing is, if a manager has to break transfer records EVERY SINGLE SEASON to produce acceptable results, then that manager isn't very good.
Let's note that even in 2018, Mourinho still got a young talented full-back and a 50M central midfielder on top of a squad that had finished second and did not lose a single important player. Justifying his utter and absolute collapse with "he wasn't backed" is disingenuous: it would have been perfectly reasonable to expect that the team remains solid, hard to beat, and fights for top 3. Instead we were 11 points behind Chelsea when he got the sack.
What kind of fecking attitude is this? Go somewhere else with your poison. Yes it is obviously allowed to be critical of a manager when he you think he is making mistakes, but slaughtering him before he has made those mistakes is just garbage.
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Mourinho certainly couldn’t challenge with that squad, and he spent hundreds of millions on it. It was his squad. That’s the point.
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