Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[croadyman]

I enjoyed the win but not the performance. Again individual brilliance bailed us out. He is not going to win us anything. Any decent team would have scored all those chances. DeGea saved us the game. Once again.

Yeah pleased we managed to get the win at the death, however like you say he is still too reliant on individual brilliance and as you saw on Saturday there are plenty of games where that strategy will catch up with us again

 

[Amadaeus]

Am I good to say we rode our luck @Wumminator?

Regardless, it has been three years. If anyone is still undecided about Ole at United, they haven't been watching enough of ours game. Today was a very typical performance that we have seen countless of time. We played bad, but somehow won. This will not work against better opponents that are clinical.

 

[pocco]

I see “individual brilliance” has become the new “no patterns of play”

thought the team selection was fine
thought the subs were good
we won

Cheers.

Nah some of us recognised it ages ago. Bruno practically changed our fortunes with unreal numbers and trying things to bail us out. When we passed up on him the summer before was nearly a fecking disaster. Thank god Spurs managed to mess up his signing too.

 

[L1nk]

I see “individual brilliance” has become the new “no patterns of play”

thought the team selection was fine
thought the subs were good
we won

Cheers.

This is the lowering of standards in full effect, drink it in everyone.

 

[Wumminator]

Am I good to say we rode our luck @Wumminator?

Yes, thought this was a poor performance overall. Need to be better.

 

[pocco]

Am I good to say we rode our luck @Wumminator?

Regardless, it has been three years. If anyone is still undecided about Ole at United, they haven't been watching enough of ours game. Today was a very typical performance that we have seen countless of time. We played bad, but somehow won. This will not work against better opponents that are clinical.

Not even just better opponents. We'll come unstuck against all sorts of teams this season. I'm 50/50 on whether we'll get out of the group stages in the CL after tonight. I'd say we've played 2 of the 3 easiest fixtures in the group as I think Atalanta will be tough and more capable in attack. To have struggled our way through those 2 games doesn't bode well for me.

 

[Yagami]

Hopefully getting away with that can be a catalyst for this team to increase the intensity and build some momentum

Thing is, since taking over, there's been countless examples of these performances where we hope it's a turning point and we start playing with the same intensity we do when we're losing but we never do. Unfortunately, I don't see this being any different.

Against Everton, we'll probably press for the first few mins like tonight, and then settle into our usual passive approach until something wakes us up like conceding.

 

[Foxbatt]

He had no idea what to do while they ran amok. Yes Dalot was not our first choice RB and was getting skinned all the time. He should have changed it during the first half. Not necessarily the subs but the whole set up. Greenwood on the right and Ronaldo and Sancho are not going to help our full backs. Pogba so far up front was getting our midfield murdered. We never had control of the midfield even for a moment.
Cavani was the obvious sub to come on. I bet 95% of CAF would also have put on Cavani as a sub. I feel that we would get out of the group stages with the players we have but would eventually lose in the quarters. We are not going to win any trophies playing like this. Yes we were missing AWB and Shaw but Maguire would not have made any difference tonight. Lindelof did his job and his one v ones were good in not getting beaten for pace.

 

[Amadaeus]

Yes, thought this was a poor performance overall. Need to be better.

Definitely agreed, but this isn't the first time and I am quite sure, it won't be the last. If things does not improve, I don't know how much longer he can ride such luck.

 

[ayushreddevil9]

He can't keep getting away with results. The poor performances will catch up soon.

 

[James35]

Can't wait for him to be gone...but unfortunately for me at least he will be here for a while yet.

Excited to see what a better manager can do with this squad.

 

[Adamsk7]

This is the lowering of standards in full effect, drink it in everyone.

Not at all. I want and expect us to win every game, as I should. I’m also practical. We are improving season on season IMO. It’s still early and there are lots of teams that haven’t kicked in to gear - Chelsea have just lost two in a row (good teams though fair enough), City aren’t looking too hot without a striker, Barca and Madrid are all over the show, Juve doing terrible in the league. We’ve got a LOT of players and the first eleven is going to take some time to settle in to place and show itself.

People forget some of the champions league games we lost in the Fergie years against so called lesser opposition. Especially Spanish teams. “Fergie time” was coined basically because we’d been playing shite and got a last minute winner! Just like tonight.

I see I shouldn’t post in here though. I’m not rabid “Ole out” enough

 

[Womp]

It really is upsetting. I love the man and wanted him to do so well, but the concerns I've had for a while now are just becoming more and more obvious. I still hope he can turn it around, but it's been very clear to me for some time now that he simply isn't up to it.

All the talk was always about more players, get better players etc. never about how he is actually improving the collective of the squad. You can mock 'patterns of play' etc. and think it isn't prevalent but it is the most important aspect in football now imo. Too many teams have great squads, we can't rely on just having a team that is far better than our opposition every game anymore. The difference at the top is the tactical ability, the collective style etc.

It's not just Ole - the whole club seems to be stuck in the past. Only the summer gone by did we finally get in a director of football. We need to be proactive, due to being reactive we missed out on countless great managers, having to resort to whatever is left, but I highly doubt we will. This club's inability to see trends before they are blindingly obvious to everyone is it's weakest attribute imo.

 

[RonaldoVII]

Positive changes got him out of jail but not sure how he can pick McTominay as the sitting midfielder when he's always been terrible there and then to have Pogba next to him to make matters worse.

 

[#07]

Thing is, since taking over, there's been countless examples of these performances where we hope it's a turning point and we start playing with the same intensity we do when we're losing but we never do. Unfortunately, I don't see this being any different.

Against Everton, we'll probably press for the first few mins like tonight, and then settle into our usual passive approach until something wakes us up like conceding.

We are such a weird team in this way.

So often we start matches on the front foot, we look like we might score. Villa was the same. If Bruno or Mason take their early chances...

But when we don't make it count there's little a collective loss of belief. It's like across the pitch the players are thinking: 'The early pressure hasn't worked, now what?" And they sink into this kind of slump of just tapping the ball around aimlessly, like they're in a state of disbelief and fear.

As you say it tends to go on until we concede, and they suddenly have no choice but to go for broke, or Bruno does some mad, off the cuff thing that works out. Then once we score, like tonight, everyone comes alive. It's so strange seeing happen in real time.

Why can't these players have the same belief all the time? For me that's the biggest question Ole has to answer. And it's not about once we score other teams come out. Cos Villarreal didn't change their approach once we scored. We just got better. Better pressing, better passing, better defensive concentration. All just cos Telles scored a worldie.

For me, above everything else, that's the biggest thing I want to see Ole address.

Sir Alex was the best of that. You always knew, at some stage, a United siege was coming. His teams had such a strong sense of belief, which came from him. His players just had that assurance that if they kept playing their game it'd come. With Ole you see the belief's shaky. The players lose themselves within games. Ole's gotta show he can change the mindset of this squad.

 

[redshaw]

Another good round of subs from Ole to change the game. He's been right about Lingard being able to contribute.

Something very amiss with the preparations and setup at the start of so many games, for a long spell in the second half Villarreal didn't do much but the damage could've been easily done before that. We play half way in half way out and start playing for real when we concede as we have nothing to lose then.

 

[SirScholes]

Not at all. I want and expect us to win every game, as I should. I’m also practical. We are improving season on season IMO. It’s still early and there are lots of teams that haven’t kicked in to gear - Chelsea have just lost two in a row (good teams though fair enough), City aren’t looking too hot without a striker, Barca and Madrid are all over the show, Juve doing terrible in the league. We’ve got a LOT of players and the first eleven is going to take some time to settle in to place and show itself.

People forget some of the champions league games we lost in the Fergie years against so called lesser opposition. Especially Spanish teams. “Fergie time” was coined basically because we’d been playing shite and got a last minute winner! Just like tonight.

I see I shouldn’t post in here though. I’m not rabid “Ole out” enough

This is the same performance that Ole has served up for years so it’s not new
A new cb and a new striker in Ronaldo….the team shouldn’t need to gel

we are lucky we aren’t out of the group after just two games, I’ll be pleasantly surprised if we make it out watching that.

he’s a below average manager surviving because we have a great team.

to wrap it up I think it’s almost criminal that this great group of players will win fck all due to the incompetent manager that we have in place.

 

[laughtersassassin]

Because opponents run through us like a dodgy curry through yer belly. The double pivot gives us a more secure platform.

It's 1 game of 433 mate. Sample size too small

 

[mckenzie79]

We all want ole to do well, because of who he is. I'm desperate for him to lift a major trophy,but he won't. His game management is awful, his subs are awful. He relies on world class players to do what they do, win games.

This is the best team Manchester United have had since Fergie , be under now illusions, don't complain about the Glazers, this is a world class squad. We should be beating 99% of the teams in the world. The pressure is on, I hope Ole does it, but in my opinion he won't even get close.

 

[passing-wind]

I'd take winning ugly if it promised at the very least a trophy at the end of the campaign but under Ole it's just not sustainable. I've nothing to say same narrative different cover, woeful performance and 3 points which is fundamentally all that matters. When on a losing run the most important element is a win so hopefully the manager and the players reset after tonight.

 

[redIndianDevil]

How are there still more fans backing OGS? Do you people have no eyes or are just masochists? It’s utterly shameful that we get outplayed by any decent team with a plan.

 

[pocco]

I'd take winning ugly if it promised at the very least a trophy at the end of the campaign but under Ole it's just not sustainable. I've nothing to say same narrative different cover, woeful performance and 3 points which is fundamentally all that matters. When on a losing run the most important element is a win so hopefully the manager and the players reset after tonight.

We've been here before already this season. Lingard late goal Vs West Ham. What was the reaction to that win? Let's just face it, those that say we rely on moments of individual inspiration or luck are spot on. We won't know until it happens, the rest of the time we'll look crap and drop points. Thankfully we have a boatload of attackers that can change a game or provide a moment. Ole has insulated himself well in that sense. He's got attackers sitting at home that would play for most teams.

 

[Idxomer]

As someone here said before, he really doesn't know what a midfield is.

 

[criticalanalysis]

So often we start matches on the front foot, we look like we might score. Villa was the same. If Bruno or Mason take their early chances...

But when we don't make it count there's little a collective loss of belief. It's like across the pitch the players are thinking: 'The early pressure hasn't worked, now what?" And they sink into this kind of slump of just tapping the ball around aimlessly, like they're in a state of disbelief and fear.

This can be very easily explained. The first 10-20 mins are based on basic instructions e.g 'go press, don't let them settle' and adrenaline.

After teams figure that they can calmly pass through our uncoordinated press, our player's motivation drop because there's only so much ineffective running can get you when it doesn't come off. So after that, they start to revert to default, which is a combination of playing square or hero balls (almost no inbetween or nuace) as they are pretty much left to their own devices because there aren't 'patterns of plays'.

 

[croadyman]

Can't wait for him to be gone...but unfortunately for me at least he will be here for a while yet.

Excited to see what a better manager can do with this squad.

Yeah so am I pal but stand by for the top reds and staunch supporters of his to make that opinion feel most unwelcome, however very glad to see that many of the fanbase have certainly not been blinded by this result tonight either

 

[croadyman]

How are there still more fans backing OGS? Do you people have no eyes or are just masochists? It’s utterly shameful that we get outplayed by any decent team with a plan.

Because anyone who isn't in the "support your manager til the bitter end" is treated like scum by members of that club

 

[#07]

This can be very easily explained. The first 10-20 mins are based on basic instructions e.g 'go press, don't let them settle' and adrenaline.

After teams figure that they can calmly pass through our uncoordinated press, our player's motivation drop because there's only so much ineffective running can get you when it doesn't come off. So after that, they start to revert to default, which is a combination of playing square or hero balls as they are pretty much left to their own devices.

What you are describing may account for why we lose our way in games. However, it doesn't account for why we find it again usually after scoring.

We've picked up more points from losing positions than anyone in England since Ole was appointed. So this would suggest it's a trend. Once we score the team changes, in a way that's difficult to understand.

As you point out, clearly, the instructions aren't changing that much. They can't. The coaching staff isn't really in a position to alter them that much. So what accounts for the upticks we see? Because we've seen a lot of them.

United will have these 20-30 minute bursts where players are suddenly making connections, hitting 1-2s, switches of play, pressing in a more coordinated fashion. Wherever it's coming from its coming from somewhere. So where?

 

[BorisManUtd]

Positive changes got him out of jail but not sure how he can pick McTominay as the sitting midfielder when he's always been terrible there and then to have Pogba next to him to make matters worse.

That, combined with Dalot and Telles (he had to pick those two of course) as full backs was a recipe for disaster, plus Sancho and Greenwood aren't exactly that helpful at the back.

 

[Green_Red]

It has to be said, that Villareal team are extremely organised in defence. When they lost possession they dropped in brilliantly. I watched them as they dropped into the box and they defended in two lines of 4 with about 2 meters between each player at times. Impossible to break down.

Their LW had a field day against Dalot, who proved tonight why he is not first choice for us. Next time he comes out in the media complaining about game time he should be shipped out.

They had plenty of chances too, lucky for us De Gea is back to his best.

Midfield continues to be a huge problem for us. The old saying that title winning teams are built on defenses is true, but titles are won by top midfields. Try and name a title winning team that didn't have one absolutely world class midfielder. Hard to watch this midfield when we've been privileged to watch the likes of Scholsey dictate games from there.

As for Ole, the super sub continues to make super subs.

Bruno looks nowhere near where he was when he joined us, not sure why, but he isn't taking as many risks as he used to, form is temporary though so he will no doubt find a vein of form and get back to his absolute best.

We're in a bad patch with some tough games coming up. The manager and the coaching staff need to find form for this team quickly or we could find ourselves well on the outside of a title race before the beginning of December.

This was always going to be the year Oles goodwill with the fans ran out and he was going to get judged. Other supporters shouldn't be surprised when he gets judged.

 

[croadyman]

It has to be said, that Villareal team are extremely organised in defence. When they lost possession they dropped in brilliantly. I watched them as they dropped into the box and they defended in two lines of 4 with about 2 meters between each player at times. Impossible to break down.

Their LW had a field day against Dalot, who proved tonight why he is not first choice for us. Next time he comes out in the media complaining about game time he should be shipped out.

They had plenty of chances too, lucky for us De Gea is back to his best.

Midfield continues to be a huge problem for us. The old saying that title winning teams are built on defenses is true, but titles are won by top midfields. Try and name a title winning team that didn't have one absolutely world class midfielder. Hard to watch this midfield when we've been privileged to watch the likes of Scholsey dictate games from there.

As for Ole, the super sub continues to make super subs.

Bruno looks nowhere near where he was when he joined us, not sure why, but he isn't taking as many risks as he used to, form is temporary though so he will no doubt find a vein of form and get back to his absolute best.

We're in a bad patch with some tough games coming up. The manager and the coaching staff need to find form for this team quickly or we could find ourselves well on the outside of a title race before the beginning of December.

This was always going to be the year Oles goodwill with the fans ran out and he was going to get judged. Other supporters shouldn't be surprised when he gets judged.

Well when you listen to the fans chanting his name tonight then hardly looks like the goodwill is running out with the matchgoers

 

[Suedesi]

The Ole in crowd will cherish the result and the Ole out crowd will tear down the performance.

Nothing to see here

 

[criticalanalysis]

What you are describing may account for why we lose our way in games. However, it doesn't account for why we find it again usually after scoring.

We've picked up more points from losing positions than anyone in England since Ole was appointed. So this would suggest it's a trend. Once we score the team changes, in a way that's difficult to understand.

As you point out, clearly, the instructions aren't changing that much. They can't. The coaching staff isn't really in a position to alter them that much. So what accounts for the upticks we see? Because we've seen a lot of them.

United will have these 20-30 minute bursts where players are suddenly making connections, hitting 1-2s, switches of play, pressing in a more coordinated fashion. Wherever it's coming from its coming from somewhere. So where?

Again it can be explained very easily because we have a stacked squad, which despite the criticism actually do give a feck and have tons of quality. That adrenaline and inspiration can be seen at the start of games (as explained above) and obviously when we are a goal down because the natural urgency is to chase the game and raise the tempo; it's just competitive spirit and I guess human psychology.

The issue is that without clear coaching and tactics, that energy and quality can only shine in bursts or rather it's being channelled in the wrong methods/areas e.g Bruno pressing high like a mad man and trying high risk passes is good effort but poor implentation as it's not in line with the rest of the team.

Why is it surprising, that these players can find a second wind after playing poorly for a while in one 90min game? No one is questioning the quality, technique and talent of your Pogbas, Brunos, Greenwoods etc. They're questioning why they can't sustain or showcase their talents consistently. That's entirely down on the manager.

 

[Bastian]

The Ole in crowd will cherish the result and the Ole out crowd will tear down the performance.

Nothing to see here

This place isn't as polarised as it's made out to be. There are some who hate Ole, and there are some who are really smug about their unconditional support for him, but plenty who have doubts, or don't think he's good enough, who'll cherish every win.

Personally, am delighted with the win, and despite my huge doubts about Ole, am hoping this will serve as some sort of a catalyst for the team's self belief, showing more aggression and bravado going forward. There are some big characters in the team and I feel like our season relies more on how they pull the collective together, than it does on whether Ole has it in him to become a top manager. You could see what it meant to the team (most of them anyway) and that's very healthy.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

The Ole in crowd will cherish the result and the Ole out crowd will tear down the performance.

Nothing to see here

People who aren't convinced about Ole cherish the result too.

It's just not sustainable though. These performances need to improve.

 

[MichaelRed]

People who aren't convinced about Ole cherish the result too.

It's just not sustainable though. These performances need to improve.

Absolutely. People are Ole out because they want the club to be successfull so of course they're happy when we win a match. Crazy that people think Ole outers actually want the club to fail. If I wanted to see United fail I'd be calling for more years of Solskjaer.

 

[Womp]

Absolutely. People are Ole out because they want the club to be successfull so of course they're happy when we win a match. Crazy that people think Ole outers actually want the club to fail. If I wanted to see United fail I'd be calling for more years of Solskjaer.

Yep.

 

[croadyman]

This place isn't as polarised as it's made out to be. There are some who hate Ole, and there are some who are really smug about their unconditional support for him, but plenty who have doubts, or don't think he's good enough, who'll cherish every win.

Personally, am delighted with the win, and despite my huge doubts about Ole, am hoping this will serve as some sort of a catalyst for the team's self belief, showing more aggression and bravado going forward. There are some big characters in the team and I feel like our season relies more on how they pull the collective together, than it does on whether Ole has it in him to become a top manager. You could see what it meant to the team (most of them anyway) and that's very healthy.

Totally nailed it here and can say I definitely fall into the don't think he's good enough but still enjoy winning games anyway

 

[Ole's screen]

Absolutely. People are Ole out because they want the club to be successfull so of course they're happy when we win a match. Crazy that people think Ole outers actually want the club to fail. If I wanted to see United fail I'd be calling for more years of Solskjaer.

Well not really because Ole seems to be guaranteeing us a level we've been struggling to maintain which is consistent top 4 team. The question is if he can take us to the next level and we'll see that over the course of this season, but if I wanted to see United fail I'd advocate we fire our manager every time we have 3-4 poor performances.

 

[MichaelRed]

Well not really because Ole seems to be guaranteeing us a level we've been struggling to maintain which is consistent top 4 team. The question is if he can take us to the next level and we'll see that over the course of this season, but if I wanted to see United fail I'd advocate we fire our manager every time we have 3-4 poor performances.

If you're implying we've only had 3-4 poor performances under Ole then you're being very disingenuous. We've played dire football under him since the PSG game that got him his job. We're no more entertaining in our style of play than we were under Mourinho, the only difference being we have more exciting & higher quality players now. He has got us top 4 twice, hardly an insane run, and he has done so with significantly better players than his predecessors.

 

[Sviken]

We don't look like a team. There is zero cohesion in anything this team does. Once again Ole is saved by Ronaldo, but how long can that keep going? If Ole doesn't have an idea what to do, then fecking find someone who does. And I don't necessarily mean a manager, although that would be preferable, but an actual experienced coach who has a credit to his name and not these clowns McKenna and Carrick. I'm fecking sick of important jobs at the club being given to club legends because they once played for United. Sentimentality Buddies FC. Quite frankly we look shambles in everything we're trying to do and that's distressing to see. It's disgusting to watch every team against us play like prime Barcelona. I can't even feel much joy in this victory because it is so underserved. Hopefully we get out of the groups, but it feels like just delaying the inevitable at the moment. Even Ole fans must have come to the realization that he doesn't have a clue what he is doing and simply feel obligated to support him because he is a United legend.

If I wanted to see United fail I'd be calling for more years of Solskjaer.

Just like every rival fan does.