“So you invoiced Spurs a total of £1bn for their completed new stadium project, now you’ve reviewed ours, how much?” , “£3bn” , “How much?!”, “£2.5bn” , “2.5?!” , £2bn..” , “So double the cost of Spurs?” , “Getting towards £2bn……Hello….”
Old Trafford revamp/could be torn down and rebuilt according to Glazer plans
- Thread starter GE
- Start date
I'd rather United be banished than play home games in the awful part of the country.
It'd be 50% bigger than Spurs's. So straight away you're looking at £1.5b+. But yeah an insane amount. Surely only the Sheikhs would spend that type of cash.
Avram was caught
A stadium rebuild held Arsenal back for many many seasons. I think United's finances like many other clubs at the moment are not too healthy...so fans might have to decide if its success on the pitch or a new stadium?
The new owners will be paying over the true value of the club to get if off the Glazers, plus a new stadium and some shiny new players...not to mention getting rid of the existing debt.
The new owners will be paying over the true value of the club to get if off the Glazers, plus a new stadium and some shiny new players...not to mention getting rid of the existing debt.
Yes totally agree on all counts. I just find it hilarious that, of course if reports are correct, an extra half billion is thrown in here and there like it’s peanuts. No surprise at all that United won’t be low balled with any quotes, or in that the Glazers wont pay it. But to be fair that would make it, maybe, the second most expensive stadium in the world?!
I know the club own the transit hub beside OT but I don't think they could shut that down. And probably couldn't even build over much if any of it.
Back in 1992 we demolished the Stretford End and rebuilt it while continuing to play in the stadium so I don't know if that would be an option for all the stands in phases.
These Wembley suggestions are a bit odd. Some of you do realise London and Manchester are some 200 miles apart?
Yeah but all are fans would be within walking distance of the ground.
The price of materials has rocketed since the Spurs stadium was tendered.
Old Trafford is like an old family home. You can't fathom ever leaving it because you think the building was what made everything special, when in reality it was just a bunch of bricks that housed what was actually important.
The fans and players will make a new stadium special. I've changed my vote to rebuild because of that, just as long as the stadium has a bit of character to it.
The fans and players will make a new stadium special. I've changed my vote to rebuild because of that, just as long as the stadium has a bit of character to it.
I'm not sure in that respect that OT is as iconic, it's a million miles from what it originally was and it's a vastly different from when I first went in the 70's, Lambeau field is only used for it's main purpose about a dozen times a year
In an ideal world they would have moved the pitch towards the Ship Canal when they built what is now the SAF stand, that wasn't an option then as there was a public (United) road that was the only access to industrial estates behind the stadium (I used to drive down there every weekday)
Funny thing is we’d sell out Etihad week in week out. Something City cannot do. Manchester is red.
Not necessarily, depends on the design
So, we can't just do what Barca and Real are doing by improving the existing structure and modernising it? Or are there complications we face that they didn't?
Knocking the stadium down to rebuild seems wrong to me. Re-developing is much more in keeping with what's happened to it over the years.
I don't know exactly what leads people to call it a "shithole"? When the weather is grim, as it was at a few games recently, people get wet in the bottom of the 1st tier. I'm sure I've felt the rain when the wind has been vicious in my seat in middle of 1st tier Stretford End. But aside from that? I went to the old wembley and even as a kid was astonished at how ramshackle that was, OT is nowhere near that level. Plus, in terms of modern stadiums, the new Wembley is shiny but pretty soulless and definitely not fit for purpose. I still get flashbacks to the rivers of piss at HT at one final. Maybe it didn't occur to the designers that vast numbers of fans would want a drink and then a piss in a short period at HT? Clearly not. So you end up with a crap stadium, it's just that it cost £££ and is more shiny. The pragmatic option is surely to renovate.
Even if you agree with a complete demolition/rebuild, do you have faith that can be done well? Which is a big caveat on that option, surely? That option is surely "I think the stadium is currently not fit for purpose, but I reckon a stadium I've never seen designed and built completely out of my control will be loads better"!
Plus, the club shelled out loads of cash a few seasons back to make the stadium better for disabled access, making changes to both ends. They've invested, albeit not enough, but come on, the stadium isn't currently too bad? Maybe I'm spoilt? W203 is fine. I'm happy to hear about other bits that aren't? MInd you, one area that has affected me (& others ) is their refusal/unwillingness to fix the platform at the ground. Train access stopped in about 2017 and has never resumed.
I don't know exactly what leads people to call it a "shithole"? When the weather is grim, as it was at a few games recently, people get wet in the bottom of the 1st tier. I'm sure I've felt the rain when the wind has been vicious in my seat in middle of 1st tier Stretford End. But aside from that? I went to the old wembley and even as a kid was astonished at how ramshackle that was, OT is nowhere near that level. Plus, in terms of modern stadiums, the new Wembley is shiny but pretty soulless and definitely not fit for purpose. I still get flashbacks to the rivers of piss at HT at one final. Maybe it didn't occur to the designers that vast numbers of fans would want a drink and then a piss in a short period at HT? Clearly not. So you end up with a crap stadium, it's just that it cost £££ and is more shiny. The pragmatic option is surely to renovate.
Even if you agree with a complete demolition/rebuild, do you have faith that can be done well? Which is a big caveat on that option, surely? That option is surely "I think the stadium is currently not fit for purpose, but I reckon a stadium I've never seen designed and built completely out of my control will be loads better"!
Plus, the club shelled out loads of cash a few seasons back to make the stadium better for disabled access, making changes to both ends. They've invested, albeit not enough, but come on, the stadium isn't currently too bad? Maybe I'm spoilt? W203 is fine. I'm happy to hear about other bits that aren't? MInd you, one area that has affected me (& others ) is their refusal/unwillingness to fix the platform at the ground. Train access stopped in about 2017 and has never resumed.
Tottenham’s stadium is arguably one of the best in the country. That’s why we need a better stadium, we don’t even have a big screen.
When I’m being overly logical and cold about it, I think the only way to have an ultra modern, future proofed stadium is to knock and start again, whether on the same site or otherwise. But then I keep coming back to the bolded bit in your post. The club is (fairly) criticised for being too sentimental. But I don’t think it would be a bad thing with regard to a decision like this.
Is exactly the reasoning the contractors will give, and it’s one in this country we fall for every time. Petrol is a prime example. Of course there is some truth in this, but increased to those extents? I don’t think so. As always, just my opinion. Hopefully we can squeeze margins and get a new world class stadium to boot.
Raw materials have massively increased in cost in the past year, probably is close to double for a lot of goods.
That goes for metalwork, wood, industrial equipment, plant hire, petrol, electrical components etc.
It all adds up and will make a huge difference on a project like this. It wouldn't be the contractors pulling a fast one, it's just the situation right now and it won't be getting any better in the short term
Materials have increased 56% YOY since 2020. They haven’t doubled, which is my point. However totally understand the point you’re making and it is having an obvious and significant impact on the costs of a new stadium. In fact let’s face it, this is probably the worse possible time in history to choose a new stadium build!
I've not been to Spurs new one, but as I said in my post I've cited Wembley as an example of a new stadium & I don't think it's great at all. Who cares about a screen? And if it matters that much, we don't need to demolish and rebuild for a screen
you're not wrong there, poor timing indeed!We can't have a screen at OT due to the cantilever roofs used.
There's no where for a screen to go.
I don't like Wembly either but it was designed more than 2 decades ago.
Maybe we just need to think outside of the box and build the greatest stadium ever?
Yes of course but in the mock up in the posted article the footprint was pretty much the same size as OT.
A screen goes in every year for the Rugby final.
If you don’t mind me asking how often do you visit Old Trafford?
That's the problem with new builds though, what's futuristic and packed with modern features now is dated and lacking within 15-20 years.
Having been to that stadium, it’s not what it’s made out to be
Why would anyone buy anything then, everything is outdated in a few years, but good designs can allow for upgrades, the current OT has been updated dozens of times in my lifetime, never mind the lifetime of the building, but it's reached the limit of what is practical
Eventuality it'll have to be updated and it won't get cheaper to do.
The problem with Wembley isn't the stadium, it's the people who the FA have in there. They have so many corporate people there, the atmosphere is shocking.
How many corporate seats are there at Wembley?
Don't think this is right?
Happy to be proved wrong but I've never seen a screen in Old Trafford.
mm, are they? They might be tbf, I've always thought they were typical descriptors when talking about stadiums/buildings but I get that they are intangible characteristics and all that jazz, though the point is fairly obvious. Shite like the London stadium and the King power distinctly lack both. So does the Emirates for the most part. I love OT for it's quirky charm - I find it impossible to separate it from United. Maybe that's not a good thing for looking to the future, I don't know.
There has been screens at loads of events at Old Trafford, from rugby to the womens euros last summer and many others in between
Wembley is a 90k seater stadium.
The following is from Chelsea for the FA cup final...
"We have received an allocation of 30,500 tickets for the FA Cup final. Within the allocation we have received 100 wheelchair positions and 100 personal assistants tickets. We also received 301 ambulant tickets and 301 personal assistants tickets. Chelsea have been allocated the East side of the Wembley Stadium.29 Apr 2022"
Lfc had the same allocation. So, for the actual fans of the 2 clubs, there were only 61k tickets. Who had all the remaining 29k tickets?
Is that so, you got a photo? Be interested to see how and where it is fixed.
I always was told the cantilevered roof was the reason a permanent screen couldn't be fixed.
Maybe it's fine for one offs, just not permanently.