Why aren't we interested in him? He seems to occupy the same position as Kagawa, but hell he's available on a loan + transfer and he can play in the middle of the park as well. It's a no brainer really
Nuri Sahin
- Thread starter SiYuan
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He doesn't. He plays much more deeper than him and I have never seen him playing in the same position as Kagawa.
I don't know why we aren't going for him but I think that we should get him.
So he's bascially a left-footed Xabi Alonso?
Something like Alonso or Banega.
We don't seem to pursue Madrid rejects. We ignored Sneijder, only to try to sign him in less favourable circumstances later. It might be a pride thing.
He's gone off to the US with Madrid today so I guess that means no deal this weekend.
He is the second coming of Redondo. Sooner or later a big club will discover that.
Perfect Hargreaves replacement.
More of a chance creator but less of a ball retainer. In his final season at Dortmund he had 3.5 key passes a game, 8 assists, but 75.9% pass accuracy and averaged 59.3 passes per game
He made 3.7 tackles per game and 2.3 interceptions and had 2 shots per game, scoring 6 goals.
Last season Alonso was 1.8 key passes a game, 9 assists, 88.1% pass accuracy and averaged 78 passes a game
Alonso made 3 tackles per game and 2.3 interceptions with 0.6 shots a game, scoring 1 goal.
So as you can see, he tried to create chances for his team more often and he took more shots, but gave the ball away more often, had less of a grip on the midfield but did similar defensive work, even making more tackles.
Do City really need him?
The thing with pass accuracy is because of Dortmunds style of play imo and not his ability to play a good pass.
Dortmund tries to switch from defense to offense as fast as possible and plays a lot of risky passes in the process.
Dortmund had an average of 78% pass accuracy last season and if I remember correctly it was even lower the season before so Sahin fits well into that.
On top of that I think he will only get better with time, if he gets the chance to play.
Our resident stat geek letranger0 posted last year in the newbies that he was the player in europe who created the most goal scoring chances (or something similar to that effect) during his last Dortmund season..
He's certainly worth a punt. He wouldn't cost a fortune and at this age even if it goes wrong we'll find plenty of buyers after a season or two. It's a very low risk transfer that could pay off big time if he turns out good.
Do those numbers really tell you anything meaningful?
It tells you this Sahin bloke loses possession a lot more than you'd usually want to see from a central midfielder.
It doesn't really, you need to see how he plays and what he does. Britton has one of the best percentages in Europe but you don't want him playing for Man Utd.
Good thing that stats don't paint the whole picture then!.
Jon terry had the highest pass completion rate in the premier league last year, does that mean we buy him and put him in Midfield?
Or that he is a very creative passer with an eye for a goal. Each for his own....
But "this Sahin bloke" sounds like Pogue has never actually seen him.
But "this Sahin bloke" sounds like Pogue has never actually seen him.
Correct.
Yes thanks. Not everything, but some things. Pretty much exactly what was typed.
Good thing that stats don't paint the whole picture then!.
Jon terry had the highest pass completion rate in the premier league last year, does that mean we buy him and put him in Midfield?
CBs tend to have very high passing success rates, why would you compare them to a midfielder?
He'd be fine if we just needed someone to pass the ball about. Which is what his stats would suggest he does.
Moneyballox - doesn't work with football - see Opta for examples.
Opta is a system worked out using stats. Its bollocks yes, but its not the hard value stats. Its the system using them to have a little table that works out badly.
You always seem to get a bit giddy and confused when someone talks about statistics. Are you bad with numbers or something?
I'd agree with you there. Passing percentages are incredibly deceptive. It doesn't tell you what sort of team he's in, as a more direct team would want players in his position to go for a killer pass, it doesn't tell you if the forwards or wingers are good at receiving passes and it doesn't tell you a whole load of other things too. I'd much rather judge players on how they play as opposed to stats.
You can't put his average passing stats solely down to him trying to create more than others. I saw him give the ball away too easily in some games for Dortmund, without him playing hard passes or anything like that.
Like Giggs?
He loves an aerial through ball, that's for sure.
On the contrary, it's precisely because I am very good with numbers that I can recognise the shite use of them. You on the other hand seem to be one of those muppets who are clueless about numbers and ascribe too much importance to meaningless ones.
They are interesting stats Ekeke, but not telling really. Madrid are playing in a league where they will dominate possession in every game barring those against Barca. Those stats are more of an indication of how those players performed under specific and differing circumstances for their respective teams, and should be seen as such, rather than as a comparative view of what they would generally contribute at any point, for any team.
Rumours are that Arsenal are trying to agree a one year loan agreement.
I am just dumfounded as to why we cannot do the same?
Is SAF just not interested in midfielders? What do we lose by getting him on a loan?
I am just dumfounded as to why we cannot do the same?
Is SAF just not interested in midfielders? What do we lose by getting him on a loan?
pride
Nope, i don't believe he is. As far as i am aware, we have not placed a single bid on any central midfielder since signing Hargreaves and Anderson back in 07.
I don't think we will sign one this year either. If we were not concerned enough to buy one last year, after releasing Hargreaves, selling O'Shea, and Scholes retiring. Plus the concerns over Fletcher, what makes anyone feel there is a greater need for a CM this season than there was last year?
For me we were desperate for a midfielder, possibly 2 last summer and yet didn't even look that seriously at any. I could argue we actually showed greater intent to sign Sanchez than we did a CM. Add Hazard and Lucas to the mix, and i would suggest there seems far more intent to sign a wide forward who can cut in and play behind a striker, than there is in signing a CM.
Fergie clearly believes that we lack creativity most of all and signing Kagawa has gone some way to address that, but it seems that he also believes we need more unpredictability/brilliance in the side. He clearly wants 4 good wide men.
Ramsey? There have probably been others as well, just not any big names.
Nuri Sahin. In 12 months time.
Why devote a place in our squad to the development of a youngster for one of our European rivals?
To improve our squad for this season. Obviously a long term solution is a hundred times more preferable but it would be better than nothing.
Because we hardly have players who can fill it let alone players as good as Sahin, at the minute. Scholes and Carrick are our only truly reliable midfielders and I don't expect Scholes to play the whole season on a regular basis.
Since when was "better than nothing" a good reason to sign someone?
If SAF thinks we need another central midfielder he should sign one. On a permanent basis.
If this is so impossible that he thinks we need a stop-gap signing then he should go for someone with experience, who can hit the ground running. Be madness to take this kid off Madrid's hands after an injury-afflicted, underwhelming debut season then expect to make more of an impression in his first season at yet another new club, in another new league.
It's always a risk playing youngsters but it's worth it if brings their game on and helps them become a better player in the long-run. Absolutely no point taking that sort of risk for the benefit of Real fecking Madrid.
But if we have a deal to make it permanent in place. Then if it works we get a top player and if it doesn't we walk away.
IF we extend your logic then we shouldn't buy but just reserve places for youngsters. I think we need more quality in the central areas.