I'm just not sure Brown and Tatum are good enough to win championships as a duo. There always seemed to be certain circumstances that explain their failures, but I still think its on them at some point.
NBA 2022-2023
- Thread starter charlton66
- Start date
I'm just not sure Brown and Tatum are good enough to win championships as a duo. There always seemed to be certain circumstances that explain their failures, but I still think its on them at some point.
All the organisational effort with picks, developments and trades produced an almost-there roster, what now? At this stage, blowing up seems suicidal. Lock Brown, get a younger, healthier frontcourt and try again next year.
All hail the historically GOAT level GOATkic.
Across the 20 finals games he averaged:
30 points
13.5 rebounds
9.5 assists
Whilst shooting an incredible 54.8% from the floor and 46.1% from deep.
He ended up with a positive plus minus of 8.5.
He also broke the playoffs triple double record, with 10 in 20 games.
He's scored the highest ever in the most offence generated in a single playoff run. That's ever.
1) 2023 Jokic - 55.7
2) 2018 LBJ - 54.7
3) 1986 Magic - 51.8
4) 1990 MJ - 51.0
The next highest is 47.6, and only 9 players have ever topped 45.
He was equal 5th highest (with 1993 MJ) offensive box plus minus in a single playoff-run (at least to the conference finals), at 9.7. The four higher are:
1) 2012 LBJ - 12.8
2) 1991 MJ - 10.5
3) 1990 MJ - 10.2
4) 2018 LBJ - 10.1
The only player close that's not named LBJ or MJ, is 2017 Curry, who comes in at 12th with 8.3.
Let's compare it to what is widely considered one of the most dominant playoff series ever:
And let's compare it to other historic greats during their first ever finals playoff run:
I could go on. And I probably will. But for now I'll leave it with this - we just bore witness to historical greatness.
Across the 20 finals games he averaged:
30 points
13.5 rebounds
9.5 assists
Whilst shooting an incredible 54.8% from the floor and 46.1% from deep.
He ended up with a positive plus minus of 8.5.
He also broke the playoffs triple double record, with 10 in 20 games.
He's scored the highest ever in the most offence generated in a single playoff run. That's ever.
1) 2023 Jokic - 55.7
2) 2018 LBJ - 54.7
3) 1986 Magic - 51.8
4) 1990 MJ - 51.0
The next highest is 47.6, and only 9 players have ever topped 45.
He was equal 5th highest (with 1993 MJ) offensive box plus minus in a single playoff-run (at least to the conference finals), at 9.7. The four higher are:
1) 2012 LBJ - 12.8
2) 1991 MJ - 10.5
3) 1990 MJ - 10.2
4) 2018 LBJ - 10.1
The only player close that's not named LBJ or MJ, is 2017 Curry, who comes in at 12th with 8.3.
Let's compare it to what is widely considered one of the most dominant playoff series ever:
And let's compare it to other historic greats during their first ever finals playoff run:
I could go on. And I probably will. But for now I'll leave it with this - we just bore witness to historical greatness.
Wizards apparently willing to let Beal go with Miami as potential suitors. His salary could be prohibitive for any potential deal, though I still expect Heat to make an attempt to find a trade for a star this off-season (though Lillard would be a more likely candidate and a better fit).
This narrative that Jokic is a bad defender needs to die. He's a good defender.
He doesn't have the highlight blocks, but he's an intelligent defender (being one of the two most intelligent players in the league) and reads plays before they happen. He positions himself well, closes lanes, uses his bulk well, and has elite active hands for a big guy, being in the top few Centres for steals over the last few years. He regularly gets a sneaky touch in, deflects the ball, and interrupts plays.
He also defended a ridiculous amount of PnR's this Playoffs and did it really well.
His defensive rating this playoffs was higher than the Freak's during his title run. Granted Jokic had Gordon, but the Freak had Jrue, who is an elite defender as a guard, Lopez and Tucker.
Who's the other most intelligent player? Are you talking about Lebron?
No one said he's a bad defender so there's no need to exaggerate. But he's not an elite defender, that is a fact. Especially in comparison to someone like Dream.
Look, it’s a convincing argument….but have you seen the way he runs? He has the waddle of a duck in the shape of a 7 foot dadbod. It’s inhuman and scaryAll hail the historically GOAT level GOATkic.
Across the 20 finals games he averaged:
30 points
13.5 rebounds
9.5 assists
Whilst shooting an incredible 54.8% from the floor and 46.1% from deep.
He ended up with a positive plus minus of 8.5.
He also broke the playoffs triple double record, with 10 in 20 games.
He's scored the highest ever in the most offence generated in a single playoff run. That's ever.
1) 2023 Jokic - 55.7
2) 2018 LBJ - 54.7
3) 1986 Magic - 51.8
4) 1990 MJ - 51.0
The next highest is 47.6, and only 9 players have ever topped 45.
He was equal 5th highest (with 1993 MJ) offensive box plus minus in a single playoff-run (at least to the conference finals), at 9.7. The four higher are:
1) 2012 LBJ - 12.8
2) 1991 MJ - 10.5
3) 1990 MJ - 10.2
4) 2018 LBJ - 10.1
The only player close that's not named LBJ or MJ, is 2017 Curry, who comes in at 12th with 8.3.
Let's compare it to what is widely considered one of the most dominant playoff series ever:
And let's compare it to other historic greats during their first ever finals playoff run:
I could go on. And I probably will. But for now I'll leave it with this - we just bore witness to historical greatness.
I didn't say that he was an elite defender, so there's no need to exaggerate.
And plenty of people have said he's a bad or terrible defender - not necessarily on this specific forum, but it has been a running narrative that has followed him around for years.
People continued to claim that no side will ever be ultimately successful with him anchoring the defence. Maybe it was my fault listening to the talking heads, or maybe you've just missed it over these last few years.
Explain to me what I was exaggerating on?
It's ungainly for sure. But he's the people's champ and a hero to all fat slobs out there.
Absolutely agree. Power to the un-toned
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
You quoted my post and then went into some long spiel about how the 'narrative that Joker is a bad defender needs to stop'. When I never said he was a bad defender. If you're upset that 'talking heads' are saying he's a bad defender then you can easily make that point in the forum without quoting my post.
Ah I see. My initial post was maybe poorly worded as it wasn't an attack on anything you said specifically, I was just expanding on the discussion. So for that I apologise.
All hail the historically GOAT level GOATkic.
Across the 20 finals games he averaged:
30 points
13.5 rebounds
9.5 assists
Whilst shooting an incredible 54.8% from the floor and 46.1% from deep.
He ended up with a positive plus minus of 8.5.
He also broke the playoffs triple double record, with 10 in 20 games.
He's scored the highest ever in the most offence generated in a single playoff run. That's ever.
1) 2023 Jokic - 55.7
2) 2018 LBJ - 54.7
3) 1986 Magic - 51.8
4) 1990 MJ - 51.0
The next highest is 47.6, and only 9 players have ever topped 45.
He was equal 5th highest (with 1993 MJ) offensive box plus minus in a single playoff-run (at least to the conference finals), at 9.7. The four higher are:
1) 2012 LBJ - 12.8
2) 1991 MJ - 10.5
3) 1990 MJ - 10.2
4) 2018 LBJ - 10.1
The only player close that's not named LBJ or MJ, is 2017 Curry, who comes in at 12th with 8.3.
Let's compare it to what is widely considered one of the most dominant playoff series ever:
And let's compare it to other historic greats during their first ever finals playoff run:
I could go on. And I probably will. But for now I'll leave it with this - we just bore witness to historical greatness.
Yep loved the RJ segment on NBA Today where he brought the numbers in comparison to other greats. Really puts into perspective just how great he was.
Scores like Durant, assists like Magic, rebounds like Duncan, shoots like Stephan and defends like Giannis.
The defending part is really important to mention since he is slandered for it, and it's not as if he only defended well in the finals as well. I watched the playoffs on DAZN and their broadcast showed playoff stats, Jokic was consistently in the top 3 I think in field goal % allowed, which surprised me.
People have been saying Steph is a bad defender for years whereas the truth of the matter is that he is an above average defender especially for his size, he always gives you 100% effort and he is actually a very good systems defender. When he came into the league he was very slight of build and got pushed around by pretty much everyone. Since then has bulked up and is now extremely strong, especially for a guard, and has improved tremendously on the defensive end of the floor.
What it all boils down to is that the media get something in their collective heads and are then too lazy and too uninformed to keep up. This is also what has happened with Jokic.
No problem. I would never say that he's a terrible defender (because that is just false) and I thought you were implying that I thought that but I can see now that I was wrong.
Great video
Ingram is crocked. Only reason he doesn’t get much attention for it is because he’s on the same team as Zion. Bridges will probably pass him in actual NBA games played by next season despite being drafted 2 seasons later.
So apparently KAT suggested that the Wolves making the playoff last season was a bigger achievement than the Nuggets winning the NBA championship. 
The more he goes on podcasts and the more I want him catapulted to the moon.
The more he goes on podcasts and the more I want him catapulted to the moon.
Be careful. He will be remembered for changing the game.So apparently KAT suggested that the Wolves making the playoff last season was a bigger achievement than the Nuggets winning the NBA championship.
The more he goes on podcasts and the more I want him catapulted to the moon.
So apparently KAT suggested that the Wolves making the playoff last season was a bigger achievement than the Nuggets winning the NBA championship.
The more he goes on podcasts and the more I want him catapulted to the moon.
Just saw some snippets, i always claimed that he is weird like weird weird but holy shit is he on some delusional spree, lost a bet, what
A week to go until the draft and seems it’s 50/50 between Miller and Scoot for no. 3, and Pelicans seem quite desperate to acquire Scoot. They will probably be able to entice Blazers with Herb Jones and pieces.
Bruce Brown hinting he might stay. Don't think it can happen as someone will offer him much more money but... There is a hope.
That one doesn't even surprised me after his appearance on Paul George podcast. He has his priorities completely wrong, not only he thinks that he is more important than Edwards but he is more worried about being remembered as someone that changed the game than someone that helped his team win things.
For years I have defended him but now it's pretty clear that unless he completely changes his mindset, he isn't someone that I want leading the Wolves.
What's up with KAT's weird voice change thing he does?
How would you feel about no. 3, Sharpe, Simons and future 3 picks and 3 swaps for Towns?
Since the trade can only happen after the draft, it would depend on who is taken. If the n°3 is Henderson then I would take it without hesitation since the Wolves have two needs, a genuine PG for the future and a genuine power forward since McDaniels is better used as a SF. Then it's a matter of flipping one of Sharpe or Simons and some picks to fill the PF position, though on the short term Anderson has been pretty good in that role.
If the pick is Brandon Miller then I'm conflicted because I really don't like the stories around him, on paper he fills a need for the Wolves and the trade would seemingly be great for the Wolves but the moral side of things makes uneasy.
Now for the Blazers, Towns is a very good player and I would assume that being around a seemingly nice person and significantly better player like Lillard would be a good fit. I also think that he would be a good fit with Grant.
All hail the historically GOAT level GOATkic.
Across the 20 finals games he averaged:
30 points
13.5 rebounds
9.5 assists
Whilst shooting an incredible 54.8% from the floor and 46.1% from deep.
He ended up with a positive plus minus of 8.5.
He also broke the playoffs triple double record, with 10 in 20 games.
He's scored the highest ever in the most offence generated in a single playoff run. That's ever.
1) 2023 Jokic - 55.7
2) 2018 LBJ - 54.7
3) 1986 Magic - 51.8
4) 1990 MJ - 51.0
The next highest is 47.6, and only 9 players have ever topped 45.
He was equal 5th highest (with 1993 MJ) offensive box plus minus in a single playoff-run (at least to the conference finals), at 9.7. The four higher are:
1) 2012 LBJ - 12.8
2) 1991 MJ - 10.5
3) 1990 MJ - 10.2
4) 2018 LBJ - 10.1
The only player close that's not named LBJ or MJ, is 2017 Curry, who comes in at 12th with 8.3.
Let's compare it to what is widely considered one of the most dominant playoff series ever:
And let's compare it to other historic greats during their first ever finals playoff run:
I could go on. And I probably will. But for now I'll leave it with this - we just bore witness to historical greatness.
Wowzer.
Unbelievable player indeed.
come on, sarni. no way would you be ok with the blazers doing this trade.
Sorry i wouldnt offer half of that
I would hate that trade but reports are Blazers are aggressively shopping that pick and the assets to build a ‘contender’ around Dame (Windhorst reported as much yesterday) and Towns would probably be on the list of players our front office may be looking at. I think it’s either him, Anunoby or Siakam and we are going to offer an impossible haul for one of them.
With Towns I’d be OK trading Simons, no. 23 and a future pick. Anything more would be overpay. But I’d still prefer a rebuild.
@Sarni if KAT is on that list I think we are pretty screwed. I won’t be surprised if we keep the pick and still hold onto dame though.
That would be a crazy trade for KAT.
You would want a minimum of Siakam AND OG or Ja if the Grizz are done with his nonsense for that package.
We're not reactionary drama queens so no we're not done
This KP to Portland rumor is wild
NBA media has picked up KAT quotes and are logically roasting him. I can't believe that he had the audicity to say that type of nonsense.
Is this a case of hanging on to a player for too long?
Wow they’ve really traded him for literally nothing. They should have never signed him to that contract, there were multiple opportunities to trade him for a decent package prior to that.
Great deal for Suns though and Wizards can at least start a rebuild now.
Great deal for Suns though and Wizards can at least start a rebuild now.