Southgate was a shit manager who underachieved with the England team and no one wanted him to continue. Carsley has just tried an experimental system in a match and it hasn’t worked. The majority of England fans wanted him gone and the grass was never green when he was manager.
Nations League 24/25 | November Internationals (Matchday 5-6)
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
The myth that never dies
You lot made 2 euros finals in a row. Seems kind of okay. Sure the football was rubbish, but all the flair players in the premier league are from other countries so what'd you expect 
The only really good manager you’ve had is Ramsey.
They were both great till they were totally shite at the euros.
Foden has been crap for England and needs to be dropped, Jesse Lingard has a better record.
Football teams are all about balance, think Carsley’s issue was forcing Foden and Bellingham back in the same team. Looked far better with Grealish, Mainoo/Gomes.
Sometimes you need an extra player in there to do the donkey work so everyone else flourishes. Germany were losing a lot of games and then Andrich comes in and everyone ahead of them starts playing better. Italy and Milan always had Gattuso with Pirlo.
Issue with England has always been trying to fit everyone in, Lampard-Gerrard days most famously when Carrick or Hargreaves should have been playing every game for balance.
Despite being a ‘flair’ player I think Grealish at an elite level is quite underrated for a team’s balance, his ball retention ability is excellent and for winning frees. Should have been in the Euros squad, offers something different. And Gomes is exactly the sort of unselfish player you could do with, just keeps things ticking and knows his role, no ego unlike Bellingham and Foden.
Sometimes you need an extra player in there to do the donkey work so everyone else flourishes. Germany were losing a lot of games and then Andrich comes in and everyone ahead of them starts playing better. Italy and Milan always had Gattuso with Pirlo.
Issue with England has always been trying to fit everyone in, Lampard-Gerrard days most famously when Carrick or Hargreaves should have been playing every game for balance.
Despite being a ‘flair’ player I think Grealish at an elite level is quite underrated for a team’s balance, his ball retention ability is excellent and for winning frees. Should have been in the Euros squad, offers something different. And Gomes is exactly the sort of unselfish player you could do with, just keeps things ticking and knows his role, no ego unlike Bellingham and Foden.
They haven’t been great for England, it was their club form I disagreed with you on.
It never dies because it's not a myth. There were a few barren years but pretending England don't have "a very good squad" (that poster isn't claiming it's the best or anything) is absurd.
So you’re saying pep Guardiola wouldn’t win anything with that England team? Or Klopp? Stop talking nonsense mate
Who knows, Guardiola needed how many attempts to win CL with City? And International football is a completely different game, far more affected by chance
Also kind of an irrelevant point since neither of those guys has been been an actual option for England, or national teams in general, so far. Klopp may be now, but only for Germany. Who do have a great club manager in charge and didn't win. After another great club manager - who won a treble and is currently turning Barcelona into a attacking wrecking ball - failed to get out of the group stage...
Don't think Gomes has had a great last month at Lille but I was surprised he was left out as he did o.k in the last two games.
Foden being an automatic starter is mystifying me a fair bit. 4 goals in 40 odd caps now and even in his early years he didn't have the same impact for England as for his club.
Was terrible in the Euros bar the first half v Holland.
Why is he just an undisputed starter? Of course he reaches a great level for his club but so does Palmer and he's hardly started a competitive match for England in 12 months.
I think between Bellingham and Foden you have to go for Jude simply due to him being able to come up with a goal in poor matches like last night and Slovakia. Foden just floats around passing the ball sideways and is then subbed, that's his impact in England games generally.
I do think there are a fair number of issues developing with this England team now so don't see them as top 4-5 contender for next World cup regardless of manager pick. Home Euros in 2028 is the one that needs to be targeted to win.
I am not sure any competent manager would play without three or four donkeys running up & down the pitch for the team’s supposed stars?
Gordon has 2 Rashford has 1 in the PL so no
England has to stop shoehorning stars into the lineup and do a proper team. Foden is just not the same player for England as he is for his club. Despite all the hate he gets here, Bellingham just delivers more for England.
Okay mate.
I do find it bizarre how desperate certain fans are to tear down their own players, but each to their own I suppose.
Pretty much. This was worse than a Southgate lineup. Pick your 11 best position players, not biggest names. I would be tempted to put in players that combine often for their club teams if given a marginal choice. Also helps that player is quick to adapt to different systems...but that is pretty much it.
Not tearing him down I’m basically saying Gordon is a better player than him on current form . It’s not even a discussion to be honest just like other posters have told you.
Fecking hell we're boring.
And behind now.
And behind now.
Germany up 2-0 in the first half, both goals by Undav.
Undav does look a really good player to have in the squad.
Undav does look a really good player to have in the squad.
The Icelandic centre forward Oskarsson looks decent.
Iceland been all over Wales this half, that goals been coming for twenty minutes ffs
Forgot Dzeko existed. Blast from the past
VVD sent off for Netherlands.
Holland fecking my acca. Nice
Silly send off, he got the ball. Was a convincing dive though.
Dumfries equalises for Netherlands.
Hope Virgil learns from this mistake!
Since Lindelöf has come on for Sweden at right back they are getting murdered down that side, they have let in one goal and he has managed to pass the ball straight into touch from about three metres away. This guy has stolen a career in football.
What can a player learn from a ref mistake?
Wales melted in the 2nd half against Iceland.
That they should have paid him more
Feel bad for Hungary. Defend their 1-0 well, and when we get someone send off they give it away.
Once we learn about the offside rule, it's over for everyone
You don't pay refs. You accidentally forget a bag filled with money in their locker...
Does Tito Flo need to teach you everything?
It IS an utter myth England "has never had a very good manager".
No one needs " to pretend" about the England squad. Too often y'all conflate having a talented squad 'with a very good one". The so called "very good squad"
has had for years clear weaknesses (at center half, deep midfield etx) that were well hidden by the previous manager yet he constantly got classed as a fool for it. The Greek match literally exposed those VERY weaknesses. But as usual like Ostriches. The same clique are burying their heads in the sand and pretending it's just "the coach's fault". (a.k.a the we have never had a very good manager myth)
Case in point we were told ad naseum Declan Rice alone paired with the glut of AM's the squad has " wouldn't lack balance", that "a good manager finds a place for TAA in his team in his best role" (inspite his draw backs in the international game) and "southgate is an utter coward for using Rice + 1". Well how did " bravery" do for y'all vs Greece when you got the type of selection you pinned for?
Fact is England has a talented squad with plenty of room for improvement before they can be classed as "very good". They have been over achieving relative to areas to improve on yet the fans constantly act like they "punch below their weight'.
100%
Been pretty encouraged from what I've seen from Bosnia under Barbarez. Unfortunately the squad is in a really bad state and we are somehow in league A for the nation's league, so we're getting fecked with fixtures a bit and losing every game under him. Putting in a good fight though.
One other poster I think? I disagree though. I definitely wouldn’t swap Rashford for Gordon. Guess we agree to disagree though, mate.