Moises Caicedo | Chelsea agree £115M fee | signed for Chelsea

[F-Red]

It's not a valuation though is it? It's what Liverpool themselves put forward in an actual auction, to get the deal done. That means it's what they valued the asset at, not Brighton. If Chelsea hadn't tried it on, he'd have been sold for less literally months ago.

It’s a valuation as they’ve paid them for it. More likely the valuation of the deal to get the player it will regardless fall onto Caicedo as a £110m signing in any reference to performance. Similar to the Maguire rhetoric of many years here.

Plus when they come to sell the £110m valuation will be referenced for whatever they get back in transfer fees.

Great quote from Klopp back when we signed Pogba:

 

[AneRu]

Every transfer is a risk and is yet to be seen if it will work out. Wouldn't say we're bringing knives cause our additions are yet to be proven.
I wouldn't base anything on preseason games. ETH knows what he wants, how he wants it and with which players.
I really don't get it how one Liverpool transfer can suddenly dampen the mood about our transfers do much.

It's not just transfer though, just fifteen months ago they pushed City to the last game, were in the CL final and won a bunch of Cups whilst their midfield was on its last knees. Granted they have lost Mane but they still proved last season, when they got their act together, that they can be dangerous going forward and they have just pushed the boat out to massively raise the level of their midfield.

No reason they won't fight for the title again and if they do come budging into the top 4 at whose expense do you think it will be? We look the weakest out of all our rivals. I have faith in ETH but I don't think he has the tools because we don't have enough goals and now we are massively outgunned in midfield.

 

[mav_9me]

There are question marks as to whether the Mount, Bruno and Case trio will hack it in the PL and the real world indications haven't been encouraging. If Mount fails or doesn't work out we are fecked, you know that. Hoijlund is still a couple of years away so besides Onana none of our signings is really proven for the level we need to compete at.

I'd be surprised if we are competitive in one on one games against the likes of City, Liverpool and Arsenal. Newcastle haven't really pulled away from us but they had better balance and were more solid than us until the last few games of the season. It looks and feels like we are bringing knives to a gun fight. After Amrabat, that is if we do get him, we need another forward signing.

I am worried too and the Mount signing may well not work out. However we have too much to do, can't compare with Liverpool or Arsenal. Which is why our rebuild is not pedestrian/ half hearted.

We are where Arsenal were in Summer of 2021 ( White, Ramsdale, Odegaard etc) or even last summer (Jesus, Zinchenko and Viera)

We've actually done well to overhaul the squad to such an extent.

 

[LordSpud]

Brilliant signing for Liverpool. Having a great summer. Not sure their defence is still up to it but they have great attacking depth and a good energetic midfield. Very young profile outside of Salah too.

Depends if this guy is shielding. Admittedly I don't know much about him but if Liverpool are paying 110m then he must be decent - and he will only get better under Klopp.

If Caicedo and Mac Allister follows the same path that other Brighton players who moved to bigger clubs (Bissouma, Cuccurella) and the Hungarian player follows the same path like their other signing from Red bull club then Liverpool are fecked too.

Klopp is a better and more consistent manager than the merry go rounds at Chelsea and Spurs

 

[Camy89]

Klopp;

"If you bring one player in for £100m and he gets injured, then it all goes through the chimney.

"The day that this is football, I'm not in a job anymore, because the game is about playing together.”

He’s a good player but £111m is insane.

 

[Borys]

Not much we can do when he is going to cost 110m £. Not with the amount of rebuild we have to do.

Well seems like we have money to spend. Already 190m EUR, and we are yet to get Casemiro cover. As a person who is not sold on Mount&Hojlund yet, I think Caicedo was an alternative.
Caicedo + Onana is 182m EUR. It really is a question if Hojlund was worth the risk this window. We will be going after DM next season anyway.

 

[GaryLifo]

More than likely yes, I agree. But that doesn't mean those who are saying wait to see are wrong.

It's not the wait and see I'm on about. It's the "100 million players never work out" and "he's massively overrated" type posts I'm taking issue with.

All transfers are a risk and we've made plenty of them with frequently bad results.

Last time I felt like this about a Liverpool signing was Van Dijk because I feared they had just made a great move, although at the time I was probably one of the copium crowd myself saying "he could easily flop"

 

[Ace of Spades]

Caicedo is faster, better stamina, better at running with the ball. Casemiro is superion in terms of anticipation and tackling I think (as long as he doesn't need to chase).

He is not that much faster, stamina is debatable and running with the ball is also marginal. Casemiro is simply better as DM in nearly all metrics

That is peak Caicedo (last season) vs peak Casemiro (part of last season). It might be Caicedo doesn't hold that level, but his skills are non questionable.

What the feck is part of last season. If you are implying that Casemiro was less consistent than Caicedo, then you are wrong. Caicedo skills are decent, but vastly overrated.

Casemiro might still be a better player this season, but Caicedo is a player worth that money IMO, we're missing out. He would actually fit perfectly into Ten Hag side.

Casemiro is a better player, he is not worth that type of stupid money and we are not missing out. There are plenty of player like him, if we want to look to replace Casemiro in the future. This is not like the striker situation where the options are sparse.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Klopp;

"If you bring one player in for £100m and he gets injured, then it all goes through the chimney.

"The day that this is football, I'm not in a job anymore, because the game is about playing together.”

He’s a good player but £111m is insane.

Yes but £100m back when he said that is probably the equivalent of £50-60m now given inflation in transfer fees

 

[mav_9me]

I agree. We have done well with getting younger hungry players this summer, which is why I'm leaning towards Todibo over Pavard.

But just 3 years down the line, Casemiro, Eriksen and Bruno will have their best years behind them. We will have Mount(27), Amrabat(30, maybe) and Mainoo(21). While Arsenal and Liverpool will have their midfield come into their prime. Meaning we will have to rebuild our midfield again to some extent.

Yes but that will always be the case. You constantly have to retool anyway. Unless you have a GOAT trio of Kroos/ Modric/ Casemiro.

Wouldn't count Eriksen in there btw.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Sadly, I think this and McAliister, together with their previous attacking signings, could make Liverpool title challengers again

 

[AneRu]

If Caicedo and Mac Allister follows the same path that other Brighton players who moved to bigger clubs (Bissouma, Cuccurella) and the Hungarian player follows the same path like their other signing from Red bull club then Liverpool are fecked too.

We can be pessimistic about Mount saying if he fails or optimistic about Mount citing his better seasons at Chelsea as a reference. What you have done is paint a doom and gloom picture for us with all possible bad situations for us and a bright future for rivals with 0% failure rate.

Liverpool don't have the offensive weaknesses we have though, they don't struggle for goals and our main offensive weakness (Antony vs Salah) is their greatest weakness. They don't need Caicedo and Mac Allister to really pull up trees for them, they need them to be functional and just provide a platform for their attack - which we know they are more than capable of.

The Slobodzai guy is one with the most question marks but he can still fail but not become a detriment to their season.

 

[mav_9me]

It's not just transfer though, just fifteen months ago they pushed City to the last game, were in the CL final and won a bunch of Cups whilst their midfield was on its last knees. Granted they have lost Mane but they still proved last season, when they got their act together, that they can be dangerous going forward and they have just pushed the boat out to massively raise the level of their midfield.

No reason they won't fight for the title again and if they do come budging into the top 4 at whose expense do you think it will be? We look the weakest out of all our rivals. I have faith in ETH but I don't think he has the tools because we don't have enough goals and now we are massively outgunned in midfield.

Maybe Newcastle. Anyway I don't disagree that this pushes them above us.

But there's not much else we can do. We are in a different rebuild stage than the others.

This is all on paper. Who knows how it will pan out. No one expected the seasons Arsenal/ Newcastle/ Chelsea/ Liverpool had last season.

 

[Vault Dweller]

He's a cracking player but that fee is beyond ludicrous. Glad we didn't get involved tbh and excited to see how Mainoo develops. Concentrate on a replacement next summer. But Liverpool have done a good job rebuilding their midfield, the s***s

 

[SilentWitness]

Does anyone think Klopp might have given the board a bit of an ultimatum?

 

[Highfather_24]

Yes but that will always be the case. You constantly have to retool anyway. Unless you have a GOAT trio of Kroos/ Modric/ Casemiro.

Yes, true, but just compare it to Arsenal/Liverpool, our direct rivals. In 3 years :

Arsenal: Odegaard, Havertz, Rice all 27 years old coming into their prime.

Liverpool: Caicedo(24), McAllister(27), Sobozlai(25), again all in their prime.

Bear in mind, we have completely overhauled our midfield since the Ole/Rangnick days. The only survivor is Bruno.

 

[roonster09]

The reason I'm highlighting this, is our squad composition age wise is a bit weird. Tifo made a video about it recently :

Not sure what's so weird about the age profile.

This is our squad, divided into Core, First team, squad players, Youth players who might break into 11 and the players linked with move.

Excluding youth players who might break into 11 and players linked with move, average age of the squad is 25.

Average age of first 11 is 26.6
Average age of second 11 excluding Heaton is 23.5.
Even if you include him, it's 25. We need one more CB btw.

We have only 2 players in the first 11 who are 30+ (Varane and Casmiro)
One player in first 11 who is 30+, Eriksen.

For some reason having players at their peak age is made out to be problem.

Core player

Age

First team players

Age

Squad players

Age

Young players

Linked with move

Age

Mount

24

Antony

23

Garnacho

19

Amad

21​

Bailly

29

Rashford

25

Dalot

24

Sancho

23

Mainoo

18​

McTominay

26

Martinez

25

AWB

25

Malacia

23

Hannibal

20​

Van de Beek

26

Onana

27

Martial

27

Lindelof

28

Pellistri

21

Bruno

28

Hojlund

20​

Greenwood

21​

Shaw

28

Eriksen

31

Varane

30

Casemiro

31

First 11
Onana	27​
AWB	25​
Varane	30​
Licha	25​
Shaw	28​
Casemiro	31​
Mount	24​
Bruno	28​
Antony	23​
Martial	27​
Rashford	25​

Second 11
Heaton	37​
Dalot	24​
Lindelof	28​
New CB
Malacia	23​
McTominay	26​
Eriksen	31​
Mainoo	18​
Sancho	23​
Hojlund	20​
Garnacho	19​

 

[mav_9me]

Well seems like we have money to spend. Already 190m EUR, and we are yet to get Casemiro cover. As a person who is not sold on Mount&Hojlund yet, I think Caicedo was an alternative.
Caicedo + Onana is 182m EUR. It really is a question if Hojlund was worth the risk this window. We will be going after DM next season anyway.

We would still need a striker in your scenario. That's what I mean though. We have too many changes to make to splash 110m£ on one player.

 

[Moston Red]

Crap news to wake up to.

 

[Rightnr]

Weird money the scousers are paying here.

Didn't they drop out of the Bellingham race because he was too much? Now they've gone and paid 30m more for this guy .

Meanwhile Chelsea baulked at paying 100m for him for ages and now that they did, they got gazumped.

I rate him but this is some United behavior in the transfer window from both clubs.

 

[Real Name]

It's not just transfer though, just fifteen months ago they pushed City to the last game, were in the CL final and won a bunch of Cups whilst their midfield was on its last knees. Granted they have lost Mane but they still proved last season, when they got their act together, that they can be dangerous going forward and they have just pushed the boat out to massively raise the level of their midfield.

No reason they won't fight for the title again and if they do come budging into the top 4 at whose expense do you think it will be? We look the weakest out of all our rivals. I have faith in ETH but I don't think he has the tools because we don't have enough goals and now we are massively outgunned in midfield.

Where were we 15 months ago? In his first season ETH has gone great things and is reshaping the squad even further. Nothing is given, nor Liverpool pushing is out of top 4 not some other rival going out of it. Arsenal fighting for the league doesn't mean they'll do it again and we're yet to see what will mish mash of a Chelsea squad will do.

 

[arnie_ni]

That's a lot of money for him and rice. I don't think either are worth it but as I say with yhr United signings it doesn't matter what you pay if you win silverware

 

[The Taurean]

Wow. Liverpool just skipped few gears suddenly. Insane price.
They were linked to him as well few months before our failed transfer from Independiente.

 

[mav_9me]

Yes, true, but just compare it to Arsenal/Liverpool, our direct rivals. In 3 years :

Arsenal: Odegaard, Havertz, Rice all 27 years old coming into their prime.

Liverpool: Caicedo(24), McAllister(27), Sobozlai(25), again all in their prime.

Bear in mind, we have completely overhauled our midfield since the Ole/Rangnick days. The only survivor is Bruno.

In 3 years our midfield will be Mainoo (21), Mount (27) and another (25). Who knows. We can't worry about 3 years from now when we have so much to fix with our squad for this season. We are just at a different stage of squad building compared to them. That's just the reality.

 

[bosnian_red]

Where do you see us this season?

As for Casemiro, nobody should underestimate him but it's being done here as we speak.

City clear of everyone, had Arsenal/United/Liverpool roughly similar level but caicedo to Liverpool puts them likely a notch above us and arsenal/below city. Fixture congestion has to be taken into account, and while we'll push for all comps I'm sure especially CL, Liverpool will likely purely prioritize league giving them an advantage the way Arsenal had last season (where I'd say they were in reality a mid 70s team, not a mid 80s).

If I had to guess, I'd say city mid 90s, Liverpool upper 80s, United and Arsenal lower 80, Chelsea upper 70s (no Europe at all), and then a gap to Spurs/Newcastle/villa/Brighton who either aren't good enough or will have fixture congestion that they aren't used to.

 

[pocco]

Chelsea will sign Lavia and Cherki I reckon.

 

[Fortitude]

It’s a valuation as they’ve paid them for it. More likely the valuation of the deal to get the player it will regardless fall onto Caicedo as a £110m signing in any reference to performance. Similar to the Maguire rhetoric of many years here.

Plus when they come to sell the £110m valuation will be referenced for whatever they get back in transfer fees.

Great quote from Klopp back when we signed Pogba:

Huh? An auction has the bidders set the price the moment asking is met and surpassed.

Don't know what the tangent you're writing has to do with your initial statement about Brighton. In all of this Chelsea are the ones that fecked up, really. Brighton sat back and let the chips fall where they may.

 

[gajender]

Yes, true, but just compare it to Arsenal/Liverpool, our direct rivals. In 3 years :

Arsenal: Odegaard, Havertz, Rice all 27 years old coming into their prime.

Liverpool: Caicedo(24), McAllister(27), Sobozlai(25), again all in their prime.

Bear in mind, we have completely overhauled our midfield since the Ole/Rangnick days. The only survivor is Bruno.

I have been following football long enough to Know these things hardly pan out the way you are describing here ,In fact I am more than confident to place a friendly wager that Arsenal and Liverpool won't have these players as regulars in three years time and some of them might not even be there .

 

[LochGormanAbú]

Weird money the scousers are paying here.

Didn't they drop out of the Bellingham race because he was too much? Now they've gone and paid 30m more for this guy .

Meanwhile Chelsea baulked at paying 100m for him for ages and now that they did, they got gazumped.

I rate him but this is some United behavior in the transfer window from both clubs.

Transfers are more complex than that though. Bellingham will be on a huge contract in comparison to what Caicedo will be on you can safely assume. Different positions too, after the sales of Fabinho and Henderson, a DM was essential. Over paid, but you have to if the other club doesn't want/need to sell.

 

[Highfather_24]

In 3 years our midfield will be Mainoo (21), Mount (24) and another (25). Who knows. We can't worry about 3 years from now when we have to fix our squad for this season.

Mount will be 27, in his prime. God knows, if he's gonna hit it off here.

Mainoo is also a question mark, because there are doubts about his injury problems, and because we have hardly seen him play in the PL.

The "another" shows that we still have some ways to go, our midfield still needs a lot of work. FdJ next summer?

I have been following football long enough to Know these things hardly pan out the way you are describing here ,In fact I am more than confident to place a friendly wager that Arsenal and Liverpool won't have these players as regulars in three years time and some of them might not even be there .

Very true, but its good squad planning.

 

[red.knight]

Caicedo is a freaking beast. United had been dancing for Gakpo for the whole January. Liverpool then swooped in last minute and hijacked him. Chelsea had been dancing for Caicedo for the whole summer. Liverpool then swooped in last minute and hijacked him. Liverpool midfield and attack is one of the best in the league now. They are now definitely challenging for the premier league title. I’m angry and sad.

We struggled to replace Casemiro when he has been missing last season and Eriksen legs are gone after his injury. Both Casemiro and Eriksren will be 32 soon. We shouldn’t be relying upon them for the whole season. We need to sign Tchouameni this summer at any cost.

 

[Grande]

It's not a valuation though is it? It's what Liverpool themselves put forward in an actual auction, to get the deal done. That means it's what they valued the asset at, not Brighton. If Chelsea hadn't tried it on, he'd have been sold for less literally months ago.

Yes, its a valuation. Liverpool value Caicedo more than they value 110m+wages. Or they would have kept the money.

 

[Sandikan]

Not sure what's so weird about the age profile.

This is our squad, divided into Core, First team, squad players, Youth players who might break into 11 and the players linked with move.

Excluding youth players who might break into 11 and players linked with move, average age of the squad is 25.

Average age of first 11 is 26.6
Average age of second 11 excluding Heaton is 23.5.
Even if you include him, it's 25. We need one more CB btw.

We have only 2 players in the first 11 who are 30+ (Varane and Casmiro)
One player in first 11 who is 30+, Eriksen.

For some reason having players at their peak age is made out to be problem.

Core player

Age

First team players

Age

Squad players

Age

Young players

Linked with move

Age

Mount

24

Antony

23

Garnacho

19

Amad

21​

Bailly

29

Rashford

25

Dalot

24

Sancho

23

Mainoo

18​

McTominay

26

Martinez

25

AWB

25

Malacia

23

Hannibal

20​

Van de Beek

26

Onana

27

Martial

27

Lindelof

28

Pellistri

21

Bruno

28

Hojlund

20​

Greenwood

21​

Shaw

28

Eriksen

31

Varane

30

Casemiro

31

First 11
Onana	27​
AWB	25​
Varane	30​
Licha	25​
Shaw	28​
Casemiro	31​
Mount	24​
Bruno	28​
Antony	23​
Martial	27​
Rashford	25​

Second 11
Heaton	37​
Dalot	24​
Lindelof	28​
New CB
Malacia	23​
McTominay	26​
Eriksen	31​
Mainoo	18​
Sancho	23​
Hojlund	20​
Garnacho	19​

Because some geniuses think 30 is some instant drop off so start talking what might happen in 3 yearsm

 

[roonster09]

Liverpool don't have the offensive weaknesses we have though, they don't struggle for goals and our main offensive weakness (Antony vs Salah) is their greatest weakness. They don't need Caicedo and Mac Allister to really pull up trees for them, they need them to be functional and just provide a platform for their attack - which we know they are more than capable of.

The Slobodzai guy is one with the most question marks but he can still fail but not become a detriment to their season.

They need their midfielders to be up for the task and provide defensive cover for their FBs. That was their biggest weak point last season.

If szoboszlai is the only one with question mark then why is Mount a question mark when he has proven for longer and at better competition than Mac Allister and Caicedo?

 

[RedC]

Well seems like we have money to spend. Already 190m EUR, and we are yet to get Casemiro cover. As a person who is not sold on Mount&Hojlund yet, I think Caicedo was an alternative.
Caicedo + Onana is 182m EUR. It really is a question if Hojlund was worth the risk this window. We will be going after DM next season anyway.

And who, pray tell, do we play up top then? Get Weghorst back?

 

[LordSpud]

Weird money the scousers are paying here.

I rate him but this is some United behavior in the transfer window from both clubs.

It's just what I would expect from US owners who didn't make the Champions League. Let's see if they make Top 4 next season - guaranteed the ol' net spend will come right back down if they do.

 

[RuudTom83]

€128 million is crazy!

Time to update all those net spend images sky sports love to put up!

 

[Borys]

He is not that much faster, stamina is debatable and running with the ball is also marginal. Casemiro is simply better as DM in nearly all metrics



What the feck is part of last season. If you are implying that Casemiro was less consistent than Casemiro, then you are wrong. Caicedo skills are decent, but vastly overrated.



Casemiro is a better player, he is not worth that type of stupid money and we are not missing out. There are plenty of player like him, if we want to look to replace Casemiro in the future. This is not like the striker situation where the options are sparse.

I can agree Casemiro is a better player but he is and will be declining while Caicedo has a few years from reaching his prime. Same way as we paid over the odds for Hojlund - not because he's worth that money now, but he might be in some time. The difference is Caicedo has already been one of the best DMs in the league.

 

[Wicked_Badger]

Really good player based on the one season we've seen him. Will strengthen 'Pool in the area they need most but to suggest they're immediately title contenders is a bit much imo. Definitely makes them more top 4 competitive but they're still lacking in some key areas (like everyone else) when it comes to challenging City.

I think some people are getting a bit over-excited about the transfer fee and translating it with how much he'll transform a team. If it'd been half of this (which is probably around what it should've been based on his performances and experience) then I don't think the reaction would be half as extreme. Let's also not forget that in his short time at Brighton, him (& his agent) have also caused issues for the management with their behaviour. What happens when a bigger club or more money comes calling next time? Might become a headache for wherever he ends up.

Still though, good signing. Crazy money.

 

[pascell]

ETH has been here 1 season, this is Klopps 8th season. And they are spending insane amount. Of course they are transforming their midfield, while we're working on it.

We've been trying to transform it the last 10+ years, even SAF even had Giggs playing CM. Look at the list of CMs we've bought the last 10+ years, how many have stuck and performed as expected?