Nicola Barella, Brozovic, Ismail Bennacer, Kephren Thuram, Adrien Rabiot, Youri Tielemanns
Midfielders who can play as no 6/no 8
- Thread starter croadyman
- Start date
The more I think about what the profile we need (technically secure, defensively strong and press resistant) and that we're going to get fleeced on one of the 2/3 forwards that are good enough to play for us, the more I think we should target Ugarte. He has really good press resistance so can relieve Casemiro from first receiver duties (which isn't a strength of his) before giving advancing the ball to our more creative talents to advance up the pitch. He's infinitely better a defender than Eriksen so should really shore up the midfield from transitions when he's beside Casemiro.
Yep I’m firmly on the Ugarte or Caicedo train personally, edging towards Ugarte purely as he’ll be 25-30m cheaper due to not having prem tax.
Doesn't Paqueta play next to Casemiro for the Brazil NT at times? Really like him as a player.
If it wasn't for the exorbitant transfer fee West Ham would ask, Declan Rice would be right up there. I wasn't a huge fan of his for a long time but Rice has come a long way in how he uses and moves with the ball. He's got a lot more personality now than he did a couple of years ago.
Yeah the English tax is huge
Yeah will definitely be a price gap between them
Would love some in-depth analysis on this guy. He’s put up some fantastic stats (at face value anyway) at PSV for years now. Not only a dominant defender but also seems a very active, consistent passer and progressor. Can’t really understand how no one’s taken him out of the eredivisie yet, what’s holding teams back?
The more I see him, the more I like Sabitzer long term.
We still need cover for Casa
Last summer they temporarily took out his buyout clause of 37.5m euros so that clubs had to pay full price, this summer he's available for that clause so he'll probably leave.
I never understand why folks think Rice can operate as an 8. He is high end DM talent. He is a Casemiro type for sure rather than one who can also operate higher. As for his price, I think people will be surprised he will be cheaper than many envisage. If am not mistaken he will have a year left in the summer. Meaning if West Ham don't sell him then they will lose him for free.
West Ham has option of year extension , so basically 2 years for all intent and purposes .
What’s your opinion on him?
The one weakness I can find is that he seems to get dispossessed a bit too often.
Other than that he looks a big improvement on say McTominay, who we could possibly shift for about what PSV would require for Sangaré.
But Erik Ten Hag will know him well, and if we don’t go for him I’ll assume it’s for good cause.
Swapping McT for Sangare for about the same price would never be a bad move, but I'd rather see the club jump on Romeo Lavia once Southampton relegates. Way younger and already has PL experience.
He is a very interesting player. His playing style reminds me very much of another Ligue 1 based diminutive central midfielder - Marco Verratti.
His contract expires in 2024, too...
The defensive side of the game is his bread and butter but he's capable of the box to box role as well. He did it last season for West Ham when he was given a bit more license to roam.
The option on his contract means he's there until 2025 and Moyes was speaking about any fee for Rice blowing the one for Enzo Fernandez out of the water. They won't get what Moyes wants for him because he's been trying to talk Rice up as a £150m player but I don't think he'd go for less than £100m. Villa managed to get that much for Grealish and Rice is a higher calibre player than him.
I'm convinced people are conflating him being able to get forward more like Casemiro did at Real Madrid with being able to operate as an 8. There is nothing in his game that indicates he has the game nor mindset of an 8. Even for west Han its alesys soucek doing most of the attacking. As for Moyes' pontifications. They will be lucky to get beyond 75-80m out of anyone for him. Enzo went for 120m because he was signed in the summer on a 5 year deal yet left after just 6 months. Same case with Grealish and his buy out clause. Before his new contract and buy out clause Grealish was not even going to fetch anything upwards of 60m.
As for United. Rice only makes sense if they are purchasing an 8 like Tielmans or Mac Calister at the same time. For he'd straight up be a replacement/competition for casemiro. Not a new 8 to upgrade on Fred or Mctominay. Unless donny revives and a Sancho evolves into a 10, allowing Bruno to operate deeper full time.
He'd be ideal, lavia Proper young cover for Casemiro at a good price. Plus counting as hone grown if I'm not mistaken...
Yea it can be either, like Pirlo or Xavi.
Rice is really deep, hes pretty much only defensive.
You need hard working b2b type player next to him though.Just read the thread from the top and was amazed nobody had mentioned Carrick until you.
A deep lying playmaker with some defensive duties. Not all 6s are the same, but that doesn’t mean Carrick wasn’t one. His sort aren’t terribly common, but it’s great to have one.
For all his positional brilliance, I’m not sure Rice has enough about him to fit in at United. Though Nobby Stiles was ok
I think each of those terms describe Pirlo's role more specifically, but all would be considered a type of #6 in current UK football parlance.
As another poster said, your 6 is essentially your deepest midfielder. Sometimes creative, sometimes destructive, sometimes a bit of both. But deep. Your 8 is box to box. Your 10 mostly sticks to attacking positions. The numbers refer to average position on the pitch, not necessarily to what role is performed in those positions, which can vary system to system, team to team, player to player.
I know what it means it current UK football parlance but the point was from an historic standpoint, since an other poster asked where that new thing came from. It's not new and it doesn't (specifically) comes from the UK.
I would've agreed with you two years ago. Rice has added an extra dimension to his game though and he's definitely capable of it. He'd be great for Arsenal if they wanted to upgrade on Granit Xhaka, but obviously he can also do the role of Thomas Partey.
Rice will quite comfortably command an £80m fee and probably more if West Ham don't mess up the deal. Brighton turned down £70m for Caicedo in January and he doesn't even have English tax associated with him, and he's been playing in the Premier League for a fraction of the time Rice has.
Caicedo has shown a much higher level on the ball compared to Rice. But agree that they should be able to get 70m+ for him, just generally that's overpriced.
I'm not sure I agree. Caicedo's a lot more impressive physically than he is technically. Most players are overpriced, including Caicedo if he were to move.
Bellingham is only 19, I reckon he will become a complete midfielder, he is already so good at his age and has so much room for developement.
Complete midfielders are never actually complete midfielders. Like Bellingham is never going to be a positionally aware #6 who knows how to just sit in space and plug the gaps defensively. It's why guys like Gerrard and Lampard never worked next to each other, and putting Scholes with them wouldn't have worked either. You need the carrick or Keane or Casemiro types in there to sit, who don't roam all over.
Bellingham isn't a 6 - he's a 8 or 10, but either way playing as an attacking box to box. He's not really a deep playmaker who can dictate the tempo, he's a gerrard or a Lampard type. Class, but I don't see him being what Ten Hag wants anyway (nor what I think we should get). We need a Scholes type. The best teams who want to dominate play always have a deep playmaker who knows how dictate tempo, speeding up or slowing down when required, and is press resistant. That's why Ten Hag likes Eriksen deep, he's the closest we have to being able to slow down and speed up play and dictate through passing.
Spot on!
I really don't think he addresses any of our needs an wouldn't be better than any of our current first teamers so don't know why we'd waste transfer budget on him. He's been alright. Has had some very good games but has been anonymous in others particularly when no Casemiro. Just don't think we can spend money on guys that don't move the dial for us.
What number is Modric then?
Who? Carrick or Rice?
Carrick definitely. Rice would need a lot more than just a hard worker alongside him.
I agree. But for many posters it’s a continental thing. British football was pretty archaic in the 90s and Most midfields were a flat four, occasionally with a 10 in front. The mentality was two box to box midfielders with an “I stay if you go” mentality. But the ubiquity of the role specific in common parlance only entered the UK a while after the influx of foreign managers and players. I was most struck by it when I lived in Spain some 20 years ago and was initially confused by the whole 6/8/10 thing to define roles. But it had been around in Europe and South America since the dinosaurs.
In reality a Keane/Scholes midfield had this balance for example. Keane was a classic hybrid 6/8, and Scholes an 8/10. It was only later, with age that he moved further back the pitch.
He'd be great for Arsenal simply because he'd enable Partey to return to the more attacking role he had at Atletico Madrid. Not because he has shown at any point he can play as well as Xhaka does as an 8. I'm mystified as to where people have witnessed this number 8 version of Rice. Even for West Ham he has simply become or more progressive 6. Not a super creative nor deep lying play maker one either. For he he is straight up a taller more athletic version of a Javier Mascherano type of midfielder. Like Casemiro they are not 8s. Even though they are good on the ball and progressive with the pass.
Last edited:
Carrick of course. Rice would need players who can do the work on the ball
To get the type of midfielder who will "move the dial" you have to spend serious money. We fecked it when we overpaid for Pogba, Chelsea further fecked it when they overpaid for Enzo. We need someone who is good enough to oust Eriksen or Casemiro and that isn't going to happen for less than 100 million. Sabitzer is available for reportedly less than 20. Hes a useful backup.
We need a striker above all else. We can't fecking score.
Haven’t followed him since, but Ounahi had one of the most impressive World Cup runs in my lifetime
Thought that was what you meant. And yes I very much agree with the latter; his positional awareness is outstanding, but I’m not sure it’s enough in a team game with a fixed number of players.