Middle East Politics
- Thread starter Raoul
- Start date
Dublin earlier as well I heard.
I am avoiding the Israel thread for a long while as I can't stand their evil anymore. But they had to come to feck up the great day of Assad's regime end
They are already sending warnings to Syrians to stay at their home ahead of their incoming bombing.
Israel gonna Israel
Someone should remind him of some of the upstanding Christian fellows he follows on twitter
The three I's have been dotted - no way of identity tracking.
And yes, our relationship works on the fact that anything they send me could be shared unless they explicitly tell me not to.
but if you're not comfortable then I'm happy to remove.
For context, one of the videos one of the guys above sent to us made it to Sky News. (Wasn't me who shared it to the media)
I'm just a guy sitting in Norway waiting for the rain, it's not really my call.
I've removed them to avoid any potential problems here just in case
Okay, I'll delete my quotation
I got the feeling that it's exactly how it's gonna end.
As much as Assad's fall is a blessing, there are too many interests at stake from powerful countries which don't have Syria's well-being at heart.
Israel wasted no time in pursuing its expansion policy whilst the West is cheering on. Turkey is also a big winner in this mess.
I can't shake the feeling that this whole "revolution" is a scam. This is a replay of the so-called "Arab Spring".
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He is not wrong for once.
HTS is ISIS' literal offspring. They might have mildered their manners, but that's who they are.
If Syrians are relieved, joyous and satisfied that a brutal dictator of decades has gone, that is good enough for me right now.
Do you think young Arabs were living a good life in 2011?
No, I don't.
I've had a first hand experience with both authoritarian regimes and jihadists, about 10 years before islamist terrorism became mainstream. I got a pretty good idea about how Syrians are feeling right now.
I welcome Assad's ousting, I just don't like who's behind it and the ones who are behind who's behind it.
Sorry for being a Debbie Downer.
Are their lives better or worse now?
They’re worse.
It doesn’t mean that the ‘Arab Spring’ revolutions were some nefarious scheme from external forces.
I do wonder how fast we are going to see what al-Jolani really stands for. Or maybe he's just a puppet for this offensive and will fade into obscurity while chaos takes over the country.
So far he is saying all the right things which he has for years) which sounds too good to be true. When his resumé shows close relations with the likes of al-Bahgdadi, al-Zarqawi and al-Zawahiri, you do wonder if it's possible at all that he has distanced himself from his fundamentalist past. Using the PM as an interim to keep stability while transitioning to a new rule is an interesting tactic.
Still can't fault the Syrians for celebrating, though.
My main response was about your insinuation about the 2011 revolutions.
Tunisia's uprising was genuine and I pinned my highest hopes on it. For naught, look at the country right now.
The rest was a rebranded G.W. Bush's "GMI" in a less obvious way.
Given the state and outcome of all these "revolutions", and the obvious and extensive meddling of the West as as well as Russia, allow me to be a bit cynical.
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Seems like he’s in Moscow.
That's what I personally believe.
HTS learned from their previous mistakes and know what comes their way if they get too giddy, and they're trying to tick all the boxes. However, there's too many conflicting interests, too many divisions and too many foreign hands on the Syrian pie to not think that this new regime will be short lived.
Neither do I. They deserve a moment of reprieve after what they went through.
Lots of revolutions end up with an outcome that, at least at first, was significantly worse than what preceded it. This isn’t unique to the Arab world.
The lives and prospects of youth across the Arab world was awful in 2010, with the leaders showing absolutely no prospect of articulating any answers.
It’s not exactly unsurprising that people rose up as a result.
This is nothing to do with this current day or what HTS are going to do. I’m not super optimistic about that point but at the same time can’t be anything but happy for Syrians celebrating the end of the butcher. A real shame he’ll live in Moscow and not face the justice he deserves.
Incredible how fast it all gone down.
I do not dispute that, I just think that the West and Russia encouraged, backed and capitalized on it in order to get more amenable regimes, replace the stooges who weren't fashionable anymore, or destroy the country if the first two options weren't avalaible.
Case in point Lybia (a current failed state, thanks Sarkozy), Egypt (which ended up with another corrupt US puppet at the helm, after a short lived Muslim Brotherhood presidency) and Syria at the time (with Israel, the US and Turkey openly financing and supporting various groups including jihadists, and Iran and Russia the Assad regime).
I believe that it's got everything to do with it, with Turkey as the most obvious puppet master, and the US and Israel cheering on. The foreign influence in this revolution stinks to high heavens, especially in the current context.
Indeed.
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I wonder if Maher went with them, and if not where he is right now?
By nothing to do with it, I meant that this doesn’t mean that I think Golani is a great guy not that HTS are going to lead Syria into a prosperous new future.
Again, as with any change, anywhere in the world, external forces will want to try to shape what happens as well. Suggesting the revolutions only came about because of this though removes the agency of the Arabs and the awful situation they found themselves in, as well as the genuine hope that many felt at the time.
Anyway I think I’ll leave it there as I’ve always been bothered by this particular suggestion and it’s going to take the thread off course.
Whatever ends up happening, what Assad did to Syria was heartbreaking and the videos coming out now genuinely make me feel quite emotional.
Talking of external actors.
Russia and Iran are huge losers here. Hezbollah likewise.
Israel look the strongest they’ve ever looked perhaps in the region.
Turkey won’t be happy if they can’t figure out a way to return the refugees and prevent the Kurds from even further autonomy.
Russia and Iran are huge losers here. Hezbollah likewise.
Israel look the strongest they’ve ever looked perhaps in the region.
Turkey won’t be happy if they can’t figure out a way to return the refugees and prevent the Kurds from even further autonomy.
Fair enough.
I still highly appreciate your views even if we are in disagreement on this particular point.
Thanks mate, you too.
I'll never understand the dictator mentality. How many historical examples of exile, death or prison do they need to see to realize that it's a futile life. Where's the joy in being paranoid everyday about a coup or people uprising? What do they get out of such a life?
Is the luxury worth all the fear and paranoia and potential consequences?
Is the luxury worth all the fear and paranoia and potential consequences?
When you're a dictator you don't really have much choice other than to be an autocrat, because any sign of weakness could result in a coup and there are rarely ever any scenarios where dictators survive the overthrow of their own regimes without having to flee to other countries. So the general incentive is to remain a dictator and consolidate power for as long as possible so one can die of old age. We're seeing this play out now in Russia as well.