Michael Olise

FrankWhite said:
£35M according to Google. Sell sancho and get him. Only concern would be injury history.
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Nobody wants to buy Sancho due to his astronomical contract. They’d be expected to pay a fee to the club plus take on the player’s lengthy and expensive wages/bonuses. Chelsea have found themselves in an identical situation by overpaying in contracts to attract talent. When they flop, you’re stuck.

The best bet is in January to offload him on loan for a wage contribution, hope he finds form and they want him permanently, or reintegrate him in the summer under the new manager. Or if Ten Hag goes before the end the season, reintegrate him sooner.
 
UTAretro said:
Nobody wants to buy Sancho due to his astronomical contract. They’d be expected to pay a fee to the club plus take on the player’s lengthy and expensive wages/bonuses. Chelsea have found themselves in an identical situation by overpaying in contracts to attract talent. When they flop, you’re stuck.

The best bet is in January to offload him on loan for a wage contribution, hope he finds form and they want him permanently, or reintegrate him in the summer under the new manager. Or if Ten Hag goes before the end the season, reintegrate him sooner.
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Why reintegrate a player that just doesn’t suit how we play and has a history of not giving a shit? You make it sound like the only reason he’s not playing is because ETH wants him out. I disagree, we spent a load of money on him. Senior management would have said to get him involved if it was just a clash of personalities
 
golden_blunder said:
Why reintegrate a player that just doesn’t suit how we play and has a history of not giving a shit? You make it sound like the only reason he’s not playing is because ETH wants him out. I disagree, we spent a load of money on him. Senior management would have said to get him involved if it was just a clash of personalities
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Well none of us know the details of that, I was responding to the classic “just sell him” post. Sell him to who? The clubs that can afford him don’t need him; and the ones that do can’t afford him.
 
UTAretro said:
Well none of us know the details of that, I was responding to the classic “just sell him” post. Sell him to who? The clubs that can afford him don’t need him; and the ones that do can’t afford him.
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Then lets release him. Bigger clubs than us have terminated contracts for such players. Real madrid did this with hazard in the summer. Arsenal did this with Pepe,ozil etc. A clear out doesn't mean you have to sell the player...it means you want the player gone by all means. If he is still here by the summer we should consider termination of the contract
 
Lash said:
Chelsea tried didn't they? There was a little bit of foul play with the release clause stuff and he ended up singing a new deal.
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There was no foul play. Palace just didn’t know Chelsea knew about the release clause or something like that and they were upset about it. What actually happened was Olise’s agent was doing his job as an agent and soliciting offers for his client. It forced Palace to give him a huge contract, doubling his wages.
 
WeePat said:
There was no foul play. Palace just didn’t know Chelsea knew about the release clause or something like that and they were upset about it. What actually happened was Olise’s agent was doing his job as an agent and soliciting offers for his client. It forced Palace to give him a huge contract, doubling his wages.
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My apologies, I wasn't really insinuating Chelsea were the guilty party, but more so the agent. You do raise a good point in him doing his job though.
 
My only concern with him is that I don't really know how well he works getting back. I kept an eye on him in the Palace - Brighton game and he did jog back into position but never really busted a gut. He's got that kind of lackadaisical style sometimes which if the going gets tough at Utd would make him an easy target.

Apart from that he looks mint. Such brilliant technique and the way he can just make a LB back-peddle due to his close control is something I've not properly seen from Antony.
 
Solius said:
My only concern with him is that I don't really know how well he works getting back. I kept an eye on him in the Palace - Brighton game and he did jog back into position but never really busted a gut. He's got that kind of lackadaisical style sometimes which if the going gets tough at Utd would make him an easy target.

Apart from that he looks mint. Such brilliant technique and the way he can just make a LB back-peddle due to his close control is something I've not properly seen from Antony.
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Yeah I have a similar concern regarding defensive workrate. Not saying its Rashford level but we can't really afford anymore attackers who don't have the desire to track back. Not saying its definitely an issue with him but I'd have a question about whether he is a fighter/one of those whose work rate doesn't drop.

Technically though he would slot into Ten Hag's style perfectly. Very good at keeping possession, can play in tight spaces and 1v1, good eye for a pass. A perfect attacking RW for us, just a question whether he can do the job defensively.
 
He could do with more time at Palace. A lot of talent, but still working out how to use it consistently.
 
Solius said:
My only concern with him is that I don't really know how well he works getting back. I kept an eye on him in the Palace - Brighton game and he did jog back into position but never really busted a gut. He's got that kind of lackadaisical style sometimes which if the going gets tough at Utd would make him an easy target.

Apart from that he looks mint. Such brilliant technique and the way he can just make a LB back-peddle due to his close control is something I've not properly seen from Antony.
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For what it’s worth he ranks very well for tackles, interceptions and blocks. He’s performing better even here compared to Antony who’s only redeeming quality at the moment is his defensive contributions.
 
duffer said:
Mostly no, occasionally yes.

For every Declan Rice there's 100 other kids who went on to do feck all.
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I don’t know all the current/active ex Chelsea players but Rice and Olise look better than anything you currently have at the club?

Tomori seems to have done okay for himself in Italy too and Livramento looks a good talent over in The North East.
 
TheReligion said:
I don’t know all the current/active ex Chelsea players but Rice and Olise look better than anything you currently have at the club?

Tomori seems to have done okay for himself in Italy too and Livramento looks a good talent over in The North East.
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Technically KDB and Salah too.
 
duffer said:
Mostly no, occasionally yes.

For every Declan Rice there's 100 other kids who went on to do feck all.
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But conversely there are very few who actually go on to do anything within Chelsea. Strong rumours even now that you’re going to bin of Gallagher who is arguably your best performer.
 
would be funny if they shipped Gallagher cause Poch doesn’t seem to much fancy Enzo at all
 
macheda14 said:
But conversely there are very few who actually go on to do anything within Chelsea. Strong rumours even now that you’re going to bin of Gallagher who is arguably your best performer.
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There's very few who go and do anything at any "top" club.

How many are in the first 11 at Man City, 1? At Liverpool? 1? At Arsenal? 1?

How many in your first 11? Rashford? Maybe Garnacho if he counts. I know McT is playing but that's due to injuries.
 
duffer said:
There's very few who go and do anything at any "top" club.

How many are in the first 11 at Man City, 1? At Liverpool? 1? At Arsenal? 1?

How many in your first 11? Rashford? Maybe Garnacho if he counts. I know McT is playing but that's due to injuries.
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But I think its only Chelsea who actively bin their best young players in moves that just make no sense.

You could have a much better team at a fraction of the cost. Our recruitment drives me bonkers. But if I was a Chelsea fan, the sales would be maddening.
 
Marwood said:
But I think its only Chelsea who actively bin their best young players in moves that just make no sense.
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Most of them made sense at the time (or.at.least, you could see the reasonong) Losing Guehi and Tomori looks ridiculous given what.we paid on centre backs since the but we the club didn't plan on the sanctions and not being able to keep Rudiger and Christensen.

Mount rejected a big contract so we cashed in.

Livramemto rejected a contract extension because he didn't want to be stuck behind Reece James (same with Tariq Lamptey). The choice was to cash in or lose them for peanuts. All 3 seem like sick notes to be honest. Maybe if we kept all 3 we could stagger their long term injuries and be set at left back.

Obviously there are lots of horrible decisions but they're not all super dumb.
 
duffer said:
Most of them made sense at the time (or.at.least, you could see the reasonong) Losing Guehi and Tomori looks ridiculous given what.we paid on centre backs since the but we the club didn't plan on the sanctions and not being able to keep Rudiger and Christensen.

Mount rejected a big contract so we cashed in.

Livramemto rejected a contract extension because he didn't want to be stuck behind Reece James (same with Tariq Lamptey). The choice was to cash in or lose them for peanuts. All 3 seem like sick notes to be honest. Maybe if we kept all 3 we could stagger their long term injuries and be set at left back.

Obviously there are lots of horrible decisions but they're not all super dumb.
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I think you can almost always find some sort of reasoning for a youth product leaving. For example there'll nearly always be a more established player in front of the young lad. Mourinho is still trying to justify De Bruyne and Salah.

But when you've let pretty much a first 11 leave, a first 11 that would probably be right up there, it's pretty crazy.
 
Marwood said:
I think you can almost always find some sort of reasoning for a youth product leaving. For example there'll nearly always be a more established player in front of the young lad. Mourinho is still trying to justify De Bruyne and Salah.
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KDB and Salah weren't youth products trying to break in, they were signed for multi-mullions and expected to play every game immediately. Neither wanted to stay and fight for their place.
 
duffer said:
KDB and Salah weren't youth products trying to break in, they were signed for multi-mullions and expected to play every game immediately. Neither wanted to stay and fight for their place.
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Well this is what I mean. There's always a reason.

You can say they didn't want to fight for their place. Or you could say they weren't invested in enough, weren't trusted enough by the manager/club. Felt they had to go. Maybe they should have been regular starters given how good they were soon after.

Are any of these sales ever just an outright mistake? Can you list any?
 
I like him from the odd highlight I've seen, but like most players we only see/hear about them when they score or do something noteworthy...it's what they do for the other 85 minutes or during the 10 games when they don't score or assist that is more important.
 
Marwood said:
Well this is what I mean. There's always a reason.

You can say they didn't want to fight for their place. Or you could say they weren't invested in enough, weren't trusted enough by the manager/club. Felt they had to go. Maybe they should have been regular starters given how good they were soon after.

Are any of these sales ever just an outright mistake? Can you list any?
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I mean KDB and Salah are outright mistakes. That doesn't mean the reasoning at the time wasn't sound, at least in the case of Salah. I was shouting from the rooftops at the time that selling KDB was a brainless decision and he proved me right very very quickly.
 
Marwood said:
Well this is what I mean. There's always a reason.

You can say they didn't want to fight for their place. Or you could say they weren't invested in enough, weren't trusted enough by the manager/club. Felt they had to go. Maybe they should have been regular starters given how good they were soon after.

Are any of these sales ever just an outright mistake? Can you list any?
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They're all mistakes if they go onto be as good as Salah or KDB or Rice. Obviously with the benefit of hindsight these look ridiculous. At the time nobody was crying about Salah leaving and certainly nobody thought Rice would be a 100 million player. There was some grumbling about KDB but not much.

They're not mistakes if they are like the 99% of young players who get dumped by every club every year and go on to do feck all in the game.

The biggest mistakes for me were Tomori and Guehi. Both looked good when they played for us, in he first team and academy. Obviously the sanctions and not being able to keep Rudi and Christensen made those sales look even more stupid.
 
duffer said:
They're all mistakes if they go onto be as good as Salah or KDB or Rice. Obviously with the benefit of hindsight these look ridiculous. At the time nobody was crying about Salah leaving and certainly nobody thought Rice would be a 100 million player. There was some grumbling about KDB but not much.

They're not mistakes if they are like the 99% of young players who get dumped by every club every year and go on to do feck all in the game.

The biggest mistakes for me were Tomori and Guehi. Both looked good when they played for us, in he first team and academy. Obviously the sanctions and not being able to keep Rudi and Christensen made those sales look even more stupid.
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I think those are the big ones. Would you rather Tomori/Guehi or Christiansen (Rudiger is obviously too good for this discussion)? That is on the clubs approach imo, where you don't have a focus on getting academy products into first team. My point is irrespective of sanctions etc, I would have looked to get the academy grads into the team ahead of the established older relatively average players.

For ex, I would much prefer Kambawala to take over Lindelof's spot.

Maybe you are getting better as you are currently giving game time to Coliwell and Matsen. But then maybe you could do better with them too by playing Coliwell as CB and Matsen as LB?
 
mav_9me said:
I think those are the big ones. Would you rather Tomori/Guehi or Christiansen (Rudiger is obviously too good for this discussion)? That is on the clubs approach imo, where you don't have a focus on getting academy products into first team. My point is irrespective of sanctions etc, I would have looked to get the academy grads into the team ahead of the established older relatively average players.

For ex, I would much prefer Kambawala to take over Lindelof's spot.

Maybe you are getting better as you are currently giving game time to Coliwell and Matsen. But then maybe you could do better with them too by playing Coliwell as CB and Matsen as LB?
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Christensen is also an academy product so you'd be sacking one off for another. And he's not an average player, he was and is better than Tomori or Guehi. There's a reason he plays for Barca and not Palace.

Poch doesnt seem to consider Maatsen as a LB at all. Colwill is fine at LB, especially when we have decent options at CB but none at LB with Cucu and Chilly out. It's a real shame that Chalobah has been out as well, he'd have got a chance somewhere in the back line.
 
WeePat said:
I mean KDB and Salah are outright mistakes. That doesn't mean the reasoning at the time wasn't sound, at least in the case of Salah. I was shouting from the rooftops at the time that selling KDB was a brainless decision and he proved me right very very quickly.
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I'm departing from Olise for a moment but what was the reasoning on Salah. He'd had a very good loan the season before, voted player of the season. A season after selling him he goes Liverpool and explodes. Was it Cuadrado starting on the right at the time?

It's difficult to see the clubs reasoning with all that in mind.
 
UTAretro said:
Well none of us know the details of that, I was responding to the classic “just sell him” post. Sell him to who? The clubs that can afford him don’t need him; and the ones that do can’t afford him.
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It's not a classic "just sell him" post. It's a replacement post. Whatever role Sancho held going into the season needs to be replaced by someone else who's contributing. Whether they will sell, loan or release him, we need to get a replacement, hence why we're on Olise's thread.
 
duffer said:
Christensen is also an academy product so you'd be sacking one off for another. And he's not an average player, he was and is better than Tomori or Guehi. There's a reason he plays for Barca and not Palace.

Poch doesnt seem to consider Maatsen as a LB at all. Colwill is fine at LB, especially when we have decent options at CB but none at LB with Cucu and Chilly out. It's a real shame that Chalobah has been out as well, he'd have got a chance somewhere in the back line.
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Fair enough.
 
Marwood said:
I'm departing from Olise for a moment but what was the reasoning on Salah. He'd had a very good loan the season before, voted player of the season. A season after selling him he goes Liverpool and explodes. Was it Cuadrado starting on the right at the time?

It's difficult to see the clubs reasoning with all that in mind.
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Pedro/Willian/Hazard/Oscar were playing behind Diego Costa for 15/16 and 16/17 when Salah was on loan at Roma and then sold to Roma. Liverpool signed him summer 17.
 
FrankWhite said:
£35M according to Google. Sell sancho and get him. Only concern would be injury history.
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That was last summer when Chelsea were trying to get him (and every other player in football) - he signed a new contract after rejecting them with a higher release clause, couldn't find much on Google, was wondering if anyone here had the inside scoop.
 
yumtum said:
That was last summer when Chelsea were trying to get him (and every other player in football) - he signed a new contract after rejecting them with a higher release clause, couldn't find much on Google, was wondering if anyone here had the inside scoop.
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It was around 80 I think
 
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