Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

Messi or Ronaldo

  • Messi

  • Ronaldo

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SCP said:
Can't we just say Messi is Federer or Cristiano is Nadal and close the damn thread? :drool:
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Nooooo - Zidane was the Federer and fat Ronaldo was the Nadal. :D


(Messi & C Ronaldo should have a series of one v ones though. I can't say there'd be much doubt over who'd win ;))
 
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SCP said:
Can't we just say Messi is Federer or Cristiano is Nadal and close the damn thread? :drool:

Always laughable to find Dutch fans from Feyenoord talking about shit, when was the last time we lost to the mighty Dutch?

Talk about delusion :lol:
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I know right. Bunch of deluded feckers.


...

Wait a minute, are you talking about me?!

Great argumentation though, you must be the head of your local debate team.
I’d say Ronaldo is Roddick and Messi is Federer though.
 
KirkDuyt said:
Let's put it this way, and yes this is my opinion etc, I think if Ronaldo and Messi switch places Barcelona will get worse and Real will get Better. The only thing Ronaldo is arguably better at is scoring goals. And even that is an insignificant difference at best. At all other aspects of the game (dribbling / passing / vision / playmaking) Messi is much better. This is not even my opinion, there is no way a sane person can debate this.

Ronaldo winning the Euro's with an utterly shite Portugal team becoming the worst Euro winners since Greece by defeating (with him) a vastly superior France in the final doesn't change that.

Why am I once again arguing in this silly thread :lol:
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It is debatable when you pretty much only mention the aspects of the game Messi’s better at and you conveniently forget all the other aspects of the game.

I’m not sure being called the worst Euro winners since Greece is really that meaningful either considering only Spain won it since then :lol:
 
KirkDuyt said:
I know right. Bunch of deluded feckers.
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Who? The Dutch or the Portuguese? :p
KirkDuyt said:
Wait a minute, are you talking about me?!
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Maybe
KirkDuyt said:
Great argumentation though, you must be the head of your local debate team.
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Wow don't know what to say...
KirkDuyt said:
I’d say Ronaldo is Roddick and Messi is Federer though.
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Nah, Ronaldo wins more trophies during his sleep than you, Feyenoord, the Dutch NT and Roddick together. We just love to be shit and try to win something. ;)
 
my take on the players both have played with at club level.

Who would win?



 
Arbitrium said:
my take on the players both have played with at club level.

Who would win?



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Jesus that would be some game. That midfield battle would be something else.

Can't even begin to pick a winner.
 
Peyroteo said:
It is debatable when you pretty much only mention the aspects of the game Messi’s better at and you conveniently forget all the other aspects of the game.

I’m not sure being called the worst Euro winners since Greece is really that meaningful either considering only Spain won it since then :lol:
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Ronaldo is better at many things fine:

faster runner
Taller
Higher jumper
Cooler hair

The Ronaldo is a more complete player is utter and complete nonsense though. He's not.
 
KirkDuyt said:
Ronaldo is better at many things fine:

faster runner
Taller
Higher jumper
Cooler hair

The Ronaldo is a more complete player is utter and complete nonsense though. He's not.
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Ronaldo is definitely better in acting before the free kick, Messi on the other hand is better in taking the free kick.
 
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KirkDuyt said:
Feck, I knew it! Ronaldo is secretly 5 midgets wearing a raincoat and you're one of them!

Also, Roddick alone won 60 titles. As the ancient Chinese proverb goes: check yoself before you wreck yo self
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Yup, now I know, I am speaking with a football Einstein, really impressed with your superior knowledge, next you are going to bring me a quote from Confucius or what?

I accept with total humbleness a guy from Argentina, Brazil, Italy, Spain, Germany, France, maybe even England saying yup you are shit, now a dutch fan I just have to say with total respect, first beat us then come and talk with me.
 
SCP said:
Yup, now I know, I am speaking with a football Einstein, really impressed with your superior knowledge, next you are going to bring me a quote from Confucius or what?

I accept with total humbleness a guy from Argentina, Brazil, Italy, Spain, Germany, France, maybe even England saying yup you are shit, now a dutch fan I just have to say with total respect, first beat us then come and talk with me.
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Fine I'll join your pissing contest.

Holland and Portugal both won 1 European Championship. Neither of us has won a world cup. However, where your best result was 3rd place we were runners up three times.

Of all Ballon d'or winners 7 were from Holland. The most of any country shared with Germany. Portugal has won 5 all your main man Ronny.

By several top 10 lists of best national teams ever, the Dutch team of 74-78 is ranked at 7th place. There is no team from Portugal in that list. Ofcourse these lists are subjective, but I'd struggle to name a Portuguese national team to make any of these lists.

In the history of the Champions league and it's predecessor the Europa Cup 1 a Dutch team won it 6 times, whilst Portugal sports only 4 winners.

There, you're shit, so are we.

fun fact: being shit has absolutely nothing to do with the merit of ones argument. Or do you think Mourinho's shit because he never played at a high level and therefore is not allowed to tell players what to do?

Here's a Confucius quote that illustrates the greatness of Ronaldo: "The will to win, the desire to succeed, the urge to reach your full potential... these are the keys that will unlock the door to personal excellence."
 
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Lord SInister said:
sorry but this post is filled with too much fan boyish logic to take seriously.
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Mate, this is a Messi vs Ronaldo thread.
Are you seriously saying that that post was more fanboyish than any other in this thread? :lol:
The whole thread is packed with fanboys and TBH, if you are not a fanboy, you shouldn't be posting in this thread. :D

And for the record, my vote goes to Ronaldo. Simply because he was prolific in 2 different leagues.
He was fantastic in the EPL (which is not easy to do). He then went to Spain, adapted to a different style of play and was prolific there, also.

If Messi were to come to the EPL and do exaclty what he does for Barca, in an EPL side, I'd hand it to Messi. But until then, I will always hold Ronaldo in higher esteem, simply because he did the business for 2 different teams and will most likely be able to do the business for another team, in another league, should he choose to.
 
Arbitrium said:
my take on the players both have played with at club level.

Who would win?



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If the two teams played 10 times, I'd guess 6 Messi wins, 3 draws and 1 Ronaldo win.

Giggs and RVN are not the same level of match winners as Ronaldhino and Henry despite both being extremely good. The defences are equally good imo. Messi I rate as better as Ronaldo, but that midfield is where the 'Barca' team would dominate. Despite being similar quality on paper, it's the combination of that Barca midfield which was the difference. They just dominated matches through possession and this would be no different. When you only have 30% of the time on the ball, there's only so much Scholes et al could create.
 
sunama said:
Mate, this is a Messi vs Ronaldo thread.
Are you seriously saying that that post was more fanboyish than any other in this thread? :lol:
The whole thread is packed with fanboys and TBH, if you are not a fanboy, you shouldn't be posting in this thread. :D

And for the record, my vote goes to Ronaldo. Simply because he was prolific in 2 different leagues.
He was fantastic in the EPL (which is not easy to do). He then went to Spain, adapted to a different style of play and was prolific there, also.

If Messi were to come to the EPL and do exaclty what he does for Barca, in an EPL side, I'd hand it to Messi. But until then, I will always hold Ronaldo in higher esteem, simply because he did the business for 2 different teams and will most likely be able to do the business for another team, in another league, should he choose to.
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Ronaldo achieving the level he has at two clubs in two leagues is hardly relevant if he's still not as good as Messi. You're conceding Messi would be better should he reach a similar level in the PL, which means you presumably think he's better then Ronaldo in in La Liga.

To think Messi wouldn't be able to do it in England really is clutching at straws. If Suarez, Aguero, Costa, Torres, Silva, Mata can all succeed here and in Spain, then to thin Messi couldn't despite being clearly better than them is nonsense.
 
That is the biggest nosense of this discussion. And then, saying that Ronaldo is a more complete player.

Peyroteo who is the reencarnation of CAL? even before the absence of Cal?, doesn't use that kind of stupid arguments.
 
nePhantom said:
Ronaldo is the more complete goal scorer IMO. He gets 35-40 yards of goal and he’s dangerous. He can score with power, precision, headers, free kicks, you name it. Messi is amazing but he’s dangerous in our just outside the box. Ronaldo has also done it in the Premier League, which is something I’m critical of Messi.
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KirkDuyt said:
Fine I'll join your pissing contest.

Holland and Portugal both won 1 European Championship. Neither of us has won a world cup. However, where your best result was 3rd place we were runners up three times.

Of all Ballon d'or winners 7 were from Holland. The most of any country shared with Germany. Portugal has won 5 all your main man Ronny.

By several top 10 lists of best national teams ever, the Dutch team of 74-78 is ranked at 7th place. There is no team from Portugal in that list. Ofcourse these lists are subjective, but I'd struggle to name a Portuguese national team to make any of these lists.

In the history of the Champions league and it's predecessor the Europa Cup 1 a Dutch team won it 6 times, whilst Portugal sports only 4 winners.

There, you're shit, so are we.

fun fact: being shit has absolutely nothing to do with the merit of ones argument. Or do you think Mourinho's shit because he never played at a high level and therefore is not allowed to tell players what to do?

Here's a Confucius quote that illustrates the greatness of Ronaldo: "The will to win, the desire to succeed, the urge to reach your full potential... these are the keys that will unlock the door to personal excellence."
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a little correction.
Portugal has 8 ballon dors.
Eusebio has 2 and Figo 1, other than Cristiano's 5.
 
KirkDuyt said:
Fine I'll join your pissing contest.
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This is a Messi vs Ronaldo thread, not a Netherlands vs Portugal thread, don't waste your time, everything you mentioned I know it very well, might not sound but I respect Dutch football history.

By the way on the portuguese football threads I even am called by other posters as dramatic because I am always saying we probably are going to be eliminated in the group stage, also I don't like Fernando Santos football concepts, so Spain and Morocco will go through.
KirkDuyt said:
Holland and Portugal both won 1 European Championship. Neither of us has won a world cup. However, where your best result was 3rd place we were runners up three times.
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As I mentioned I know all that, your performances at the WC are much better than ours, we only perform well at European Championships.
KirkDuyt said:
Of all Ballon d'or winners 7 were from Holland. The most of any country shared with Germany. Portugal has won 5 all your main man Ronny.
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:nono: Germany 7, Netherlands 7, Portugal 7, and we didn't won 8 because a stupid Benfica journalist cnut here from Portugal voted for Gullit instead Futre, when Porto won the European Cup in 1987 vs Bayern.

By the way 3 players won, Cristiano, Figo and Eusébio, sorry about that, it was a draw on this one, somebody has to do his homework on this forum, I know, I am hard to beat.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballon_d'Or

KirkDuyt said:
By several top 10 lists of best national teams ever, the Dutch team of 74-78 is ranked at 7th place. There is no team from Portugal in that list. Ofcourse these lists are subjective, but I'd struggle to name a Portuguese national team to make any of these lists.
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I give that no Portuguese NT had the same quality than the Dutch between 74-78, but those rankings are subjective to me.

For example the 66 team from Eusébio in 6 matches won 5 and only lost the semifinal vs England who played at home. And they beat Brazil, Hungary and the Soviet Union, with Benfica and Sporting players who won the European and Cup Winners Cup, while Eusébio scored 9 goals, so probably they weren't that bad.

Also the 2000 team from Figo, Rui Costa or João Pinto only lost in extra time vs France in the semifinals and played atractive football, even the 2004 team, if we exclude the 2 games vs Greece wasn't bad at all.
KirkDuyt said:
In the history of the Champions league and it's predecessor the Europa Cup 1 a Dutch team won it 6 times, whilst Portugal sports only 4 winners.
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Yup, but in 2011,2004 and 2003 Porto won 2 Europa Leagues and 1 Champions League, while the last time a Dutch team won was in 2002 with Feyenoord.
KirkDuyt said:
There, you're shit, so are we.

fun fact: being shit has absolutely nothing to do with the merit of ones argument. Or do you think Mourinho's shit because he never played at a high level and therefore is not allowed to tell players what to do?
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No he is shit because between 2002 and 2010 he was top level, after Inter he is just on a downward spiral, for me he isn't the best portuguese coach, but that doesn't matter for anyone here because nobody cares about football played, they just look at what he won in the past.
 
Pass and Move said:
If the two teams played 10 times, I'd guess 6 Messi wins, 3 draws and 1 Ronaldo win.

Giggs and RVN are not the same level of match winners as Ronaldhino and Henry despite both being extremely good. The defences are equally good imo. Messi I rate as better as Ronaldo, but that midfield is where the 'Barca' team would dominate. Despite being similar quality on paper, it's the combination of that Barca midfield which was the difference. They just dominated matches through possession and this would be no different. When you only have 30% of the time on the ball, there's only so much Scholes et al could create.
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yes thread is filled with fan boys but I find it terribly hilarious when people act like playing for Real Madrid and Manchester United is a great disadvantage.
 
I've now decided that this is the worst debate in the history of debates and I hate myself for not being able to stop reading these pointless nonsense.
No one is going to win this and no one will convince anyone that they're wrong, so you guys should pack it in and go outside ffs.
 
SCP said:
snip
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To be fair, you brought up the I should shut up because the Dutch are shite argument.

Also, I'm not trying to be a dick (failing horribly I know) as I respect Portuguese football very much :)

Also also, point taken about the ballon d'ors, I forgot about Figo and Eusebio, silly me.

The main thing I'm trying to say though. No matter what team you support or what country you're from. The performance of your (national) team has no merit on the quality of your argument. And you opened with lol you're Dutch your argument is invalid. And that is about as big a fallacy as they come.

Anywho, no hard feelings, I still think Portugal are shit and Messi is better than Ronaldo :devil:
 
By the way, no confusion here, no problem at all in saying Messi is a complete player without admiring the 3 transformations Cristiano had during his carrer.
 
Arbitrium said:
Because one utilizes accuracy, and the other hits and hopes. Ronaldo should revert to taking all free kicks the way he took it v Sunderland.

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As the article pointed out, the conversion rate isn’t so different, and Ronaldo strikes them from further out, therefore one has to conclude his method is more beneficial to the team than Messi’s.
 
Aguero is better than Messi apperantly. He did it in la liga and the mighty premier league.
 
Cal? said:
As the article pointed out, the conversion rate isn’t so different, and Ronaldo strikes them from further out, therefore one has to conclude his method is more beneficial to the team than Messi’s.
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I just don’t understand it. I remember seeing this live (I was just behind the person taking the video actually)



He strikes the ball almost perfectly with the inside of his foot. It’s as clean as it gets. Then he nailed that one v Portsmouth and changed completely to the knuckleball technique. I’m confident that even from distance, he’d have scored so much more if he changed back to the other technique.

If you’re 20-30 yards out, and it’s the last minute and you need to score the free kick to win, I think most pick messi.
 
Arbitrium said:
I just don’t understand it. I remember seeing this live (I was just behind the person taking the video actually)



He strikes the ball almost perfectly with the inside of his foot. It’s as clean as it gets. Then he nailed that one v Portsmouth and changed completely to the knuckleball technique. I’m confident that even from distance, he’d have scored so much more if he changed back to the other technique.

If you’re 20-30 yards out, and it’s the last minute and you need to score the free kick to win, I think most pick messi.
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If you’re 20 yards out, you may pick Messi, if you’re 30 yards out and pick Messi you’re insane, has he even scored from that far out?
 
Cal? said:
If you’re 20 yards out, you may pick Messi, if you’re 30 yards out and pick Messi you’re insane, has he even scored from that far out?
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You'd pick Messi, as him floating the ball into the box has a better chance of someone converting it than Ronaldo taking a free kick from 30 yards out.
 
Cal? said:
If you’re 20 yards out, you may pick Messi, if you’re 30 yards out and pick Messi you’re insane, has he even scored from that far out?
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He’s had a fair few in the 28/29 yard range to justify him taking ones from 30
 
Pass and Move said:
You'd pick Messi, as him floating the ball into the box has a better chance of someone converting it than Ronaldo taking a free kick from 30 yards out.
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That’s purely hypothetical, Real have scored plenty with the keeper palming Ronaldo free kicks into the path of attackers
 
@Cal?

A fairly large amount of these, the wall is placed either on or outside the 18 yard line, so it’s minimum 28 yards. I think the original point stands, anything between 20-30 yards (which is always the most likely range for scoring from free kicks) you choose messi.

 
Peyroteo said:
They score at the same rate as eachother so why would you pick Messi?
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Because from that distance accuracy beats power more often than not. There’s absolutely no way that if we did a comparison of free kicks taken from 20-30 yards that messi wouldn’t win in terms of goals scored, shots on target and the distance that the target was missed by.
 
Arbitrium said:
Because from that distance accuracy beats power more often than not. There’s absolutely no way that if we did a comparison of free kicks taken from 20-30 yards that messi wouldn’t win in terms of goals scored, shots on target and the distance that the target was missed by.
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Why would you care about by how far they missed?

If anything according to the numbers Ronaldo should have a better conversion rate from that distance since he takes a lot from further out which lowers his percentages. It's a very small difference either way
 
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Lord SInister said:
One thing I fail how has Cristiano suddenly being argued as a more winning player over Messi, is it because he has won one more CL as an active finalist over Messi. Because as far as I know Messi's contribution to all Barcelona victories are as much Cristiano's to Madrid or Utd.
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I'm sorry but without Ronnie, we're not winning the CL or most of those league titles. He was unstoppable in England.
 
Culero said:
That opinion should never ever be recognized in any debate about a players greatness. Absurd and illogical considering Messi's performances in the CL against English sides.
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Why though? In my opinion (which is the basis of the thread) the English league is a stronger league than the Spanish league. Again, not saying Messi is garbage, but if I could choose one out of the two I’d choose Ronaldo.
 
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