Messi in Miami

[Gehrman]

Damn looking up Riquelme's best passing on youtube its not hard to see where Messi got his style from

 

[Fallon d'Floor]

Anyone coming with stats to prove a point and compare radically different football eras isn't worth a serious conversation.

I'm sorry, did something in my post offend you or are Leicester fans just assholes?

 

[Ole'sgunnarwin]

Anyone coming with stats to prove a point and compare radically different football eras isn't worth a serious conversation.

Ridiculous thing to say. It's not everything but of course it's important

 

[Eriku]

I've given up arguing across eras. Maradona was the best player of the 80s. Messi is the best player of the 21st century, or the last decade at least. Messi v Ronaldo is a fair debate, because they are dealing with the same circumstances. Maradona v Platini is a fair debate because they were dealing with the same circumstances. Messi v Maradona is not a logical debate. Football in Messi's time is completely different from what it was when Diego was playing. The whole world was completely different.

Yeah, that’s why I don’t have a firm answer when asked.

 

[Eriku]

Your response their is fair. But you were saying you obviously you haven't watched Maradona. Nobody said anything about levels above. They're both the 2 best players ever but there was nothing Maradona was clearly better at than Messi

FriedClams did:

In terms of ability with the ball, their dribbling is almost identical but passing wise, Messi is a few levels above IMO.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

FriedClams did: In terms of ability with the ball, their dribbling is almost identical but passing wise, Messi is a few levels above IMO.

Which was ridiculous to be honest.

You can prefer Messi's passing over Maradona's, but there's no shot it's levels above. They're both in the same tier.

 

[Sky1981]

Well he did it twice with Napoli to begin with, and if you watched him in his prime you'd sing another tune.

I absolutely love Messi and there's no doubt
in my mind that he's up there with the best footballers to ever grace a football pitch. Anyone putting him as the greatest of all time wouldn't have any complaint from me.

But seeing people trying to downplay what Maradona was and what he achieved is absolutely hilarious.

Between Maradonna and Messi is a matter of flavor. I dont think there's much to say, nothing wrong if you prefer one or the other is slightly "condom thin" better

But what irks me is that people from both sides arguing that one is the better because of silly arguments such as "doing it once with Napoli" or "doing it in 21st era where it's easier for attackers" argument. All eras have their plus and minus. In Maradona Era scoring 30 goals a season will be considered phenomenal not even R9 managed it i think. In messi time scoring 40-50 a season is called a bad season. So the bar is way higher. Messi won a treble and it's meh, while Maradonna won ONE serie A or was it two?

Now again. I rate both as equal, slightly favoring Messi because of longevity. It's hard maintaning 40 goals a season average for 15 years for me.

And people pointing to YouTube compilations of Maradona, as if Messi has none. Messi scored 600 plus goals we're falling asleep watching his compilations.

I'm a ronaldo fans btw, but this "Maradona is better. Period" really irks me

 

[Sky1981]

Ridiculous thing to say. It's not everything but of course it's important

Stats dont paint a full picture but 650 goals does paint the picture well.

It's a fact that proves a point rather than otherwise. Maintaning consistency over 15 years is hard. As you grow in reputation teams are more aware, studying your moves, double teaming you, blocking low, even sending hatchet guys to injure you. That's what separates the best top tier footballer with one or two season wonder. They up their game and evolve

 

[Eriku]

Which was ridiculous to be honest.

You can prefer Messi's passing over Maradona's, but there's no shot it's levels above. They're both in the same tier.

Yeah, hair-splitting. Certainly no daylight between them. That compilation That Bloke posted should make that pretty clear.

 

[Fortitude]

I'm sorry, did something in my post offend you or are Leicester fans just assholes?

The fundamental lack of understanding of the era Maradona played in and what 80's Serie A football represents (that being the apex of the sport's defensive organisation, negativity and difficulty to score) is probably acting as a trigger.

You have to weight attacking contributions in that era and league differently, or factor them into what you're presenting otherwise it becomes redundant because, like it or loathe it, there will never ever be a 1:1 ratio between that league and it's difficulty for attackers and anything else before or after. In fact, that era and that league plus the culminating World Cup '90 forced change for the entirety of football, for the greater good of the entertainment factor and to give attackers protection as well as reprimand defenders for truly disgusting, unrelenting foul play, the likes of which players in the latter 90's, let alone into this millennium, never once had to endure on a football pitch.

Because of that era and that league, we have been privy to the attacking growth of the game.

 

[That_Bloke]

The fundamental lack of understanding of the era Maradona played in and what 80's Serie A football represents (that being the apex of the sport's defensive organisation, negativity and difficulty to score) is probably acting as a trigger.

You have to weight attacking contributions in that era and league differently, or factor them into what you're presenting otherwise it becomes redundant because, like it or loathe it, there will never ever be a 1:1 ratio between that league and it's difficulty for attackers and anything else before or after. In fact, that era and that league plus the culminating World Cup '90 forced change for the entirety of football, for the greater good of the entertainment factor and to give attackers protection as well as reprimand defenders for truly disgusting, unrelenting foul play, the likes of which players in the latter 90's, let alone into this millennium, never once had to endure on a football pitch.

Because of that era and that league, we have been privy to the attacking growth of the game.

Thank you.

 

[That_Bloke]

Your response their is fair. But you were saying you obviously you haven't watched Maradona. Nobody said anything about levels above. They're both the 2 best players ever but there was nothing Maradona was clearly better at than Messi

I think that you should re-read my post.

 

[That_Bloke]

I've given up arguing across eras. Maradona was the best player of the 80s. Messi is the best player of the 21st century, or the last decade at least. Messi v Ronaldo is a fair debate, because they are dealing with the same circumstances. Maradona v Platini is a fair debate because they were dealing with the same circumstances. Messi v Maradona is not a logical debate. Football in Messi's time is completely different from what it was when Diego was playing. The whole world was completely different.

Which is the wisest thing any sane fan football fan can do.

It's not. The debate only happened on paper, mostly stirred by media in search of a Hollywood story, in an era plagued by a moneyball approach and people only swearing by numbers instead of paying real attention to the players they prop up. Anyone thinking that C.Ronaldo was in the same league as Messi understands nothing about football.

That's not to say that CR7 isn't an all time great in his own right, because he absolutely is. However in terms of raw talent, vision, playmaking, passing, dribbling, freekick taking and overall ability, Messi utterly buries him six feet under, and he didn't need the 2022 WC for that. They're on par when it comes to finishing. The only thing CR7 truly is better at is heading the ball. I personally consider the latter as one of the best, if not the best ever in this category.

Indeed, even if the debate ended after the 1986 WC, and by Platini's own admission Maradona was the better player anyways.

Absolutely, hence my reaction when people try to bring up numbers. That means they're either completely short of arguments or simply don't know or understand how different the eras were, how the teams were organized, the overall style of play practiced in this era, especially in the Seria A, and how difficult it was to score goals back then.

Maradona played deeper than Messi and was forced to get the ball in his own half most of the time. His primary goal was to break the double-decker routine and feeding his team mates whilst avoiding career ending tackles. Every single game. That's not even considering that Napoli were a nothing club when Diego popped up and it took three seasons to really get them up to speed.

 

[Acrobat7]

I've given up arguing across eras. Maradona was the best player of the 80s. Messi is the best player of the 21st century, or the last decade at least. Messi v Ronaldo is a fair debate, because they are dealing with the same circumstances. Maradona v Platini is a fair debate because they were dealing with the same circumstances. Messi v Maradona is not a logical debate. Football in Messi's time is completely different from what it was when Diego was playing. The whole world was completely different.

Thank you.

 

[That_Bloke]

Absolute genius at work by there.

Notice how deep Maradona is when he makes these passes, his ability to keep and protect the ball in tight spaces and how he anticipates the incoming passing opportunity.

I can't get over people worshipping a Mbappé and throwing the "word class" epithet at scrubs like Bellingham or even worse, a Bruno Fernandes. That a Vini Jr. is in serious contention for the Ballon d'Or says it all.

Messi is the last of an all but an extinct breed.