He lost a bit of pace but is making it up in other areas and becoming more surgical. Think Ronaldo (brazilian) in 2001-2004 period
Messi at the World Cup - No Ronaldo comparisons!
- Thread starter amolbhatia50k
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The pace on that pass is just perfect.
Pace, weight, angle...everything about it is just perfect
Even in my head I'm trying to play that pass and it seems impossible, so easy to overhit it.. the execution is out of this world. Perfect amount of spin to just cut across Kompany at the right time.
That's the best pass I've seen for a long long time. Ridiculous.
I have seen championship players score better goals. Really bad argument.
It wasn't about the quality of the goal, it was about the occasion. It was a crucial goal that killed off Atlético Madrid in the final to win Bayern their first ever European Cup which was followed up by two more consecutive European Cups. On a personal level that goal put him as the top scorer in the tournament for the second year in a row and even more impressively was the goal that saw him complete the relatively unique feat of scoring in every round of the European Cup.
Thanks for your constructive criticism of my argument though. It's stuff like that that keeps the football forums alive.
Messi's finishing as a whole seems to have deteriorated over the past year, but it's most visible specifically in 1v1 situations. Really didn't expect him to miss that chance right at the end there, even though it was a fine save from Courtois.
yeah i've noticed that too, it's not just the shot, he could've easily just carried the ball and gone around courtois with speed since courtois came so far out. I can only imagine that such a sprint makes him tired and sloppier when it comes to execute. in the past such a situation would've been a guaranteed goal for messi.
He gets put under immense pressure, probably more than he gets in Europe.
Agreed, the pressure he plays under is incredible. The expectations placed on him are incredible and the comparisons that are made must be difficult to cope with on a day-to-day basis.
I was also surprised when he missed that final chance at the end of the last game. It seemed all set up for him to round Courtious and slot it home but he tried to toe poke it strangely.
Also, is it fair to say he's the best passer of the ball in the game currently?
When I was going through barcaforums earlier this year the consensus on there was he's a better passer than Xavi and Iniesta.
He is one match away from glory. Im sure he knows that this is his one shot at it and he simply has to take it.
He was poor tonight but some people were going over the top in the match thread, saying he couldn't be seen on par with the greats because of this, as if none of them had some poor spells.
Good for him. I'm torn on wanting him to win it and preferring Germany as a team.
he's been dissapointing today against the dutch, but there will be no verdict until the final is over.
Why is it all about Messi? He's had a below-par World Cup and IF Argentina win the World Cup, you know whats going to happen, people will say he's surpassed Maradona/hype his performances up into something they wasn't when he's not set the World Cup alight like the Maradona's/Pele's of the past.
It will also be interesting to see how Messi plays in the final, if he turns it up a notch and becomes a demon... all these theories will come to a rest by sunday and we'll know whether he's been saving himself, or whether he's really truly been knackered and exhausted these past 14 monthes (which i think is true regardless).
Messi is over the hill. He is still a world class player but we now know he has started to lose his pace and might need to readjust his game like Giggs had to do... how the hell did that happen. He has just turned 27.
i actually don't consider this below par for messi anymore, just his style these days. He has few chances per game because defenses are so focused on locking him out, and yet still produces game changing moments at a more threatening and consistent regularity then anyone in this world cup so far. Compare him to robben and he's made i think 3x as many key passes and even dribbled more then Robben?
People are just overly criticizing because they have unrealistic expectations.
something to do with 70 games a year for 4 or 5 years consecutively and playing through injuries.
Wasn't poor at all. Just below his usual high standard. Created 2-3 chances which should have been converted.
Hope Argentina wins it all. That way he can be considered a top 3 all time player.
Hope Argentina wins it all. That way he can be considered a top 3 all time player.
there's no way Argentina will win it. for me, it's all pretty similar to us vs Bayern; 2 or 3 quallity but underperforming individuals against perfect team. it's just not enough. Di Maria and Aguero aren't even at their best.
The issue for Messi is that when you compare greats you have to take in to account their club football performances and their performances for their national teams. Maradona reached his highest peak both for on club level and on the international stage and so did Pele whereas Messi simply hasn't ever performed in the biggest tournaments to a level comparable to the other greats.
This is Messi's third World Cup and I doubt he will return as a 31 year old in 2018 dominating enough to be compared to the very finest in history, he may shock us though who knows.
Disappointing very any half decent team he came up against after the group stages, and even at that they weren't great teams at all. Invisible for the majority of the Dutch game, he honestly looks half the player he was a year ago but then again he has no Iniesta and Xavi at Barcelona.
You're right that is exactly how it will be portrayed, but in my view he's been average most of the tournament and Argentina have a team have been fairly underwhelming for the players they have and the opponents they've faced. I don't understand why everyone continues to peddle the lines about 'Messi's World Cup' and 'bound to play a crucial role yet'. Why? Not every Argentina success = Messi success. He's done no more today or this tournament than Mascherano, Higuain, Garay etc.
Some would argue that what Messi has done at club level surpasses what the other two did, due to how dominant and incredible he has been in Europe on numerous occasions.
The World Cup is only a small sample of his playing time, and is no longer often considered as being the pinnacle of football, whereas it was back then. I know it's great for a player to win a WC if they can, but for me it shouldn't be viewed as the be all and end all, especially in the modern game.
I fail to see how winning one match, no matter how big it is will make him the best ever. For me he is already in the top three ever no matter what happens and he got there from his consistency and great performances from 2008-2011. How would a defender slipping tomorrow and costing argentina the win make him any worse than if they went on to win? The world cup is a team trophy not an individual one, so I think it is unfair on messi for people to say he has to win the world cup.
Hope he wins it.
Messi is over the hill 
Good on him. A rare opportunity.
And that's why I hope Argentina don't win it because i don't consider Messi a top3 player of all time.
Top players make ANY side into champions (like Maradona Napoli) and being the main driving force in the their country being conquerors, not a cog or by-stander like Messi as been at this World Cup, certainly in the knockouts.
I think Messi is just very lucky to have played in possibly the best club side in history, one of the most naturally gifted talents to have played the game for sure, but Messi for Argentina is not the best player in the world, never has been and i don't think he would if he played for any other club other than Barcelona.
Messi's work rate was terrible. He lost the ball on several occasions, and instead of trying to win the ball back he just continued strolling. I'm not expecting him to run back to his byline like Ji Sung Park, but around you, make things happen. He was supposed to be the focal point of the attack, and I felt Lavezzi and their number 8 were better going forward, while Mascherano and Zabaleta were rocks at the back. He rarely attempted to dribble. His passes were mostly overhit. Bad performance from the man.
I don't see Argentina winning the World Cup against Germany unless Aguero, Messi and co just wake up.
I don't see Argentina winning the World Cup against Germany unless Aguero, Messi and co just wake up.
so why he didn't do shit in champions league?
If Argentina wins it all, but Messi has an awful finals game, then no he won't be considered a top 3 all time player by many people. It's not the result, it's the performance. If he is the best player ever, he needs to show that on the pitch, and in this last game, you'd forgive a casual watcher of the game for walking away thinking Lavezzi was the star of the Argentinian team.
its no surprise he has lost pace or isn't as good as before. The amount of games he has played and the level he has played them in, it was always going to take a toll on his body.
No disrespect but all the other greats such as Zidane, Figo, Giggs etc did not play at the level that Messi has played in recent years. Only Ronaldinho and Brazillian Ronaldo have played at a similar/better club level to Messi and no surprise both players broke down quickly and they were far from their best when they reached their late 20's.
No disrespect but all the other greats such as Zidane, Figo, Giggs etc did not play at the level that Messi has played in recent years. Only Ronaldinho and Brazillian Ronaldo have played at a similar/better club level to Messi and no surprise both players broke down quickly and they were far from their best when they reached their late 20's.
Messi is over the hill
Physically he's, if not over it completely, quite clearly on a downward slope.
He probably isn't as good as he was once was but still world class though. That should be good enough to make an impact
Even if Messi gets sent off in the first minute and Argentina win it on penalties on Sunday, it'll be billed as Messi winning the World Cup all by himself.