Mats Hummels

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AkaAkuma said:
How have Gotze and Lewandowski been received when they returned with Bayern?
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If I remember correctly not much happened when Lewandowski returned apart from the usual boos. He was always a highly professional mercenary and he gave it his all even though his contract was running out so the backlash wasn't that horrible.

Götze on the other hand had to warm up in the tunnel...
 
Dwazza von Moosesteiger said:
What a dick. For a country whose people put the wander in wanderlust their footballers leave me fairly perplexed what with their reluctance to play abroad.
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Only a couple of clubs are attractive for a player like Hummels, mainly those with a realistic chance of winning a CL title. Not all of those will be actively searching for a player his position. Who is? Bayern ofc. We all heard the rumours about Real or Barca, but there's a bit of a difference between a piece in the gossip column of a sports tabloid and an investment of that size actually agreed upon. He also will have talked to players who have first-hand experience playing for those clubs - Sahin, Kroos, Özil, Trapp, Ter Stegen, Schweinsteiger and might not have liked *every* bit he heard. About Bayern he already knows naturally.

Fun thing is that last weekend Hoeneß told the Media it was Hummels who "knocked on the door". The rest of the Bayern bigwigs were not amused (Neither was Watzke) and quick with a dementi, insisting it was Bayern made the move. Speculations in the media why a seasoned pro in the football and media world like Uli would do such a thing, as it obviously did nothing to smoothen the transfer. Either he did it on purpose because he doesn't want Hummels back, or he was actually telling the truth, unaware of the official communication line.
Might be a power thing between the current, quite new, team managers Reschke and Sammer (who are said to like Hummels) and the old guard who doesn't, and has trouble acknowledging that things changed in his absence.

Me? Well all i saw in the media about the transfer was initiated by old man Hummels or looked like it. Hummels may have said the truth that he didn't offer himself, but no one asked if that included his manager as well. I recon team managers like Reschke are in contact with a couple of prospect transfers all the time, its their job to do.
 
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AkaAkuma said:
How have Gotze and Lewandowski been received when they returned with Bayern?
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For Götze it was like a nightmare. He got boo'd and insulted extremely.

For Lewandowski it was a different case, he left in piece. People knew he came from abroad and had no special connection to Dortmund, also he always was honest about his destination and still gave his best for the team when he had to play 1 more year for Dortmund against his will.
 
This guy is really deluded. It's like he wants an easy transfer to Bayern while everyone sings his name.
 
strongwalker said:
Only a couple of clubs are attractive for a player like Hummels, mainly those with a realistic chance of winning a CL title. Not all of those will be actively searching for a player his position. Who is? Bayern ofc. We all heard the rumours about Real or Barca, but there's a bit of a difference between a piece in the gossip column of a sports tabloid and an investment of that size actually agreed upon. He also will have talked to players who have first-hand experience playing for those clubs - Sahin, Kroos, Özil, Trapp, Ter Stegen, Schweinsteiger and might not have liked *every* bit he heard. About Bayern he already knows naturally.

Fun thing is that last weekend Hoeneß told the Media it was Hummels who "knocked on the door". The rest of the Bayern bigwigs were not amused (Neither was Watzke) and quick with a dementi, insisting it was Bayern made the move. Speculations in the media why a seasoned pro in the football and media world like Uli would do such a thing, as it obviously did nothing to smoothen the transfer. Either he did it on purpose because he doesn't want Hummels back, or he was actually telling the truth, unaware of the official communication line.
Might be a power thing between the current, quite new, team managers Reschke and Sammer (who are said to like Hummels) and the old guard who doesn't, and has trouble acknowledging that things changed in his absence.

Me? Well all i saw in the media about the transfer was initiated by old man Hummels or looked like it. Hummels may have said the truth that he didn't offer himself, but no one asked if that included his manager as well. I recon team managers like Reschke are in contact with a couple of prospect transfers all the time, its their job to do.
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This really isn't true; there are about 5 clubs in England who would take Hummels and pay a pretty big fee for him. And there's no reason to suggest Barca wouldn't be interested either: a ball-playing, WC winning CB with stacks of experience.
 
Wonder what would happen if United came in with a hefty bid for him, would Dortmund accept knowing they'd be preventing Bayern if Hummels could be swung to join?
 
Devil81 said:
Wonder what would happen if United came in with a hefty bid for him, would Dortmund accept knowing they'd be preventing Bayern if Hummels could be swung to join?
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Well.. Why wouldn't Dortmund take a lot of money to not sell him to their rival?

I find that "statement" (he really only said to to a fan while leaving the training ground) kinda confusing btw. I mean, if everything really was open why would Watzke feck him over with an announcement like that?
 
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do.ob said:
I find that "statement" (he really only said to to a fan while leaving the training ground) kinda confusing btw. I mean, if everything really was open why would Watzke feck him over with an announcement like that?
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Because Hummels is a cnut and deserves it? Because Watzke wants to create a hostile environment for Hummels to force him to leave this summer, taking away the chance to do a Lewandowski and leave on a free to Bayern one year later?

I hope both Hoeneß and Watzke piss him off so much, that he decides to go abroad instead.
 
Balu said:
Because Hummels is a cnut and deserves it? Because Watzke wants to create a hostile environment for Hummels to force him to leave this summer, taking away the chance to do a Lewandowski and leave on a free to Bayern one year later?

I hope both Hoeneß and Watzke piss him off so much, that he decides to go abroad instead.
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You don't want him?
 
Balu said:
Because Hummels is a cnut and deserves it? Because Watzke wants to create a hostile environment for Hummels to force him to leave this summer, taking away the chance to do a Lewandowski and leave on a free to Bayern one year later?

I hope both Hoeneß and Watzke piss him off so much, that he decides to go abroad instead.
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Sure I agree, that Hummels deserved the whistles against Wolfsburg (the stuff after the match was a bit OTT though, it just seems bizarre that the team goes over to the fans after a 5-1 trashing and all they hear is whistles and insults, even if it's only targeted at Hummels), for stabbing the club in the back when they were just about to possibly get within striking distance of Bayern again. But if things were really completely open why would Watzke force him out? Dortmund won't get a better player than Hummels, no matter what fee they get, it created bit of turmoil within the club when Dortmund usually work very hard to keep things quiet and Dortmund need Hummels staying for another year to be a viable option on paper if they want to pressure Bayern into a serious offer.
The only explanation that makes sense to me is that Hummels made his decision, but doesn't have the guts to take the fallout like a man and instead tries to blur the truth to make the uncertainty stall the fans until he is gone.
 
Someone said:
You don't want him?
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Nope. Wouldn't want him for free. I don't want us to sign any more Dortmund players, I can't stand Hummels and find him insanely annoying and I don't trust his determination, his motivation or his injury record. Don't get me wrong, he's a quality player and actually a bit underrated. His peak years from 2010 to 2013 were nothing but sensational, but I really don't want him at Bayern.
 
do.ob said:
Sure I agree, that Hummels deserved the whistles against Wolfsburg (the stuff after the match was a bit OTT though, it just seems bizarre that the team goes over to the fans after a 5-1 trashing and all they hear is whistles and insults, even if it's only targeted at Hummels), for stabbing the club in the back when they were just about to possibly get within striking distance of Bayern again. But if things were really completely open why would Watzke force him out? Dortmund won't get a better player than Hummels, no matter what fee they get, it created bit of turmoil within the club when Dortmund usually work very hard to keep things quiet and Dortmund need Hummels staying for another year to be a viable option on paper if they want to pressure Bayern into a serious offer.
The only explanation that makes sense to me is that Hummels made his decision, but doesn't have the guts to take the fallout like a man and instead tries to blur the truth to make the uncertainty stall the fans until he is gone.
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Maybe Hummels really hasn't made up his mind, but Watzke simply doesn't trust him and doesn't want to take the risk? Maybe they don't even mind to see him leaving now? How irreplaceable is he actually considering his performances on the pitch? And his leadership can't be taken seriously anymore, if it ever was as big as some suggested. He certainly never deserved the captaincy. Maybe the fact that he considers going to Bayern is enough for the club to say, go feck yourself?

I actually think it strengthens Dortmund's position against Bayern. If the environment is hostile enough, so that staying isn't an option anymore, Bayern have to pay up to 'save' him. If we tell Hummels, that we won't, he either has to stay in that hostile environment or look for a move somewhere else. Once staying is the least likely option, Dortmund get what they want. Either what they demand from Bayern or Hummels leaving to a club outside of Germany.
 
Balu said:
Maybe Hummels really hasn't made up his mind, but Watzke simply doesn't trust him and doesn't want to take the risk? Maybe they don't even mind to see him leaving now? How irreplaceable is he actually considering his performances on the pitch? And his leadership can't be taken seriously anymore, if it ever was as big as some suggested. He certainly never deserved the captaincy. Maybe the fact that he considers going to Bayern is enough for the club to say, go feck yourself?
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Imo Hummels has been absolute class this season. Sure you can replace him as a defender, but not his build up skills. He's just so good at deciding when the opponents pressing allows him to advance and then at distributing the ball, which both quite often breaks up the oppositions organization, because it's like having an extra midfielder.
I'm pretty sure Dortmund won't get anyone like that. Here's a compilation from just a few cup matches to illustrate my point:



I actually think it strengthens Dortmund's position against Bayern. If the environment is hostile enough, so that staying isn't an option anymore, Bayern have to pay up to 'save' him. If we tell Hummels, that we won't, he either has to stay in that hostile environment or look for a move somewhere else. Once staying is the least likely option, Dortmund get what they want. Either what they demand from Bayern or Hummels leaving to a club outside of Germany.
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I have to admit that makes sense, but that sword cuts both ways. Because if the enviroment is too hostile Dortmund will be forced to sell and even if it takes Bayern out of the equation a possible foreign club can still use that argument to lower the fee.
 
do.ob said:
I have to admit that makes sense, but that sword cuts both ways. Because if the enviroment is too hostile Dortmund will be forced to sell and even if it takes Bayern out of the equation a possible foreign club can still use that argument to lower the fee.
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Oh well, English clubs suck at lowering the fee. Wouldn't be worried about that. And if Dortmund gets 5m less but sell him abroad, I'm sure they take it.
 
Kicker tomorrow says: Hummels move to Bayern in major doubt!!!

He would prefer to stay, Dortmund have offered him a "big contract" til 2021 and his main reason for a move to Bayern Munich would be because of his family/friends in Munich.
 
Sean_RedDevil said:
Kicker tomorrow says: Hummels move to Bayern in major doubt!!!

He would prefer to stay, Dortmund have offered him a "big contract" til 2021 and his main reason for a move to Bayern Munich would be because of his family/friends in Munich.
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Kicker is reliable?
 
Would be a weird twist. I thought Hummels himself handed in a transfer request.
 
VorZakone said:
Would be a weird twist. I thought Hummels himself handed in a transfer request.
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I reckon he thought he could get away with it all on the hush hush, now hes been exposed probably having second thoughts having seen the reaction
 
Sean_RedDevil said:
Kicker tomorrow says: Hummels move to Bayern in major doubt!!!

He would prefer to stay, Dortmund have offered him a "big contract" til 2021 and his main reason for a move to Bayern Munich would be because of his family/friends in Munich.
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that would be awesome
 
Cassidy said:
I reckon he thought he could get away with it all on the hush hush, now hes been exposed probably having second thoughts having seen the reaction
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The reaction was quite predictable, so I'd be surprised if it's just that.

There was also an article in the very reliable SZ today that said things have shifted in Dortmund's favour (slightly).
 
TitusCrumble said:
Surely that's the same with all of the countries in the top 4/5 leagues though? British players rarely move abroad. Spanish/Latin players are more likely to stay in/go to La Liga than anywhere else. Italians prefer Serie A, judging by the lack of Italian players not in Italy.
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British players I'll agree with you on. They're actually worse than Germans but Spain and Italy have had more than a few. I can't think of many Germans beyond Ballack (Chelsea), Matthaus (Inter), Klose (Lazio) and Madridistas Illgner, Kroos, Khedeira* and Ozil* (*not real Germans so they get asterisks ;)) ooh, Carsten Jancker as well but honestly he was shite.

My consternation comes from the fact that Germans love to travel and emigrate yet as footballers they seem inclined to stay at home. I guess it's a big league and perhaps they don't feel the need to go abroad to have a successful career in the way that Africans, Czechs, Croatians etc, might.
 
strongwalker said:
Only a couple of clubs are attractive for a player like Hummels, mainly those with a realistic chance of winning a CL title. Not all of those will be actively searching for a player his position. Who is? Bayern ofc. We all heard the rumours about Real or Barca, but there's a bit of a difference between a piece in the gossip column of a sports tabloid and an investment of that size actually agreed upon. He also will have talked to players who have first-hand experience playing for those clubs - Sahin, Kroos, Özil, Trapp, Ter Stegen, Schweinsteiger and might not have liked *every* bit he heard. About Bayern he already knows naturally.

Fun thing is that last weekend Hoeneß told the Media it was Hummels who "knocked on the door". The rest of the Bayern bigwigs were not amused (Neither was Watzke) and quick with a dementi, insisting it was Bayern made the move. Speculations in the media why a seasoned pro in the football and media world like Uli would do such a thing, as it obviously did nothing to smoothen the transfer. Either he did it on purpose because he doesn't want Hummels back, or he was actually telling the truth, unaware of the official communication line.
Might be a power thing between the current, quite new, team managers Reschke and Sammer (who are said to like Hummels) and the old guard who doesn't, and has trouble acknowledging that things changed in his absence.

Me? Well all i saw in the media about the transfer was initiated by old man Hummels or looked like it. Hummels may have said the truth that he didn't offer himself, but no one asked if that included his manager as well. I recon team managers like Reschke are in contact with a couple of prospect transfers all the time, its their job to do.
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Er hat viele trophy angst, ja?
 
Dwazza von Moosesteiger said:
British players I'll agree with you on. They're actually worse than Germans but Spain and Italy have had more than a few. I can't think of many Germans beyond Ballack (Chelsea), Matthaus (Inter), Klose (Lazio) and Madridistas Illgner, Kroos, Khedeira* and Ozil* (*not real Germans so they get asterisks ;)) ooh, Carsten Jancker as well but honestly he was shite.

My consternation comes from the fact that Germans love to travel and emigrate yet as footballers they seem inclined to stay at home. I guess it's a big league and perhaps they don't feel the need to go abroad to have a successful career in the way that Africans, Czechs, Croatians etc, might.
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You should put an asterisk behind Klose, he maybe looks more german than the other two but unlike him they spent their whole life in germany.
 
Dwazza von Moosesteiger said:
British players I'll agree with you on. They're actually worse than Germans but Spain and Italy have had more than a few. I can't think of many Germans beyond Ballack (Chelsea), Matthaus (Inter), Klose (Lazio) and Madridistas Illgner, Kroos, Khedeira* and Ozil* (*not real Germans so they get asterisks ;)) ooh, Carsten Jancker as well but honestly he was shite.

My consternation comes from the fact that Germans love to travel and emigrate yet as footballers they seem inclined to stay at home. I guess it's a big league and perhaps they don't feel the need to go abroad to have a successful career in the way that Africans, Czechs, Croatians etc, might.
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What ancestry does Khedeira have?
 
Dwazza von Moosesteiger said:
British players I'll agree with you on. They're actually worse than Germans but Spain and Italy have had more than a few. I can't think of many Germans beyond Ballack (Chelsea), Matthaus (Inter), Klose (Lazio) and Madridistas Illgner, Kroos, Khedeira* and Ozil* (*not real Germans so they get asterisks ;)) ooh, Carsten Jancker as well but honestly he was shite.

My consternation comes from the fact that Germans love to travel and emigrate yet as footballers they seem inclined to stay at home. I guess it's a big league and perhaps they don't feel the need to go abroad to have a successful career in the way that Africans, Czechs, Croatians etc, might.
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Schnellinger, Netzer, Breitner, Rummenigge, Kohler, Brehme, Littbarski, Häßler, Förster, Schuster, Stielike, Briegel, Klinsmann, Völler, Möller, Effenberg, Sammer, Reuter, Berthold and many more. Hardly any of the great German players of the 80's and 90's didn't play abroad actually.

Even today besides the obvious ones you also have the likes of Rüdiger, Mustafi, Gomez, Podolski, Mertesacker, Marin, Schürrle, Boateng and more who moved abroad/still are abroad. And that's only the ones who were capped for the nationalteam. The list is very long.

The Mitcher said:
What ancestry does Khedeira have?
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German mother, Tunisian father, born in Germany and lived and learned playing football in Germany. It's stupid to put an asterisk on it, he's simply German.
 
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I don't mean to call anyone out, but generally speaking it's a bit racist to call people not really German (or any other nationality for that matter) when they were born there, spent their entire life there and actually have the passport that says otherwise, just because their appearance is a bit different.

Especially when in the same sentence Mirosław Józef Klose, who was actually born in Poland and only moved to Germany when he was around 7 (afaik) is not added to the list of exceptions.
 
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do.ob said:
I don't mean to call anyone out, but generally speaking it's a bit racist to call people not really German (or any other nationality for that matter) when they were born there, spent their entire life there and actually have the passport that says otherwise, just because their appearance is a bit different.

Especially when in the same sentence Mirosław Józef Klose, who was actually born in Poland and only moved to Germany when he was around 7 (afaik) is not added to the list of exceptions.
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It's obviously racist to say Khedira isn't a real German. What the feck is he then? Surely he can't be Tunisian either, because of his German mother? It's sadly common between football fans and some idiots will probably say that we Germans are too sensitive, but it's unacceptable in my opinion. I kinda understand the discussion of ancestry in football when it comes to immigrants or when it comes to naturalisation of adults. But even then it's dangerous to claim that for example Özil isn't 'really German' when he never in his life had a different nationality. His grandparents immigrated to Germany decades before he was born. How long does it take until you're a 'real German'?
 
Balu said:
It's obviously racist to say Khedira isn't a real German. What the feck is he then? Surely he can't be Tunisian either, because of his German mother? It's sadly common between football fans and some idiots will probably say that we Germans are too sensitive, but it's unacceptable in my opinion. I kinda understand the discussion of ancestry in football when it comes to immigrants or when it comes to naturalisation of adults. But even then it's dangerous to claim that for example Özil isn't 'really German' when he never in his life had a different nationality. His grandparents immigrated to Germany decades before he was born. How long does it take until you're a 'real German'?

In Khedira's case it's simply racist, he's a born German of German descent.
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You see the same thing with French players of immigrant backgrounds. I constantly here how "foreigners" led France to the 98 World Cup even though basically the whole team grew up in France.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
You see the same thing with French players of immigrant backgrounds. I constantly here how "foreigners" led France to the 98 World Cup even though basically the whole team grew up in France.
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Yeah, it's the same story. It's really sad.
 
Keeps It tidy said:
You see the same thing with French players of immigrant backgrounds. I constantly here how "foreigners" led France to the 98 World Cup even though basically the whole team grew up in France.
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Who says that? That's really stupid.
 
JPRouve said:
Who says that? That's really stupid.
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Well here in the US Jurgen Kinnsmann has had a little bit of criticism when it comes calling up so many players who grew in other countries especially all the sons of American servicemen who grew in Germany. And while I am personally fine with Kinnsmann but, some who defend Jurgen say it is the exact same thing the French did to win the 98 World Cup not noticing the big difference.
 
do.ob said:
I don't mean to call anyone out, but generally speaking it's a bit racist to call people not really German (or any other nationality for that matter) when they were born there, spent their entire life there and actually have the passport that says otherwise, just because their appearance is a bit different.

Especially when in the same sentence Mirosław Józef Klose, who was actually born in Poland and only moved to Germany when he was around 7 (afaik) is not added to the list of exceptions.
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Totally agree. Also just look at teams like Belgium or France they have tons of players in their squad that have an ancestral background in other countries but play for the country they grew up in which I think is totally okay but I also don't mind if someone decides they want to play for the country of their (grand-)parents even though I'm sometimes not certain what connection they have to a country that they only know from their holidays but maybe that's because I don't subscribe a blood and soil philosophy.
 
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