How on earth are people doubting the credentials of a 24 year old player who finished 19th in Ballon d'Or voting a season or two ago, has been voted Chelsea's player of the year twice, and has had ringing endorsements from every manager he's played under?
Mason Mount's Many Misfortunes
- Thread starter horsechoker
- Start date
He will not be playing in the role he played at Chelsea though, that is people's main issue.
He played in a similar role as he seems to be playing here for England and never impressed. There is more ways to look at it, than yours.
Was Frogie teaching you to cross the road, because he said you need perseverance, trial and error, perfect timing which sounds about right
That way van der beek and sancho can finally be unleashed, just like how pogba was unleashed by all those midfielders we signed.
Well, as someone who watched nearly every game he played … those “good” seasons are a bit misleading. He deeply divided fan base opinion even then. It seemed like we tried to force our play through no matter where the particular manager tried to play him.
He won POTY for us in a year he couldn’t bail down a particular spot. And aside from that remarkable CL … we weren’t very good, and many of our better players didn’t qualify for the award because they were injured for too many games.
And people told us we were crazy, because if 3 different managers kept choosing him, he must have something.
Last year I repeatedly referred to him as “the place where offensive build ups go to die” in these forums.
I genuinely hope I’m wrong and he is your best player. I hope he has great success against everyone but us. But the crux of it is:
whenever people would ask about him by saying “what position does he play?” … the response is generally “it depends” or “I don’t know”
And it wasn’t because he’s excellent at multiple positions: it’s because just did t quite work at each one. They had to base the spaces allotted to everyone else around him, and that was awkward because he’s not really good enough to be the type of player you cater to that much.
Hopefully he scores tomorrow, then celebrate by pointing out his no. 7 shirt, then kissing the badge.
This thread is a fecking dumpster fire.
It's spoilt caftards, what do you expect?
Seems like Erik brought him in because he runs around a lot. Just like Weghorst was brought in for the same attribute. His strikers need to run around a lot, his midfielders need to run around a lot but his goalkeeper needs to be Paul Scholes.
Seems a bit backwards to me. Why not get a silky smooth midfielder, a striker who can actually score goals and a goalkeeper who does what his position suggests?
Seems a bit backwards to me. Why not get a silky smooth midfielder, a striker who can actually score goals and a goalkeeper who does what his position suggests?
Well why not get a manager then who plays this traditional way. ETH has a footballing philosophy and I would rather he sticks to it and we see how far he is able to take us.
We are playing the traditional way. That's the thing. We still seem like a Ole team that concede control of the game to any big team we face. Well maybe our midfielders should be the type of players like Scholes and Xavi and Pirlo and not our goalkeeper.
Edit: forget the goalkeeper part. I don't mind that. I even like it but it just seems stupid and doesn't make any sense to me when his midfielders don't have to be these amazing passers of the ball but his goalkeeper has to be Pirlo reborn. Fine let your goalkeeper do that, but now our first midfield consists of two number 10's and a DM who was never known for his passing ability and is almost retired. No wonder we can't control a game.
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I actually DID think ETH had a plan for where to play him; maybe he could unlock him more. I think Ten Hag is incredibly intelligent and wouldn’t sanction the limited resources coming his way on a lark.
Seeing the posts here he's gonna be our new carrick isnt he ? Long time lurker here and posters were bashing carrick all the time for "doing nothing" in the pitch. He was only appreciated during his later years. Football is not only about doing fancy shit on the pitch.
The game is evolving. There aren't too many Scholes or Xavi or Pirlo in the game anymore. And the ones who are (like Modric) are not already taken by top teams. I am sure ETH would love to get one if he had but his way is to work around the deficiency by getting goalkeeper and CB comfortable in being playmakers. Let's see first how ETH's newly worked side does before complaining, shall we?
OK this is really funny. I genuinely laughed out loud.
He could have chosen anyone in the world other than Mount to partner Casemiro and Bruno in our midfield. My problem is the type of transfers being made. He wants to play "modern" football and looks for a goalkeeper who's top attribute is his passing, thats fine. But then the midfielder that we desperately need, that he gets is a second number 10 just like Bruno. When looking for a midfielder his top attribute should also have been his passing. The inconsistency is doing my head in. If your goalkeeper has to be good on the ball so should your midfield surely?
I bet any money in the world we would be playing better ("modern"
) football than we are now if we sticked with De Gea but instead built a balanced midfield that can control the game. I like Onana, I'm all for it but for the love of god the same thing should apply to our midfield to.The season hasn't even started yet...
I got a glimpse in pre season when our first eleven played together. There won't be much difference in style.
Yes, but moaning about a failure to control games when a meaningful one hasn't even happened and ranting about a signing and ETH's ideas in the market before we've even kicked a ball in anger does seem a bit premature. If I had no idea of the history I'd think the manager has no clue what he's doing reading your summary of his transfers.
Ten Hag said:
“So we really looked into the history of Manchester United and we really looked also into the qualities of our players. And then you can say, so what do we want to be? That is, we want to be the best transition team in the world. We want to surprise. We want to play dynamic [football], we want to play with speed and we want to play aggressive out of a very good team spirit. So that is United."
Ole and EtH are both intelligent football men who have been in the game for decades and understand the nuances of the sport better than anyone on this forum.
The reason Ole's United played the way it did was because of the qualities of our players. Namely of our two best and most influential players - Rashford and Bruno. We kept it tight at the back, packed the central areas with McFred, forced the opposition to wide areas where AWB could handle any winger and Maguire could handle any cross, got the ball to Bruno as quickly as possible for the counter, and used the pace of Rashford and Martial to cause problems at the other end of the pitch.
Under EtH, the qualities of our players haven't changed that much. Granted, we've bought a lot of new additions. There's more emphasis on playing out of the back now. But the core to our attack is still Rashford and Bruno. It's just good management to make the most of the tools at your disposal.
Ten Hag is pragmatic. He was happy enough to flip between having a targetman #9 in Haller at Ajax one year to a false #9 in Tadic the next. Fergie was the same in that he never had a clearly defined philosophy beyond emphasising direct attacks and "possession with purpose". Everything else was negotiable depending on the qualities of his players. If the current manager wants us to be a transition team because he thinks that's our best route to success, I'm all on board.
I'll never understand why people want a manager with a brand identity. I don't care if my manager has a preferred style of play with dedicated Tifo videos or a catchy moniker like tiki-taka or gegenpressing. Our 2008 was night and day different from our 1999 team. Just give me someone who gets the team playing exciting football and can win matches.
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Which games where they?
Vs Leeds - we played our reserves and back ups, Mount played first half and we had 60% possession.
Vs Lyon - Just like leeds we played reserves and back ups, Mount played first half and we had 62% possession
Vs Arsenal - It wasn't our first 11, missed Rashford, Casemiro. Almost first 11. Mount played first half and we had 53% possession
Vs Wrexham - None of our first team played
Vs Madrid - Almost our first 11, we had more possession in both halves.
Vs Dortmund - Our back up team played that game, still we had 65% possession.
Vs Lens - Our first 11 played that game. We had 71% possession in the first half, overall 63%.
There wasn't a single game where we averaged less possession than opponents and our first 11 played vs Lens, 60 mins vs Madrid and 45 mins vs Arsenal.
I know what he said, I watched the interview in pre season. And the thing that stood out to me most was "we want to be the best transition team in the world" which translated means nothing more than we'll just bend over to big opposition and hope for a counter. Like lesser teams do when they play us. I don't know how to feel about it because I was hoping and praying we would get Ten Hag over someone like Pochettino. I was looking forward to a dutch total football possession based style and an amazing midfield.
But then he goes and builds this weird team. A midfield consisting of two numbers 10's, one of them who's best attribute is running around like a headless chicken. Just like the striker he brought in on loan last season. The best defensive Striker I've ever seen amazing, a striker who can't fecking score but runs in circles. But oh no look at my modern exiting football my goalkeeper has to be Paul Scholes.
You shouldn't use facts like this to destroy his argument.
Rely more on feeling like he does.
Yes I'm being sarcastic
Really good post!
Show some patience. It’ll all click soon it feels like. Mount is a really good technical footballer who will work his ass off. This is what is everyone has been crying out for with Casemiro and Bruno in the team. Enjoy it. It has improved the squad considerably I think.
Some of our fans are legitimately mad…you at least need to give a player 10 or so meaningful games before making conclusions on their fit/ability…this might be the most embarrassing thread in the entire site right now…and that’s saying something.
Fans have no patience, they need the player performing 9/10 each game to be called a success. Mount needs some time to find his place and also get used to the new tactics. I saw the Lens game and he made some nice runs from midfield, our players didnt find him even once. It will take sometime but I see Ten Hag has a plan on how to use Mount, especially as we will be playing more on the front foot and Lisandro will be the one moving the ball ahead from midfield.
You are making up things now. Transition team is not equal to bend over and hope for a counter. Best to get educated on what we are trying to do, otherwise how can anyone put weight on your opinion of transfers.
I remain calm.
What are you on about? Being the best transition team does not mean bending over and trying to hit on the counter. It’s based on the idea that teams are at their most vulnerable immediately after losing possession and therefore you are more dangerous by effectively pressing the opposition so you can win the ball higher up the pitch. That is the opposite of sitting back and just letting teams attack so you can then counter. It’s proactive, not reactive.
A related aspect of this is ensuring your team is press resistant, so you can play through the opponent’s press and move into attacking positions whilst preventing them from gaining an attacking advantage through their own transitions.
To make all this work you have to have players that are hard working, tactically astute, technically sound and comfortable on the ball.
Can you really not see how the changes Ten Hag is making to the squad fit in perfectly with that philosophy?
Onana > De Gea
Martinez/Varane > Maguire
Mount > McFred/Eriksen
I’m absolutely baffled by your comments to be honest. I don’t know what you’ve been paying attention to if you can’t see what he’s trying to do and how his personnel changes fit in with that.
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Really needs a goal or assist
Playing in transition is not ‚hoping for a counter‘ but can be pro-active.
That‘s what Ten Hag wants: winning the ball back with pressure on the ball, and attacking direct whenever possible.
We have the players to do it: Martinez, Bruno, Eriksen and now Mount are all capable of it and so is Onana. Casemiro is fairly good at it too, and so is Varane.
Lots of teams like to press nowadays, and we are working on bypassing the press quickly.
I was hoping for total football too, but it makes sense to do this pressing style with quick attacks, based on who our best players are.
Let’s hope the Caf give the lad some time to play his way into form and the system. Completely ridiculous hope I know, as I fully expect this thread to get inundated with comments tomorrow like “what’s he actually good at?”, “what’s the point of him?”, “we’ll never win anything with Chelsea rejects”. Etc etc. And someone will definitely mention Caicedo in the match thread.
Meanwhile I am expecting a solid performance from Mason as he adapts to ETHs instructions. I think he’s an excellent fit for what we are clearly trying to do, and we need to give him time. I’m fully convinced that by the end of this season, he will be widely regarded as an excellent signing.
Meanwhile I am expecting a solid performance from Mason as he adapts to ETHs instructions. I think he’s an excellent fit for what we are clearly trying to do, and we need to give him time. I’m fully convinced that by the end of this season, he will be widely regarded as an excellent signing.
And they need a scapegoat and looks like they found one during preseason
I think he tried it last season and realised DVB can't deal with the speed of the game in the epl. Mount can however.
I hope he scores today which will shut up some people here. Him and Bruno combined should be looking at 20-25 goals in the season which should help sharing Rashford and Hojlund's burden.
Did Mount play as an actual #8 at Vitesse or a #10?
Too slow i suppose.
The problem is how do we get the Old Donny back. Just like PlayStation once its broken it will never be the same.
No way near physical enough. Mount is also more agile and arguably a better goal threat with more creativity.
As per whoscored.com, its in midfield (4-3-3)