Mason Mount's Many Misfortunes (please don't make another waste of money post)

Doracle said:
Played Norwich twice. That’s 6 of those 21 GAs. Scored 1 goal that season against a team higher than 12th in the league at the time.

Look he’s a decent player and we all hope he works out for us. However, a lot of us are struggling to see him as a player worth spending £50m on when we already have Bruno. It’s a bit depressing that even when I read someone who thinks he will be good they invariably start with how good he is at pressing, rather than his actual football ability.
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You could arguably do that for every player. Chances are that they will score or assist more often in games where they are much better than the other team. He also assisted the only goal in Chelsea's win in the CL final.

I agree. Personally, I wouldn't sign Mount and would rather go for someone that brings us more control and fight in midfield. I can understand what Ten Hag is trying to build, though. There won't be a lack of presence in the midfield with our defense pushing forward and playing a high line and full-backs tucking into midfield. And for what he is trying to build, Mount is a very good fit. I hope he does well and really excited to see how he does here.
 
Doracle said:
Played Norwich twice. That’s 6 of those 21 GAs. Scored 1 goal that season against a team higher than 12th in the league at the time.

Look he’s a decent player and we all hope he works out for us. However, a lot of us are struggling to see him as a player worth spending £50m on when we already have Bruno. It’s a bit depressing that even when I read someone who thinks he will be good they invariably start with how good he is at pressing, rather than his actual football ability.
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You know this doesn't actually mean anything, right? If you ask people to describe the moon they'll probably start with something like "it's in the sky" or "it's round". It would be ridiculous to take that as evidence that the moon doesn't have any effect on the tides, but that's the same logical argument you've made with Mount here. "People start by saying he's good at pressing which means he's not good at other things". You're either having trouble distingushing objective reality from the argument you're having, or you're just arguing in bad faith.

By the way, the reason people start with his pressing ability (which is an actual football skill, btw) is that it's the most obvious differentiating quality between him and Christian Eriksen, whose minutes Mount will largely be replacing.
 
AneRu said:
And this is how we got sleep-walked into a decade long era of mediocrity and malaise. Shutting down critical voices, deferring to authority even when the logic is warped as in this case and then shouting like you are in bedlam when it all goes wrong.

Posters could see with every disaster, maybe bar Sanchez and Sancho, flaws in the thought processes behind disastrous signings and appointments but were always shut down in the name of support. The concerns raised in the Moyes, Ole appointments were valid, the concerns raised in the Maguire, Mount signings were and are valid. I don't see the benefit of shutting out critical voices when the club hasn't done anything to earn unwavering trust since 2013.

Chances are high that Casemiro in a single pivot behind two no.10s will fail. Why shut down such a legitimate discussion? Do you think pampering a player's ego will suddenly turn them into prime Modric. A huge gamble was taken and posters have a right, if not responsibility, to question whether it was the right one or even worth it.
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Yes because our critical voices on a player prior to the season really will lead us to malaise. We have 0 control as fans apart from putting pressure on the manager when it looks like it’s time to go. We won’t influence team selection, we won’t influence transfers. What we can do is just take a breath and wait for a player to play one, just one competitive game before piling the pressure on.
 
I am not convinced with Mount neither am I convinced he is the right profile of player in our midfield.
We could have been a better team with McAllister rather than Mount.
 
E-mal said:
I am not convinced with Mount neither am I convinced he is the right profile of player in our midfield.
We could have been a better team with McAllister rather than Mount.
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For what Ten Hag was looking for, Mount fits the bill a lot better
 
I believe he’s going to be a dynamo for us. He’s going to make some of his fellow teammates look better when he’s playing. I believe Antony’s going to look much better next to him, and Hojlund‘s going to love him too.
 
E-mal said:
I am not convinced with Mount neither am I convinced he is the right profile of player in our midfield.
We could have been a better team with McAllister rather than Mount.
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Completely agree. I think MacAllister had his eyes set on Liverpool but of all the options out there, Mount is very low on my list - especially for that obscene fee.

It baffles me how - once again - our rivals (several of whom aren’t even in the CL) manage to rebuild their midfield with quality young players (MacAllister, Rice, Enzo, Caicedo etc) while we end up with dubious quality.

Obviously EtH has a plan and I hope Mount proves us wrong, but I just can’t get excited about him at all.
 
KjaAnd said:
It baffles me how - once again - our rivals (several of whom aren’t even in the CL) manage to rebuild their midfield with quality young players (MacAllister, Rice, Enzo, Caicedo etc) while we end up with dubious quality.
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Yes, truly baffling why we've not signed Rice at £105 million, Caicedo at £110 million, and Enzo at £107 million (in january).
 
KjaAnd said:
Completely agree. I think MacAllister had his eyes set on Liverpool but of all the options out there, Mount is very low on my list - especially for that obscene fee.

It baffles me how - once again - our rivals (several of whom aren’t even in the CL) manage to rebuild their midfield with quality young players (MacAllister, Rice, Enzo, Caicedo etc) while we end up with dubious quality.

Obviously EtH has a plan and I hope Mount proves us wrong, but I just can’t get excited about him at all.
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What is wrong with all of you? This guy has not even played a match yet for United. Wow.
 
izec said:
Chelsea look already so much better without him :angel:
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Chelsea managing to keep hold of the entire 22/23 team is more impressive...I thought they would of had to make more changes than just selling Mount.

What a difference 1 player can make :cool:
 
AneRu said:
No but questioning the club's decisions is a valid discussion to be had but we have posters on here shutting people down for over a decade from discussing legitimate concerns. In this case doubting whether Mount will work in a three with Bruno and Case is as a legitimate concern as to doubting whether Moyes was suitable for the job.

All misgivings were shut down in the name of support but long after Moyes and Ole have had their pay offs it is still us the fans left holding an empty bag, going through yet another rebuild. My point is that the last ten years have proven that the club isn't infallible and those who question its decisions or are critical of certain players have a voice which shouldn't be shut down everytime in the name of support.
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How is anyone being shut down? Some posters are voicing concerns that they don’t think he’s the right fit; some seem to have already concluded he’s the wrong signing and are complaining we should have signed someone else; some are replying that we haven’t even played a single competitive match yet and so it’s a little early to be writing him off/assuming he doesn’t fit into the system Ten Hag wants to play. I fail to see how the latter are shutting things down rather than simply providing a pretty obvious and sensible counterpoint to the doubters.
 
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E-mal said:
I am not convinced with Mount neither am I convinced he is the right profile of player in our midfield.
We could have been a better team with McAllister rather than Mount.
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We could have, or we could be a better team with Mount. Let's wait and see how he performs before making assumptions like that.
 
E-mal said:
I am not convinced with Mount neither am I convinced he is the right profile of player in our midfield.
We could have been a better team with McAllister rather than Mount.
Click to expand...
KjaAnd said:
Completely agree. I think MacAllister had his eyes set on Liverpool but of all the options out there, Mount is very low on my list - especially for that obscene fee.

It baffles me how - once again - our rivals (several of whom aren’t even in the CL) manage to rebuild their midfield with quality young players (MacAllister, Rice, Enzo, Caicedo etc) while we end up with dubious quality.

Obviously EtH has a plan and I hope Mount proves us wrong, but I just can’t get excited about him at all.
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I too believe that Mount, who hasn't played a competitive game for us yet, is shit and we would be better off with someone like Mac Allister, who actually played today and showed every sign that he's shit.
 
Doracle said:
Played Norwich twice. That’s 6 of those 21 GAs. Scored 1 goal that season against a team higher than 12th in the league at the time.

Look he’s a decent player and we all hope he works out for us. However, a lot of us are struggling to see him as a player worth spending £50m on when we already have Bruno. It’s a bit depressing that even when I read someone who thinks he will be good they invariably start with how good he is at pressing, rather than his actual football ability.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that’s not how that works. Lots of other players played against Norwich and the like too and their stats also include those games, whether they scored against them or not. League points gained against Norwich also count, just like the goals and assists do.

Aside from the goals and assists, pressing seems to be one of the absolute fundamentals of Ten Hag’s football philosophy so how on earth is that not an incredibly relevant aspect of Mount’s football ability!?

Argue he’s the wrong fit all you like, but arbitrarily acting like some of his goals and assists don’t count, and then just writing off one of the most important ways he will fit into Ten Hag’s system seems like an odd way of going about it.
 
Chairman Steve said:
I believe he’s going to be a dynamo for us. He’s going to make some of his fellow teammates look better when he’s playing. I believe Antony’s going to look much better next to him, and Hojlund‘s going to love him too.
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Same, not worried about this signing at all. And he was a decent price as well, given what costs we are seeing for other players atm.
 
So excited about Mount.

He’s the type of player that will make any formation balanced wherever he is asked to play and have an insane defensive stability through work rate of the whole team whilst also having technical ability that improves creativity and goalscoring.

He just gives a bit to everything everywhere.
 
zaafi said:
You could arguably do that for every player. Chances are that they will score or assist more often in games where they are much better than the other team. He also assisted the only goal in Chelsea's win in the CL final.

I agree. Personally, I wouldn't sign Mount and would rather go for someone that brings us more control and fight in midfield. I can understand what Ten Hag is trying to build, though. There won't be a lack of presence in the midfield with our defense pushing forward and playing a high line and full-backs tucking into midfield. And for what he is trying to build, Mount is a very good fit. I hope he does well and really excited to see how he does here.
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I think we will see a lot of Martinez controlling the play in our half and Mount Bruno etc pinning the opposition high up the pitch.
 
Jeppers7 said:
I think we will see a lot of Martinez controlling the play in our half and Mount Bruno etc pinning the opposition high up the pitch.
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Does Varane have the physicality to anchor what will essentially be a back 3 in transition? Do we have enough ball control everywhere on the pitch to keep up pressure or ball recycling ability up the pitch to maintain pressure? Then on Mount himself does he have awareness needed for the role, because its a niche role that not every midfielder with a good pass and stamina can fulfil?
 
I reckon he’s going to do wonders here…. He was Chelsea’s player of the year twice & he had a good spell at Derby.

ETH will get the best out of him
 
KjaAnd said:
And? We can’t be sceptical of signings based on their previous performances?
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You can of course.

The issue is that in this case (last year aside) the player's performances have generally been very good. Thus the two POTY awards for a CL-winning top four side.

So when people are expressing the strong levels of "scepticism" that some have been before he's even played a competitive game for us, it suggests they either didn't actually watch much of him at Chelsea, don't have particularly good judgement or are in the habit of expressing themselves like petulant kids.
 
KjaAnd said:
Completely agree. I think MacAllister had his eyes set on Liverpool but of all the options out there, Mount is very low on my list - especially for that obscene fee.

It baffles me how - once again - our rivals (several of whom aren’t even in the CL) manage to rebuild their midfield with quality young players (MacAllister, Rice, Enzo, Caicedo etc) while we end up with dubious quality.

Obviously EtH has a plan and I hope Mount proves us wrong, but I just can’t get excited about him at all.
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Ironic
 
Mr Pigeon said:
I too believe that Mount, who hasn't played a competitive game for us yet, is shit and we would be better off with someone like Mac Allister, who actually played today and showed every sign that he's shit.
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I too believe that mount is shit even though he hasn't played a competitive game, and we would be better with Szcoobydzoobydoo woo just ran around all day.
 
Really not impressed with him so far this PL season. He's gone missing and I don't think he's even had one key pass yet. Fraud.
 
Maybe Eric sees him as his new donny utilizing him the same way he did sonny at ajax.

I'm probably just reaching.
 
The Mitcher said:
I too believe that mount is shit even though he hasn't played a competitive game, and we would be better with Szcoobydzoobydoo woo just ran around all day.
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The thing about Szcoobyburtbacharach is that his xAgGxG (expected assisted goal Goals expected Goals per game) when he played for Shitehawks United (0.0001) was vastly superior to Mount at United (0.0). But ideally we should've bought Lavia and Caicedo to play them in goal as a double pivot. That might mean we can't play the way that Ten Hag has been training the squad to perform but I know better because I once met Frogie.
 
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