[criticalanalysis]

I think this is how we are going to play from the back. Martinez will be the main guy, Shaw will be the one to beat press and carry the ball forward but there will be a gap between Casemiro and Mount&Eriksen. Even watching Mount "all-touches vs Arsenal" he is playing higher than Eriksen and Fred imo.

I like Mount, he is very good all action midfielder but we need to accept dropping back to get the ball is not something he is used to taking care of. I don't think that's a big issue but I am a bit sceptical if we will be able to beat the press and keep the ball against organized teams.

I also don't think he's that close to Eriksen. Eriksen imposes himself on the game much more, while Mount is "reactive" and less involved. Early days, but this is pretty much what I expected based on his Chelsea days.

The bolded is the crux of my concern. I do think that's the intention and like you I'm not sure if it's good enough (against the top teams) and therefore we will need a player like Mount/Bruno in their respective positions to be quicker to drop deep, play between the lines and give the centre backs, keeper and Casemiro an easier outlet.

As for Mount and my points raised above, I am extrapolating on literally 3 games of friendlies so I'm well aware it's very premature to see any visible progress thus far. I.e Even if it doesn't look good now, it may click better half way into the season.

 

[roonster09]

I think this is how we are going to play from the back. Martinez will be the main guy, Shaw will be the one to beat press and carry the ball forward but there will be a gap between Casemiro and Mount&Eriksen. Even watching Mount "all-touches vs Arsenal" he is playing higher than Eriksen and Fred imo.

I like Mount, he is very good all action midfielder but we need to accept dropping back to get the ball is not something he is used to taking care of. I don't think that's a big issue but I am a bit sceptical if we will be able to beat the press and keep the ball against organized teams.

I also don't think he's that close to Eriksen. Eriksen imposes himself on the game much more, while Mount is "reactive" and less involved. Early days, but this is pretty much what I expected based on his Chelsea days.

You can add Onana too, he is comfortable pinging the passes to attacker. Earlier we didn't have GK who could spot a pass and execute it. Now if the team is pressing aggressively, it leaves lot of space for our attackers to run behind which will naturally push teams back. This will give us bit of time on the ball. Don't think teams will be pressing aggressively pushing very high against us like they did last season.

Also vs Arsenal EtH made adjustments, moving CM to RB/RCB to build the play from back, we might see lot of similar adjustments.

 

[sglowrider]

Mount & Casemiro/Mainoo are the thinking man's positions under ETH's system -- they have to see the whole picture. Plus they need the physicality and skills.

 

[Bebestation]

Ten Hag wants us to be a quick transitioning possesion based team & this is why Mount being reactive than Eriksen being proactive on the ball is important. @Borys

Its hard to envisage, but imagine a possesion based team that doesnt hold on to the ball unnecceserily slowly because its actually a counter attacking team inside that can actually benefit from the opposition winning a ball & being on a attack.

Players like Mount, Onana, Rashford, Sancho, Dalot can take up quick temporary positioning, whilst Mount,Bruno, Onana, Shaw, Martinez, Sancho can make quick risky passes whilst having the defensive ability of Casemiro, Wan Bissaka, Varane & Martinez to win / compensate a ball & start a quick C.a style attack again. All the so whilst pressing every chance it gets.

Just because Pep perfected a style of possesion football doesnt mean thats the very only possesion way to play - but when we do want to play like that we can use a more on the ball proactive & precise but therefore slower player like Eriksen which will influence the whole team.

 

[VP89]

You can add Onana too, he is comfortable pinging the passes to attacker. Earlier we didn't have GK who could spot a pass and execute it. Now if the team is pressing aggressively, it leaves lot of space for our attackers to run behind which will naturally push teams back. This will give us bit of time on the ball. Don't think teams will be pressing aggressively pushing very high against us like they did last season.

Also vs Arsenal EtH made adjustments, moving CM to RB/RCB to build the play from back, we might see lot of similar adjustments.

I was wondering why Mainoo was at RB for the Bruno goal!

 

[city-puma]

His technique is really good and he adds balance.

 

[sglowrider]

Ten Hag wants us to be a quick transitioning possesion based team & this is why Mount being reactive than Eriksen being proactive on the ball is important. @Borys

Its hard to envisage, but imagine a possesion based team that doesnt hold on to the ball unnecceserily slowly because its actually a counter attacking team inside that can actually benefit from the opposition winning a ball & being on a attack.

Players like Mount, Onana, Rashford, Sancho, Dalot can take up quick temporary positioning, whilst Mount,Bruno, Onana, Shaw, Martinez, Sancho can make quick risky passes whilst having the defensive ability of Casemiro, Wan Bissaka, Varane & Martinez to win / compensate a ball & start a quick C.a style attack again. All the so whilst pressing every chance it gets.

Just because Pep perfected a style of possesion football doesnt mean thats the very only possesion way to play - but when we do want to play like that we can use a more on the ball proactive & precise but therefore slower player like Eriksen which will influence the whole team.

I think you are right based on the ETH interviews so far. It makes sense. We have always had rapid feints and attackers traditionally. ETH is just updating the ol' United Way. Pointless to have possession for the sake of it -- like walking the ball into the net. He will make us more pragmatic by focusing on creating as many chances and goals as possible

 

[Bebestation]

I think you are right based on the ETH interviews so far. It makes sense. We have always had rapid feints and attackers traditionally. ETH is just updating the ol' United Way. Pointless to have possession for the sake of it -- like walking the ball into the net. He will make us more pragmatic by focusing on creating as many chances and goals as possible

Yeah it goes with the interview & even the targeting of Hojlund - he not only looks rapid through on goal but plays these quick risky passes & flicks with his back to goal through on for his team mates.

A quick, risky team that can hold possesion & counter attack.

 

[sglowrider]

Yeah it goes with the interview & even the targeting of Hojlund - he not only looks rapid through on goal but plays these quick risky passes & flicks with his back to goal through on for his team mates.

A quick, risky team that can hold possesion & still counter attack.

He is playing with the cards he has been dealt plus an homage to the past best Fergie teams -- unpredictability ie goals from everywhere. 'Blink of an eye' goals.

 

[Borys]

Ten Hag wants us to be a quick transitioning possesion based team & this is why Mount being reactive than Eriksen being proactive on the ball is important. @Borys

Its hard to envisage, but imagine a possesion based team that doesnt hold on to the ball unnecceserily slowly because its actually a counter attacking team inside that can actually benefit from the opposition winning a ball & being on a attack.

Players like Mount, Onana, Rashford, Sancho, Dalot can take up quick temporary positioning, whilst Mount,Bruno, Onana, Shaw, Martinez, Sancho can make quick risky passes whilst having the defensive ability of Casemiro, Wan Bissaka, Varane & Martinez to win / compensate a ball & start a quick C.a style attack again. All the so whilst pressing every chance it gets.

Just because Pep perfected a style of possesion football doesnt mean thats the very only possesion way to play - but when we do want to play like that we can use a more on the ball proactive & precise but therefore slower player like Eriksen which will influence the whole team.

That is a fine approach, I do think we fit this quick-transitions style better, but we will need to build from the back just as often as we play in transition so the concern is still valid IMO. Also, Ten Hag said last season that we play too much end-to-end "tennis games", but replacing Eriksen with Mount means this is how we are setting up to play IMO.

 

[CG1010]

That is a fine approach, I do think we fit this quick-transitions style better, but we will need to build from the back just as often as we play in transition so the concern is still valid IMO. Also, Ten Hag said last season that we play too much end-to-end "tennis games", but replacing Eriksen with Mount means this is how we are setting up to play IMO.

Yeah looks like he is embracing that now. The only difference being that our pressing should improve significantly by shifting Erikson to Mount, Martial to Hojlund and by pushing the defensive line further by getting Onana. So maybe we can control the game more. This is absolutely the key for us to play the way ETH wants. I am concerned particularly about likes of Sancho who are quite lazy at pressing.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Involved in some really good link up play in the final third. Looking forward to seeing more of that.

 

[RuudTom83]

For the coming season I want to see how EtH approaches the away games against the big teams.

Watching Mount for 45 mins against Arsenal was a promising start (for a friendly match) and against the smaller teams I can see him being very useful.

Just curious to see how EtH uses him in the bigger games.

 

[El Jefe]

Still doesn't look a natural CM in there to me. You can see he's still getting used to picking the ball up in deeper positions but the qualities he brings to us in the middle are vital things we've lacked.

I think EtH will work wonders with him in time just need to be patient and let him cook.

 

[Bebestation]

That is a fine approach, I do think we fit this quick-transitions style better, but we will need to build from the back just as often as we play in transition so the concern is still valid IMO. Also, Ten Hag said last season that we play too much end-to-end "tennis games", but replacing Eriksen with Mount means this is how we are setting up to play IMO.

I think another big difference is the size of the team on the football pitch.

Pep’s teams feel/are huge because they are all keeping their specific positioning and passing the ball more so than players moving all over the place.

Eriksen suits that style of team because he neither would have to move a lot and be in different positions - whilst also being accurate with his passing from deep to his more static team mates.

Mount is different - he is known almost as the jack of all trades & it might be worrying that he seems like a master of none especially from deep.

But I think Ten Hag wants our team much more compact and even narrow - so we play very squashed together as a team which allows every player to take temporary flexible positions.

• Our proactive keeper allows us a very high defensive line, almost in the positioning of other teams tactical deeper midfielders.
• Then we have midfielders like Mount who can arguably take the positions of a temporary CDM, CM, CAM, LM, LAM, RAM, RM that sits on a very high defensive line (so doesn’t need to drop too deep to receive the ball) whilst having the defensive central protection of Casemiro and quick passing ability of Bruno.
• This allows our relatively flexible but fluid attackers (Rashford, Garanacho, Sancho, Amad, Antony, even Hojlund ) to be further up the pitch, initiate presses whilst making quick passes to each other whilst taking temporary positions themselves that can out do the opposition both in possesion and out of possesion too.
  
  
  
• I think sometimes the need for a Scholes or a Xavi in a possesion based team is definitely felt but I do think this is why maybe a player like Mainoo may give us slight new generation of players for such a team - a player that can learn and provide a defensive ability like Casemiro whilst also learning and providing a passing ability of someone like Eriksen; all taking that ability in to one player for a quick, transitioning possesion based team can be ruthal on a counter attack.

 

[Borys]

I think another big difference is the size of the team on the football pitch.

Pep’s teams feel/are huge because they are all keeping their specific positioning and passing the ball more so than players moving all over the place.

Eriksen suits that style of team because he neither would have to move a lot and be in different positions - whilst also being accurate with his passing from deep to his more static team mates.

Mount is different - he is known almost as the jack of all trades & it might be worrying that he seems like a master of none especially from deep.

But I think Ten Hag wants our team much more compact and even narrow - so we play very squashed together as a team which allows every player to take temporary flexible positions.

• Our proactive keeper allows us a very high defensive line, almost in the positioning of other teams tactical deeper midfielders.
• Then we have midfielders like Mount who can arguably take the positions of a temporary CDM, CM, CAM, LM, LAM, RAM, RM that sits on a very high defensive line (so doesn’t need to drop too deep to receive the ball) whilst having the defensive central protection of Casemiro and quick passing ability of Bruno.
• This allows our relatively flexible but fluid attackers (Rashford, Garanacho, Sancho, Amad, Antony, even Hojlund ) to be further up the pitch, initiate presses whilst making quick passes to each other whilst taking temporary positions themselves that can out do the opposition both in possesion and out of possesion too.
  
  
  
• I think sometimes the need for a Scholes or a Xavi in a possesion based team is definitely felt but I do think this is why maybe a player like Mainoo may give us slight new generation of players for such a team - a player that can learn and provide a defensive ability like Casemiro whilst also learning and providing a passing ability of someone like Eriksen; all taking that ability in to one player for a quick, transitioning possesion based team can be ruthal on a counter attack.

That is a rationale of all the moves we're doing in the transfer market, it's difficult to argue the points you're making here to be honest. But this is all based on the assumption that our back 4 + GK + Casemiro won't be heavily pressed when we're building up from deep. I think that's certainly possible but there's a problem on the other side of the pitch - we only have one player who can hurt opposition on the counter in Rashford. I am afraid that is not enough to keep opposition stretched. In which case, I am a bit sceptical how well we will do in the middle of the park still, especially if Mount keeps occupying those positions high up the pitch.

Exciting times ahead, when I hear about Casemiro behind Mount and Bruno I think it's a bit naiive approach still, but we'll see soon enough.

 

[Blood Mage]

I think he's a number 10. Wouldn't be surprised if Bruno ends up dropping deeper so Mount can get further forward.

 

[NLunited]

I think he's a number 10. Wouldn't be surprised if Bruno ends up dropping deeper so Mount can get further forward.

Not gonna happen, Mount has been and will be playing as an eight for us.

 

[IHateTheEightyEights]

He was rubbish in both games. No need to cover it up with theses on ETH's formation and tactics.

Hopefully he can do better when the league starts but honestly I don't see it at all. I've always thought he was the sort of midfield player who needs to justify his starts with goals/assists, and a decent amount of them. When he was at Chelsea I was thinking he'd need to get around 15 odd goals for him to have had a good season

 

[NLunited]

He was rubbish in both games. No need to cover it up with theses on ETH's formation and tactics.

Hopefully he can do better when the league starts but honestly I don't see it at all. I've always thought he was the sort of midfield player who needs to justify his starts with goals/assists, and a decent amount of them. When he was at Chelsea I was thinking he'd need to get around 15 odd goals for him to have had a good season

Would one goal and assist every two/three games be acceptable?

 

[Blood Mage]

Incredibly harsh to say he was rubbish against Arsenal, unspectacular maybe but he had some nice passes and touches.

 

[V.O.]

He is playing with the cards he has been dealt plus an homage to the past best Fergie teams -- unpredictability ie goals from everywhere. 'Blink of an eye' goals.

Where the feck is the keeper for that first one?

Might as well have been stood in the east stand.

 

[RedDevil@84]

What should be our expectation from him this season?

 

[NLunited]

What should be our expectation from him this season?

He’ll be a support midfielder contributing in pressing, build-up and goals+assists. How many? Somewhere in between Eriksen and De Bruyne of last season would be acceptable imo.

 

[IHateTheEightyEights]

Would one goal and assist every two/three games be acceptable?

I'd say if he didn't get double digit goals and assists, or close to it, it'd have been a poor season.

 

[TwoSheds]

I'd say if he didn't get double digit goals and assists, or close to it, it'd have been a poor season.

Playing CM? Do you mean 10+ (G+A) or 10+G and 10+ A? Because there's no way he's getting the latter from CM.

 

[Borys]

Playing CM? Do you mean 10+ (G+A) or 10+G and 10+ A? Because there's no way he's getting the latter from CM.

Sensible take. The problem is Mount's Chelsea stats will often be used against him - because he's not getting close to that "best season" playing CM role.

 

[IHateTheEightyEights]

Playing CM? Do you mean 10+ (G+A) or 10+G and 10+ A? Because there's no way he's getting the latter from CM.

Why not? Casemiro got 7 goals last season and 7 assists. Gundogan has been getting 10 goals a season from CM for a while now. 7 assists last season too.

Doesn't have to be exactly 10/10 for Mount but if he's not around that I'd be disappointed and he'd probably have had an average or poor season.

 

[TwoSheds]

Why not? Casemiro got 7 goals last season and 7 assists. Gundogan has been getting 10 goals a season from CM for a while now. 7 assists last season too.

Doesn't have to be exactly 10/10 for Mount but if he's not around that I'd be disappointed and he'd probably have had an average or poor season.

Because he's not world class like Casemiro and Gundogan? Just a thought.

 

[SAFMUTD]

What should be our expectation from him this season?

Him settling as a nailed starter over Eriksen would be a good start. Also challenging possession against top teams as well, a midfield of Casemiro, Mount, Bruno seems technical enough on paper to do it.

 

[Rajiztar]

Why not? Casemiro got 7 goals last season and 7 assists. Gundogan has been getting 10 goals a season from CM for a while now. 7 assists last season too.

Doesn't have to be exactly 10/10 for Mount but if he's not around that I'd be disappointed and he'd probably have had an average or poor season.

Mount will give you 20+ g+a combined coming season. Don't worry. Any body think otherwise will get humble pie.

 

[Rossa]

Never been a player to get me off my seat. That being said, one could argue only Garnacho in this current side has that ability, bar Rashford when he’s in the mood.

Hopefully he makes us play better and opens up space for others to run into. With him, Bruno and Casemiro in midfield, we should have a creative, hardworking midfield and Eriksen who can at least cover for two of them at a very high level.

 

[FrankDrebin]

Where the feck is the keeper for that first one?

Might as well have been stood in the east stand.

The performance from the Roma GK throughout that game was shambolic.

 

[0le]

Mount will give you 20+ g+a combined coming season. Don't worry. Any body think otherwise will get humble pie.

People said the same about Sancho. It is never a guaranteed thing.

 

[3vra]

is been more then 30 matches already and i have never seen him do much, we already have that kind of player in VDB. He does not bring anything i have not seen any creativity, he is just there, no inpact on the game whatsoever and seeing him with that 7 still make me sick. I hope he can turn it around and somehow made it here, but he just is not good in any particular thing, also why is he playing behing Rashford, i thought he was bought to play alongside Casemiro at 8, because at 10 he is not existent. I have not been so angry at any transfer for a long time.

 

[Rajiztar]

People said the same about Sancho. It is never a guaranteed thing.

Sancho never did in pl but Mount did it in pl already. That's the difference.

 

[Salfordlad70]

is been more then 30 matches already and i have never seen him do much, we already have that kind of player in VDB. He does not bring anything i have not seen any creativity, he is just there, no inpact on the game whatsoever and seeing him with that 7 still make me sick. I hope he can turn it around and somehow made it here, but he just is not good in any particular thing, also why is he playing behing Rashford, i thought he was bought to play alongside Casemiro at 8, because at 10 he is not existent. I have not been so angry at any transfer for a long time.

He has played a couple of pre season games and it is mostly experimental stuff and getting players match fit. This kind of criticism is premature and ridiculous.

 

[AjaxCunian]

He has played a couple of pre season games and it is mostly experimental stuff and getting players match fit. This kind of criticism is premature and ridiculous.

It is shocking though if you barely show anything in pre-season.

 

[Ali Dia]

He will do better once he figures out his partnership with Bruno through the middle and has a striker pushing defenders back.

 

[Salfordlad70]

It is shocking though if you barely show anything in pre-season.

It’s not. Theses are just glorified training sessions. It’s the same every year. You buy new players and try to integrate them into a new side with players that are effectively strangers and no one is fully fit.

It takes time.