I think we can convert him into a CB. This is genuine idea, not a pisstake. He's a good header of the ball, strong, has good positional sense. Drawback is that he's a tad slow and a bit shit with the ball in his feet, but surely that's a position we can use him when we're like today short of defenders?
27
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His positional sense is terrible. He was all over the place in tonight's game. He's not even particularly brilliant at heading; he's just big, so naturally heads the ball a lot. I wouldn't be surprised if we utilised him defensively because of how thin we are at the back, though. He would at least offer us a presence defensively, and could just clatter players if all else fails.
Useless
In midfield that is. In defence he I think can do better tactically. He's not brilliant at anything(apart chesting) but at least he'll probably be useful against limited and slower but more physical strikers. In any case I think at CB he'll do the least damage..
So because he is shite as a midfielder and shite as a forward, we should try to fit him as a CB? He would be a fecking disaster. No positional sense, no ability to read the game or read danger, slow as feck and he is awful with the ball at his feet.
Would be a nightmare to see him there.
So in one post you say that he is not a creative force and something that should be expected of him. In the next post you infer that his best games came as an advanced CM and thus that is his best position. What exactly does he provide higher up the pitch except for the odd flick ons if he is not a creative force.
Furthermore you claim most of his passea are backwards because he is playing with his back to goal. Many players do that, that does not mean they dont know how to turn with the ball. What good is he playing up front if he passes the ball straight back as soon as he receives it. That is one thing Rooney gets slagged off for as well.
His contribution is awful defensively and average at the best of times in the offense. What exactly, apart from some headers and flick ons, doea he provide to this team if he cannot play as a CM? If that is all we want, I would rather we go for Andy Carroll.
He is the bane of my existence and a tragicomic figure.
The protagonist and avatar of the post-Ferguson era. Signed by Moyes, retained by Van Gaal and the next manager will offer him as a sacrifice to the football gods. Only then will the curse be broken.
Unlucky not to score today.
The protagonist and avatar of the post-Ferguson era. Signed by Moyes, retained by Van Gaal and the next manager will offer him as a sacrifice to the football gods. Only then will the curse be broken.
Unlucky not to score today.
He is consistently terrible, and will be looked back on as the worst, most played player ever to west a Utd jersey.
His passing is terrible, his touch is brutal (other than his 'chesting'... Let that sink in for a second, a Utd player is constantly praised for his cheating ability.... How the mighty have fallen!). His aerial threat is the biggest myth in football. He's a constant red card liability.
The lad is an Everton midfielder who has a limited few decent performances once every season and that's all he'll ever be. He offers nothing for Utd except an excuse to revert to hoofing the ball aimlessly. He destroys any formation with his complete lack of positional play.
The only good thing he done lastnite was stay out of the way and was basically a spectator. A truly terrible footballer in the Djemba Djema category.
His passing is terrible, his touch is brutal (other than his 'chesting'... Let that sink in for a second, a Utd player is constantly praised for his cheating ability.... How the mighty have fallen!). His aerial threat is the biggest myth in football. He's a constant red card liability.
The lad is an Everton midfielder who has a limited few decent performances once every season and that's all he'll ever be. He offers nothing for Utd except an excuse to revert to hoofing the ball aimlessly. He destroys any formation with his complete lack of positional play.
The only good thing he done lastnite was stay out of the way and was basically a spectator. A truly terrible footballer in the Djemba Djema category.
He would give away a penalty and get sent off every game. He's all elbows, bad tackles and surprised looks when the ref blows him up.
His role at Utd should be limited to changing light bulbs and checking smoke alarms.
Not really much wrong with that. Going for a creative idea like a backheel and it not coming off isn't a big deal.
More importantly, Fellaini really isn't good enough for United. I don't think he can be considered a midfielder anymore as most of his work tends to happen in the attacker third of the pitch (between no10 and second striker). And while he can be a good option to bring on sometimes to unsettle teams, it's questionable whether we want to keep someone like that at the club when he's inevitably going to be used more frequently, because, well, the guy wants to play football, and hence starts important games, and becomes your "go-to sub". We have to aim higher IMO. You want to bring someone off the bench like PSG can bring on Lucas to bring insane pace in, or Barca could bring on Pedro. Or we used to bring on Hernandez (when we used to play counter attack).
As bad tonight as he's ever been.
But yet, I don't hate him anymore. And by that, I mean I don't get this rage filled emotion in my body every time I see him in a United shirt, plodding about the pitch, doing feck all.
That progress, right?
But yet, I don't hate him anymore. And by that, I mean I don't get this rage filled emotion in my body every time I see him in a United shirt, plodding about the pitch, doing feck all.
That progress, right?
Ridiculing a guy for an attempted backheel is a bit cheap. After every match people carry on about our lack of creativity and taking no risks, yet when someone does try something and it doesn't come off they use it as a stick to beat him with.
And it's not a skill with high success rate either. Sometimes it comes off sometimes it doesn't. Nothing to mock unless you just want to go "fellaini lol"
But surely there's a difference between showing attacking intent when the club is struggling for goals and trying to showboat when the team is losing and needs a win to stay in Europe?
I just hate seeing him play a deep midfield role for us, and the less said about him up front the better. So I guess you see where I stand on the subject.
I just hate seeing him play a deep midfield role for us, and the less said about him up front the better. So I guess you see where I stand on the subject.
well...pretty much. He was good at advanced role last year, but seems to have taken a huge step backwards. Then again he will not prosper as CM as he lacks the tactical discipline and positional sense there, also the pace, skills etc, but if we move him into defence I guess he can have better positioning and tactical discipline there. I mean I don't think we can sell him and I don't think he can develop in midfield and seems like plan B is not working when he's in the hole, so what to do with him?
Of course we can sell him and we will.
I only really felt like that about him when Moyes was in charge. He grew on me somewhat last season although his limitations were still abundantly clear despite the overrating by some on here. This season he's been generally poor and I've now resigned myself to the fact that he's just not good enough. When I see his name on the team sheet, I just get this inevitable feeling that he won't do anything of note during the match.
I just die a little inside when I see him play for us...
What team of our stature would have Fellaini in his squad? Even worse in the first 11? Real ? Barca ? Bayern ? Never in a million years!
What team of our stature would have Fellaini in his squad? Even worse in the first 11? Real ? Barca ? Bayern ? Never in a million years!
The thing that is so frustrating with him is how we use him. If we kept his role simple, just break up play and get forward for set pieces/where we're gonna cross it in the box then he could be effective if not ideal. But we seem to give him way too much freedom when he just does not show the football intelligence or technique to justify it.
Yesterday we let him push up high on the left a lot and I just couldn't understand why. I get it for goal kicks but in normal play he shouldn't be so far forward that we have a big gap in the midfield or that Mata is having to come short to get on the ball. If the ball is played to feet he struggles to do much with it in those areas as well and when he's not there it slows down the progression of the ball as the other team can press us more easily with one less outlet for the defence to pass too.
I said it at half time but I don't think all the blame lies with him. Like with Schweinsteiger constantly pressing high up the pitch it has to be somewhat tactical as you don't see anyone advising them to not do it and you'd be surprised if they were going against the managers wishes and he does nothing about it.
It's also really frustrating when we just push him up top because the build up play goes with it. I just think that if we actually looked to keep playing, maybe at a quicker pace with more risks and he's used to just get in the box when we're in the right area we'd get more out of him. At the moment it feels like LVG has a warped sense of what he's bringing to the team as least imo. And although I'm not a fan of Fellaini I don't think it can all be blamed on him as it must be a tactical decision in part.
Yesterday we let him push up high on the left a lot and I just couldn't understand why. I get it for goal kicks but in normal play he shouldn't be so far forward that we have a big gap in the midfield or that Mata is having to come short to get on the ball. If the ball is played to feet he struggles to do much with it in those areas as well and when he's not there it slows down the progression of the ball as the other team can press us more easily with one less outlet for the defence to pass too.
I said it at half time but I don't think all the blame lies with him. Like with Schweinsteiger constantly pressing high up the pitch it has to be somewhat tactical as you don't see anyone advising them to not do it and you'd be surprised if they were going against the managers wishes and he does nothing about it.
It's also really frustrating when we just push him up top because the build up play goes with it. I just think that if we actually looked to keep playing, maybe at a quicker pace with more risks and he's used to just get in the box when we're in the right area we'd get more out of him. At the moment it feels like LVG has a warped sense of what he's bringing to the team as least imo. And although I'm not a fan of Fellaini I don't think it can all be blamed on him as it must be a tactical decision in part.
He's not even good enough to break up play to any decent standard.
He reads the game poorly/slowly, he ball-watches, he's not agile or quick on the turn, gives away fouls, isn't strong (he might be able to shove people off the ball, but he's awful at mixing strength with any sort of movement)
And he needs extra touches, so when he does win the ball, he'll never do anything worthwhile or progressive.
He's a target man. He's only good for situations that require standing around being a nuisance, and using little brain. His only use is being hoofed the ball. But teams have been sending their centre backs forward for years, so why even bother with him? He's not even good at heading the ball.
Nothing against the guy, but let's call a spade a spade. He's out of his depth, and it's not his fault.
Aye, from a footballing perspective, we are currently nowhere near the stature of those clubs. Commercially and size wise (fanbase) for sure we are. We need to get back to that level, and yeah, Fellaini isn't going to be the calibre of player who does that IMO.
It's difficult to for me to hate him, but I actually do, which is irrational. I mean, it's not his fault he's playing for one of the biggest clubs in the world. Which footballer could turn that down.
I agree his break up play isn't great but I think he can do a job there. Don't get me wrong he'd be my last choice in the middle ahead of all our other midfielders but if you get a situation like yesterday with the injuries and I presume Carrick on the bench for when/if BFS runs out of steam then I think you've got to make the best of the situation and there Fellaini can do a job helping to keep us solid in the middle, winning the goal kick and getting in the box for set pieces/crosses. Why we feel the need to give him more freedom beyond that, particularly in a game like yesterdays where we had showed that our main threat was running in behind is something I don't understand.
He started off OK. He put in a couple of tackles. Nicked the ball off Wolfsburg players and I started to think that finally we are seeing him in a proper DM role where he could be useful. Then something happened after 10 mins and he went from doing decently in DM to absolutely sucking on the wide left/striker role which he was pretending to be. Who gave him those tactical instructions?
Playing him in a midfield two is the same as chaining a boulder to his midfield partner's neck. He just seems to do what he wants and leaves his partner isolated. With a bit of discipline and understanding, I think Fellaini and Schweinsteiger could have done the job last night. Fellaini has many limitations, but what he is good at is useful. But, it's not useful if he goes launching down the left wing and then loses the ball.
I don't think he fits in to this seasons forward pointing 4-3-3. But then again, I don't think many of our front 6 players do.
I don't think he fits in to this seasons forward pointing 4-3-3. But then again, I don't think many of our front 6 players do.
Maybe he was told to keep it simple for the first 10 and then push up? Alternatively if he was going against the managers wishes why did no one correct him? I didn't see any of the coaches/players advice him to stay deeper. He didn't become more disciplined in the second half and what he was doing was not unlike what we've seen before from him. It's the same with Schweinsteiger and his pressing that seems out of sync with the team, which was an issue yesterday but most highlighted by the arsenal game. Again if the manager/coaches don't want it or see it as a problem why didn't we see any communication or if there was behind closed doors any noticeable change? LVG doesn't strike me as someone who tolerates players going maverick.
Whenever he plays in midfield, we have no control over the game, and well, no midfield at all. Wanders off post all the time, and compromises the one thing we're good at - keeping the ball. I understand he can be the target man if he goes up, but that's no how we look to play. He is anti-LVG as a midfielder.
Shouldn't have been in that starting lineup, Carrick would've made of world of difference alongside Basti.
Shouldn't have been in that starting lineup, Carrick would've made of world of difference alongside Basti.
He's not even good enough as a target man. He's surprisingly weak in aerial battles and for a guy of his size, he's losing way too many 50-50's.
Playing him in midfield was clear suicide. Even Pereira would have been a better choice. There were times yesterday when one Wolfsburg player would go past Schweiny and Fellaini with one or two touches like they weren't even there. Overrun in midfield is putting it mildly.
Playing him in midfield was clear suicide. Even Pereira would have been a better choice. There were times yesterday when one Wolfsburg player would go past Schweiny and Fellaini with one or two touches like they weren't even there. Overrun in midfield is putting it mildly.
Very true. Whatever he arguably does offer us in midfield (and I'd personally say it's not really a lot), is just countered by the fact that his positioning and poor reading of the game hinders us massively. He's a very unintelligent footballer, which was a problem when we were up against an intelligent counter-attacking side last night.
He isn't equipped to play in a two-man midfield. We have known this since Moyes' season with us though. He needs the extra protection afforded in a 4-3-3, though tbf most of our midfielders do.
Last season the Carrick/Fellaini/Herrera midfield trio was integral to our success. Fellaini's part in that was as a box-to-box player - he provided energy and a high work rate both going forward and defensively. He linked up well with Blind/Young on the left (which was where most of our best play came from, rather than the Herrera/Mata Spanish love duo on the right). He got into the box to provide a threat from crosses and set pieces, closed down opposition defenders constantly, and always tracked back to defend and make important tackles in our half of the pitch.
I cant really be bothered to debate any further here because the bottom line is that most of this place have had it in for Fellaini since he signed, and nothing he does will ever register for those fans as being acceptable. Some fans are at least honest enough to admit this, whilst the others try to 'objectively' argue that Fellaini is a league two player - despite him showing at Everton and United that this is obviously not the case.
As it stands, it wont surprise me at all if Fellaini is sold in the summer - the 4-2-3-1 formation doesn't suit him (or any of our other midfielders for that matter) and he deserves better than to be a bit part player constantly getting abused by his own teams 'fans'.
Ahhhhh the Rooney procedure you mean
Integral to our success! You mean getting fourth and that run of three games where we played well? Also that worked well enough for three games before opposition teams sorted that out and we could do squat all after that. I just cannot understand why do you and others point to those three games to somehow justify his contribution. He was decent last season and I agreed but he does not suit the formation or the style we are playing now and he is not good enough or important enough for us to change that style to revolve around his best attributes. I would love for us to play more direct but even then his first touch and his ability on the ball is so limited that he would be as useless then as he is now.
I am not one of those who says he is a league two player, but he is DEFINITELY not a United standard player if we intend to reach where we want to again. What exactly has he shown at United? He has been average and I would be very glad if we get shot.
He maybe deserves to be a starter but no way at a club of United's stature. He won't get a sniff in the Bayern/Madrid/Barca teams. His level was Everton and he won the lottery when Moyes brought him to United.
The thing is though that this isn't at all true. I've been a massive critic of Fellaini while here, but I'll happily admit that he was actually quite decent last season at times, and had a very good spell for us where he genuinely looked like an excellent box-to-box midfielder.
The problem was that it's mostly been a limited to a decent spell, and was arguably our most impressive spell in the entire Moyes/LVG era. I won't dispute that Fellaini played well. What's also certain though is that he was benefiting from playing in a side that managed to play some good football: he was in with a performing Carrick and Herrera, for example. His good spell for us was mostly limited to one period, and it's not good enough if he wants to remain. Cleverley had a good spell for us. Anderson did too. He needs to show a lot more if he wants to remain here, and a spell of good football in a performing side isn't good enough. What impact is he making when we're struggling? He's the type of player who, with his stature and very different style, surely should be an impact player of some kind.
Again, if Fellaini can't adapt at all to a 4-2-3-1, then that's his problem, and not ours. I understand that players have preferred roles in which they'll thrive, but it's not too much for us to ask for Fellaini to adapt from one midfield role to another and not look a bit rubbish in the process of doing so. It's not as if he spent the entirety of his Everton career on the tip of a 4-3-3 formation, for example.
In addition to that, he's not really being abused, by our fans, which is a ridiculously melodramatic term to use. He's just being heavily criticised because he's playing poorly. And that's fair enough. There's no agenda against him. No determination to prove him as being terrible. No conspiracy. No ulterior motives. People just think he's a bit shite considering the standard we should be looking at, and he continues to vindicate us.
Try the Valencia thread last season.
Fellaini wasn't that great last night, but as an attacking force, he gave us something extra. Especially with the quality of Blind's deliveries, that was something we could use to our advantage, and we almost did last night.
You are fighting a lone crusade war that you wont win though. Whether he has a good game or not, some people wont give him the time of day.
I agree he does not suit the current system. But the fact that Fellaini did well for us last season should provide some proof that he is clearly capable of playing at this level.
Moyes buying him was a mistake because he was not what we needed at the time. However, Fellaini showed at Everton and last season at United that he is capable of dominating the match against the top teams in the league. Last year he was one of our best performers in the big games, consistently. This season the system has been changed and there is no longer a really a role/place in the team that suits him, and for that reason I think he should be sold. However preferable to that would be simply reverting to the 4-3-3 which served us well last season.
Who's had the bigger mare? Fellaini this season or @Walrus in this thread. Show me a midfielder who doesn't play better in a midfield trio. 
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The irony of people calling him "bogbrush" When he's absolutely toilet
Who's had the bigger mare? Fellaini this season or @Walrus in this thread. Show me a midfielder who doesn't play better in a midfield trio.
At least Walrus is consistent. More than can be said about Fellaini
He's only useful if his responsibilities are forwards facing. I genuinely didn't realise how terrible he is in his own half when we bought him. He can't tackle, he can't keep up with runners and he's somehow weak in possession despite having elbows of fury.
If we stick him in the oppositions half, near their final third he causes problems. That's it. That's his only use now.
And our XI can't sustain a player that is such a luxury.
If we stick him in the oppositions half, near their final third he causes problems. That's it. That's his only use now.
And our XI can't sustain a player that is such a luxury.
Absolutely.
As for the bit about him being "somehow weak in possession despite having elbows of fury" - it's because he's the useless kind of strong. He's 'strong' when it comes to standing his ground and waiting for a hoofed ball to reach him.
But the kind of strength that football requires much more is the strength that one shows when turning, dribbling, running, moving. He's flimsy as anything with a high centre of gravity.
It also doesn't help that his technique is average, which means that he has to do everything technical with loads of care. So, for example, when he goes to control a dropping ball, he's so focused on getting the control right (because he's not a natural) that he pretty much neglects using his body effectively. Which is why he always looks a second away from being dispossessed.
Similar to Carroll; only actually looks 'strong' when he's standing still, waiting for a long ball.
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