Manchester City under Pep Guardiola | Pep on City v Liverpool ref: "He likes to be special"

[redflair]

I think Pep's post-match intervew was simply the symptom of a huge escape from a car-crash afternoon.

They really were looking down the barrel when Fernandinho was sent off but they pulled a decent performance out of the bag which, in a strange way, increased Pep's emotional turmoil after the no-show at Anfield.

Also deep down, he realises the imortance of fighters like Fernandinho in the ranks - but now that's he missing for some key, feisty clashes to come - it's increased his impatience and tetchiness.

Goodison will be a massive battle now - and it's unlikely to improve his mood.

 

[VP89]

Villa and Forest bigger clubs than City? I can go with that...

Its a great rule. The sleeping giants of Milan and Ajax aren't forgotten either.
Obviously you'd have other necessary conditions, presumably playing first division football being another one (therefore carving Villa and Forrest out).

 

[padr81]

Plenty of time for that to change, like when they play Everton away

Yeah as opposed to Joses easier game against Liverpool. I can't wait to revisit this thread come the seasons end. United beat a bunch of nobodies bar Spurs and all of a sudden Jose's turned a corner. City lose to Spurs, Chelsea and Liverpool and Pep is finished.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

I was not making a critical statement about his opinion, the only thing that looks tiring is always the same stuff from Guardiola, when guys like Wenger do not win nothing relevant in more than 10 years the press in England never put hard questions to him.

While Pep and Mourinho are always getting the stick from the British Media, with Mourinho even worse, a month ago on the Guardian the so called experts said that he was finished, guys like Wenger get a free ride by the media, just my opinion, lets keep talking about Guardiola on a good or bad way, but I believe that City and United will improve until the end of the season, I will not be surprised if Monaco beats them on the Champions League.

But Wenger's never had the largest transfer budget, Mourinho/Guardiola's budgets and the value of their squads dwarf Arsenal's. Expectations are bound to be higher.

 

[Gazautd18]

Surely this thread must be renamed 'Pep Guardiola goes into Meltdown'? He's choking harder than Papa Doc.

Just made me choke!!

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

The opposite of Mourinho. One inherited a club that needed work and although it took time to implement changes things are now starting to improve. The other went into essentially a ready-made set up and it started well but now the influence is being felt results are turning sour.

Wait didn't United and City get the exact same points last season? Didn't United supposedly sign better more expensive players? Although you both have spent bucket loads. City has the older squad this season and still have a 3 point buffer on you.

 

[SteveJ]

"Who told ya you can f*ck with the mighty Pepa Doc"

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Change of subject but how confident are people that we can catch City? There's no reason why we can't but I just think they have that extra bit of quality in their squad. It's a tough ask but there's obviously a chance, it would be absolutely fecking brilliant to steal their CL spot.

On the topic of Pep, this Mourinho quote seems to be relevant right now:

'When you enjoy what you do, you don't lose your hair, and Guardiola is bald. He doesn't enjoy football.'

He's such a petulant child. Male pattern baldness is hereditary and Mourinho enjoys parking the bus does he?

 

[padr81]

Wait didn't United and City get the exact same points last season? Didn't United supposedly sign better more expensive players? Although you both have spent bucket loads. City has the older squad this season and still have a 3 point buffer on you.

Don't speak sense. United are worse but better when it suits. Pep is terrible for only getting 42 pts from 20 games, Joses 39 is much better. Even though in reality both teams have nearly identical records against the big clubs and poorer clubs and City are above in the table because of the OT win, everyone knows its false and the true story is Guardiola after one rant has melted down, new found compsed and non tempremental Jose is the saviour and winning 6 games in a row against most junk and a tight one against Spurs is much better than the 10 City won with a win at OT. Why because certain members of the CAF said so.

 

[#07]

Wait didn't United and City get the exact same points last season? Didn't United supposedly sign better more expensive players? Although you both have spent bucket loads. City has the older squad this season and still have a 3 point buffer on you.

We signed one player for £89 million. That was the one instance where City did not spend more per player e.g. Bailly cost £20m less than Stones. Sane was a clear £15m more than Mkhitaryan. City also spent more than Man Utd: £174 million to £150 million (link).

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Welcome to the Premier League Pep! City fans having a major reality check. The City and United dynamic has completely switched. At the start of the season, they were bragging at how the best manager in the world had chosen them and how it was just a matter of time before Mourinho had his meltdown and plunged United into crisis.

Not panning out that way. Anyone notice the amount of times Jose talks abut how he is enjoying his time at United and really happy to be here. You don't hear that from Guardiola. I would argue that of the two, Jose is having a bigger impact right now. I'm sure he'll come good but he's certainly not walking on water as expected.

It didn't look like it a couple of months ago.

 

[SwansonsTache]

It didn't look like it a couple of months ago.

Understandably frustrated at ref decisions going against us on a weekly basis and never getting a result despite us dominating teams.

He did however NOT have a moan like Pep just did both in his post match interview and presser, a minature meltdown if I ever saw one.

In fact both Klopp (yesterday), Pep and Wenger (Zoogate) has had bigger moans in pressers and post match interviews this season than Jose, which must be sad for all you oppo's who's been predicting a Jose meltdown weekly now for a few months.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Did you really type that? Granted, Bravo hasn't exactly been all that so far but the others? Injuries aside, it's pretty much universally accepted that Gundogan is a quality player. Nolito is well respected in his native Spain and has actually been a decent signing so far. Sane is still young and is one of Germany's best prospects, as is Stones from an English point of view. So that just leaves the 19 year-old, 5 games in his first 6 games for Brazil, Gabriel Jesus and if you don't rate him then you really do need to have a word with yourself. Not only that, the kid hasn't even played a single minute for us yet and you're writing him off already.

By the way, we signed Silva, Yaya, and Tevez when we didn't have Champions League football.

How has Nolito been so far? He had some outstanding performances last year.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

I thought a necessary requirement for a "big club" is to have a European trophy.

lol, Arsenal.

CWC

 

[cyberman]

Wait didn't United and City get the exact same points last season? Didn't United supposedly sign better more expensive players? Although you both have spent bucket loads. City has the older squad this season and still have a 3 point buffer on you.

City were given every excuse under the book. From City only underperforming because Pellegrini was a dead man walking at Christmas to KDB / Aguero etc getting a chance to work with a world class manager to Pep being able to bring through the youth from their fantastic youth teams.
Jose was a broken man who had the modern game pass him by (apparently)
Also can rival fans stop using the fecking league as this definite measurement? We told you that our points tally didn't reflect our performances and if we played the same way and stuck with it the results would come.
Well guess what? Our run seems to have come as a shock despite United fans repeating themselves over and over and over. Look at the top 4 thread from a month back. Arsenal and Lvpool fans were falling over themselves posting laughing green smilies to the mere suggestion of a United CL challenge.

 

[padr81]

City were given every excuse under the book. From City only underperforming because Pellegrini was a dead man walking at Christmas to KDB / Aguero etc getting a chance to work with a world class manager to Pep being able to bring through the youth from their fantastic youth teams.
Jose was a broken man who had the modern game pass him by (apparently)
Also can rival fans stop using the fecking league as this definite measurement? We told you that our points tally didn't reflect our performances and if we played the same way and stuck with it the results would come.
Well guess what? Our run seems to have come as a shock despite United fans repeating themselves over and over and over. Look at the top 4 thread from a month back. Arsenal and Lvpool fans were falling over themselves posting laughing green smilies to the mere suggestion of a United CL challenge.

Your results aren't a shock. You've beaten the teams you should and lost or drawn with the other big teams.

 

[AR87]

Don't speak sense. United are worse but better when it suits. Pep is terrible for only getting 42 pts from 20 games, Joses 39 is much better. Even though in reality both teams have nearly identical records against the big clubs and poorer clubs and City are above in the table because of the OT win, everyone knows its false and the true story is Guardiola after one rant has melted down, new found compsed and non tempremental Jose is the saviour and winning 6 games in a row against most junk and a tight one against Spurs is much better than the 10 City won with a win at OT. Why because certain members of the CAF said so.

Last I checked City also, according to most, were starting from a higher level than United, so them being ahead isn't much of a surprise. I'd also argue that much like Pep would feel, our performances against Everton, Arsenal, Stoke and Burnley were much better than our 4 point haul from those fixtures. I don't think Pep's out of his depth or doing a terrible job, but I do feel better about United's current trajectory than City's because I think we did a better job of adding players to strengthen our weaknesses this summer than City did.

Now that the bedding in period for each club's new managers and players is over, we'll see how things stack up towards the end of the season.

Your results aren't a shock. You've beaten the teams you should and lost or drawn with the other big teams.

Beating teams we should isn't something we were doing under LVG or at the start of the season under Mourinho, so that is a very tangible improvement. If Mourinho can replicate those performances against the other top-6 teams we'll be in business and considering our performances in recent matches against Arsenal and Tottenham I believe he can.

 

[cyberman]

Your results aren't a shock. You've beaten the teams you should and lost or drawn with the other big teams.

Well they are. Have you seen us over the last few seasons?
It's also the manner of our performances in these wins. We played just as well v Palace and West Brom away as we did v Arsenal and Spurs at home. That's the great thing about it.
It's not as if everyone else are stringing 6 games wins and 1 defeat in 17 or whatever it is streaks together.
Can't be that expected

 

[padr81]

Last I checked City also, according to most, were starting from a higher level than United, so them being ahead isn't much of a surprise. I'd also argue that much like Pep would feel, our performances against Everton, Arsenal, Stoke and Burnley were much better than our 4 point haul from those fixtures. I don't think Pep's out of his depth or doing a terrible job, but I do feel better about United's current trajectory than City's because I think we did a better job of adding players to strengthen our weaknesses this summer than City did.

Now that the bedding in period for each club's new managers and players is over, we'll see how things stack up towards the end of the season.

Beating teams we should isn't something we were doing under LVG or at the start of the season under Mourinho, so that is a very tangible improvement. If Mourinho can replicate those performances against the other top-6 teams we'll be in business and considering our performances in recent matches against Arsenal and Tottenham I believe he can.

Nowhere have I said you haven't improved, but City haven't really regressed either, not to the point that people spout on here. No doubt Jose has dealt with his weaknesses very well during the season, but results for both clubs have been virtually identical, so to suggest one is in crisis and the other is on the up is crazy. United are on the up off a nice run of fixtures, City looked impressive early season on a nice run of fixtures, (united win over spurs and cities over United being the exceptions). Realistically how many points did United fans expect off those games?

To say one is now a juggernaut and the other finished on the back of identical results is crazy, just like those writing off Jose and United after what was a blip at Watford and losses in 50-50 coin flips (City, Chelsea for United and Liverpool, Spurs away and Chelsea home for City). What kind of adds to how poor those results looked was the stuttering in Europe and City going out of the EFL cup.

But in reality Citys last fixtures were losses to Chelsea, Leicester (only really bad result), Liverpool, wins over Arsenal and the teams we are expected to beat. Not a great return but not a great fixture list either.

 

[padr81]

Well they are. Have you seen us over the last few seasons?
It's also the manner of our performances in these wins. We played just as well v Palace and West Brom away as we did v Arsenal and Spurs at home. That's the great thing about it.
It's not as if everyone else are stringing 6 games wins and 1 defeat in 17 or whatever it is streaks together.
Can't be that expected

You didn't genuinely expect your team not to pick up? Not having a loss maybe but with your fixtures I for one posted here a bucket load of times it was only a matter of time. I probably underestimate how bad you guys rated yourselves and I suppose you kind of feel the same as myself, that even though its not perfect its better (me with regards City) truth is any other season we'd both be showing borderline title form.

 

[AR87]

Realistically how many points did United fans expect off those games?

Idk. From the last 6 and with how weird and hectic the festive period is I'd have been satisfied with 14 points. To get a maximum of 18 is a very good return considering the demoralizing stretch we had prior to this. I for one really thought West Ham would be a draw, but thanks to Mike Dean it was a relatively straightforward and easy victory. West Brom away was the other fixture in this run that I had pegged as a draw.

 

[cyberman]

You didn't genuinely expect your team not to pick up? Not having a loss maybe but with your fixtures I for one posted here a bucket load of times it was only a matter of time. I probably underestimate how bad you guys rated yourselves and I suppose you kind of feel the same as myself, that even though its not perfect its better (me with regards City) truth is any other season we'd both be showing borderline title form.

Not borderline. Actual title winning form.
Arsenal were top this time last year with a points tally that would have them 6th on goal difference today.
And thats only by 5 goals as well

 

[Stacks]

Villa and Forest bigger clubs than City? I can go with that...

Its a great rule. The sleeping giants of Milan and Ajax aren't forgotten either.
Obviously you'd have other necessary conditions, presumably playing first division football being another one (therefore carving Villa and Forrest out).

nope. Arsenal are a bigger club worldwide than Bordeaux, Celtic, Feyenord, Bucharest, Red Star Belgrade. You know this. There is little debate. Players from these clubs would long to move to Arsenal and see it as a step up to a bigger club. Same with City.

 

[VanGaalEra]

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Understandably frustrated at ref decisions going against us on a weekly basis and never getting a result despite us dominating teams.

He did however NOT have a moan like Pep just did both in his post match interview and presser, a minature meltdown if I ever saw one.

In fact both Klopp (yesterday), Pep and Wenger (Zoogate) has had bigger moans in pressers and post match interviews this season than Jose, which must be sad for all you oppo's who's been predicting a Jose meltdown weekly now for a few months.

Pep's essentially complaining about the ref/English reffing. You're forgetting Mourinho, doing the same, actually intimidating a ref in the refs quarters, complaining about the FA, whinning about other managers and criticising players publically and coaches.

Paul Hirst @hirstclass
Jose not holding back in press conference. Says he passed all his knowledge and experience on to the players but they let him down.

Make no mistake this is a meltdown by Guardiola but it's nothing compared to Mourinho.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

City were given every excuse under the book. From City only underperforming because Pellegrini was a dead man walking at Christmas to KDB / Aguero etc getting a chance to work with a world class manager to Pep being able to bring through the youth from their fantastic youth teams.
Jose was a broken man who had the modern game pass him by (apparently)

City haven't needed excuses up until the last month or so because they were in contention for the title. It's now after the Liverpool loss that Guardiola. Mourinho had a worse start than Moyes and plenty of your own fans wanted him sacked and this was after a terrible start to last year. It's no wonder he got criticism.

Also can rival fans stop using the fecking league as this definite measurement? We told you that our points tally didn't reflect our performances and if we played the same way and stuck with it the results would come.
Well guess what? Our run seems to have come as a shock despite United fans repeating themselves over and over and over. Look at the top 4 thread from a month back. Arsenal and Lvpool fans were falling over themselves posting laughing green smilies to the mere suggestion of a United CL challenge.

The league is the best judge of a manager and team over the course of the season unless they're sacrificing the league to win the CL. And yes the league did reflect your performance because your defending was poor, defending is part of a performance.

Your current winning run is against teams you're expected to beat, albeit the consistency is impressive.

 

[cyberman]

City haven't needed excuses up until the last month or so because they were in contention for the title. It's now after the Liverpool loss that Guardiola. Mourinho had a worse start than Moyes and plenty of your own fans wanted him sacked and this was after a terrible start to last year. It's no wonder he got criticism.



The league is the best judge of a manager and team over the course of the season unless they're sacrificing the league to win the CL. And yes the league did reflect your performance because your defending was poor, defending is part of a performance.

Your current winning run is against teams you're expected to beat, albeit the consistency is impressive.

League doesn't reflect performances over 3/4/5 games though.
That's the point being made. Nobody was saying we should have won all 19 games so far

 

[RedPed]

It didn't look like it a couple of months ago.

City haven't needed excuses up until the last month or so because they were in contention for the title. It's now after the Liverpool loss that Guardiola. Mourinho had a worse start than Moyes and plenty of your own fans wanted him sacked and this was after a terrible start to last year. It's no wonder he got criticism.



The league is the best judge of a manager and team over the course of the season unless they're sacrificing the league to win the CL. And yes the league did reflect your performance because your defending was poor, defending is part of a performance.

Your current winning run is against teams you're expected to beat, albeit the consistency is impressive.

Wow, this coming from a Gooner supporting a manager who has been living on past success for 12 years because he gets top 4 each season. Half your own fans want Wenger out!

 

[padr81]

League doesn't reflect performances over 3/4/5 games though.
That's the point being made. Nobody was saying we should have won all 19 games so far

Nope but a team is not only as good as their last 6 results.

I think 1 game against everyone else is much fairer than judging United last 7 (WestHam, Middlesboro, Sunderland, WestBrom, Palace, Spurs (home win against a rival), Everton )
and Cities last 7 which are (Burnely, Liverpool, Hull, Arsenal, Watford, Leicester, Chelsea) 4 wins and 3 losses, one blip result, 2 coin toss losses against Liverpool away and Chelsea home. Especially when we've just played 3 of the top 6, big 6 or whatever Sky will refer to it as and the defending champions (who admittedly we should be beating). Of those only the Leicester result is a real shocker. And its exactly why I argue or form isn't that bad. Especially given our record against the top 6 last season.

Now if we lose to Everton and fail to beat Spurs or vice versa, than we will be at panic stations.

 

[AR87]

Now if we lose to Everton and fail to beat Spurs or vice versa, than we will be at panic stations.

This I agree with, but the reality is the reason City's under the microscope now is because of Pep's bizarre reactions in the post-match interview and press conference yesterday. If he'd shown some genuine happiness about overcoming a justified red card and in his team pulling out a result under tough circumstances the narrative would be much different.

 

[rotherham_red]

This I agree with, but the reality is the reason City's under the microscope now is because of Pep's bizarre reactions in the post-match interview and press conference yesterday. If he'd shown some genuine happiness about overcoming a justified red card and in his team pulling out a result under tough circumstances the narrative would be much different.

Pretty much, this.

 

[padr81]

This I agree with, but the reality is the reason City's under the microscope now is because of Pep's bizarre reactions in the post-match interview and press conference yesterday. If he'd shown some genuine happiness about overcoming a justified red card and in his team pulling out a result under tough circumstances the narrative would be much different.

The red card was fair as was the goal but I get a feeling Mason being the twat he is never explained to City it was the second ball that was a goal and also that City feel Bravo was pushed on the initial cross. But as a City fan, I'm not one for the conpiracy theory shit on BM (its why I hang out here.) Mason was absolutely beyond terrible for the entire game. I mean Warnock should have being book at least 4 times, completely went through the back of Silva and when he was lying injured told him get off the pitch bill our physio told him told him go away. Just watch the tackle and you'll see why we got so fired up. He didn't even give a freekick and told a player who'd just been clattered to get up.

I gather he was terrible for yourselves a few days earlier though I missed most the game. Not corrupt just incompetent.

Given Sagna's post and Peps presser I think City have deliberately decided to come out confrontational for some reason or other.

 

[AR87]

I gather he was terrible for yourselves a few days earlier though I missed most the game. Not corrupt just incompetent.

Given Sagna's post and Peps presser I think City have deliberately decided to come out confrontational for some reason or other.

Yep. Mason is awful. So is Dean. Unfortunately for us we've had more decisions go against us this season than the other top sides, but yesterday we definitely had them turn in our favor in a big way.

I haven't seen the challenge on Silva, but that sounds about par for the course for Burnley.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Wow, this coming from a Gooner supporting a manager who has been living on past success for 12 years because he gets top 4 each season. Half your own fans want Wenger out!

Our manager had to sell his best players year on year, without having a transfer budget in order to pay off a stadium debt. You've generally spent more than anyone else in the league for the last 30 years. Expectations are obviously different, unless you're not great with either logic or in fact knowing anything, ie the Wenger outers.

 

[padr81]

Yep. Mason is awful. So is Dean. Unfortunately for us we've had more decisions go against us this season than the other top sides, but yesterday we definitely had them turn in our favor in a big way.

I haven't seen the challenge on Silva, but that sounds about par for the course for Burnley.

With regards Mason he'll get off lightly because he got the Fernandinho red right or at least his assistant did but I'd love to see both United and City lodge a complaint or something and go, this is not good enough.

 

[M18CTID]

How has Nolito been so far? He had some outstanding performances last year.

He's done well so far despite not playing every week. My only issue with him is that he's got a bit of a screw loose. Sent off for a head butt against Bournemouth and was lucky not to see red for the same thing away at West Brom.

 

[rotherham_red]

Our manager had to sell his best players year on year, without having a transfer budget in order to pay off a stadium debt. You've generally spent more than anyone else in the league for the last 30 years. Expectations are obviously different, unless you're not great with either logic or in fact knowing anything.

Not true. We've spent more last season and possibly the season before. But City and Chelsea before them outspent us and before Abramovitch, it was actually Liverpool who were the big spenders in the league.

 

[RedPed]

Our manager had to sell his best players year on year, without having a transfer budget in order to pay off a stadium debt. You've generally spent more than anyone else in the league for the last 30 years. Expectations are obviously different, unless you're not great with either logic or in fact knowing anything.

Feck me!! This is Arsenal we're talking about. He didn't have to do no such thing.....sitting on that famed huge cash reserve year in year out. How long have you been at the Emirates now?? Still shopping in the bargain bins! Obviously, a fair amount of the Gooners can't be blessed with great logic either to quote your own words. No wonder they're all pissed if your pitiful justification is anything to go by. That's why they were nearly killing each other a few years back.

 

[M18CTID]

Understandably frustrated at ref decisions going against us on a weekly basis and never getting a result despite us dominating teams.

He did however NOT have a moan like Pep just did both in his post match interview and presser, a minature meltdown if I ever saw one.

In fact both Klopp (yesterday), Pep and Wenger (Zoogate) has had bigger moans in pressers and post match interviews this season than Jose, which must be sad for all you oppo's who's been predicting a Jose meltdown weekly now for a few months.

At least those 3 managers actually turn up for every post-match presser which is more than can be said for Mourinho this season And to actually imply that your manager doesn't ever moan and whinge has got to be up there as arguably the most laughable thing I've ever read on this forum.

For those first couple of months of the season, he cut an unhappy and dejected figure which to be honest came as a surprise to me considering the decade-long hard-on he's had for your club. Personally I thought he'd keep his powder dry as a result.

 

[WackyWengerWorld]

Not true. We've spent more last season and possibly the season before. But City and Chelsea before them outspent us and before Abramovitch, it was actually Liverpool who were the big spenders in the league.

You were breaking British transfer records in the 80s and 90s prior to winning the league and after though and often had the highest net spend. The amount you were spending, prior to Abrahimovic, blew everyone out of the water. Leeds tried to keep up with the spending and went bust. Liverpool spent allot but sold loads of players to finance it, where as United didn't need to do that.